Moraghan Training - Stevie G



  • Reg WandReg Wand ✭✭✭
    edited February 2019
    Good 10k effort Pete, so close but maybe nice to have that target still there for the next one.
    Sounds like a tough way to say a few thread hellos Bus! Still, 3rd v50 and very disappointed with it, is some consolation.
    Well my race was also a bit shite but at least it comes with a variety of disclaimers. Actually the cold felt like as much of as incumbrance as anything else. Jogged a mile warm-up, heart rate was really high and the tendon was a bit sore too. Walking to the start I was 50:50 as to whether I should start or not but ultimately decided to risk it.
    I started around 6 minute miles but I was on the limit HR wise, felt ok to about 7/8 miles then it all became a struggle, I didn't force it after that, thinking of future races and just did enough to keep moving forwards at a reasonable pace and get it over with. Not that I was taking it easy, legs felt horrible but I just wasn't killing myself. Finished in 1:22:26 just jogging it in and happily letting the sprint finishes all come past. It's hard to be critical given the last three weeks but I still get the feeling that I would have disappointed myself even if I hadn't got injured.

    Still, I broke the curse of Bus.

  • I think you're mad Reg, but very well seen out!

    In between yours and Bus' days would have been my fear today. Perhaps sound, perhaps too cautious, but this way we live to race another day.

    As do you chaps... in a few days ;)

  • I nearly gave up Reg, on the basis of the head to heads :smile:
    I think that was a cracking performance in the circumstances though. You were looking strong when I was with the 1:20 pacer. When you're not having a good day, the second half of Wokingham, whihc is ever so slightly uphill, then with those motorway bridges can really find you out...

     It wasn't me that was 3rd V50 by the way - that was Frank F - I was 15th old bloke :tired_face:
  • I was going to say I got nothing out of today but I did get a bit of a suntan, in February!

  • There was that year Wokey was called off, and rescheduled to a scorcher in May (was it?), but sunshine in Feb is just ridiculous.

    Almost as silly as snow in mid March last year.

  • Oops, well 15th is ok Bus :D
    I'm glad you carried on, that pacer came past me with a decent sized group still, I was watching that Dom chap up the road and I could see him missing out on the sub 1:20, I didn't have much else to keep myself entertained.
  • Ahoy then chaps.

    Good to see you Bus, sorry didn't get a chance to chat for longer (had to get back for a birthday party for a 1 year old!).

    Reg - always good to catch up mate, sorry it didn't work for you in the end, still looking forward to the time it all comes together and you leave us all for dust - definitely got a sub 75 in you pal.

    SG - you were missed today fella, hope everythings ok and you're back into it soon. 

    So, a mixed bag for me then. Absolutely delighted with the overall performance, but at the same time livid at myself for not being able to tie shoes up properly. 

    Despite calls of sandbagging, the fact that I was struggling to run 6mm in Jan for a parkrun made me really unsure of where I'm at the last few weeks. However, really starting to enjoy my running again so was just interested to see where I was at fitness wise. 

    Jogged 3 miles or so as a warm up before saying hello to a few faces and placing myself fairly near the front. Had warmed up in different shoes before rushing to put the mythical vapourflys on pre-race. Noted in my head that I'd only single looped them, meaning to double them after dropping my bag. Promptly forgot.

    Got going and felt really good. Despite saying the first mile wasn't going to be a 5:35 this time, I'm through the first 0.5 in 5:30 pace. At this point my left shoelace comes undone. No way I'm running 12 miles like that, so I've got to stop. F*ck. Faff around trying to tie it, before surging back and still running the first mile in 5:42 despite a 15 sec or so stop. 

    All that's going through my head is that it's going to happen to the other one, and sure enough, a mile later, the right one is undone. Double f*ck. This time I can't get it done up, and I'm flapping around like my hands are covered in grease. After what seems like an age, it's finally tied and mile 2 is a 5:59, but groups I want are slightly up the road. 

    Annoyingly, I'm feeling really good and through 10km in 35:55 which is laughable after my struggles to go sub-18 for 5km in Jan. Ran pretty much the whole race with the lady that won, and she just sat in behind from miles 4-11 getting a tow before clearing off with 2nd just a few metres behind. 

    Mile 11, my nemesis last year, reared it's ugly head with a 6:10 v. last years 6:11. Temptation to through in the towel at this point was so strong, but brought it back to close with 5:56 and 5:55, meaning mile 11 was the only 6+. Hit a really rough patch so was happy to see it off and finish (relatively) strong. 

    Had ideas that I'd be close to last years time (wasn't looking at all), and turned into the finishing straight seeing I might go sub 1:17. Gave it everything but was absolutely fooked, ended up with 1:16:56, which is 3 seconds slower than my PB.

    So yeah, mixed emotions, tie my shoes properly and I'm convinced I go low 1:16, but it's all if's and but's, and I'm happy with the way I applied myself and battled to the line - especially after the laces where I'm thinking screw it I'll just save it for Reading.

    Onwards and upwards from here. I think I've got a 75 in me.

    Enjoyed the mini 'journey to Wokey' on here, even if it didn't work out for some in the end. Hopefully there'll be another one soon. 
  • Stevie  GStevie G ✭✭✭
    edited February 2019

    Heck of an effort Joe, even with the laces messing about! Potentially happening so early didn't cost as much as it would have done later! Imagine trying to get going again midway or at 10-11!

    I knew no one doing 20mile training runs at low 7s was going to be doing a mid 78!

    No reason in time you can't get that sub 77 a good chunk lower. Even this bastad got a 75.41 back in the day ;)

    Will get back to some easy runs this week. Half wondering if I was ever that bad, but we move on. Feels vaguely embarrassing to have almost set a party up, then not shown up myself :p:'(

    Are Clapham putting a 12 stage southerns team in for 4 weeks time? We'll be there (all going well!)

  • Bad luck Bus I'd've caught you for sure if it were a mile longer.
    Cracking 'jog' at Wokey from you again Reg.
    So Wokey race report.
    Up at 6am after a half dozen hours of piss poor dozing & waking.
    I left the house at the appointed hr for the rendezvous with my clubmate & chauffeur. Only a 2K drive but almost stacked the car on the unfamiliar lane when a 90 degree bend appeared out of the fog as I was doing about 50 :s HR pounding I got to an empty RV spot! Moments later headlights appeared & we were off. Uneventful drive after that if a bit slow in places due to thick patches of fog which kept appearing until we hit the M4. Pit stop & leg stretch at Chieveley but we're still on course to arrive at the car park for 8:35. We spend 10-15 minutes on stretching, foam rolling & glute activation to undo the 2hr car journey. Walked to the start, collected baggage tags, toilet visit number 2 & bump into a mate from P&D thread who is literally the guy in front in the queue! back to drop bags off & I plan to go for a wu. Mate isn't interested but I bump into another P&D guy + mate so we do some dynamic stretching/glute activation before jogging a gentle 2K. I then head to the toilet for the 3rd time before joining my clubmate behind Dan the 1:25 pacer. 5 minutes later we're off. I'm about 50-100m behind Dan within moments but use the downhill to gradually work my way back up to him which I do after about a mile. We then tick off the miles with the only noteworthy moments being a nob leaping across the road in front of me without any warning as we approached the roundabout because it was coned off 200yds ahead ffs! Then someone (possibly the same guy) hitting a cone about a K further on & sending it rolling into my path! Fortunately I dodged those 2 bullets & passed through 3M in 18:55 - a bit quick but then it's largely downhill for that first 5K. By 3.5M I'd had enough of the bunch causing me to have to chop my stride & I was feeling good so decided to push on & run just ahead. The miles continued to tick along at steady 6:30s. The watch was lapping just before the mile markers up to 9M (58:00) when they came back in synch. 10M was 64:34 so I needed a 19:52 5K uphill to PB which I was pretty sure was impossible however I did think a 20:2x was realistic so kept working hard. I was overtaking & being overtaken in roughly equal measure though possibly erring in my favour :)
    Mile 11 was my slowest at 6:49 but I rallied to put in 2 more 6:30's During that final mile I pushed hard downhill & was doing 5:50 pace however it was too early as my HR went in to the red & I almost blew up: legs started to feel crampy on the cut up road surface through the new housing development. Once through that I rallied again & hit 5:50 for a bit more before dying on the slight incline from the roundabout up to 13M. My final sprint was lacklustre but I was happy to see 1:25:2x on the clock coming up to the line & even happier that my watch read 1:25:19 once I'd stopped it after crossing the line. 1:25 pacer was about 10 seconds behind me :D
  • Nice one jools.
    Did wonder what a 2k drive was for a moment...2000miles, 2000metres..but 2hours.
    Long one!
    Decent days work for you after last week. What's up next?
  • Another mile Jools?  Sounds like another 100 yards and you'd have flown past!

    Mile 11 is definitely a bugger - hitting the start, up that bridge, with another soon after is a bit of a killer!  I remember being overtaken by multiple paralympian Richard Whitehead on that bridge years ago, and before his 2012 glory days. The crowd were roaring him on, I was feeling shite and he was moving fast. For just a brief moment, I looked at his blades and thought "you bastard - wish I had those"! Most ungentlemanly of course.... 
  • Final XC of the season next Saturday then a weekend off racing before Fission 20M. I ran 2:14:27 there last year at the back end of a 90M week despite missing the start by 72s & therefore running the first half far quicker than I'd intended (1:06:05). The course was also flooded up to calf depth in 3 places on both laps so we were running in heavy waterlogged shoes from about 5K. I know I had a 2:12 in me given better conditions & a more measured start. Don't think I'm in quite that shape this year but should be able to better my official PB of 2:15:39 at least.
  • Jooligan said:
    Final XC of the season next Saturday then a weekend off racing before Fission 20M.
    When I started reading the first four words of this sentence, I though you'd done an XC in the afternoon after Wokey! It wouldn't have surprised me either.

    Nice report and run Jools.
  • RicFRicF ✭✭✭
    Good racing all round guys. Well done.

    The reports bring the whole matter to life. Good reading.

    Joe, Shoelaces then!

    First change the laces for some with a bit of grip. Then do a double twist of the lace before the bow. Pull the knot (single) really tight. And then - the bit that matters most - tuck the loose ends of the arrangement away to stop them flapping about.

    It's the loose ends of laces being bounced about which unties the things.

  • Reg WandReg Wand ✭✭✭
    edited February 2019
    Being a triathlete Joe should be using elastic laces anyway, I can't actually think of an advantage for traditional tie laces.
  • Good racing all - I'll post my indoor movements later. SG - Had a very long chat with your friend..everyone's friend (I'll let you guess ;) )..he turned up in my 1500.

    One thing - this HR monitor stuff. What happens if you're having a stormer and the HR is too you back off?

    Looking forward to 'King Sandbags' report especially ;)

  • Laces is always one of my big concerns pre race. I'll always totally untie, and retie securely in the 10mins before the off. 
    Having had laces untie in a cross country or 2 before, it's certainly a worry! Worst time was jumping a water crossing at Tadley, landing heavily in some mud, and taking the shoe off! Still tied up tightly! ARGHHH

    That took some adrenaline to force my foot straight into the tied shoe, as you can imagine how long that would have taken to untie those muddy warm tight laces, and tie back up! We'd be talking 2mins minimum!

    Anyway, back into it.
    4mile easy. Pace comfy, but legs wouldn't have me believe I've spent 2 1/2 days off totally. Excessive sweating back to more normal levels, but making a few throaty "clearances" instead. So something was up, and we'll ease back in with short ones until the latter end of the week I think.
  • Simon - i dare say he's fine. It's at booze o clock online he gets a little bold!

    Kind Sandbag already posted didn't he? Aka Joe ;)
  • muddyfunstermuddyfunster ✭✭✭
    edited February 2019
    "One thing - this HR monitor stuff. What happens if you're having a stormer and the HR is too you back off?"

    Never happens unless the monitor is on the blink. And when it is, you know because it's _way_ off.

    Usually when I'm having a stormer I'm going faster than I would've anticipated for a lower heart rate.

    I managed to pick up a bug and didn't feel at all like running this weekend. Unwisely went down to parkrun for a social run and trotted round in 18.28 and felt rough afterwards. May have a pootle today after sleeping a lot Sat/Sun.
  • muddyfunstermuddyfunster ✭✭✭
    edited February 2019
    Congratulations on the 10k improvement Pete - next time out it'll be sub 38, but may have to be before it gets much warmer.

    I think Joe's parkrun times, in clogs and flat cap, should not be relied upon as indicative of race ability :) Well done Joe.

    Reg, that's a proper effort nevertheless. The sort of training run you would maybe knock out once or twice in a marathon campaign. Hope it all holds together today and going forward.

    Bus - shame about the hip playing up.

    Jooligan - well done too, better than Wrexham already. It'll all feed into the marathon pot, especially with 5m afterwards.

    Stevie - Shame you had to miss out. I'm facing a similar decision this week about Newport Half after not feeling up to a long slow run yesterday - I should have known based on runs last week feeling unusually hard to get through. On the one hand, rest and hope I'm then fresh for the race. Alternatively do a standard pre-race week on the back of feeling unusual and risk making it worse. Leaning towards the 'kill or cure' solution.

    I wonder if it will be lesson learned for your friend Dom ?

  • Stevie  GStevie G ✭✭✭
    edited February 2019
    Hope you get a decent recovery Muddy.I think you probably "properly" have something, where I'm just on the borderline, but on the other hand, for me to take a 2 day rest takes some doing, as anyone who has read the thread for years will know.

    I read and appreciated all the pre Wokey thoughts. I did consider it was some sort of "stress" thing, but to be honest it would have happened before, and I feel similar now, so you'd think it'd have eased if it was that. Will just trot out some stress free easy stuff for a bit - the beauty of no real races on the agenda, bar the 12 stage which is 4 weeks away

    Dom will think it was top training campaign, as he took almost a min off the pb. I dare say he'll only realise when the gains take real effort to make. Then it'll bite doing such intense mad sessions. It's irony of the highest magnitude that he was smashing himself, and pbd, while I didn't even get to the start I guess :)

    Kept busy over the last week instead, got my po10 back catalogue up to 190 races now. Not bad, when it was sat on about 140 a couple of weeks back.

    Probably can squeeze that to 200-205 of the 240 which will be it.

    PS (not to tempt face and talk meets and then not turn up again....)

    anyone else in the 12 stage relays?
  • Stress really hammers the immune system though Stevie. Could be a combination of all that.

    Yes, to be fair to Dom I suppose the 10m training run pace in the cold is irrelevant as a measure of anything other than excessive zeal, given it was a much warmer race day.
  • SG - we've got a team going but I don't think I'm going to turn out. Got too much in the race diary at the moment for it to fit. Glad to see you back on 2 feet today.

    Muddy - classic 18:28 5km with a bug. Hope it's nothing too serious. See how you feel a bit closer to race day I reckon. 

    Yeah still kicking myself re; the laces. Always double knot without fail - what a moron. On the plus side, feel good today, recovery run was fine, couple of easier days before getting back into it. 

    Should probably have a look at my 35:41 10km PB at some point given the last 2 years at Wokingham I've gone through the distance in sub 36. 
  • Deffo Joe. Although there is the slight down first 5km, you've got to have a real opportunity at getting that down i'd say.
    There's a BP 10k in March I think I saw.

    I get all keen seeing tonnes of races at times, so need to at least wait until a run feels good again before jumping in...but for you that certainly that looks a close to home good chance.

    This short month keeps catching me out, not realising it's 1st March this Friday.
    Ealing mile would be nice. But as per above statement really!
  • Some excellent results at Wokingham, enjoyed the reports. Joe I'd say a big PB is on the cards at Reading, especially with another 3 weeks training.

    SG - Ill be doing the 12 stages but the Midlands ones, looking forward to making my club debut.

  • DachsDachs ✭✭✭

    Well done all at Wokingham.

    Reg I spoke to after the race anyway, but you seemed pretty relaxed about it, so onward and upward.

    Bus, very tough race.  Nice vets positioning though.  Maybe the fact that you struggled and were still 3rd V50 reflects that this is just that cruel bastard ageing at work.

    Good race there Jooligan, and glad to see you're fitting in with the thread nicely by being halfway through your report before you've parked and been to the toilet.

    Joe, terrible shoelace error there!  Had it happen to me in one of my first races, and have always made damn sure since.  Fortunately that was only a 10K.  But you'll see those PBs tumble very soon.

  • DachsDachs ✭✭✭

    Since I have re-appeared, I’d better provide a report from Wokingham.

    As I’ve said, my form has been well off this winter.  Typically finishing in the 20s in the XC league as compared to the teens in the winter leading up to me breaking 70 at Wokingham two years ago.  In terms of training, the short reps have been there or thereabouts, but tempos and long run paces have also been down.  Therefore, whilst I was very much looking forward to getting back on my favoured surface and seeing where my fitness stands, my expectations were not high.  My suspicion was that I ought to be able to do 72:xx, 71:xx would have been a good day, and sub 71 would be dreamland.

    Managed to break my Garmin, so it was crappy stopwatch time.  Wasn’t too concerned about this, as it would prevent me getting hung up on pace.

    Usual mad dash at the start, albeit this time the high-vis wanker who used to start right at the front then run 1:55 was absent, so no moving bollard to negotiate.  Positions change through the first mile, but eventually the race settles into a decent sized fast group moving into the distance, a distinct chase group up ahead, and then dribs and drabs.  I am one of the drabs.

    About a mile and a bit in I find myself running with frequent competitor James of Woodstock, about 40 metres behind the chase group, without anyone else in close proximity.  James and I broke 70 together 2 years ago, but it occurs to me that he had been quite down on his prospects this year, and was targeting 73.  The risk is that he’s gone off fast and will drop, and I’ll find myself in no man’s land for the entire race.  With that in mind, I rudely put in a big effort to make up ground and tag myself onto the back of the chase group.  It takes me about half a mile, and a reasonable effort, to do this, but I am satisfied that it is worth it.

    Now part of a group of 7, and the first watch check is at 3 miles. 15:48. OK, that’s … er… quicker than I expected.  Oh well, let’s just commit to it!

    Stay with the group through 5 miles, which is reached in 26:20, which is well ahead of 70 pace.  Hmm, maybe today will be better than I imagined?  I remember hitting 10K in 32:45ish in 2017, so it looks like it will be similar this time.  However, the group is pressing hard, and, in all honesty, it’s too fast for me.  I drop off the back, and the distance grows to about 30-40m, but I rally in time to keep that gap from growing further, and them being reasonably close ahead is still psychologically easier than being totally isolated.  Sure enough, 10K is chalked up in around 32:45.

    The 7 mile point is around Hurst, which is only a few miles from home, and is packed with my clubmates marshalling, so I get a bit of a boost going through here, but back on the lonely roads and the group are pulling ahead and it becomes harder again.  Another runner drops off the group, and I catch up and press past.

  • DachsDachs ✭✭✭
    Ninth and tenth miles are tough, but I get to 10 miles in 53:13.  Again, this is almost identical to two years ago.  Can I really pull a sub 70 out of THIS form?

    No, as it turns out.  The last 5K is where I lose all the time.  I have someone to chase ahead, as another runner has dropped from the group, but the pace has slowed, and it’s just about bringing it home any which way I can.  A final sprint is needed to avoid the ignominy of losing to a Bracknell Forest runner who has closed quickly, but it’s across the line in 1:10:21.

    Well, have to say I didn’t expect that.  So I was well chuffed, as you can imagine.  Even more pleasing was going through 10 miles in the same time as in 2017.  I am not surprised the last 5k was slower, as back then I’d been virtually doing marathon training, whereas my long runs this time round have been a bit haphazard.  Back then, I knew it was a peak, whereas now I suspect there’s more to come.

    The elephant in the room is the Vaporflys.  Yes, I have joined the bouncy orange bastard revolution, as had a large proportion of the front end at Wokingham.  SG will no doubt be keen to hear how much difference they made (there was definitely some), but it’s very difficult to tell.  As I said, I thought I was in 72 shape, so it’s tempting to say 2 minutes, but I may well have underestimated my own ability, and it’s not like it was a breakthrough to a level I’d never achieved before, so who knows?

  • Still a blistering performance Dachs. I can't believe the shoes can be worth more than a few seconds a mile at best, so down to the engine!

    Wish I had been 3rd v50 - that was Frank Fulcher in1:18:02. I was a lowly 15th :-(

    Bloody hungry today!
  • 2mins would be an insane improvement from the shoes! So i expect you're like a lot of the vapor brigade in underestimating their fitness and training.
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