Moraghan Training - Stevie G

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  • SorequadsSorequads ✭✭✭

    Some big weeks, SC. Good that you can adapt and run with your son. Like the sound of that pyramid. Always good coming back down. Have heard of people getting Covid after vaccination, and it did seem they had it far less severely, although they were very recently inoculated. 

    Very nice royal flush there, SG. Will aim for something similar tomorrow although prob +30s.

    Hope the hammy is ok, Bus. Find they can linger longer than most injuries. 

    Interesting comments on the tri representation, Phil. Not quite sure where I stand. Reg, Joe, any thoughts? The marathon equivalent has only been around a few years, and seems to have jumped in terms of difficulty to qualify. 


    Got out on Monday afternoon for this week’s VO2 session. P&L called for 8 x 3 minutes uphill at 3k to 5k effort, with jog down recoveries. I plumped for 8 x 2.5 minutes, as that is how long it takes to run up the hill, and 8 x 3 seemed a bit savage. Not especially fast, but a tough workout. Something sadistically satisfying about hill reps. 

    Had time for 8-10M easy yesterday morning, but my legs were having none of it. Absolutely knackered. Not too surprising, really. 5M plod at 8:50 pace, then squeezed in a further four after school at 9 m/m. Headed along the river trail. In fantastic condition - although I haven’t returned yet after today’s rain. 

    10M easy today along the canal, 7:46 pace. Great to be back on this favourite of a route. Lots of wildlife, very peaceful and lovely views once you are a mile or two away from town. 

    Wind looks monstrous tomorrow. Planned progression style run, so will do loops to stop being battered for too long at any one point. Either 0.75M around the industrial park by the river (more scenic than it sounds), or 2M around the racecourse/river. 

  • Stevie  GStevie G ✭✭✭✭
    edited March 2021
    Good luck SQ - wouldn't have fancied today's conditions if something a bit harder paced was needed.
    And glad you didn't make a mistake with your hills - like the time i needed to sprint short hill reps - was meant to be a slight slope, but I did it on a steep one, and could feel it for about 4 days - when I generally only ever feel stuff leg wise after races, or the time I did 0.3mile hill reps instead of 0.3km. Boy I was "tight" for time back to the office that day :D 
  • The BusThe Bus ✭✭✭
    Stevie G said:
    ps I had a look at seg guy's fb profile and accidentally must have sent a friend request as I was a bit surprised to see he had accepted!!
    That's embarrassing. But quickly deleted and ahem we move on.


    Doh!!!

    Let's move these pages on quick smart!
    Er, that would be a page Turner then SG :-)

  • The BusThe Bus ✭✭✭
    Cheers SQ -if you are doing a sesh tomorrow I hope the wind is no where near as bad as forecast earlier or at least at your back for the end of the progression!
  • Sorequads said:

    Interesting comments on the tri representation, Phil. Not quite sure where I stand. Reg, Joe, any thoughts? The marathon equivalent has only been around a few years, and seems to have jumped in terms of difficulty to qualify. 

    My comment is mostly in jest: you get to pick a Strava profile picture and the choice of picture says a lot about you. I stole mine from some old guy who blows hard while running. I agree in principle with age group representation but it has to be properly managed. The V35 male standard for a half is 77:30 and Mo Farah is 37 and just ran 63 minutes for a half. There should be qualifications and a proper race and the top N from the race get the vests and not vice versa. 


  • Reg WandReg Wand ✭✭✭
    I have expensive bikes and a GB trisuit so I guess I am a tri wanker  :D GB representation can be both difficult and easy depending on distance, age and location of the championships. I entered a couple of qualification races for the Olympic distance early on and didn't get close. Longer distances tend to be easier as a lot of the quality is focused on Ironman events.
  • Reg WandReg Wand ✭✭✭
    I have also had hamstring issues so had a week off running. To compensate for a lack of progress there I have gone back to a sugar ban for a few weeks to try and get to race weight. I only mention it here to help commit myself to it :-)
  • Stevie  GStevie G ✭✭✭✭
    edited March 2021
    No-one would have a problem with you or JB donning the GB age vests Reg, as you're both strong runners, and excellent cycle monkeys.

    It's when you see guys 30-45 who wouldn't be in their own club's top 10-20 runners, and aren't particularly strong cyclists either, you wonder about.

    Having said that, I very much believe it's essential to do both bootleg and high quality races for variety. If you only do one end of the spectrum you'll either think you're better than you are, or worse than you are :)

    And no I;m not just setting the scene for when I go and do some Cock n Biscuit village 13 runner race just to claim a 3rd place V40 pot in summer ;)
  • SCoombes2SCoombes2 ✭✭✭
    True. Most people know who are 'good' and who are taking the pish.

    Got a great compliment off a good coach a few years back at the Stevenage relays. I had just won the Doug Anderson 5k in Bedford the night before in 15.38 (ah those were the days..) and we were talking about these 'mouthy' runners etc etc.

    He said to me..'I like you, because you know you're good....but not THAT good' ;)

    Made me laugh..He was coaching 13/14 min 5k runners at the time! Took it as a compliment.
  • Stevie  GStevie G ✭✭✭✭
    Running isn't the sport to be too cocky about, as everything is black and white on times.
    Yes, there's the elevation/windiness/training run type blaggery that we all love relying on, but you can't fake your best times on the rankings sites.
  • SCoombes2SCoombes2 ✭✭✭
    Yes we all know 'those' sorts in the local running scenes.
  • The BusThe Bus ✭✭✭
    Stevie G said:
    Running isn't the sport to be too cocky about, as everything is black and white on times.
    Yes, there's the elevation/windiness/training run type blaggery that we all love relying on, but you can't fake your best times on the rankings sites.
    Unless your name is Samir, and then it kinda works :smiley:

    Is your hamstring improving after a week off Reg? I'm convinced sitting at my desk is worse for it than running, though tonight's run was definitely less than comfortable! I suspect I might need to take a few days off both running and sitting, but given running is probably the only thing keeping me sane currently, other than Aldi's cheap, but rather pleasant Glen Marnoch Islay Single Malt and beer I'm loathe to stop - especially as the former is at lest moderating the weight increase being caused by the latter!
  • Stevie  GStevie G ✭✭✭✭
    Not your favourite time, but maybe there's a case of getting your run in pre-work, so that you get it in before hours of sitting about?
    Although it's difficult, as everyone knows runs are good for loosening those tight bits! Fine line at times.

    I find less of a problem these days, but maybe that's because I haven't done two "proper" sessions a week for a while, am barely driving, and although sit loads, it's not sitting "properly" like you have to do in an office.
  • Reg WandReg Wand ✭✭✭
    Bus - It has improved whilst not running but whether it would have improved anyway I don't know. Mine is a tear in a small area rather than general tightness. I did try running after a couple of days but it was grumbling straight away so I rather moodily returned to the house. Short test run was ok on Wednesday so I will do a proper length run today.

    Yesterday was a lunchtime Zwift race where I came 4th and did 351w for 24 minutes at 4.8 w/kg which is about 10 watts below where I was last year so the cycling is not too far off and should be on an upward curve.

    I lost my local legend status on a climb in the Chilterns this morning as someone else beat my 1 attempt with their second :-)

    To combat injuries I am regularly doing some Yoga stuff, I quite enjoy it, especially as I pick the sessions off Youtube based on the attractiveness of the instructor. I'll specify it's a female just in case someone is tempted with a wise crack.

    One of the reasons I wanted to give up football and start running was because I liked the idea that my efforts would be clear in black and white, having spent many years covering lazy people on the pitch.
  • Stevie  GStevie G ✭✭✭✭
    Having said that, it was back to the track today for the first time in maybe a month?

    Fancied at least 6x1km at 10k pace at 90secs, and then I'd see if I wanted to throw another rep in, or some tastier stuff.

    Bleak, bleak weather. Loads of rain, loads of wind. At times in those reps I did wonder about binning it down to shorter ones quite soon!

    However, stuck it through for the minimum of 6, and then threw in 2x400 and 2x200

    Didn't take splits per laps for the 1000s, a few cursoary glances at average pace, which obvs on a track wearing the watch on my right wrist going anti-clockwise, you have to add up to 15secs a mile to the average :) , so did them "on feel"

    3.29
    3.31
    3.32
    3.30
    3.32
    3.31

    (average 3.31)

    400s, 1.19x2
    200s, 37,35


    The road 1ks last Friday, were almost identical, but with 4x3.30, 1x3.31, and 1x3.33, and are just 1 second quicker as an overall basket.
    But it clearly shows what plenty of wind and rain combined do to times, even when you have the luxury of not having to look out at roads and for obstacles!
  • Stevie  GStevie G ✭✭✭✭
    edited March 2021
    Reg, the bit that running can't replace is scoring goals, and having a gang of teammates. I suppose you have the latter to some extent in running with say TVXC and team prizes, but i'd say it's only really those relays that come close, and even then you're not out there at the same time in an us v them battle.

    When I was about 23/24 I used to have an hour of footy with the work lot at 6pm, sometimes running there (2miles with a steep hill), and then quite insanely be back at the same venue, but indoors for an absolutely barking time slot of 10-11pm, for 5 a side, the same night :D 

    My fitness obviously increased in running terms after that, but for actual football powerhouse mode, mixed with super keeness, that was the absolute peak.
    It'd be 45mins into the second session, and i'd still be monstering about smashing it into corners and sprinting about, and being gutted when it got to 11pm.

    And then not being able to sleep until about 1am :D 
  • SorequadsSorequads ✭✭✭

    I feel for your Bus - I get really angst having to sit down for longer than twenty mins or so. Fine during a lesson when getting up to help etc, less so in a meeting. Sneak in a few off camera lunges?!

    Good effort with the race, Reg.

    Strong going with the extras after 6 x 1k, SG. 10 - 11pm is outrageously late!

    Had to check my strava profile photo, PMJ. Think it might be verging on your wrath - arm warmers and long socks! Although it was at Snowdonia Marathon in a storm. The arm warmers are a surprisingly good way to keep warm, yet still give options. 


    With yesterday’s filthily strong wind, I wend for the 2M loops of the racecourse. Figured this would give variation from the wind and not be as monotonous as 0.75M loops. 

    3M warm up round the river, then 4 x 2M loops of the racecourse: 14:44, 13:50, 13:05, 12:55, 1M warm down. All in, just shy of 12M at 7m/m. 

    Really pleasing session. Haven’t run a progression for ages. I like the lack of pressure of hitting splits throughout and it feels good to finish strong. Will definitely be having another crack at this at some point. Feeling in quite good nick. Come on races!

  • Stevie  GStevie G ✭✭✭✭
    edited March 2021
    I never quite understand SQ, why people wear arm wearers, but with a vest. As opposed to just wearing an equally thin, but long sleeved number.
    Similar to when people combine gloves with vests, or vests with tights in races etc.

    Takes all sorts I suppose, and in my early to mid racing days I used to wear some ludicrously big shorts, dodgy socks (some guy on a RW review once mentioned being gutted at being overtaken by a "kid wearing Bart Simpson socks" - that was me :) and a couple of times wearing skins for races)
    I can't even imagine wearing a thermal skin top for a half marathon now! Must have been roasting.


    Good progressions on those 2mile loops. There definitely is something freeing about not having those splits you need to hit, and just romping up the gears.

    I've kicked back into proper sessions targeting the 10k sort of zone, as firstly I've not raced a 10k since 2017, so at some stage I should do one, and it's a less harsh intro then jumping straight into 5k stuff.

    I'll wheel out the 5k plan I've used for a couple of years decently soon-ish.
    Has 4 pace zones, 5k-3k-1500-800, and 3 sessions in each over 12 weeks.
    You do 1 session in each zone, and then by sessions 5-8, the distance of the rep has ramped up, and similar 9-12.

    So for the 5k stuff, you start 8x600, 2x400,2x200, and then the first bit becomes 6x800, and then 5x1k.
    Those 400 and 200 bolt ons are useful, as you've had what could be described as a full session already, and then you put some pace in on the session worn legs.

    There's a couple of madly tough sessions late on, stuff like 5x400 at 800 pace, which I'm not certain is doable, even off 3min recoveries, but you've normally banked the gains from the first 9-10 or so sessions.



  • The BusThe Bus ✭✭✭
    Good sessions both!

    Might take that approach to yoga as well Reg!

    Its simples SG - depends what bit of you gets cold!  I feel the cold in my hands more than my arms, so often wear gloves with at or even a vest in something like Wokingham on a cold day. The big advantage of arm warmers instead of a long sleeved top is you can take them. You do need somewhere to shove them of course! (not that I have ever worn them!)

    Tights and a vest should definitely be illegal though :smiley:
  • SorequadsSorequads ✭✭✭
    Not raced a 10k since 2017, SG!!

    I'm generally with Bus. Arm warmers very useful for being to roll them down, up. Have only worn them at Snowdonia - where conditions more changeable and brutal than your standard marathon. Very useful though.

    Generally like to be as cold as possible when racing. 2019 Chichester 10k was 2C and wore the standard vest then, my 'racing' gloves. But never, as you say, vest and leggings. 
  • Stevie  GStevie G ✭✭✭✭
    It's funny how it works with frequency of racing distances at times.

    I have the strange record of 2 10milers in 2 weeks in 2012, and then going 6 years without another one.
    Way less 10milers than 10ks though. If you disregard parkruns, there's probably more 10ks then even 5ks.

    I wore gloves in 1 race, a freezing cold January XC race. Regretted it literally 100metres in, when it was unbearably sweaty and warm :D 
  • Reg WandReg Wand ✭✭✭
    I can't do arm warmers, I'd feel like one of those birds from the 1930s (guess), you know the ones, sparkly dress, cigarette in one of those fag holders.

    I did Wokingham in a hat once when it was properly cold. Otherwise it's vest, shorts and normal socks.

    Nice work on the sessions SG/SQ.

    9 miles done at lunch and hammy seemed ok but took it easy.


  • Stevie  GStevie G ✭✭✭✭
    A hat in a race. That just sounds way too hot. Unless you weren't racing it.

    I did a Bus style strava flag a while back and got a "report" of it back today, they seem to think it's correct.

    Even though the person is a 9min miler on normal runs, and has supposedly put a 4.52 paced 1/4miler in on a less that ideal route.
    Even though the graph shows them clocking 3min miling for 50% of it :D 

    Apparently you can't re-flag if they blag through it. Someone else can though :)
  • TRTR ✭✭✭
    I dont even wear a vest in the summer......always wear a cap or hat year round.....in the winter i wear what id wear for training as i see it as training, so long sleeve helly, t shirt, gloves, hat......i think it makes me better able to cope with warmer weather on race day in spring or summer
  • Reg WandReg Wand ✭✭✭
    Joe runs marathons in either a flat cap or his swimming trunks so I think anything goes.
  • SorequadsSorequads ✭✭✭
    Amazed you don’t do arm warmers on the bike, Reg. but then I am ten years out of date with my bike kit.

    Surely you need a best to get those summer gains, TR?

    Anyway, just entered an actual race! TR had previously mentioned the Shepperdine Marathon, south Gloucestershire, end of April. It is the same price (£23) for the marathon, or the recently added half. And you can change from one to other up to a couple of days before. 

    Have run the Berkeley 10k from the power station before and they are pretty, very quiet lanes. Rogue Runs put on a well organised event. 600 max limit across both events. Quite excited! 
  • Stevie  GStevie G ✭✭✭✭
    Cruising back in with a marathon is a big statement :)
    Although a HM too.

    Sounds like some of these setups down here where the value for money is great for the longer race.
    Some of our lot charge something like £20 for a 5k, maybe £25 for a 10k and £30 for a half. The worst pro rata value in history for the 5ks.
  • SorequadsSorequads ✭✭✭
    Definitely the half for me. The value for money element crossed my mind, but 23 is reasonable for a half. And the race fund hasn’t been dipped into for a long time!
  • The BusThe Bus ✭✭✭
    I'm confused TR - you're wearing a vest in your profile pic???

    Usual fair tonight, and after a day off work with minimal sitting around the hamstring was a fair bit better than last night - not gone, but easier, and progressively less sore as the very easy paced run went on.
  • Stevie  GStevie G ✭✭✭✭
    After a race obvs Bus :)

    TR strikes me as a man with exceptional discipline and routine. Making me look like a laid back freestyler extraordinaire.
    Same route, 20miles, no GPS, no music, same gear, same pace, no messing.

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