Moraghan Training - Stevie G

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  • Serious week Ric with some scary reps in the mix. All on top of your hard active job, you must feel in great shape.

      Nice run SG and PMJ. My ears were burning today but I'm attributing that to that big yellow thing in the sky  

    Tim. I feel your pain. My race report follows. Take comfort that you felt strong in the conditions - more to come for sure.  

  • Felsted 10k for me. Iron - Normally I'm a trigger man but the km markers were sooo far out (man) at the last 10k, I decided to leave the Garmin on mile auto today. target was 5.33  per mile (or 3.26 per km) to go sub 34.30. Of course, everything depended on the weather as i never fair well in the heat but at race start, although it was hot, the cloud cover meant no direct sun.

      As always, miles 1 & 2 were about settling into pace and identifying who around are looking good for the pace and who is being optimistic. 5.26 & 5.28. Most were optimistic and disappeared soon enough.  

    A few lumps and mile 3 in 5.39 but no problem - 5k done just ahead of 17.14 target. Water table at this point and I was in a group of 3 and one of the fellas basically grabbed a cup and stopped to drink it... I ran straight into the back of him.  

    Then the sun came out and it was strong but mile 4 was 5.34 so still on target but it was feeling hard now.  Then, as with my last 10k, the wheels fell off. Despite all the threshold running, I just couldn't keep the pace going and slowed. Fair to say I gave up mentally too - it was so damn hot and i just wanted to pack it in. Miles 5 & 6 done in 5.45 & 5.50. Not even threshold pace!   

    Finished in 34.56 according to Garmin, nearly 20 secs slower than a month ago and 30 seconds slower than my goal which I feel is well within grasp. Hugely disappointing as my recent 34.39 has been classed as kmt on Po10 so today's will count as PB. Might have to find another to do. Any suggestions?

  • RicFRicF ✭✭✭

    Johnas. Yes, I'm feeling pretty fresh at the moment. The reason is probably a result of avoiding heat damage and a kind of 'couldn't care less' attitude to my daily run pace.

    I'll plod along at 8/9 minute miling as long as I stick to the plan, and the plan is to accept whatever numbers emerge from a run rather than force them out because my ego can't handle slow numbers.

    I eat and drink at all sorts of times. Eat later runs are out. Can't afford to drain my resources in such a way, too damaging. My chats with Bob Parker (Dave Bedford's coach) revealed that much was made of Dave's huge mileages. Nothing was made of the fact that he was eating and drinking almost continuosly. Loads of beer, fish and chips. masses.

    Well done on your race. The heat can sort of creep up on you in these events. I tend to pour water all over my head during such conditions if possible.

    My latest discovery is about how much water a 'flannel' can hold. While doing the 40 x 200's this morning, the flannel kept things nicely cool throughout.

    Smoothering one's limbs in sunblock and moisteriser appears to retain the cooling effect to a large degree. Word of warning, don't put sun-block on your forehead. I'd done this before the BUPA 10k and spent quite a bit of the race dealing with stinging eyes.image

    According to some authorities, a temperature of 25C will add at least 10 seconds per mile over the ideal of 10C. In the 'Complete Runners Handbook', Glover estimates 25 seconds per mile at 26C. 

    I wish!

    I predict Johnas that if you can keep cool/cooler in these conditions you'll nail a sub 34 minute 10k.

  • Cheers guys.

    Well done Jonas, better than me!

    Stevie .. No GPS for me, just my watch (I have a footpod but don't wear it for races, just look at the stopwatch).  1st KM marker came at 4:36, then 2nd at over 8mins.. third in 11:30 .. made no sense!

    The start on the track was the wrong way and the event brochure had it only going around once then off a different route the other way.. 

    Took a glance down the results; many PBd so I can only put it down to disorientation/false sense of security.. I must have thought I was going at a better pace than I was.. no wonder it didn't feel too hard!

  • Stevie  GStevie G ✭✭✭
    RicF wrote (see)

     

    I predict Johnas that if you can keep cool/cooler in these conditions you'll nail a sub 34 minute 10k.

    And he means next time out, so get cracking image

     

  • RicFRicF ✭✭✭
    Stevie G . wrote (see)
    RicF wrote (see)

     

    I predict Johnas that if you can keep cool/cooler in these conditions you'll nail a sub 34 minute 10k.

    And he means next time out, so get cracking image

     

    I sure do.image

    Looking through some results and discovered a runner who finished less than half a minute ahead of me last week (ok, 29 seconds) had run 16:13 for a 5000m two weeks earlier.

    I suppose he could have been compromised since then but never mind. it gives me hope.

    10k in Regents Park next week. Temperatures predicted to hit the 30's. I predict many a 'blow up', like last year in the heat. Only worse.

    Despite being a club event I noticed a number of guest runners. Only cost them £1 so a cheap race.

    Battersea in 5 weeks is a target of sorts for me. Sub 29 minutes last year. Sheer velocity seems to flatten out in the 5:40's regardless, the ability to just keep going however is much improved. That'll have to do. For now.

  • Stevie  GStevie G ✭✭✭

    There's always the chance he's one of these runners who do races as tempos, but that kind of thing is always promising Ric. I'm a big fan of that kind of conversion type stuff.

    Johnas, add in some high temp, and you can probably lose any amount of time, so 20secs isn't too bad. There is however, a reason why targeting a June-August race as a pb hunt is risky!

    2 years ago I got away with a "just a bit hot" pb at the Dorney Dash. But imagine if that'd been this year, it'd have been miserable!

  • Finished off my week with a 5 mile jog and a bit of rowing. 60 miles... Slightly less this week because of the 10k. 

  • The BusThe Bus ✭✭✭

    Very good performances from the pair of you in the heat, even with a bit of accimatisation, so don't be hard on yourselves!

    Ric-  that's one hell of a week!!  Personally I follow the Dave Bedford training model in all aspects apart from the mileage, intensity and speed image

    SG/Philip - very good pace for that long run as well! Funnily enough, that's the same pace I did on this evening hilly XC 10k, which was my fastest off-road training run for a very long time, and I thought I was going some! Made it 55M running and 40 odd cycling for the week. 

    Topped off a very nice day, with a few hours pootling about the Thames near Weybridge in the canoe. even got a bit of open water swimming in! Feel slightly cooked now - bit like the lamb I just did on the barbyimage

    Two easy weeks to come now, split up by the beast that is the Wycombe Half before the rampinig up to Abingdon!

     

     

     

     

  • Stevie seeStevie see ✭✭✭

    Tim... two things. You ran slower because you totalled 60 miles for the week! And... get a GPS watch! image

     

    Sounds like a solid outing Johnas, still got a sub 35 on the board? No harm in that! I'd like to get a sub 36 on there this year! You can threshold run all you like, but when's it's hot, it's hot and it will hurt at some point! Don't worry about it. image

    7.75 for me, 55 for the week. 3K on Tuesday!

  • DachsDachs ✭✭✭

    Sorry to hear about some disappointing 10ks there from Tim and Johnas.

    Tim, if you've ramped up the mileage a bit it just looks like some of those miles are in your legs.  The fast times will come, just keep going with it and don't force it.

    Johnas, bad luck on that, sometimes it just doesn't happen.  Who on earth stops at water stations at sub-35 pace?  But even so, still a sub 35, which isn't too bad for an off day.

    Bus, you're taking to these parkruns.  Ryan runs my own local one sometimes, seems a nice bloke.  I seem to recall he's got one of the highest win counts in parkrun, maybe that's what motivates him.

  • DachsDachs ✭✭✭

    New Forest 10 today was pretty brutal.  30 degrees, 11:15 start, very little shade (it's not as forested as might be expected, much of it on exposed heath).  The announcer seemed to be egging us on to drop out even as we lined up.  The worst aspect was that there was virtually no shade in the race area beforehand, so I'd been stood in the blazing sun for a good hour + beforehand.  However, we'd camped opposite the night before, so didn't have to knacker myself out travelling down.

    In the first mile, a little group of 4 developed at the front, and I was happy enough to hang back a bit behind that group and stick with Ben M-D from Bracknell, which I pretty much did for the first 3 or 4 miles.  At mile 2, I basically almost ran into a horse, as he wandered out in front of me.  Then he and his equine chums trotted down the course for a bit, and I had the rare opportunity to overtake a bunch of horses. 

    3 or 4 miles in, one bloke fell off the group ahead and we went past him, and shortly after that I started to pull away in 4th.  Could still see the group ahead, so I kept plugging away, but was tiring badly in the heat.  Not much to report for the next few miles, but about 7 miles in, a young guy from one of Ric's clubs fell off the lead group and I went past.  He stuck with me for a bit but I was able to open a gap, and could see that 2nd was starting to come into reach as well.  However, the last miles were hard, and I had to break into a very short jog on a couple of occasions.  I was still gaining on 2nd, but the finish came too soon for that, and I ended up 3rd in 57:21.

    That's some way behind what I'd be looking for in a quick 10-miler.  Not quite a PB course in ideal conditions (flattish, but plenty of gravel, some of it a little loose), but decent enough - but given the heat, I have to be pleased with that.  It is a PB only because I don't already have a 10 mile PB, and slower than my time at 10 miles at Wokingham Half, but RunBritain has it as my best performance.

    Spent the rest of the day sat around picnicing.  Nice.  Before joining what seemed like all of London trying to drive back up the M3.

  • RicFRicF ✭✭✭

    Dach's, I reckon you can safely factor in a 15 seconds per mile loss into that one, well done on taking it on.

    Trying to think of any 'young guy' from either of my clubs who would take on a race of that distance and operate at that speed. In the Metro's the only one capable would be Nigel R, but he's a V50. Harrow AC has several guys who could operate at the required pace but being so 'track minded' damn near shit themselves at the thought of any distance beyond 5k.

     

  • Nice run there Dachs, good result in the heat. Looking at the results it shows you were not far off second nor first and had a healthy lead on fourth: looks like that lad lost a lot over the last 3.

    You have to watch B M-D, writes a very funny blog on fetch. I hear rumours he may be jumping ship as his GF is now a Dasher.

    My runbritain ranking has jumped up again, seems the relays were ultra tough so were given a SSS of 2.8 though my vSSS was 0.7 so I didn't run well. compared to others?

     

    SSS is a measure of the speed of the course and conditions on the day and is used to adjust the basic handicap scores so times on slow, average and fast courses can be directly compared. The lower the value, the faster the course on the day.

    vSSS is the difference between your performance and the SSS value. The lower the value, the better you performed compared to everybody else. Negative values mean you performed better than the norm.

  • DachsDachs ✭✭✭

    Sorry RIc, not your club at all.  Confused Harrow and Hillingdon.  It's all London innit,

  • Stevie  GStevie G ✭✭✭

    Dachs, cracking effort. All I can say is that it's a mark of how you've come on, in that we're looking at the results surprised to see you as low as 3rd! A far cry from the chap who was beaten by a chump like me at Wokingham 2 years ago image

    Better still, Ric has you at 54:50 10mile pace on a good day! Anything less, and you're letting the thread down image What's up next?

  • Thanks for all the comments and for your optimism Ricimage But that's my short stuff over with besides this Sunday's Olympic Park 5 miler. Anyone else doing it? Then it's joining the rest of you marathon training.

    Awesome result Dachs. Excited to see what you're going to do at Abbo. Will you be doing Maidenhead Half out of interest?

    Bus - envious of your little Thames cruise. Growing up in Maidenhead and on the Thames, I do miss messing about on the water. As much as I love Tunbridge Wells, it could do with a river.

  • The BusThe Bus ✭✭✭

    Nicely done Dachs! After a race like that, you must have loved the queue up the M3!

    Johnas - yep, must admit I do feel priviliged having the Thames not far away as wellas the Chilterns on my back door step (though I'd swap it for Ullswater and the Lakes if I'm being picky!!).

    My brother in law suggested I do the Richmond PArk duathlon with him in Spetember, whihc sounded good until I looked up the cost - £68!!!!

  • ML84ML84 ✭✭✭

    I was walking up the Lakes on Saturday Bus. Walked up Paveys Ark. I'd post some pictures but i can't get them up. Haha. Burnley can get quite a bad name but is two mins from the Pennines and on the doorstep of the Lake District and the Yorkshire Dales. 

  • DachsDachs ✭✭✭

    Johnas - likely to be doing Maidenhead, but there's a possible clash with a family thing I need to iron out in the next week or so.  If not I'll try to find another half somewhere.

    Tunbridge Wells could surely create its own river if all the residents wrung out their blue rinses at the same time in the town centre?

    SG - Cheers for the words.  I'm getting a bit spoiled on the top 3 positions this year - 7 in a row since April! Frome Half Marathon is next up, next weekend.  Could be another tough one.

  • The BusThe Bus ✭✭✭

    At least Tunbridge Wells has a bit of rock climbing to mess about on though Johnas...

    Matt - I'm very jealous! Did you go via Jack's Rake?

    I was going to go out for reps at lunch, but decided as I'm racing Sunday, my legs are feeling pretty heavy and its darned hot, I went for a bit of a walk instead...

  • Think you've got TW mixed up with Eastbourne Dachs. T-Dubbz as we call it is both young and down with the kids


    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=meF5X1X_5RI
  • literatinliteratin ✭✭✭

    Johnas & Dachs, you are both actually thinking of Bexhill-on-sea, where I went to college. That video is amazing though.

  • Bluenose74Bluenose74 ✭✭✭

    Dachs... Cracking result mate.... Can see you winning that one next weekend... Didn't realise they had also changed the 10k course, down into town, then up,up,up and out the other side, let the nightmares begin....

  • ML84ML84 ✭✭✭

    Bus, I did go via jacks Rake. i went with my brother and his father in law who is a mountain leader. The views were spectacular. If I won the lottery id be up there in a shot. I wouldn't go up jacks rake again though, I /forum/smilies/confused_smiley.gifh@t]sh@t myself. 

    Great run there too Dachs. Consistently churning out quality results since I've been posting on here. 

    Track Monday for me on the back of a 71 mile week last week which included running up Pendle, Bouldsworth, whernside and ingleborough plus two speed sessions. Also had a day off in there. I did 5 x 1000 off 2 mins (rec slightly longer as I just wanted to try and knock out some quick ones and hoping to not smash myself up with sale on Thursday) 

    3.08- 3.05- 3.03- 3.05- 2.59 ( put in a big finish from 200 out on the last one) hopefully I've not left my best on the track again. 

  • The BusThe Bus ✭✭✭

    There's a couple of pretty exposed bits on Jacks Rake, that's for sure! Not nice when its wet...

    Nice fast reps there, especially after a big week.Looking good for the next outings.

     

  • Sounds like some solid runs in the heat guys, Its never going to be superfast above 25 degrees. Well done for the sub 35 Johnas, be interesting to see what you do over the 5 miler. Tim from your 5k the other week there is plenty to come and I agree with SG, get a GPS watch!

    Dachs thats sound like a fast time to me, good job on the 3rd place! And a half marathon this weekend, going to be another hot one by the looks of it, go for the win image

    Big mileage from Ric and Matt last week in particular, I do struggle to go slow enough on my easy runs and am often looking at the watch, I think this stops me from getting enough miles in. Still, 56m last week, 2nd highest ever so building up steadily.

  • Thanks Seb... Been checking the sports tours international Facebook page and the event pages on this site.. People are saying it was long.. A few saying 10.4k as I suspected.. Will probably never know.

    Anyway, 3000 tomorrow with Stevie S and gonna watch Dean's 800 afterwards! 

  • Stevie  GStevie G ✭✭✭

    Only a top inform runner or a complete nutter would do back to back 10milers and half marathons on consecutive weekends in this heat! image

    Tim, it happens old son. That Bupa 10k I did a while back seemed to come out 1/5 mile long, which seems impossible for a race that is the national 10k championships. I know the guy who coaches the chap who came 2nd (to Mo Farah!), and he's convinced it's been long for a while, as he hasn't touched the times he did years back despite equal fitness.

    Matt, very fast reps. I did a flat out 1k a couple of years in 2.57, so to do a 2.59 to end the set is madness! (granted i'm sure I did the first 400 shockingly quick, and then the rest dribbled away, but still!)

  • The BusThe Bus ✭✭✭

    Or a top, in form nutter image

    Double for me today. After a rest day yesterday, this morning 7.5M xc started off OK, but by the end  my legs were feeling pretty sore. Odd, but possibly just a hangover from last week. We'll see how tonights run home goes.

    On the plus side, my hamstring issue seems to be turning a corner (touch wood) and I've been able to sit down at work with much less pain than before, after last weeks physio visit and a my focussing on the full range of stretches and exercises I've been given. Fingers crossed with that one!

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