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Moraghan Training - Stevie G
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None taken Dean :-). It's a positive thing that we have such a wide range of talent on here and still are all happy to take advice off everyone.
Simon - you need sponsorship. perhaps from a quality brewer ;-)
Anyhoo, now I've got my new watch that also does heart rate and stuff, what does anyone think about changes of RHR as a potential indicator of illness? My HR has gone up the past two days, by a fair bit compared to the last week (from sub 45 Sun to Tues, to over 55 the past two days), but I've had a bad cold and thought I was getting over it. Should I be concerned or is it just one of those things?
It also does cadence. I'm pretty happy with that as it comes out spot on for what I'm told is supposed to be about right averaging close to 180 spm.
Bus, I assume that your watch is a wrist-based optical HR? Whilst it's great to have HR without having to wear a chest strap, it's very easy to receive false readings from light interference with a loose watch, interaction with sweat, skin and hair... Quite a few issues!
I guess the thing is to keep an eye for a while, maybe a month to get a general idea of RHR (it may fluctuate over about 10bpm or so without actually indicating anything out of the ordinary due to the aforementioned), and then pay attention to out of ordinary trends from that
Now, cadence, that's another can of worms, given Mo Farah has a cadence less than 180... Does that mean he's overstriding?
Been in Leeds a few days now, and run twice so far - 10k each time along the canal path. First was 8:29/mi for 76.7%HR, and second was 8:23/mi for 76.2%HR - good to see speed increasing and effort decreasing, albeit slightly!
Absolutely no issues with my foot, and have a free afternoon today, so gonna do 10 or so miles later today
Thanks Matthew. Glad to hear the foot is holding up. Yes it is an optical HR, but seems to be consistent - the increase over the past 7 days of RHR has been a nice smooth curve, and I can sit, force myself to relax and watch the rate drop accordingly - until a certain young lady from admin walks past that is :-)
Despite his stature, Mo has much longer legs than me!
That's the problem with technology Bus...you know too much, too much to worry about
Did a few sessions down at Tooting when John Bicourt was coaching us (Mr controversial on Facebook/8 lane) and he was interested to check HR. Since then never bothered with it.. Like the sponsorship idea, btw..
Good to hear the foot on the mend MH. Anyone doing Counties this weekend? Beds/Bucks is Shuttleworth this year...presume we will be heading back to Wycombe the year after?
I've used them on and off since then. Mainly off. That's because I doubt the claims made for the things from a position of optimal training.
I use to race with a cadence of 200 spm. I never had the power to belt along at a mere 180spm with a long stride.
🙂
Good news MH, time for you to crack on in 2018 to some tidy stuff I reckon.
Agree with you on the optical HR. While i'm confident it was in and round accurate when reporting a colossal 205 at a humid offroad summer race, i'm pretty sure the 210 it had me at for an easy pace cruise the other week wasn't right!
brewery sponsorship - now that's the real underlying reason I stopped running as a teen and started playing hockey. At freshers fair at uni I was spotted by the 1st XI hockey captain who recognized me from a tournament a few months before in sheffield,
I said I hadn't made my mind up about what sport I would do at uni. either Running, football, basketball or hockey. he gave me a crate of beer and said the hockey team is sponsored by a brewery. I said I was still unsure and he put another 24 can crate on top and said how about now? he then said man of the match gets a crate every week. Got my attention and I signed there and then.
never turn down a team sponsored by a brewery. though it will destroy any sporting aspirations in your early twenties!
Ok, so i'm coming close to the end of my massive spun out time off work, 2 working days left.
Thought i'd get an Ealing mile race in today, for a nice little trip.
Not particularly expecting anything, it's Jan, and haven't been doing much shorter stuff for a while.
Got a bit complacent with leaving time, so throw in a delay tram, and it was already past 12 (12.30 race start) and I hadn't even got to Acton Town for the line switchover!
A couple more stops, and about 1/4 mile jog to the start of the park. I then remembered the start is the other end, so another half mile jog over to the start.
Signed up, and it's about 12.15! Don't really fancy it, but another mile jog and most important unleashing, and it's ok.
I'm keen Malone on the start line in the Datchet vest, I clock a kid in an AC vest, as well as a guy in a beanie hat, and flash trainers. They'll both be fast I think, based on nothing.
My last mile race was that 9.44 Welsh one, so I should be alright to beat that I think
even if the wind is quite tasty.
We're off, I take the lead, feels alright, but then whatever pace you do in the first 50metres feels alright.
At this one, you often know where you'll be coming in the first 100metres or so. Tight bend, straight with shallow pot holes, then a turn into a windy stretch for the slightly down part.
I'm leading, feeling alright, if not top burn, but the hooves are heavy behind me.
Tell myself no watch checking today, it'll report slower than you're running in this park due to the loopy shape of 8 course.
Get to half way, and I realise i'll definitely be seeing this through 1st today, so keep it an honest effort. Round a bend thaty takes you wide, to the right of the tree that sits in the middle of the path (one day i'll try and go left) , up the slight incline, round a bend, into another straight of wind, and finally into the finishing stretch.
I can clock it only up to 4.46 or so, could I get in under 5 still!?
noo, time is going very quickly, and i'm still a way off, I've missed 5 comfortably.
5.08!
That'll have do as a 1st of year off the cuff mile loosener. You probably don't often do your fastest mile in Jan.
For a top race performance, you probably need these 3 things
Optimal training, still conditions, a close race/ be against slightly quicker people.
Had none of those 3, on a loopy windy course, so i'll take it as a fun turn out on a day off.
3 races done, we're well on the way to the 25
One of those slightly embarrassing claims of being the fastest M35-39 for a mile in 2018 so far
Fastest so far in 2018 is 5.00 at South Shields and while I don't know what that course is like, you really need a course like that Gosport one I did in the summer, a flat, straight course with faster people there, on a still day to get closer to your max.
200 spm! That's some going Ric - you should be referred to as the roadrunner from now on!
Dean, I'm not sure many uni students would pass up on brewery sponsorship - even if it were lawn bowls
That's a rather good mile time for so early in the year, and I would bask in the M35-39 rating for as long as you can! Like you say, conditions need to be right for a good short race, and I reckon the most influential is a quality field.
So, did my long run this arvo like I said earlier. Although, I didn't really think through my lunch and felt bloated right until the moment I set off (note to self, Tesco mayonnaise-based pastas and big milky coffees are a no-go!), so as a result decided to see how I felt about distance.
Got to 4mi, and decided that I would continue to 5 and turn... Only to decide at 5mi to continue until 6mi
Pace/HR was looking good at this point - 76-77%Max for 8:27/mi or so. So, feeling good I thought I'd just see how it all came together on the way back without really worrying about HR, but also not going stupid!
All together it came back as 12mi at 8:17/mi for 78.6%HR - so a nice, unexpected, negative split! Rather happy with that given the recent runs, and I daresay here marks the return!
Steady progress Matt H; time to speed up a bit now maybe?
Must admit I think there is getting to be too much tech in running now; maybe I'm just too set in my ways but I think time, and km splits are enough. Cadence, HR % etc. seem a bit excessive for amateurs but willing to be convinced otherwise (did take me about 8 years proper racing to even bother getting a Garmin and before that some years to bother with a stopwatch on training runs
Ta chaps.
Pete - hard to quantify isn't it. It's relative versus distance raced I think, like inclines.
Myself and Phil were blown to oblivion when running on the Winter hill route in Marlow the other day, that was freezing cold, and very severe! So nothing like that. But I suspect (on the vagaries of memory!) a fair bit windier than my 5.00 and 5.01s there.
But enough to sap a few seconds per stretch. But how much was also down to "coming in cold" to the most intense distance I race, the arriving with 15 to go, and even the intense start of this week, who knows.
Probably quite likely that super fast Gosport mile has planted a seed of "this won't be your fastest" before i'd even turned up, which is always a bit of a downer mentally.
Am enjoying being flexible with sessions and races on an adhoc basis, but I know deep down I need to do some specific stuff based on my own level and targets for bigger race performances. That's the challenge really - embracing more social stuff with the Dashers, while trying to keep the performances as high as poss.
3 of the next 4 weekends have an XC in, so will have to make sure I get some long runs in, as it's only 6 weekends to Wokingham half if I do that!
Have resisted getting caught up in the Cliveden XC club event this weekend, which is meant to be harder than our hardest XC, so will make sure of a long in then.
Matthew - good to see a long come back. The girl in question is almost certainly aware of the effect she has on most of us!
I agree re the too much info with heart rate, cadence etc, but it livens up a dull evening reviewing your own stats! Ric - therein is my problem then. My180 spm is with short legs and stride length
one of my trainees - Skinny over on the "overdone it thread" I think once tried to change his natural cadence, and ended up getting injured. Strikes me as one of those things you just leave as it is, unless it is actually causing an injury. At non pro level anyway!
Having a map through of dates and events. Already knew Eastleigh 10k and Reading half clash which is a little unfortunate.
Then double checked, and the 12 stage southern relays are the same day too! Sake!
Even stranger is that these sort of events are always Saturdays, yet they've changed it to a sunday this year? What, to clash with the fastest 10k and biggest half in the south?
In fairness, I should worry about getting my first half for almost 3 years done safely without looking ahead..but still
ps Bus, it seems our club are allowed "special dispensation" to switch places over amongst our club very late on...ie now!
Still...staying out of it!
SG, handy win there. Britain's Number One! Now you need to work on your photography.
LOL at Bus leering his way round the office like a public sector Harvey Weinstein.
Decent long run Matt H.
Something of a shocker at the track session on Wednesday. We had an EA coach down to take a session for the club, so we had a big turnout. Was a good session, 7 x 3 minutes with the odd numbered reps at 10k pace and the evens at 5k pace, all off 90 seconds. However, towards the end of the session, one of the runners collapsed on the edge of the track. Medically trained clubmates on the scene immediately, along with stadium staff with a defibrillator. Ambulance got there, but he couldn't be saved. Horrific stuff, first time I've witnessed anything like that. Not someone I knew other than by name, but lots did know him well, and the whole club's in shock at the moment.
Bloody hell Dachs - couldn't be saved! I was enjoying the first half of your post, and expected the "shocker" to be you were only doing mile reps at 5.00 pace or something, than that
Awkward to really delve, but any idea if it was an overdoing it sort of thing, or underlying condition?
After being slightly put out by the "how slow am I compared to loads at Datchet" banter I just took on their group chat, that has very quickly put that pathetic stuff to bed!
And, no Matt, you can't! Besides, its all relative and in the office she is considered a stunner, but it's a small pond - take it to the wider world and you might say, meh....
As for being a public sector Weinstein, well you can't help notice someone attractive, but there's a bit of a gulf between a simple biochemical reaction and then helping yourself no matter what!!!
Yes, I realise there was something of a grinding tonal shift in my post.
I had a shock of a similar nature on new years eve when I was told of the sudden death of a neighbour.
The guy was only in his 40's.
There were underlying health issues. How much life style choices played a part is open to question.
Whatever, I felt a bit embarrassed running past his widow who was having a ciggy, while I'd just done 6 miles.
🙂
Did 15 x 400 on the track on Thursday which wasn't great. The forecast 40mph gusts didn't disappoint or the sideways driving rain. Hamstrings felt tight all the way through and one has been niggling since. Very easy 8 miles Friday night and toyed with the idea of doing the parkrun this morning. Jogged down there which was 3.5 miles and set off with the 18 min pacer. At 1.2 miles there was a group of 4 of us going at just under 5.40 pace but I felt ok so pushed on. Ended up running 16.57 and first home on a slightly longer course due to the grass being like a mud bath. Couldn't see my splits after as i didnt have the lap set on my watch but pleasing to pick the pace up and dip under 17 after running over a 1/3 of the race at 18 min pace. 11 miles in total then another easy 4 mid afternoon and long run tomorrow.
LSR today. Still feeling somewhat under the weather, I was in two minds whether to do it or not, so took it very easy and actually ran the vast majority by hear-rate rather than pace. Tried to keep out of the Garmin defined max zone, so under 173 bpm. Harder than it seems after several miles. What was particularly interesting (to me!) was that the downhills were actually harder to keep under than the uphills - which supports something I've always felt, in that climbs can actually be a bit of a break! Also interesting, was that I ran the last mile relatively hard, but the heart rate hardly climbed - weird! Long and short was a long, but very slow run.
20 miles this morning @6.39s with 5 x 1 min on/off in the last couple of miles. 87 miles for the week.
Bracknell parkrun for me. Bit disappointed with 20'13 but the course is now even slower than ever and much faster runners like Andrew Stay only just got under 20 so not too bad. Top age grade out of well over 400 despite being only 76.xx%. 9.5 mile at tempo (6'55) pace with a climate this morning in a windy WGP. Felt very hard work!.
Dachs' note is one outside the usual bubble we live in to some extent, certainly on here where it's all about striving for excellence, or at least running some local races
Matt - that is great mileage, and i'm not just applying the "anyone who runs more than me is heroic" scale
Although I suppose it really is all relative, I find mid 60s is fairly reasonable to fit into a week the way I break it down, with fairly low commitments outside of it, so another 20 on top takes some doing, even accounting for the extra speed you do it.
That must either be doubles every day, or a pretty long single?
Pete - Always good workouts at parkrun, what would your current scale look like time wise do you reckon? From a Battersea Park/Hyde Park course, through a "fair" parkrun like say Black Park etc
My lot mostly all did Cliveden today, and hoovered up the trophies. Top 3 outright, with Chris B second V40, whoever beat him must be decent, and fast Jill back to dominate the women's section!
It's always a massive event when Dashers do a race, facebook explodes with photos, group chats, threads etc. You really do miss out if you're not there!!
If i'd turned up i'd have been 5th Dasher at best! I wasn't certain how fast one chap was, as his PO10 is quite patchy, and has no times my best level, but then hey, i'm not my own best level right now
However, he was right up there at the first XC in October, and just behind Samson in 3rd today. So it's clear...
So Little Chris was right, if booze is so bad, why are those 4 faster than me
I think we all know though, if I started, i'd be about 50/51st fastest there
You can't beat talent, but you can give yourself the best chance in other ways!
Signing up for the Wokingham half tonight. 6 weeks time. I need to finally, after 2 1/2 years get to full circle, complete a half marathon well and only then know i'm 100% again! So won't be expecting huge things, won't be going mad, but perhaps a reasonable, sub 1hr 20 vague aim, starting off aiming to beat 6min miling each mile is a plan, and I can bank something and work off that later in the year.
Club event, so will have 50-60 club buds there, and hopefully Big Bus too, just for pure security/people to haul me into the bushes off the course
Before that though, there are 3 XC races, and i'm aware I need to get some long runs in.
15 today in 7.11 felt decent. 7.30 first mile (am sure these never used to start so slow), 7.18 average by mile 10 (little climb up to..Cliveden actually!), and a 6.43 last mile.
May have to get some midweek longs in to make up for 3 of the next 5 weekends having a Sunday race