Moraghan Training - Stevie G

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  • Stevie  GStevie G ✭✭✭✭
    RicF said:
    Wool, good man. 

    I generally accept that when SG hints at curtailing a subject, it's curtailed. The Ringmaster rules.

    (obvs I imagine Ric to be routinely lashing the Ruislip/Harrow general type area's plants on mere training runs with his hydration plan)  Cheek!

    My hydration plan for races remains a definitive example of how to avoid needing to unleash 'during'.

    Drink as much as you like before the race but absolutely nothing at all in the space between two hours and 5 minutes from the off.

    Excess fluid would be off loaded in the two hours - with no more going through the kidneys.
    5 minutes from the start, you can drink again. That fluid won't go through the kidneys since they shut down under race effort. 

    As for long runs...I'm out to build and avoid damage. I'll stop as I need to. 

    Well done too on the races Wool, Muddy, Pete.

    Combination of race experiences from The Cabbage Patch and Gosport.

     Cabbage Patch 1997 - hitting 5 miles in 26:49 and then getting undone by a #2. Ended up with 55:29 with a guy I'd overtaken earlier (who finished 8th) running 54:45. I never beat that time.

    Gosport HM. Charging down south at the last minute to toe the line, blowing up and walking from 11 miles but still getting sub 80 mins. An odd event where after I crossed the line, a guy who followed me in, thought I should receive a face full for not running the whole way.

    Screaming, "You're supposed to 'f..ing run, not walk". 

    One of those occasions when I had a reply. "Actually I was leading until 12 miles when I tore a hamstring, but thanks all the same". 

    He apologised a few minutes later. Fun times!

    Was gonna say I couldn't stop everyone chatting about magnesium for about 5 weeks, so i don't know about being the ring master :)

    Then, on quoting you found a much richer fuller post, that didn't make the main post? Yet you hadn't edited it...bizarre! RW quirk again?
  • Wool said:
    Just the most surreal experience running down the closed A4, lead car just ahead, trio of Dashers close to the front. But no spectators. Good, fast course. Shame it’ll probably never happen again - £8k to close the roads, only 700 entries. Real shame.
    PeteM said:
    Stayed like that till the end and I finished 66th in 64'21 with him a few seconds in front. So a pretty satisfactory result given my recent struggles to do a decent time over longer distances. I've done CP10 lots of times now and that must be about average for all my efforts there.

    Great race as ever with lots of freebies in the goody bag like a long sleeved technical top and some craft beer; Scott Overall only 2nd in 54'00; beaten by nearly 3 minutes by the winner a Leeds AC guy. That club mate of Ric's,Nigel Rackham is something else; 11th in 56'29 and he is about my age; over 92% WAVA :o
    Odd how the two races are having very different experiences with regard to attendance. Cabbage Patch sells out fast and the quality is going down. In 2011 there were 80 runners sub-hour. Scott Overall's 54 dead would have been 13th (just ahead of Nigel Rackham). Alex Miller was 32nd in 2011 with 56:41 and so did well yesterday to finish 5th in 55:38.

    Slough Half used to be a big draw (there was a half and a full) but I guess that counts for nothing today and for the Instagram generation it probably scores low.
  • Stevie  GStevie G ✭✭✭✭
    Ric - that missing half is a good anecdote. 
    Brought back memories in my early days of running, out with Handy Cross for a run through of the Wycombe half course a week before the main thing.

    I'd run most of it with a hottie, who the late chairman was also keeping a firm eye on.
    I wasn't the fittest back then, so had to walk a bit near the end.
    A few mins after finishing,  some tattooed up heavyweight guy doddled in, and chuckled that I'd "blown up", and he'd "seen me walking".

    Took the laugh off his face with a cheeky "still beat you though, didn't I" :)

    Only time I ranted at someone (probably unfairly), was that dreaded Wycombe 10k 08/09? where the marshal hadn't bothered to get in position early enough, meaning only the leader and myself did the full route, seeing my guaranteed 6th, and potential 4th end up being scraping top 10. Ranted at some bloke who done the "short course", when not really his fault :open_mouth:
  • Stevie  GStevie G ✭✭✭✭
    Wool said:
    Just the most surreal experience running down the closed A4, lead car just ahead, trio of Dashers close to the front. But no spectators. Good, fast course. Shame it’ll probably never happen again - £8k to close the roads, only 700 entries. Real shame.
    PeteM said:
    Stayed like that till the end and I finished 66th in 64'21 with him a few seconds in front. So a pretty satisfactory result given my recent struggles to do a decent time over longer distances. I've done CP10 lots of times now and that must be about average for all my efforts there.

    Great race as ever with lots of freebies in the goody bag like a long sleeved technical top and some craft beer; Scott Overall only 2nd in 54'00; beaten by nearly 3 minutes by the winner a Leeds AC guy. That club mate of Ric's,Nigel Rackham is something else; 11th in 56'29 and he is about my age; over 92% WAVA :o
    Odd how the two races are having very different experiences with regard to attendance. Cabbage Patch sells out fast and the quality is going down. In 2011 there were 80 runners sub-hour. Scott Overall's 54 dead would have been 13th (just ahead of Nigel Rackham). Alex Miller was 32nd in 2011 with 56:41 and so did well yesterday to finish 5th in 55:38.

    Slough Half used to be a big draw (there was a half and a full) but I guess that counts for nothing today and for the Instagram generation it probably scores low.
    That's a shocking decline in standard. I wonder why that is? There still aren't huge amounts of 10milers to choose from unlike halfs.
    (Presuming you've not done very selected stats and picked out especially one off high v lows)
  • Yes shame about the CB10 - Really good race and it was relatively cheap for a decent standard race. Good racing from PeteM, Wool and Muddy. Nice to see Nikki win the women's race up in Brum, she's from Leighton Buzzard and we know her really well - her mum was my wife's lab tech at the school she taught at. Good to see she's getting back into it now, she's a previous southern xc champ too.

    Really busy weekend - out late Friday night then Surrey lge xc at Richmond Pk on Saturday afternoon. got down there and it was ridiculously warm and windy, and I didn't feel particularly up for it. It's basically the same as the usual course, but you come up to it from the side, do two laps and back down to the finish in a 'pan handle' style. So went out quire steadily and although the first lap was a bit of a struggle, I managed to stay quite close to Dach's (2nd claim) team mate Ben P most of the way round. The course was so dry that occasionally massive clouds of dust would go everywhere, bit annoying.

    Kept it together relatively ok, came in around 50th, which is about par these days, standard is very good, only 4th V45.

    Nothing much yesterday, just 30 mins or so down to watch the kid in the junior parkrun


  • DachsDachs ✭✭✭

    When races start to sell out quickly that usually leads to a decline in quality.  Fast runners don't tend to book in races months ahead unless it's a massive target for them.  Same thing is happening to the Yateley series I'm afraid, and I speak as one of the main beneficiaries of that.  The solution, if race organisers want to maintain the standard, which they won't necessarily, is to set places aside for those who can run a certain time.

    Excellent running there Wool, and great to get under 80 Muddy.  Good turnout from Pete too.

    Hampshire XC league down in Bournemouth on Saturday, in the shadow of Simon's beloved AFCB's stadium.  Well, not really in it's shadow, cos it isn't very high.  Long story short, didn't feel great on the warm up, started in contention but by 1K I was dripping in sweat and knew I was going to struggle.  Finished 29th and lost to a clubmate who hasn't ever been particularly close.  A bit slower than last year, when I also had a poor race.  Still, on the plus side none of the V40 contenders were there, so I took the win, and we also took the team vets win.

    So anyway, this illness has now been knocking around a month now, and it's pissing me off.  I'm going to have a super-light week and try to get shot of it once and for all.

  • DeanR7DeanR7 ✭✭✭
    edited October 2018
    nice PB Wool (& vaporflys) and mixed bag of racing in difficult conditions for Pete, simon, muddy and dachs.  
    i couldnt face the wind on saturday or the torrential rain on sunday so did both sessions on my treadmill.  12miles on a sunday morning on the treadmill requires you to switch the brain off so put an old film on i havent seen in a decade...dirty rotten scoundrels.  forgot how much i loved this...chuckling away to myself.

    Dachs- not sure what your targets are but a proper rest is probably due to shake that bug...what rest did you have post malaga?

    the top end fast types can always get a place in sold out races...but im talking sub 30 10k types and faster.

    talking of mid race pit stops my worst moment was in the national xc champs a couple of years ago when i charged off course into the woods (about 100m away).  the look on some supporters faces was WTF is going on here.  it scuppered my race position significantly.
  • Stevie  GStevie G ✭✭✭✭
    I can feel the stinging ring piece from here Dean :)

    Dachs - sounds like you're spot on about needing an ease down, and good job you didn't do that marathon recently - imagine how that'd have felt!

    While I've disappeared completely away from my club while focusing on a Johnas training block, I have clocked what sessions they've been doing.
    Tomorrow's sounds a fun rampage - 6x4min thrashes round a loop in the middle of town - enjoyed that one when I last did it - classic style leading the fast chaps home on rep 1 despite trying to keep it sensible.

    Tonight's session though, 4x1mile quicker than 5k pace? That's got to be asking a heck of a lot hasn't it?! I bet no-one comes close to achieving that
  • RicFRicF ✭✭✭
    I raced the Cabbage Patch before the route was changed, taking most of the second half away from the main roads.

    It was a really fast course then. No steps by the river to climb for a start.

    I ran nine miles yesterday in the rain, and just came back from a cycle ride in the damp. The 2300 feet of ascents on the ride will do as strength training.

    🙂

  • WoolWool ✭✭✭

    Ric - did Neurerkar (sp?) run the record there on the old course? It's fast as it is but I always wondered whether he really did it with the steps in as well!

    SG - not sure if you saw that I was trying to stop Sid from going to the track tonight. For 3 months he has built to running a PB at his home HM. He was completely ground to a halt at the end having gone off WAY too fast and still he wants to go to the track the next day!

  • Stevie  GStevie G ✭✭✭✭
    edited October 2018
     :D  :D
    That's the Datchet way! Multiple races, no easy runs, tonnes of sessions back to back without any thought to paces, and ignoring the massive improvement you get simply from doing more, slower, early doors.

    There's a couple of things that we all go through early on. Struggle to accept that easy running gets you quicker longer term, and once you hit a training peak, ease down, when all you want to do is progress.
    He's deffo at the latter.

    EDIT - had a quick sniff through fb, couldn't see it.
    was going to simply add a "please don't do track tonight".

    I remember doing some reps about 5 days after a big half marathon effort once, and finding them tight on the legs still. The day after simply beggars belief.
  • RicFRicF ✭✭✭
    Wool, yes Neurerkar ran that on the old course. Instead of heading down the towpath he was able to blast along the road and running anti clockwise, go over the bridge which today's victims have to reach via the steps.

    I vaguely remember a change which put the runners on the towpath on the last couple of miles. I think it used to do the whole ten miles on the roads before that.

    Can't see why they can't use the old course, it's not as if any major junctions need crossing. Anyway, I was getting the impression that running, weight of numbers, charity and health benefits were beginning to take precedence over frustrated fat consumers doing their shopping.

    🙂

  • bus, I see there is a video up of the fell race: looks a tad wet

    https://www.facebook.com/james.appleton.9/videos/10103023551385950/
  • Stevie  GStevie G ✭✭✭✭
    Last sesh before GSR then
    5x1mile (1600) Threshold off 2mins, 4x200 off 200m jog

    Aiming for around 1.28 laps for a 5.52, and 37 secs 200ms

    Stormed it really, only 1 of the 20 laps was a 1.28, and from rep 3 they all started a bit silly, 1.23 and 1.24 pacing, ending 1.25-1.26

    So 1600s in 5.49, 5.49,5.45, 5.43, 5.42
    Add 2 secs for the equivalent mile pace and we have 5.51,5.51,5.47,5.45,5.44

    200s, 35x1, 36x3

    Now to see how this all comes out on Sunday!



  • WoolWool ✭✭✭

    nice SG - the weather forecast looks sensational for this weekend's racers. Pretty envious actually!

    thanks Ric, I can certainly see how the course would have been better when you didn't have to do the riverside trail bit and the steps. I do love the CP, shame it's not chip timing proper but completely understand why it's not. Next year....

  • Yes light winds for the GSR SG - not easterly, but not gale force at least
  • The BusThe Bus ✭✭✭
    Cracking racing Pete and MF. Well done on the PB Wool!
    It does seem a shame about CP, and the slower section by the Thames in particular.

    Saw that video Philip - the rain was biblical, but the decider for me was the zero visibility and gale force winds, which meant getting lost was a strong and very dangerous risk! Hats off to those who got round though, and that video has made me regret not manning up and doing it a wee bit. That said, my legs were fresh enough to do a long run in the fells in the late afternoon sunshine on Sunday instead, and waiting for the car to be fixed on Monday meany a very nice walk over Wansfell Pike in the sunshine again, so the weekend wasn't wasted. I got back home around 9.30 last night, just catching the tail end of that atrocious crash near Oxford on the M40 where 3 people died. An elderly couple towing a caravan went the wrong down the fast lane apparently. Motorway was closed for 14 hours to clear up the debris. Certainly puts my travails into perspective.

    Back up to Ambleside on Saturday :smile:
  • All the best for GSR on Sunday SG. Does your number say Portsmouth18 or Porstmout18?
  • Yes Bus, saw the video and we went up and down to Brum on the M40 on Sunday ourselves - makes you think. I presumed they panicked. Nightmare.


  • Oh yes, did some training myself Tuesday - 10 x 600 on the long grass, progression from 2.01, down to 1.46 for the last one, decent warm up for the southern xc relays on Saturday at the Scrubs. Did some 30 sec reps down the canal this morning..I know I joke about annoying cyclists, but it's really starting to get busy on there now with runners and walkers too.

    There's already been murmurings about banning cyclists from the towpaths in Central London. The majority are fine - but will be interesting to see how it pans out of it keeps getting busier.

  • Bit of a catch up here, sorry to hear about your disastorous trip to the lakes Bus!

    Nice couple of HMs from Muddy and Wool.

    Usual sessions from SG, I have to admit you do so may now, I glaze over the numbers but I get the impression you're hitting your targets with ease so looks good for the GSR.

    And XC has commenced already. Just had a look at the XC results for Hants, surprised to see you behind MA dachs, I just checked PO10 and I have a 6-0 head to head record over XC against him :)

    So my work/old work had these chiropractor people come in to try and fleece us of some money and I signed up to a full assessment. Inluded 5 x-rays and two consultation sessions for £30 cracking deal I thought ;) . He reckons I have one leg longer the the other. It's about 12mm difference. So just ordered a heel pad to compensate. Also had a session to move some bits about, quite enjoyed it!

    I've managed a good 20-30 miles a week the last 5 weeks too so things looking up.
  • The BusThe Bus ✭✭✭
    If it is the left leg that is shorter Reg, than a fast track career awaits :wink:

    The weekend was only a disaster for the first half - got em an extra day off work! Oddly, my back and hip have also been OK ish this week.

    I wanted to be a chiropractor but was put off when I realised it was such back breaking work....

    Nice session Simon


  • DachsDachs ✭✭✭
    Reg - He has improved massively, and has now run sub 34 10K on a pretty slow course.  And, as per my report, I wasn't well, and on form ought to be looking for well within the top 20 in the Hampshire League.
  • Reg WandReg Wand ✭✭✭
    edited October 2018
    I'll make sure I never race him again then :D
  • DachsDachs ✭✭✭

    Good idea.  I had a 12-0 record against him until the weekend.
  • Had a look at MA - only a couple of seconds slower than me at the southern relays. Loads of kids at the Hants league - I was 4th V45 in the Surrey league! And I ran ok -ish..
  • Good luck SG at GSR tomorrow! Plus anyone else racing today/tomorrow. Go well!
  • Best of luck to you at Abingdon Stevie, and to Stevie G at the GSR and anyone else racing ...

    Quiet week for me due to work and parenting, so not many miles logged. Probably due a down week after ramping things up quickly after the marathon. I have a 5k race planned for tomorrow which may slot into a long run.
  • RicFRicF ✭✭✭
    Good luck all those racing today.

    The wind appears to have calmed down and with temperatures not hitting the deck, there could be some decent results.

     GSR broadcast on Channel 5 at 10:10.

    Going ok this week until I got the hint of a lurgy which has afflicted the others in the house. 

    Stopped training immediately and three days on, nothing has developed beyond the initial stages. No need to encourage the bugs.

    🙂

  • WoolWool ✭✭✭
    Looks like a perfect racing day. Look forward to reading some smashing results.

    Wedding for me yesterday on the side of the Thames, right by the Cabbage Patch steps. Wore new shoes and now have matching gigantic holes in my heels. Not quite the issue I thought I’d have to be dealing with ahead of a mara in 6 days. Funny how I nearly always find a way to make things a bit harder than they need be!
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