Moraghan Training - Stevie G

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  • WoolWool ✭✭✭

    SG - you put sunglasses on your emoji. I believe you've said more than once before that real runners don't wear sunglasses. Or run on routes more scenic than Slough trading estate. PMSL - explains why you posted that pic of the 'wonderful' Welsh car park the other day. You are hilarious!!

    I think the Jubilee has the perfect surface. Not tarmac but still smooth.

  • Stevie  GStevie G ✭✭✭✭
    edited August 2018
    You know I work round here don't you son, so the couple of mile start and end always have to be from here. I don't wheel into Slough just for the giggles.  I'm not entirely sure where the Jubilee River goes from and to. I presume it's the bit behind Mercier park? I've had a little slope into that territory for a bit.

    The photo was the backdrop, but I think you know that. Men of your age go nuts for scenery, so i was trying to bond with you. :)

    On another note, I'm going to have a 6 week dabble on what is basically a Daniels plan, but won't go up to 3 sessions a week - will stick at 2 as always.

    A threshold and an interval. I'll be adding a midweek medium long, and getting the LSR back up to 15 or so, so a 3rd session would probably be risky.

    As my next focus race will either be a half or a 10miler (when i finally commit to one or other) working the Threshold zone so heavily should cover both distances off.

    Today's 10 was plenty in the rain, but when you get a race properly on the schedule, it certainly concentrates the mind. That spell of 6 or 7 x15milers pre work for Wokingham did wonders.


  • DachsDachs ✭✭✭

    More racing for me to report, this time the Hercules Wimbledon 5K festival. 

    In a fit of excitement, I had put down a highly ambitious 15:10 time when I entered, which was a fair while ago, but didn't end up managing to bring myself into anything like that shape.  Fortunately, the organisers had largely ignored people's wild predictions and gone off recent form, so that placed me firmly in the C race. 

    Felt pretty rotten for much of the day, fending off the arrival of yet another cold, but, as always I decided not to can it, and by the time I got there I felt a bit better.

    Race was being paced at 74s.  That would bring me in at 15:25, and my PB is 15:25.6.  Really, I am desperate to scrape under 15:20 and wanted 73s, but decided it was much more sensible to accept a ride for the first half and see if I could press on from there.

    Pacer was dead on the 74s, and managed to find a spot directly behind him on the kerb to avoid getting stuck in position changing behind.  From there, just ticked off the 74s.  By the time I got to halfway, I was tempted to try to move off the front of the paced group (a handful had already struck out ahead of the pacer from the off), but didn't believe I would have made it stick.  Pacer stepped aside after about 9 laps, and then it started to wind up.  With a mile to go I still felt OK, but there was no increase in pace I could come up with, and the last three laps I felt absolutely horrific, like I was going to heartily spew everywhere.  At 300m to go a load of blokes flew off - most of them broke 15:20, so I was still in contention for it had I anything left to give - but I was suffering badly, and it was all I could do to hold it together for 15:25.22 - a PB by a third of a second!  Spent about 10 minutes bent double feeling very sick, and ran a mile warm down where I also felt my stomach turning over.  Never felt anything like that after a 5k, not even usually after a half.  At least I know there's nothing more I could have squeezed out.

    So, the quest for sub 15:20 continues, but at least now I have an 8-year streak of 5k PBs every year since I started racing seriously

    2012 - 16:33 (road)

    2013 - 16:22 (road)

    2014 - 15:42 (road), 15:46 (track)

    2015 - 15:36 (track)

    2016 - 15:28 (track)

    2017 - 15:25.6 (track)

    2018 - 15:25.22 (track)

    You can kind of see the trend in the scale of improvements!

  • RicFRicF ✭✭✭
    edited August 2018
    My previous post appears to be there from my perspective SG.

    Transient forgettable fare anyway. 

    Dachs, a pb is a pb but I imagine on occasions like this, 'best' is the last thing you feel like. But well done on and hope you feel better.

    Having read that report from Dachs reminds me, where's the Bus?

    🙂

  • Stevie  GStevie G ✭✭✭✭

    Nice one Dachs, certainly very fast! Love that it's got to a position where you're counting 100ths though :)  Good to see that pbs can still be squeezed out even at your level, and even that many years of ramped up training later.

    And I bet on the right day you can properly beat the 15.25 pb, as it's not like you're having loads of goes.


    Matt - if you see this before the pages turn over too much, are you at the Podium 5k on the 27th?

    I Was randomly on some po10 pages earlier, and noticed our pal Boucher (from past questionable behaviour at parkrun fame) put a 16.05 in there! He'd done a 16.03 in 2008 elsewhere (and faster way way back) but nothing anywhere near at parkruns. Although, most likely he wasn't trying to smash those. But still, that's one heck of a time, which is very encouraging of the venue!

  • Stevie  GStevie G ✭✭✭✭
    edited August 2018

    On another note, the session I'm attempting tomorrow from Daniels is

    "sets" of 2mins hard (1min), 1min on (30secs), 30secs (30secs) at "Interval" pace. Which on my plan is about 1.20 lapping - interval and repetition being distinct zones apparently - the latter being the real fast stuff. (Doing it on a track i'll do 600-300-150, so the first 2 are 100% on anyway)

    Should be about 7 sets to be around 5miles.


    This all feels pretty fresh, so am looking forward to it

    Dean - how about it - i'm trying something totally new :)

  • Reg WandReg Wand ✭✭✭
    Nice one Dach's very quick. Shame you didn't managed to break that magical fifteen minutes and 20 second barrier :D

    After cycling to work and back, I hit the pool tonight for 40 x 100 metres off 15 second rests. There was a nice bit of totty in a skimpy bikini, thankfully I have mastered breathing to either side so I am able to perv in both directions.
  • Nice one Dachs, obviously found out about it on Facebook first, looks Like you gave it the full monty at least. Hopefully your race face was as bad as mine was finishing at MK on Saturday. 

    Trainiing last night was 4 sets of (600,400,300), 70 secs recovery with 90 secs between sets. Did 80 for all the 400's as I've got a few races over the weekend. 600's were 1.51,1.49, 1.45,1.44 and the 300's 51,50, 48,47.
  • Stevie  GStevie G ✭✭✭✭
    How come you did the middle bits fairly pedestrian (by your standards) and rampaged the others?

    Went off and did 7 sets of 600 (1min), 300 (30secs),150 (30secs). Aiming for 1.20 lapping

    Got the 600 a little too slow on a couple, probably because I wasn't concentrating enough and thinking about 50metre and 100metre lines for future reps :)

    At one stage I stopped at 500metres (on the 200m line) ignoring that i'd started on the 100m. When that happened i just took that as an extra and went back to a full set, rather than having one underpar

    However, all in all, a good workout, probably a little harder than i'd gone in thinking. Reminds me of the Moz days where with 2 sessions in a week, one i'd think would be tough, and one reasonable, and both came out good workouts.

    2.03, 1.00,30
    1.59,1.01,30
    2.02,1.00,28
    2.00,58,29
    2.00,1.00,28
    1.37 - the 500 in error
    1.59,58,30
    2.00,58,28

    9.5miles all in with wu/cd, so a tidy sum. 50.5 so far this week, 4 later, then whatever Sunday comes out as , but mid to high 60s week.




  • Simon Coombes 2Simon Coombes 2 ✭✭✭
    edited August 2018

    Decent sesson SG and good mileage all in all for the week. On last night's session - I took the 400's easy just because of this weekend's races - 8 & 1500 double tomorrow and the 4 x 800 relay at Lee Valley on Sunday. I'm in a V45 team helping the V50'S in their (I think) world record attempt, I think the time to beat is 8.25.

    Dean was going to be in the V45 team, but couldn't make it down.

  • RicFRicF ✭✭✭
    Good session SG. Changing pace has much to be recommended for.

    On the totty in the pool. She'd have to be a real looker for me to take any notice Reg.

    Then again, I was always a bit selective. Or maybe just cautious. Zero opportunity more likely.

    Not like some I knew.

    Forty years back in the factories, there were apprentices who took part in pull-a-grot competitions.

    They'd go down the pub or club and basically charm (with much drink) the girl they deemed to be the roughest looking in the place.
    The winners invariably scored.
    Chivalry took a back seat (Ford Capri usually) on such occasions.

    One Monday morning I over heard some weekends results. "I tell you, she was 15 stone, wearing a whale-bone corset and had a face like Bingo off the Banana Splits.

    Strewth! 

    Meanwhile, I stuck to fishing. Seemed a safer option.

    And to training.

    Reverted to an alternate running/cycling pattern. The reason is I can hit the biking with a level of intensity that I couldn't handle running.
     One thing from that is I still recover from the running aspects.

    Two lots of 30 minutes today on the bike.

    Tomorrow is loosely planned as a run lasting two and a half hours. I'll eat and drink on that one.

    🙂

  • The BusThe Bus ✭✭✭
    edited August 2018
    Yep, still around Ric - just been to busy holidaying to post :-)

    Just back from Cornwall after a horrendous journey of just shy of eight hours - stiff as a board now!

    Reg - good work at the pool. After two weeks on the beach every day I've had my fill of bikini clad babes (nah - not really!)

    Matt H - sounds like a cracking race that!

    Dachs - good work on the PB (and previous race). That's how I feel after most races :wink:

    Wool - we've offered to teach SG how to read a map before, but he seems to prefer out and back routes through dull industrial estates. Helps focus on the pace rather than being distracted by scenery I guess :smiley: (nice reps by the way SG)

    Good luck with the weekend of racing Simon!


  • Reg WandReg Wand ✭✭✭
    Hope you had a nice holiday Bus, I am in the Lakes week after next, hopefully I can fix my achilles in time to run a few fells.

    Ric, I lower my standards whilst I am swimming as it's that or the black line on the bottom of the pool.


  • RicFRicF ✭✭✭
    Two hours twenty five minutes worth in the bag, so getting there. Just a matter of losing some flab and it'll be easier.

    Last of the beers in the house about to be dealt with. Will I survive without?

    🙂

  • RicFRicF ✭✭✭
    Two hours on the bike done. A bit windy but intended as recovery. Judging by how the legs feel right now, I'd say job done.

    🙂

  • ML84ML84 ✭✭✭
    Good time on your feet there Ric. 

    Dachs, nice work on the 5000m. Like I said on FB, hopefully its all being saved for a nice chunk off your PB in Malaga.  


    SG, I'm away that weekend but the lad who runs the club I run for organisers the Podium race. I know quite a few lads running it and a few from my club will be looking at running between sub 15 up to mid 16s. If it fits and you're up this way then I'd definitely recommend you giving it a good crack. 

    Had a dabble at my first fell race in about 2.5 years yesterday. 9.3 miler with about 2900ft of climbing and a cat A race. Zero chance of winning it with a clubmate who is a GB mountain runner but my plan was to hopefully stick in the second group and see if I could get second place. In a group of 4-5 after the first climb with my mate a long way infront. 

    Managed to open a gap on the second climb with another lad and then there's a rough, steep descent before the next climb. I don't have the confidence to just 'let go' as its ankle breaking tackle and I lose about 50m to second place. Get to the bottom and realise the gap I had behind had gone due to me fannying around but managed to open up the gap again on the climb. 

    Despite taking it easier on the next descent and trying to save something for the last climb I managed to keep the gap. Calves were cramping about half way round so I was grateful to get round in the end and finish 3rd. 
    Quads are a bit trashed today but managed a group run at around 7min pace and 15 miles this morning. 
  • The BusThe Bus ✭✭✭
    Still good work Matt. Given your 'tinkering' on the fells giving some genuinely impressive results, I can't help wonder what a bit of fell focus would bring....

    Ric - similar bike ride for me this morning, but I feel knackered now!  37 miles to Windsor and back, with a coffee and pastry on Eton bridge. I've not ridden more than an hour for ages, but as my legs just don't seem to want to run currently I thought I'd give it a whirl - I've got some weight to shift post holiday boozing! Slightly oddly, having done absolutely no stretching whilst on holiday, my hip has been fine. Admittedly I've run less miles the past 3 weeks and no doubles the last two, but all the runs I've done have been hard and hilly.
  • RicFRicF ✭✭✭
    edited August 2018
    After your last report Bus, on the post seven pints and curry run, I wondered what level of knackerdom you might have shipped. 

    ML, Good race. I think these days I'd rather watch such events than take part.

    I'm ok myself going up hill. But find it impossible coming back down. A lack of stability and leg speed is one thing against me.

     A lack of bounce when tired would make descending feel like I'm running on stumps.

    🙂

  • The BusThe Bus ✭✭✭
    Managed a few runs since that one Ric - all hilly fare and including around 10 yesterday. It's just my legs have felt tired for several weeks now. I thought a few lower mileage weeks would shift that general feeling, but I suspect it might take more than that. 

    Matt - I can guarantee you are a better descender than I am!
  • Stevie  GStevie G ✭✭✭✭

    Bus - seems to me that tonnes of very hilly runs, may possibly be the reason for your knackeredness ;)

    Long long drives probably add to it too.


    13.5miler today, including the classic hill at the start of the Wycombe half (wel, the equivalent, as the actual course goes through private land). Made me remember what a challenge that course was - as if a half marathon isn't hard enough, you ruin yourself mile 1!

    Brought up a 68mile week - highest of the year comfortably - 2x 65.5 the previous.

    Proper week - 2 big sessions, a medium long, and a "proper" length LSR, ie at least 13.

    Will work out how this week best pans out if I do the Podium 5k the following Monday, would need to move any sort of LSR off the Sunday for starters.

    I am up that way anyway that evening, so would need to get up a day earlier.


  • Stevie  GStevie G ✭✭✭✭
    edited August 2018
    Was having a look through the other sections of this forum, and also fetch (!), and it's amazing how there's so little action on them these days.
    A few years ago they were an absolute hive of activity. Now, someone will post about a race, and there won't be a response in 4months. A shame.

    I suppose there's so much of it on fb groups and strava and places these days instead.
  • RicFRicF ✭✭✭
    SG, I imagine that there was once a pent up wish to broadcast which until the advent of the internet, was controlled strictly by the media.

    Then only the famous had a chance to say something.

    Nowadays everyone has a chance to say bugger all.

    Going back a bit. You mentioned long runs.
    I'd restrict them to once a fortnight. Leaves a space.

     I reckon that once up to distance, the effects of a long run can last for a good six weeks. If that means, 'can a really long run, once every six weeks cover the rest?", then yes.

    Building up to it takes some effort. After that, it's maintenance level.

    To take things on a step. I wonder if it's possible to build match days into the schedule as enhanced rest days with maybe two days off or even back to back.
    The other side of the coin is doing much more on the other days. 
    It's by the book.

    Heavier sessions but more recovery.

    🙂

  • RicFRicF ✭✭✭
    Bus, I can relate to that feeling.

    It must be frustrating not being able to recover enough in order to smash yourself to bits as often as you would like  ;)

     

    🙂

  • Stevie  GStevie G ✭✭✭✭
    edited August 2018

    Depends how you're defining "really" long run Ric.

    The weekly 15 in the run up to the Wokingham half certainly got me ready for it. Even with the backdrop thought of the previous half still fresh in my mind.

    Gonna sign up for a few races. Will try this Podium 5k. At worst it's another race, one I've wanted to do for a while, with a once in a lifetime tie up to both a Salford City and United game. At best it could be a rival to the Battersea Park effort. No lose scenario. Also, going the majority of the way up the night before, means no drama like the Wales and last United game trips!

    Aim to do the last Gosport 5k too. Enjoyed the mile/5k double in June, and aimed to get to one of the 5 events in the (different route) 5k series. Well, the first 4 didn't work date wise, so he 5th one it is, mid Sep job.

    Fancy the Great South Run too. Wouldn't call it unfinished business as such, as I stormed it in a mid 57 last time, coming a week after a lower 57 at Cabbage Patch, but SIX (!) years on I haven't done any 10miler since, so will be nice to get back down there. A lot has gone on in between!

    In the meantime, will work to Johnas Daniels threshold plan, and try not to be tempted to do the more "fun/social" Datchet sessions, as I know these sessions are what I need to get up to the right level.

  • Great fell racing ML - something I've always fancied trying, but not sure if there's many places down here that would classify. Saying that, there might be on Dartmoor!

    Good to hear you're thinking of the GSR. What's this Johnas plan you speak of? I need something a little more structured in the mean time.


    Been a quiet week for me, after a couple of recovery runs following the RAT I noticed that I wasn't trying to stave off some calf tightness, but instead fostering some ankle aches. Nice to have a week off, but need to put the hammer down now. 
    Race wise, I'm tempted by a track 3000m on Thursday evening, having never run the distance before. Potentially dicey if the ankle isn't 100%. Low key 10k on Friday evening, just a jolly or tempo effort depending on the lay of the land. Then a "long run" at Truro HM on 16th September, perhaps harder second half. 7th October is Plymouth 10k and my GSR tune up. Give it beans and adjust my target for the main race two weeks later - GSR itself. Would love a PB (sub 62:50 or so), but unlikely - just gotta carry some consistency into next year. 
    Plymouth 10k is also the same day as the Plymouth fixture of the local XC league (go figure) - shame to miss it as it's one of the easiest to make, and likely busiest as it's the first. Should be able to make all the others though - my first XC season!
  • alehousealehouse ✭✭✭
    Morning!

    SG, the forums are indeed quiet these days. We used to get over a 100 contributions a day on the daily thread; now it can be in single figures.

    On another note, message me re the Salford City game! I'm up for it!

    Reg: last October I was woken in my hotel room by loud klaxons at 6 in the morning...the start of the Ibiza triathlon! Didn't even know it was on! Message me if you want to know more! 
    Progress is rarely a straight line. There are always bumps in the road, but you can make the choice to keep looking ahead.
  • Yes HM - get into the xc mate. Good re entry into racing ML84. Bus -good to hear of your expeditions in the SW.

    Decent weekend of racing for me - first up was the SAL and I managed my best ever combined 8&15 combined time with a 2.05.7 for the 800 and 4.12.4 for the 1500. The only slight downside of the day was that James (Skinner) came down to run the 5000 for Haywards Heath and obliterated my 5000m V45 lead with a superb 15.28. Fair play to him, had a decent chat too - was on his lunchbreak from a well known advertising firm in the city! talented bugger ;)

    Day after went to the Kimbolton half as the missus was massaging - then down to Lee Valley for the 4 x 800 relays. there were 4 teams, v35,40,45 & 50. I was on first leg and the idea was to help the 50's get their World lead by going off faster than I would usually and try and act as a wind break for the 50's guy. Went through in the lead in 61, and the 50's bloke came last with 100 to go as did the 35's guy..we all came in around 2.05. Really pleased with that as I thought I would only be able to manager 2.07/8. Perhaps should have gone off faster on the 1st lap on Saturday.

    We won the relay by a second, but incredibly the 50's missed out on the WR of 8.25.7 by 8 100th's of a second. Really good fun and met some runners I will see in Malaga.

    1500 next at Watford tomorrow.

  • Stevie  GStevie G ✭✭✭✭
    Aley - will do nearer the time - excellent you're coming along! 

    Booked the hotel last night, so the treble is on! Having wanted to do both a Salford game and the Podium 5k for a while, it's unbelievable that both fit a United game so well, with so much time in between - literally a one off ever!

    Back when I started work, 15 years ago now, at a quiet moment you could always rely on some RW entertainment. Now, apart from some of the training threads, which can turn over well, the rest is a ghost town. 
    I miss other features like being able to review races too. I checked fetch, and it's no better, just a more awkward format.

    That's one hell of a set of races Simon! If i'm on 24 for the year, and you always seem to have done at least double what i've done, are you well over 50 so far in?

    ps, your wife does sports massage? You really have inherited the world there :)
  • Stevie  GStevie G ✭✭✭✭
    ps Matt - just to clarify, as i'm not sure if you ever came across him, Johnas is my old pal from Marlow Striders days, who then became a regular to occasional thread poster. He's a chief proponent of training to threshold, as per Daniel's training methods. He saw some incredible results off it, and I'm sure he got well into the 33s for 10k, mid 16s 5k and sub 1hr 15 for the half.

    I've been looking for a tweak to the training, something different to my distinct MP throughto HMP base build up, or 5k zone training plans.

    Therefore, using the 16.56 5k zone, it gave me a "VDOT" i think of 60.5, meaning using the 60-61 zone for timings. It gives 5.52 for threshold, and Johnas/Daniels swear by rampaging this zone.

    My last HM was 5.54 pace, so straight away it's a touch quicker than that, so the sessions are good as this set are starting where i'd usually end. Ie 3x2miles at HMP was my peaking session for a half marathon race, so now 3x2miles threshold is only session 2.

    So last week was 3x10mins Threshold, rounded up to 7 laps, today, 3x2miles (well, 3200m as on a track so 8 laps)

    Aim 1.28 lapping, 2mins in between reps
    Rep 1   26x2,27x3,28x3
    Rep 2   25x1,26x1,27x4,28x2
    Rep 3   25x1,26x3,27x3,28x1

    Generated some serious heat on that one, but all came off nicely to plan, slightly ahead in fairness.

    This feels like the final missing ingredient now, out of comfort zone progressive sessions, like the Moz days :)


    ps Matt - will enter GSR today, so we'll have to meet up on the day

  • Reg WandReg Wand ✭✭✭
    Thanks for the offer Aley.

    Nice fell race there Matt, I like that you've not done it for a while so thought you'd just aim for second place!

    I did GSR about 20 years ago in about 63 minutes as I recall, it was like a bloody hurricane coming down the seafront.

    No run for nearly a week, trying to give the achilles a rest. It's improving slowly. I reckon another week would do it but I am not sure if no running is necessary or whether I just carry on and do a few miles here and there. Decisions decisions. 

    Meanwhile just doing the usual biking and a bit of swimming.
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