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Hmmm..... so how do I tell which my local church is Sass?
I've moved since my last attempt at going (excluding Christmas Eve carol services!) but the problem is that I know a fair few people in the village, so if I start going and then stop I'll get a barrage of well-meaning questions that I don't want to answer
Sunday is the one day I don;t have to get up at 6am so it consists of:
Long lie, papers, coffee, bread and jam, radio 4 , kitchen based pottering, chasing the kids from their beds and forcing some sort of activity on them, LSR, dinner, chasing the kids into the shower, packed lunch making, bed.
Also agnostic so the church thing is lost on me.
normally: lsr then work, or, work then lsr for me. Managed to do my lsr yesterday and I have today off work - yay!
No church for me, was never made to go as a kid, and I've only been for a couple of weddings and two extremely long catholic funerals.
I'm a pagan so it's the wonderful outdoors, rain, sun, wind or snow
I've never understood the dragging the kids to church every Sunday bit. We made a concious decision to give our children the choice. The Celtic liturgy relies on daily offices rather than one big Sunday Shindig, and its a lot quieter and less intrusive. Sunday for us is always a quiet day when we do as little work as possible. Races, fishing, and other leisure activities are encouraged.
Our children are grown now. One is a regular churchgoer, one goes when he can be bothered to get out of bed, and one never goes near a church (and never did as a child). I dont see it as my place to preach to them one way or the other.
I'm not sure that Indoctrination is the correct word. It implies malicious intent. Parents who drag Children to church against their wil rarely do so maliciously, more out of misguided concern for the childs spiritual well being.
The thing is that Christ said "dont stop children from approaching me" not "drag them kicking and screaming into my presence".
Its simply a matter of being open and honest and having meaningful and respectful discussion. Each of my children respects my views and those of their siblings, and we've had some interesting conversations at the meal table on that basis.
My grandfather, a CoE vicar felt (broadly) the same way. His children went to church as part of the family until age 11, when he considered they were old enough to make their own choices. They all chose to keep going, but made other choices as adults.
One's a Quaker, one's a Mormon and one has remained CoE.
It wouldn't have worried him at all....he always considered that Christianity was about how you behaved, not showing up on Sunday or labels.
Fell Running wrote (see)
I had to share the cheer I let out in my kitchen on reading this, thanks FR. The trouble with being brought up by a convert is that dogma = fact and a different viewpoint = the work of the devil.
As a child I learnt very quickly not to question out loud, but it left a lot unanswered.
atheist, so I do my Sunday spin class and a wee run after it dodging the thunderbolts as I go!
Big David wrote (see)
I think that CHURCH & SUNDAY SCHOOL have often been the best turn off that Christianity has every had.
I sincerely hope that those who I teach these days don't think that!
This morning in West Warrington, 8 churches came together on our local rec and had an open air service. It was brilliant. Not done it for years, but we've just had a big summer festival and finished it off with a bang. Really brought the local community together.
I do my LSRs on a Saturday. I don't think God sits in heaven wagging his finger at me if I occasionally race on a Sunday though
Each to their own I say.
LSR - church - lunch - ironing - sunday roast - get the kids too bed.
As an agnostic, I have a rather strange relationship with church. I get up every sunday to ring bells to call people to a service that I don't actually believe in. I think of it as my way of paying a debt - I get to ring chuch bells for fun during the week, so I ring them on Sunday for the church in a fair's fair basis.
Like several here, I was put off very young. in my case by going to a Church of England school where RE was taught as fact. Being an inquisitive child, I was always asking "why" and this was never supplied with an answer that satisfied me. I've never accepted the "because I said so and that was the gist of the response.
That being said, there is something hugely attractive and inspiring about a really good high church service using the old form of words. I'd tick the box "agnostic with high church leanings" if it existed!
It's a strange old world.
It sounds to me like you got to the "questioning stage" a bit earlier than most people do, Helen liz! At primary level, there probably isn't time to explore the ifs and buts of Christianity, (even in a CofE school) and most children will just suck it up and make their own minds later as teenagers or young adults.
My children have been going to church all their lives and really enjoy Sunday school. The younger one happily accepts what she learns. The older one is naturally more analytical and although she hasn't come right out and said so, I expect she will question soon what she is being taught.
I just hope I do better than the "because I said so" answer you were given, because that's never a good response!
*sighs* I wish I could ring bells! Sounds ace.....
I do take issue a bit with the "we don't take the children to church because we want them to make up their own minds when they are older" brigade. How can adolescents/adults choose something they've never been given the opportunity to experience?
So far as asking questions is concerned, I've had the opposite problem with my recently acquired congregation: they've been used to the 'Father knows best' approach and so I've had to really push them to consider "why?" and "how?" and "what if?"
I go out on the bike early - normally have to be back by 10 as my partner does her LSR on a Sunday. As far as God goes I'm agnostic probably leaning towards thinking there must be more than the physical world we live in but fearing that that might just be wishful thinking.
I like some things about church - the tradition of it - though I don't have a firm belief in God - probably more accurate to say I hope there is something beyond this world and feel there probably is but I wouldn't put my house on it. When I have been to church in the past (which is on rare occasions) it's always felt a little bit too prescriptive to me though - maybe not enough chance to disagree or discuss what you are talking about. I'm just the sort of person that likes a bit of an argument I guess.
Sass: I believe that sending children to church or to Sunday school is incorrect as it teaches only one system of belief. Later when they start to question about religion and are capable of making their own minds up their thinking has been already coloured by previous experience and teaching.
I've done my best to teach my children right from wrong, based on the simple tennant of "Don't do or say things to other people you would not want done/said to youself". If you examine all the major religions you will find that teaching within them.
LB - I understand from my parents I was a nightmare! You know that annoying stage children go through at about 2-3 where everything is "but why...?" it seems I just never grew out of it. Still haven't very useful in my job it is too!
bell ringing is ace - a bit of cardio exercise (getting up all those stairs, usually) and upper body workout along with some mental exercise, all rounded off with a pub trip. And there's nearly always somewhere relatively close that'll welcome you with open arms - even if you're as mediocre as me! I have ringing links to Liverpool too if you ever wanted to know more...
Morning, I have to admit; I envy those who profess to have a personal relationship with God, I grew up in a very Christian household and even sang in the church Choir until I was old enough to begin questioning my personal relationship with God.
I hope there is more to life than; be born, live and die because I believe in aspiring to be better than I am and if I manage to achieve that in this lifetime, to be able to move on to a higher level of being.
Sorry I seem to have wandered off the topic, which is whether Church or LSR on a Sunday. I have to admit to LSR early on a Sunday morning. Very few people about, lots of nature to see and appreciate. Perhaps I don't need to be in a building to appreciate God after all.
Is currenlty an LSR for me but i run past our local church and being a proper grown up now i do wonder if there is more to life, in fact i really always have but it is only now that i'm keen to explore what.
I took myself off to sunday school when i was in my early teens but that stopped when i was about 16 and i didn't have anything to do with church apart from the usual and the odd midnight mass at christmas. I do belive that its more than "wishful thinking" as popsider said, simply because of the strength of people's faith in many religions and the historical grounding in a lot of them, but what that is i do not know, i probably never will but i find it fascinating to find out more and i think that whatever route i choose, "god" whomever he may be, will love me no matter what.
I agree with Runner String as well - who ever inspired this earth, certainly had a good eye.
......but must have gone to the toilet when he got round to creating Runcorn and Widnes...
lol - true - lol