Added in Etape Cymru, which I found MILES harder than IM Wales, but appears initially to be comparable. So I checked the maths and I wonder where some of the data is coming from. I believe IM Wales has 1,220 metres of "up", so just 10.9m/mile. Likewise, I think last year's Outlaw had 496m of up, which makes just 4.3m/mile. If I'm right, perhaps the variance can be explained by the well known Iron-Ego Inflation Coefficient?

That said, I might be talking right out of my starfish as oft times before, so I won't change the numbers below.

Scottish coast to coast 42.99m per mile Fred Whitton 30.89m Aqueduct thingy - 27.9m Chiltern 100 Biggy - 24.5m Etape Cymru - 21.7m Ironman Wales - 21.4m Cheshire Cat - 20.9 m Bike Radar - 17.4m IMFR - 16.0m IM Regensberg 13.39m IMCH- 11.25m Outlaw 11.07m Challenge Vichy (2013 race ?) 9.6m IMDE - 8.69 m

STIL - by all means change the figures if you've found newer stuff - they do change the courses. I've just found a bikely track for the outlaw that gives it as 944 meters for the route - so that would give it as 8.4m - still the flattest we have - which ties in with my thoughts ?

Scottish coast to coast 42.99m per mile Fred Whitton 30.89m Aqueduct thingy - 27.9m Chiltern 100 Biggy - 24.5m Etape Cymru - 21.7m Ironman Wales - 21.4m or is it 10.9m or 15.6m ?? Cheshire Cat - 20.9 m Bike Radar - 17.4m IMFR - 16.0m IM Regensberg 13.39m IMCH- 11.25m Outlaw 11.07m Challenge Vichy (2013 race ?) 9.6m IMDE - 8.69 m

Odd. Your IMW routes from "bikemap" suggest 5,700ft, but all of the ones logged at Mapmyride say 4,000ft for the same route, which I make 1,200m. I don't know which one is right...... if either ! But I've ridden the route twice and it's not an especially hard bike ride if you don't have to run 26 miles afterwards. Certainly nothing like Etape Cymru.

Similar with the Outlaw. Mapmyride has this year's elevation as 488 metres (671 the year before). Bikely has it at 944. Erm.... don't know, mate! Anyway - hill brick at Burton Marshes beckons .

My Garmin shows Outlaw as 2457 elevation for 2012. Assuming that's feet(LOL), thats er, 744.5M? It wasn't a tough bike from an upsy downsy point of view. BTW exactly which bit WAS Oxton Bank?

So we've established that personal GPS's and mapping websites are complete cobblers. Glad I decided against that snazzy Garmin 910 for Christmas after all .

## Comments

it is! you will hardly notice oxton hill - described here often as a pimple -this is apt

the first half of the course is gently rolling - which is nice because you're not in the same position all the time!

I like this! This tells me IMCH is only a bit worse than Outlaw.

IMCH isn't too bad but I think that data may be for the old route ?

Added in Etape Cymru, which I found MILES harder than IM Wales, but appears initially to be comparable. So I checked the maths and I wonder where some of the data is coming from. I believe IM Wales has 1,220 metres of "up", so just 10.9m/mile. Likewise, I think last year's Outlaw had 496m of up, which makes just 4.3m/mile. If I'm right, perhaps the variance can be explained by the well known Iron-Ego Inflation Coefficient?

That said, I might be talking right out of my starfish as oft times before, so I won't change the numbers below.

Scottish coast to coast 42.99m per mile

Fred Whitton 30.89m

Aqueduct thingy - 27.9m

Chiltern 100 Biggy - 24.5m

Etape Cymru - 21.7m

Ironman Wales - 21.4m

Cheshire Cat - 20.9 m

Bike Radar - 17.4m

IMFR - 16.0m

IM Regensberg 13.39m

IMCH- 11.25m

Outlaw 11.07m

Challenge Vichy (2013 race ?) 9.6m

IMDE - 8.69 m

STIL - by all means change the figures if you've found newer stuff - they do change the courses. I've just found a bikely track for the outlaw that gives it as 944 meters for the route - so that would give it as 8.4m - still the flattest we have - which ties in with my thoughts ?

I've found a track for IMWales - http://www.bikemap.net/route/1614402#lat=51.715050122735&lng=-4.8861050000001&zoom=11&maptype=ts_terrain that gives it as 15.6 m/mile. I dont think it could be 10.9 - but I've not ridden that one to compare. 15.6 sounds plausible to me ?

Scottish coast to coast 42.99m per mile

Fred Whitton 30.89m

Aqueduct thingy - 27.9m

Chiltern 100 Biggy - 24.5m

Etape Cymru - 21.7m

Ironman Wales - 21.4m or is it 10.9m or 15.6m ??

Cheshire Cat - 20.9 m

Bike Radar - 17.4m

IMFR - 16.0m

IM Regensberg 13.39m

IMCH- 11.25m

Outlaw 11.07m

Challenge Vichy (2013 race ?) 9.6m

IMDE - 8.69 m

Outlaw 2012 8.4m

Odd. Your IMW routes from "bikemap" suggest 5,700ft, but all of the ones logged at Mapmyride say 4,000ft for the same route, which I make 1,200m. I don't know which one is right...... if either ! But I've ridden the route twice and it's not an especially hard bike ride if you don't have to run 26 miles afterwards. Certainly nothing like Etape Cymru.

Similar with the Outlaw. Mapmyride has this year's elevation as 488 metres (671 the year before). Bikely has it at 944. Erm.... don't know, mate! Anyway - hill brick at Burton Marshes beckons .

My Garmin shows Outlaw as 2457 elevation for 2012. Assuming that's feet(LOL), thats er, 744.5M? It wasn't a tough bike from an upsy downsy point of view. BTW exactly which bit WAS Oxton Bank?

It was that bit when you thought, ah, finally a bump, then about 3 minutes later thought "was that IT?" About 13/ to a half the way round from memory?

Really wasnt anything to comment on from memory.

Just looking, I had 1261ft (388m) ascent for Outlaw and 3252ft (1001m) for Regensburg! Both 111 miles

We are all over the place ! Outlaw was very flat though. Flatter than any IM I've done I think.

those looking at wales...are you taking into account the second loop that might be a difference

So we've established that personal GPS's and mapping websites are complete cobblers. Glad I decided against that snazzy Garmin 910 for Christmas after all .

Fred Whitton 30.89m

Aqueduct thingy - 27.9m

Chiltern 100 Biggy - 24.5m

Etape Cymru - 21.7m

Ironman Wales - 21.4m or is it 10.9m or 15.6m ??

Cheshire Cat - 20.9 m

Bike Radar - 17.4m

IMFR - 16.0m

Challenge Henley 2013 14.3m

IM Regensberg 13.39m

IMCH- 11.25m

Outlaw 11.07m

Challenge Vichy (2013 race ?) 9.6m

IMDE - 8.69 m

Outlaw 2012 8.4m

Updated for the Challenge Henley route. I thought it would have been hillier than that - it was up and down all the way but nothing too drastic.