Moraghan Training - Stevie G

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Comments

  • RicFRicF ✭✭✭

    SG, e gods, races. They're all adversity aren't they? You're clearly training in the right zones after all.

    Had a thought about your peak HM of '75'. Didn't that come after an enforced lay off due to injury? 

    Its the larger picture featuring the peaks and troughs.

    robT. My blood lactic results indicate I'm pathetic.

  • RicF  - I don't think so!

     

  • Stevie  GStevie G ✭✭✭

    Ric, not at all old son.

    Between September 2012 and Spring 2013, I had a period of monumental training and racing that even long time heroes like yourself found themselves having a glowing heart over.

    Interestingly (well...interesting by the standards of a running forum), even in that spell, that saw big pbs at 5k, 5m, 10k x2, 10m and HM, I still had 2 10ks come out under par due to high wind!

    Showing that even in top notch training you're still beholden to weather.

    Looking back, there was a 10k/HM/5k pb over 4 weeks.

    The challenge is getting back to that fare.

    Rob, I like the way that even at your age, you're still looking for new impetus, new ways to improve. That's some impressive stuff old son.

  • Stevie G Thanks but I look at Runners like Andy Ward, Andy Green, Martin Rees to name just 3 and think Jesus they're fast for their age so why can't I go faster after all I did have a 22 year rest!!!!! (alcohol abuse ignored)

  • Stevie  GStevie G ✭✭✭

    shame you had that Rob, but the important thing is you did come back.

    And are still storming it.

    And it's good to see that training hard well into 40s and beyond is doable.

  • RicFRicF ✭✭✭

    Thanks for the support guys.

    At times I wonder if what we do is worth it, and then a couple of comments in the right place and I know we're all definitely right in the mix.

    As for new impetus. I'll find out if the strength training emphasis works at the Southern 12 stage at Milton Keynes. 

    I was total crap there two years ago, surely I couldn't be any slower.

  • V50 in December really looking forward to 2015 already!! and I haven't even raced this year Trafford 10k this Sunday to set benchmark for improvement when try the new training regime!

     

  • Stevie  GStevie G ✭✭✭

    That's it Ric.

    It's nice when you're pbing and are billy massive balls, but it's just nice to be able to train injury free, go and do a 10miler or something in the fresh air, and be able to enjoy being fit.

    Helping Lit and Skinny in their aims is a new angle too. Obviously depends on finding people with the right drive or commitment too though!

  • It's an interesting discussion. In cycling,  input can be measured as Watts. This removes wind,  pace,  HR,  how you feel on the day,  effect of caffeine, etc. 

    Pace training in running or cycling measures output,  and is subject to perturbation through wind,  inclines,  etc. 

    HR isn't pure input, maybe first derivative or something. I think Rob's approach is the best way to deal with HR,  better than resting and max HR to define zones alone. 

    Stevie G wrote (see)

    Iron, out of interest, how do you account for hills, feeling slightly under the weather, different weather conditions etc.

    Surely all of those will affect the readings?

    For me the HR is a cap to stop me going too hard. If the HR is reached then I cap effort regardless of pace. Keep things easy effort. Yesterday I was capped at 140bpm and had to walk a lot. To give you an idea,  an avg 150bpm on a flat run gave me 10mi/min.

    My max HR is very close to 200. I'm a high revving 2stroke.

  • Stevie  GStevie G ✭✭✭

    True say Iron. I'm obsessed enough without adding HR to the mixer.

    7x800 up tomorrow. Best do a good job, or Ric'll  tell me off in only the way he can image

  • IronCat my zone 4 (easy/recovery) is to run in range of 140-150BPM and I averaged 6.35 min miles with HR ave 147, to keep in zone it took me about 2 miles to regulates as HR all over the place but eventually got in and more importantly stayed in the zone. Stevie G I found to stay in zone I slowed down going uphill and ran a little faster down only marginally I even found myself preparing to do that. I was surprised by average pace as I didn't look at that at all during run only when I'd finished image

     

  • Stevie  GStevie G ✭✭✭

    ive obviously never tried HR, but a guy called Dai Roberts swore by it, and he was a 30min 10k man at peak...and won the Wokingham half in 1hr 13 or so aged 45 ish!

    So I'm sure it has its uses!

  • RicFRicF ✭✭✭

    Indeed SG, how about doing the 800's uphill? 

  • Stevie  GStevie G ✭✭✭

    i've got my work cut out on the track thanks son!

    Well, in fairness, i'll be pleased to see the track still in one piece for starters, as it's on massively borrowed time now before being demolished.

    Which is a real blow, but it's been great for a few years.

  • Is the track being rebuilt or demolished forever?

     

  • Stevie  GStevie G ✭✭✭

    Demolishing this one imminently, amidst a general overhaul of the whole sports centre next to it.

    And then building a new one about 5miles away in a tiny town with nothing else around. Seems an odd idea,

    Will make the days of getting the track session in and getting to work on time quite optimistic, if you can even get onto it that early anyway. Hopefully it won't all be locked up that early.

  • That's annoying hope it all works out

  • Stevie  GStevie G ✭✭✭

    ta! may well lead to short term pain of having to do intervals on flat road sections, but can't worry about what we can't control.

    And makes a good disclaimer for not hitting times image

  • I do all my speed work on road now as I felt track aggravated calf issues in my old bodyimage I think it's easier to hit paces on track but after all we largely race on roads, paths etc.

    I did 8*150m (approx.) strides on roads today ave pace approx. 4.35min/mile this was a pre race session after 4 miles steady at 7.10 min miles on forest paths now 2 very easy days!!

  • Stevie  GStevie G ✭✭✭

    strides? that sounds more like flat out sprints to me!

    One of the (few) true things Ric has ever said (just kidding Ricky image), was that in a race one of the key things is knowing you can run flat out without being smashed down by something.

    That has to help on the track too, whereas the road/pavement always has a slight risk.

  • Haha promise I was running quick but not flat out!! I find big risks of road pavement are potholes, kerbs and traffic!! you can't just go for it as you're always having to scan ahead unlike the track when you can concentrate on running and form!!

  • robT wrote (see)

    IronCat my zone 4 (easy/recovery) is to run in range of 140-150BPM and I averaged 6.35 min miles with HR ave 147, to keep in zone it took me about 2 miles to regulates as HR all over the place but eventually got in and more importantly stayed in the zone. Stevie G I found to stay in zone I slowed down going uphill and ran a little faster down only marginally I even found myself preparing to do that. I was surprised by average pace as I didn't look at that at all during run only when I'd finished image

     

    Obviously we're different abilities and different people. For that pace I'd be mid 170s. image

    I guess the aim is to regain some aerobic fitness and then increase it. Like you I find it takes a while for the HR to stabilise. Also as I'm running slower I'm wearing long sleeve top which always seem to cause static issues and HRM spikes. 

  • My triathlete friends all train using HRM it seems to be accepted much more than by runners!

    As you say we are all different and there is training you do I'd never dream of being able to do and visa versa but that's why I love sport image we all compete to the best of our ability.

  • DeanR7DeanR7 ✭✭✭

    Rob, smash trafford

    8*300 ave pace 48 secs off 3 mins rec.  felt controlled and Something to build on.

  • Thanks Dean I'll be trying my hardest but don't have speed endurance base yet but will have!! trying to go under 34 but we'll see image my confidence has gone sky high since the lactic tests and the times that I've been told are achievable based on my lactic threshold results and its very exciting but need to build speed endurance to achieve any where near potential even at 49!! will take a little time but hope Christleton will be another strong marker

    Good session speedy as always image are you doing Christleton, good luck in Inters

  • DeanR7DeanR7 ✭✭✭

    Cheers, I should be doing christleton as johns training plan is based on getting me 5k fitness going into the track season so I might as well have a crack at christleton.

  • ML84ML84 ✭✭✭

    I entered christleton the other day. Thread day out! image 

    just the usual pre race sluggishness from me. Feel absolutely wiped out this week. Canned a run on the treadmill at 7min mile pace after 4 miles last night as i felt really leggy. day off today then a few strides on sat. Only ran 22 miles this week so far too. 

     

  • RicF - your posts on here do make a difference! I have picked up many sessions from this thread across the years, including a few from your good self. What is interesting about your posts is you seem to throw in the odd curve ball that makes me stop and reflect. For example, Stevie G often posts on other threads about training at your current level of fitness and not at a target time (a sound point). However he is currently training based on last years times and not this. My instinct would be to push on at last years times but can see what you say about stepping back to previous training zones (train at your current fitness).

    Matt3 - cut mileage for Trafford 10k myself and also feeling leggy. Good luck to you and Rob on Sunday. If I get to 7.5K when you finish I will be on for a PB image

  • RicFRicF ✭✭✭

    Cheers Max. I'm constantly trying to make sense of this running/training activity of ours.

    The mystery is that while there appears to be rules in the training process, there also appears sometimes to be no rules. The target constantly moves.

    I have difficulty where someone says/sells, "This is the way to do it", a cut and dried procedure/recipe/instruction manual.  Not that simple.

     

  • DeanR7DeanR7 ✭✭✭

    Ric - it would be worse place if everyone agreed and there was only one way to train.  Whilst occasionally I might not agree with some of your training observations I can 100% recognise they will work for many Others.   But the courage comes from honest self reflection and confidence to change/try something new in training.    Ric the greatest complement I could pay you is you are always looking to mix up your training and try new things and still race well.  It's something we all could learn from.image

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