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Moraghan Training - Stevie G
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Today and fri felt a bit weaker compared to plenty of warm days going back a while so maybe just underfuelled or slightly off for whatever reason.
I remember a marlow teammate telling me he fell to pieces in any sort of heat whereas could run well however cold.
Bus that's running to a tee isn't it. Totally unexpected bumps in the road!
Hopefully no harm done in the scheme of things when you're back
You still did 15 around 7mM pace wasn't it? Seemed pretty strong to me given how windy it is!
It sounds more like one of those things you'd file as an impact injury - especially freak for non contact sports lots like us, but once it's dealt with it's gone. Rather than the dreaded overuse build up thing that takes some targeted stuff to see off.
Yes Bus it is a bit odd saying it felt weak when I've fairly comfortably still done a 7.03 average for 15, monitoring whether I am actually feeling a knee or not, including the 5mile up to Beaconsfield, but you know how we like to dissect everything on here
But I suppose this is why most of us favour shorter racing in the warm months! Maidenhead 10 last April was a scorcher and I was surprised how comfortable that felt, but I certainly wouldn't take that as the "rule" and pile in for any summer HMs any time again
I’m sure you’re running those 15M too fast. In fact all your runs seem to average 7:0x SG. Great times but not really progressing now? Time to slow most down & do some speedier workouts?
Good week on the bike Bus. Not so good on the foot injury 😞
That’s a big week for sure TR. No walking today then?
Standard 10M here with 2x 1M flat & a 0.5M hill climb in the first 4M to bring up 82 for the week & 8,800ft of climb.
Shame about the foot Bus, surprised it's not better now and annoying how innocuous it was too. Decent long run SG -great TT stuff from MH and Reg
Pete - No problem with the bike stuff - less posts for me to go with
Yesterday thougt I'd do 12 long hill reps. Stuck the hill on Instagram if anyone is on that. Quite warm too! It was 82 secs and got the last down to about 75. Really hard work.
Today did last weeks run backwards, so I could run down the A5 southwards with the wind behind me. So was just over 7mm for the first 7, then got a bit of tempo going and brought the pace for the full 14.6 own to 6.54mm. Leg 2/10 pain so hopefully that's that now - won't report on it.
My mate told me about the Jess Ennis circuits. Had a tester today, might do his few times a week. If the first one doesn't kill me.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l0I-guMfR3E
Take your point Jools but it feels the wrong time to increase sessions. Racing won't be for months at earliest.
So it's just ticking over, filling the furlough days and keeping my eye in with a bit of faster work. There is no need to progress as such.
But a 6m slower than HM tempo and a good number of 1-2min bursts feel enough quality for now. No track availability either.
Most of us know we could ease the pace down without any issues at all, so I suppose it's most important to recognise if you're getting a bit weary (like Fri and today felt), or if you're not hitting session paces - which at the moment is only the Tuesday tempo, as Friday is more an "as it comes" job. And there of course not being an obvious reason why you're off pace in the tempo, like wind!
But with a lot of rest, no work, no commute, not maxed sessions and just single runs i suppose it's no surprise to be a bit quicker?
I'll set off slower tomorrow and see how it pans out, at least keep the run in between long and tempo down a bit.
I think id crumble if i attempted your mix of mileage hills and efforts 😂
Will monitor splitting back into some doubles, now that's back on the table Wed on, but realistically i'd probably find it more of an arse to do 2 runs a day in this current set up unless I'm on a course day - with none for the next 3 weeks on the agenda.
Instagram Simon? How hip do you think this crowd is?
You'll be posting yourself dancing on Tik Tok next!
Good to see you're back to normality.
I know I've been guilty of running slightly too fast too often because I've tried to cram the miles in whilst suffering from work related time constraints but whilst we don't have that pressure it seems a good time to relax the pace from time to time. My run on Thursday averaged over 10 min/mile, even GAP was over 9
Matt - great mile time mate, knew you had quicker than 5:30 in you.
Reg - certainly went for it, kudos for that! I've no doubt you'd be sub-17 on just a standard 5km distance as well right now, so I'm definitely not claiming the win there.
TR - really impressive mileage with no long run.
Plenty of hilly turbo miles at the weekend ahead of an attempt at this 'Everesting' on Saturday. Plenty of people have done it recently, but I'm just planning on turning myself inside out and laying down a quick a time as possible. Anything under 10 hours I'll be relatively happy with.
But i suppose the two cruxes are 1) not hitting sesh paces and 2) niggles.
After 6-7 weeks of singles which has been very different I'm just starting to monitor part two there.
These are odd days though. In doubles that second run often comes out a step slower. For certain after a session.
Those sunday runs i think you almost get "up" for a little too.
I remember Moz first telling me about page 1 or 2 of this thread about the concept of easy runs. Back then it was no quicker than 7.20 for easy. That honestly felt like walking back then as id obviously got used to going way too fast..i suspect deep into sub 7 in pre watch days.
If any run of the week could do with being easier it's the one In between long and tempo so today's would naturally be a bit slower but I'll start off a bit more so too.
I have realized that I have a habit of sitting with one leg tucked under my butt. I seem to have done it for a long period while sat on a conference call last week, with my right lower leg being squeezed between my butt and the hard surround of a wooden chair. The result is a lot of pain in the ankle / achilles and I haven't been able to run since it happened. I believe this has to go high on my personal list of ridiculous injuries.
I can walk without pain now so it's defo going in the right direction but no need to risk anything in the current environment. I like Zwift too
You sit with your leg under your butt? That can't be comfortable!
Sweepstake on the pace of today's 10 before the strava load ruins it?
Bike chat: put my name down on the reconditioned Wattbike Atom waiting list. Not sure why, I'd struggle to power the lights on an Xmas tree!
Wool - even by my standards that is indeed a ridiculous injury! Hope it is short lived though.
Sounds like a world of pain lined up there Joe - you'll love it
Struggling to stay positive currently - the foot is as swollen and sore as it was over a week ago today after just a 2M stroll yesterday. Just as we are being told we can soon exercise as much as we like too!
Jools - good stuff more good work. I was excused walking yday, i can do both next weekend !
Good stuff Simon
Joe - sounds tough, but you've been putting the hours in and love a challenge.
Weve been telling SG to slow down for ages, at least on the odd run. All that recent 7.0X mileage at LT a minute slower than mp, is a lot of work......but i do mostly easy running myself apart from the odd session or tempo, so whilst my legs would disagree i finish practically every run (tempo or reps apart) feeling that i could do it again.
Regulation 10m tonight, one of those runs when you are glad to get out of the wind when its done.
Obviously I don't mean that as I have had sore calves for 3 days now but I reckon at least every other week SG you should have a session in there that scares you into running very easy the day before and the day after it. Why not wind that long run up occasionally finishing at sub 6 for the last few miles and then just dawdling it on the trails the week after at 8+ minute miles.
I am probably fortunate that I can stress my CV system on the bike to get some regular threshold training, it's just some of that load bearing stress that my calves can't cope with.
I've looked at the Atom but I'd have to sell my Wattbike first and I might wait for the second generation of smart bikes to iron out any kinks.
Hope you're hanging in there Bus.
5 for me this morning, leg feels OK so hopefully the most ridiculous of injuries has been short-lived.
I'm thinking of driving somewhere for a run at the weekend. I hardly ever do that in normal times but being limited to running from the front door has left me a little bored. The running routes in the Surrey Hills are probably the only thing I am missing about work. I suppose it'll have to be an early start though as EVERYONE is going to be out and about this weekend, aren't they? I'm seeing some very interesting positions being taken by the National Park authorities. Seems like the Lakes are trying to keep everyone away while the Dales are accepting the fact that everyone is going to arrive anyway and are opening car parks etc. Some great posts on the Windsor Great Park FB site too where many locals with an over-inflated sense of entitlement seem to think that the car parks should be open for them alone. FFS!
Hope you are right about the cycling too, though must admit I've always found it works the other way round for me....
I've driven a couple of miles twice to do my timed solo virtual races that was obviously before the guidance changed, I don't care though as it made no difference to anyone and I've done about 30 miles in 8 weeks.
I actually found that running kept me in good cycling shape last year but I think part of it is that cycling fitness appears to endure much better than running.
Wool; not looked at WGP FB pages but I think more the issue is the park is open and annual pass holders (like my wife who oft moans about this!) pay for parking as part of their annual pass but a) can't use it and b) get no pro-rata refund. Doesn't bother me personally; as pretty much a local I can run or cycle there and, even if I can't be bothered and drive, I know free roadside parking next to both the Ascot gates and the VW one. If you want to know those just pm me but guess you are as aware as I am!
Interesting stats Reg but you are quite an outlier; I find I need to do at least about 20 mpw running however much I cycle, or the running level drops quite quickly.
Got back into running Sunday and Monday combining a faster pace for a few miles alone with running alongside my daughter for her runs. She is up to running 10k distance now though, so no real need to add more once the new rules start and some days can feature running and cycling.
Did a wilfully slower 7.33 10miler yesterday, including a little sortie into some random field or two. Was alright. There is good logic in making the run in between the long one and the tempo like that for sure. I'll probably try and adopt that going forward.
Reggie is right about how you naturally back off when you're doing other hard sessions - which I was saying earlier about how this generally is a time of lighter sessions, so the paces creep up on other runs as you don't have as much lingering fatigue.
Usual runs I'm not overly convinced that 1min slower than HMP is "too fast" per se, but it it definitely is top end.
One of Moz's key mantras was "know when to back off", and the Friday and Sunday runs felt a little more knackering than usual, so it was probably time, after the 6-7 week switch to double digit doubles.
Todays 6m tempo was a 6.11 job. Same route as last week, which came out at 6.20, but that's definitely not down to a slower Monday run, that's down to only a light wind, not a strong one
Unlike other weeks, the last 4 miles were the quicker ones.
Makes the 5 week sequence 6.10-6.25-6.10-6.20-6.11, in a game of spot the windy run!
All 5 have a bit of a down gradient, but 10-12 feet a mile isn't a biggy I don't think for this sort of thing. More important to hit the effort. Last 2 weeks have a sharp hill just before 2miles.
As often on a quality/race type run you forget about those little niggles, but I suspect the back off day yesterday plus a lot of stretching, especially the underworked calvess did the trick.
I always forget to do much on the calves as I very rarely feel anything there. But there's every chance they are the catalyst for feelings elsewhere!
Took so long waffling that out, missed both your posts
Reg - must be frustrating having a "Limiting" effect on your running with injury, but with your higher priority sport giving you loads of joy, perhaps not as bad as it would be for pure runners.
If a few months ago anyone had said that something so big would happen that no one would for a second think about Brexit, no-one would have believed them would they?
A sign that life can turn up side down in a second and....add something really deep and thoughtful here
Anyone else follow Paul Martelletti on Strava, 152 miles last week including a little 40 miler at 6:22 pace, fucking lunatic.
The written reasons for needing to be able to drive to WGP range from some that really make you feel for the situation folks are in during the lockdown (e.g. disabled family member) to some which I just laugh at (my dog is old, can't walk there but loves it and you can see the smile on his face when I tell him we're going to Blacknest Gate today).
Pete - yes, the car park cost thing is a point of issue for some but it's clear that the majority of folks are enjoying the relative quiet of the park at the moment and so they just want to maintain that for themselves. Perhaps they should stay at home and let others enjoy a quieter environment! I'm 0.3 miles from the Long Walk, I can manage that without driving! In fact, I get pretty bored of running in WGP and often turn to different routes as a result.
Nice tempo SG. Will you go back to doubles now you can? As I've said to you elsewhere, I think you have great opportunity to get in your car a couple of times a week and run in some new / fantastic places now. I'm jealous in some ways (although I'm not trying to belittle the fact that your furlough doubtless brings you other issues).
Good to hear your own-goal injury has pretty much cleared off already Wool.
I'm with you Pete, Bus. Whenever I cycle a lot my running top speed slows right down. Don't know how you do it Reg. Raw talent & an ability to stay in the hurt zone I guess.
I drove 2 miles to get off the hill for today's session: 8x 1K off 90" walk /60" jog after a 5K wu including 6x20s strides DH then just the 2K cd up a modest hill rather than last weeks killer climb. Happy with the paces especially as I'd only had 15hrs recovery from Monday's hilly 10M rather than 22hrs last week & a harder w/e with a faster PR, longer Saturday & a fartlek on Sunday. K reps averaged 3:49 (vs 3:54) & ranged from 3:42-3:54 so definite progress
Jools - I'll always listen to well intentioned advice from the thread, as you guys follow my witter day to day
Everyone posting currently has something different to offer, and shows a large amount in resilience in what they do.
The tempo felt decent, but then I've done 5 weeks of these now, so that probably happens naturally. Let alone with the wind easing up. However, the Monday between long and tempo definitely makes sense.
There's not really any attempt to progress right now - it's a case of ticking over - so bedding in a solid tempo, and some faster light reps, plus 60-65mile weeks feels a good base for as long as it needs to be.
When there's a sign of a race I'd work the tempo up - longer, finishing faster, mixing paces - a progression that's been behind all my best races 5mile and over.
To answer Wool as well, I will probably throw the odd drive in, as furlough will definitely be until the end of June for me now. Also - I want to check the car still works, and actually get some value for the tax on it! Did 0 miles last month!
A Marlow offroad sortie perhaps, or maybe switch my Friday 1-2mins for a light bit of seg hunting (despite telling a couple of pals I was "over them" the other day
) That would probably be the most fun option.
No courses until June, but I dare say doubles would sound most sensible those days. But I think as keen as I am i'll struggle to bother to get out for doubles on "free" days.
Again, about as concise as Jimmy Jabberer of 23 "Why take 10 words when you can take 1000" Street
But general principle I work to, is 1) am I hitting the target paces in sessions and 2)am I growing niggles/fatigued.
Only Tuesday is really relevant to point 1 at the moment, but for the first time in a long time, I felt number 2 was a bit of a thing last weekend which called for a backing off.
However, Monday reset that and back ready to go again.
You look like you're enjoying your running a lot at the mo, and while it's a different approach to what I'm doing, I can see that progression in paces must be pleasing.
I probably get my most satisfaction from the week on hitting the Tuesday session right.
Reg, I'm not surprised your calves are sore - you didn't have too much of a die-off in pace! Nicely done.
SG, glad to see a tempo that's not been hampered in some way! FWIW, I definitely agree with the others regarding easy pace. I also disagree that you shouldn't see any changes because you're maintaining - you should be getting a training stimulus which will bring you forward.
Bus, sorry to hear that running is off the table for some time, but glad you're enjoying the bike. Hopefully when you get back to it your legs will welcome the change.
TR, keep oiling that machine - you're gonna reap some big rewards when the time comes.
Wool, I'm glad to find out I'm not the only one who sits on a leg! Not sure how the habit formed, but definitely understand how uncomfortable it can be on the wrong type of chair. Glad it's cleared up for you.
Joe, you're an absolute mentalist. Is Katie joining you on the attempt?
SC, tidy hill reps there! All better that the leg isn't a problem anymore. Certainly don't fancy the circuits myself!
So, despite a little victory on Friday, I'm back on the injury bench for now. The mile and the weekend running ended up aggravating the lower soleus/achilles on one side, and I had to abort today's run after 15mins, at a 4-5 out of 10. It wasn't sore this morning after resting yesterday, even when out walking the dog. Hopefully it's short-lived.
Calves always seem to be the problem areas for me, so will have to work in some strengthening...