Moraghan Training - Stevie G



  • DachsDachs ✭✭✭

    Johnas - just goes to show how marathoning can be. I really thought sub 2:40 with change was totally nailed on for you today. Hopefully the PB will be some consolation. Just really bad luck with that cramp, not much you can do about it. Come do London next year, we can pace each other round to a comfortable sub 2:40. Then we can both retire from marathons for a bit. Anyway, thinkm this time last year youd have happily taken 2x sub 2:45s in 2013.

    Hope you enjoy some beers, you deserve them.

  • DachsDachs ✭✭✭

    Dean, good to see you back out there, and matt a decent result on a hilly course.

  • Johnas, a PB is a PB and you can't ask for more. It is nice to move ahead in big chuks but that is the right direction to move in.

    Slinkz, surely Doom is a Cornish beer, lots of nice ales on the IOW: we had a few really nice ones a few years ago on holiday.

  • Cheers all. As you say, PB is PB so not too disheartened. Disappointment comes as I know I'm in form and everything was running to plan. Never had cramp before and hadn't bargained for it to spoil the party. That's the unpredictability of marathon running.

    Dachs - that sounds like a plan for London. Swore yesterday never again, but you know how it is!
  • Johnas, I can understand your frustrations after such a good period of training, but a PB is always good news, as is a sub 2:45 for the second time in a year.

    Dean, good recovery after losing your shoe.

    Matt, well done on a windy 10k... Don't worry about the time, you've got much quicker in you. 

    Easy paced 11 miler for me yesterday in 1:18.

    got a 14k trail race this weekend but feel really out of shape after my hols. Will see how it goes. Not sure I even fancy speed sessions this week. Haven't done any runs quicker than 7mile/min since the half marathon a month back. 

  • Well done Johnas. Even if you're not best pleased with it at the moment, there won't be many people who've run a 2h 42m mara in their lives.

    Glad to hear you got back racing Dean.

    Rest day for me yesterday followed by a windy track today. 4 x 800m (200m jogs) 300m (300m jogs). 800s came out as 2:55 (ha!), 3:01 (bit more like it); 3:05; 3:02 and 300s as 63s; 65, 64, 65. Had a bit of stumble in the last 300m... my right knee just went and then put my landing on my left foot out.. recovered ok but I can see how easy it easy to do some serious damage on the track!!

  • TRTR ✭✭✭

    Johnas - did you do anything differently training wise in the build up. The thinking behind cramp is now more of a lack of specific training/pushing too hard than a salts/electrolytes thing. I'm kind of undecided, I usually get a bit of hammy cramp in the last few miles, but think its a lack of training (or build up races) thing now.

  • Well done Johnas. Can't remember if I said that already or not! Nice on Matt.

    Good track sesh Scottish. When I started speedwork up again last month I found my body was all over the shop at speed. Some core work should sort that.

    14km today in a tad over an hour.

  • Iron, I've always wondered... what are these 'pirate' badges about?

    A 7.4 for me, with a slow start in the dark then a silly, silly last 4 miles of 6:40, 6:20, 6:12 and 6:35. I'll pay for that tomorrow no doubt! image

  • Pirate is the RW tri 'club'. The original ethos (so I'm told) was to go do an Iron-distance tri as the first one. Something like less than 9 months after a typically sedantary lifestyle. No pressure, all for fun, etc.

    Of course that has all changed now, and we've produced a few fast ones and had 3 people race in the Ironman world champs this year in Hawaii.

    Enjoy the DOMS image

  • 14 miles yesterday lunchtime to bring up 200.49 miles for October with 3 more running days to go.

    I see the Newcastle Town Moor marathon was won by Nigel Rackham aged 51. It was the BMAF champs so no surprise a lot of vets were running but a quality run to do 2:36 with second place in 2:42.

  • quick check in. 8x600s at 10k pace, 200jog this morning. Averaged in between 2.02/2.03.

    Keep up the good work all.

  • If I can do a sub 2:40 when I'm 50 I'll die a happy man.


  • TR - did i do anything different? The short answer is yes - everything.

    At the start of August I changed my coach due to some poor 10k results. the timing wasn't ideal as it was the same week maratyhon specific training was due to start but instead we focused on quality and introduced lots of tempo running. the results soon followed with break throughs at HM (sub 75) and 10K (33mins).

    The focus of this quality and racing was that I sacraficed more marathon specific training in my opinion. I said as much on this thread but hoped that quality over quantity would reign supreme. In those 3 months, i ran over 20 miles only 4 times with only 2 runs over 21 miles and maybe that's where the problem lies.

    I know it's easy and almost cliche to blame 'lack of long runs' but in hindsight maybe that was the case. In previous campaigns i've run 6 - 8 20 mile+ and mostly on consecutive weekends. whether cramp came on due to this lack of endurance and time on feet, who knows but it's definitely plausible

  • ML84ML84 ✭✭✭

    If I sacked my coach I'd be homeless.image 

  • How do I get a coach? 

    Went for a rep session with a club group yesterday. There were some juniors and no runners my level so it was nice and easy after my break.

    Each rep consisted of 250m hill, turn around and jog down to a flat junction, 250m flat out and then a jog back to the start. Had to wait for the others, regroup then go again.

    Did 6 of these. Not really a useful workout so went completely flat out on the last bit.  For a worthwhile workout, it should have been 8 reps with no recovery (the jog back was sufficient in my opinion).

    Went up on the fells this morning, ran up a small fell that was very steep, then ran around the base. Just 6 miles and my lungs are burning even 3 hours afterwards! 


  • RicFRicF ✭✭✭
    Philip_M_Jones wrote (see)

    I see the Newcastle Town Moor marathon was won by Nigel Rackham aged 51. It was the BMAF champs so no surprise a lot of vets were running but a quality run to do 2:36 with second place in 2:42.

    Its possible that I might have had something to do with this.

    After the last drubbing I received at the feet of NR. I ventured if he'd ever considered running at international level as a vet?

    Not knowing the process I pointed him in the direction of joining (2nd claim) one of the official vets clubs. I also mentioned that the BMAF would only consider runners who could 'age grade' in the 90% plus region. (One for the ego, that one)

    I had no idea he'd done anything about any of this until this result. I guess he likes the look of the 'Gold' medal as he's joined the same vets club as I have.

    SCVAC 10 mile champs in November at Epsom.

    If Nigel turns up, I'll be a very distant silver at best.

  • TRTR ✭✭✭

    Johnas - mmm, sounds like you did pretty well off that low amount of long runs then, how about MP running of MLRs ? Could have been a good return on the investment that you did put in, as it makes you wonder how much more you'd have had to put in to make a sub 2:40. There comes a point when it takes a lot more miles to gain a few minutes, although I bet with a few more long runs you'd have fared a bit better. Impressive performance given the lack of miles.

  • Quick update, another track tempo of 10mins, 7.5mins, 5mins, 5mins, 2.5mins all @tempo, with the shorter reps hitting 10K a per usual. 30mins of tempo running though!

  • Good session SS. Track lunch for me tomorrow.

  • Johnas great marathon in my humble opinion never dish a PB as it's a PB image

    Mattl strong 10k in difficult conditions

    Scottish nice maiden parkrun win

    And everyone else great training as always.

    Its been just over 2 weeks since my 28 week uninterupted training block came crashing down with "another" calf pull image and I was forced to rest for 3 days!! this time I did something different and I was recommended to see a guy for some alternative treatment and this is how it went

    1) calf pull severe pain in 3 areas on the Saturday limping all day Sat/Sun pain on every footstep

    2) Monday pain eased a little but very tender to touch went to see new guy in afternoon

    3) Monday night pain seems to have gone ? strange

    4) Tue/Wed morning no pain went to see Guy again Wed afternoon and then told to run that evening did 3.2 mile at 7.13 pace no pain but slight tightness

    5) Thur ran 5 at  7.15 min mile

    6) Fri went for treatment again ran 6 mile that night, 7 mile Saturday and 8.5 mile Sunday

    7) Tue tried two efforts in run 2.5k at 5.55 pace and 1k at 5.40 pace all ok, Friday tried efforts again in run 2 mile stretch including a big hill at 6 min mile overall 8 mile run at 6.23 pace

    8) all other runs steady and 57 mile for the week (21 mile prev week)

    9) last night last test to check calf 8 mile progresive starting 7.10 down to 6.00 min miles kept to pace first 5 mile and then went 6.12,6.01 and 5.35 (oops) felt great and very comfortable throughout

    10) How do you explain that!!! calf good and strong and confidence came flooding back image

    Roll on 2014!

  • 28week running streak Rob? Wow. After my long run on a Wednesday, i embrace the mini break until Friday, not sure i'd handle every day, let alone for 28weeks! Is it big mileage? Do you not find such a streak just relentless?

    Reading about your calf pain made me think how rare it is we have things that actually stop us running for a few days. Niggles, yes loads, things that actually force rest not so much.

    14miler done this morning. Certainly the longest I've ever done before work, but felt bizarrely comfortable. 6.57 pace, but could probably have still been going now if i'd fancied. Only a low level slight left ankle feeling, but that seems to come on every 5-6months or so.

    The rest of today will be mostly recovering/eating!

    ps Johnas, what happened with your coaching situation. When we last spoke you were saying how great it was going and seemed well into it, and the results, certainly marathon seemed to be cracking. 
    Would you say in hindsight that the 10k/5mile breakthroughs were at the expense of the marathon? Is it possible to breakthrough at both at once?

  • StevieG  - I didn't find the running streak relentless quite the opposite invigorating but a little obsessiveimage I was averaging approx 57 mile a week ranging from 53ish lowest to 62ish a week highest depending on racing!

    I agree re the niggle thing and you can rest assured the older you get the more the niggles are ever presentimage though calf good at moment hammy/glute sore rightside, knee and achilles intermitent pain at start left side other than that bloody great image

    Just spotted thread with Samir/Scott wow that kid's goodimage


  • that's comforting to know for the future! not!

    I suppose having an extra day to cover the mileage over helps, but i can't see a time i'd go 7days a week. Having said that, i didn't see a time i'd be doing 14milers before work!

  • and those 2 will look back on that thread with embarrasment. Both could be real quality, but Samir especially has carried on in such a way that he'll have to do amazing times for anyone to say well done now!

  • The BusThe Bus ✭✭✭

    How about Ullock Pike, Skiddaw and Carl Side before breakfastimage

  • DachsDachs ✭✭✭

    Rob, good to see you've avoided a nasty injury.

    Johnas and I have reversed our fortunes.  This time last year, Johnas had a faster marathon and I had a faster 10K and Half.  Now it's the other way round.  Personally, I don't think it's possible to be in optimum marathon and 10K form at the same time.  Having said that, I still think Johnas was in shape to go nicely under 2:40 and maybe just suffered some bad luck with the wind and cramp.

    As for my running, I returned to running with a 4 on Monday, 4 on Tuesday and 5 today.  Running like an old man.  Slightly concerned about a bit of tightness in the groin area (settle down!), particularly given that, if I remember correctly, it was a groin issue that hit Chingo post marathon and took him out indefinitely.  I was thinking about having a stab at Gosport in November to capitalise on the marathon training, but not sure I want to push it.  Having a race I'm aiming for always makes me take risks with injury I might not otherwise take.

  • Dachs I think wise to watch groin over next few weeks indeed it was Chingo's groin that caused issues but it has also maifested into hip issues I think for him last time I communicated with him running was not on the agenda until he felt sorted image

    I aslo know a guy with a pinched nerve in his groin and he's struggling too he's a v50 and 15.35 5k upto 2.42 marathon this year so real quality!

  • DeanR7DeanR7 ✭✭✭

    rob - glad its going well.

    coach had me doing a 5*1k session to find my speed again, target 3.07 off 3 min rec.

    3.11, 3.10, 3.12, 3.13, 3.13.  thats 2 sessions on the bounce where i have missed every rep by a distance. 3 weeks ago i was chruning out 6*1m reps in 5.13 (3.15km pace) and hitting them well. now im struggling to hit that on half the volume.  agreed with my coach i will give it a 400 session on thursday and try the 5k reps again next tuesday and if no change if going back to basics and just doing easy running for all of november and i build again.  Leeds abbey dash has no chance at this moment.

    i bought the daniels book, had a flick through and i have a number of questions already. but will read it properly before i embarass myself.

  • Dean don't over analyise you don't loose fitness that quick but obviously your confidence has taken a knock. John D has proven with the 2 of you working together you can get it right time after time, you are having a temporary blip and God help anyone who takes you for grantedimage

    3.12 average is pretty damn good ( recovery too long thoughimage )

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