Moraghan Training - Stevie G



  • Stevie  GStevie G ✭✭✭✭
    Slight hiccup in the road....

    With the 5x1km relays on Thursday, I needed a bit of re-assurance of how this quad might tighten up, as if it's tight on 7.30 running, any sort of hard running could be dangerous.

    Got half a mile in at easy pace, and literally had to stop, as it was like I was carrying the leg.
    Realised I wasn't doing much more, so just settled for pootling a mile home at 830 or so then limping the rest back in.

    Hour later, walking feels fine, so it can't be "that" much of a tear, but the relays are 100% out at least.
    The doubt of that being removed feels a relief to be honest as me and the partner usually do well in these, so could only go badly with a niggle doubt.

    So I guess it's lots of walking and wait until there's no sore point on the quad/no ache when bending etc, lots of icing etc, and in a day or 2 foam rolling/gentle stretching, and when it feels right, try and ease back in?

  • Stevie G said:
    I always suspected you just monstered in, posted your stuff without any attempt to read back Phil...but asking about the Marlow 10k/10m about 5 posts after I'd done a massive summary of it is quite special 
    I start a post and get distracted and then press send and it appears 2 or 3 pages later. 
  • The BusThe Bus ✭✭✭
    We're all falling apart on here at the moment!!!!  Patience SG - this is what its like now you are a vet :wink:

    8.5M for me today and he hamstring was OK, but my left hip was sore and its really stiffened up this evening!

  • JooliganJooligan ✭✭✭
    Chapeau Pete: I’d be extremely happy with those race times right now & I’m ‘only’ 52 later this month.
    PMJ That’s very fast walking. I can do 14 on the flat for a coupla miles & whilst training for the SWT I marched 2 miles 600’ uphill at 16 min/mile pace s
    Bad luck on the niggles SG & Bus.
    Rose Inn is certified accurate & I’m sure it’ll have a WA licence so will be on Po10 however sounds like that might be irrelevant right now.
    Been plodding away around 8 min/mile pace daily for between 35 & 90 minutes.
    Feeling a bit beat up after my 3 big adventures. Did a flat parkrun (Portsmouth Lakeside) in 19:57 Saturday. Mostly hard trail with puddles & uneven surface rest on tarmac. 3 dead turns too. Good enough for 6th out of 170 odd but definitely sub-par.
  • Stevie  GStevie G ✭✭✭✭
    Yep Jools, glad I didn't book anything!
    Expected a little bit of downtime from Endure, but thought I'd had that!

    It must sound small time to some of your mad distances etc, but I suppose Endure wasn't just about the 30miles, which is already a decent haul in 24hours, but had the effort levels up too.

    Oh well, doing a couple of half hour walks a day, forcing myself to remember that while it may feel almost perfect walking, that's just a good sign it can't be much of a strain. But to be patient and not try and run until I can't find a sore spot, or it's tight when I move at certain angles sat down etc.
  • Stevie G said:
    Yep Jools, glad I didn't book anything!
    Expected a little bit of downtime from Endure, but thought I'd had that!

    It must sound small time to some of your mad distances etc, but I suppose Endure wasn't just about the 30miles, which is already a decent haul in 24hours, but had the effort levels up too.

    I think the bigger factor is more to do with how big a change it is to what you normally do. 30 miles at 6-minute pace is 3 hours solid running and your normal "long" Sunday run is 13 miles at 7:30 pace so not much over 1.5 hours.

    I also think Covid has a part to play. Runners generally run when they can and rest when real-life interferes, so I'd generally travel abroad 3 or 4 times a year and I'd run but my mileage would be down to about 50% so it would also be a rest. With Covid the daily run became that, each and every day.
  • Stevie  GStevie G ✭✭✭✭
    edited August 2021
    You're right on the change, in terms of the 30miles thing for sure. But remember sub 6miling (well, 6.00/6.01 or so) was the team average. Only my fastest one was actually that pace, and by the end i was probably "only" turning over about 6.40s, but take your general point.

    I feel slightly fraudulent talking about "injury", as I'm walking 100% fine, and have to manipulate my legs around to even find where the sore spot is! I can feel the left quad is tighter when doing the classic standing foot in hand, quad to ass stretch.

    But a bit unsure when to re-start. If I knew for 100% that say 1 week would be perfection again I'd suck it up. But if i took a week, and then it was glitchy again it'd be pure annoyance.

    I think the best bet is probably throw a 3miler in soon ish, see how that goes, and if it's loitering around annoying tightness, maybe even an Oesteo once over. See where things are actually starting from.

    On the day I had to stop, I did a 2mile walk that evening, then 2x2mile walks yesterday, and will be the same again today.
    Walking is a nice safe way to keep activated, but my word it takes sooooo long to rack those 2miles up
  • Walking is very different to running. A couple of weeks ago I couldn't run a single step but managed 15 miles across the Peak District, up, across and down Kinder Scout plus a few more. 

    With any injury or niggle the hardest thing is to know when to push and when to rest. Sometimes they will clear themselves and other times they flare up.
  • Stevie  GStevie G ✭✭✭✭
    Yep. I was going to go on the basis of when i can't find a sore spot on the muscle, or feel it tighter than the other side, that's the time.

    Off to Wycombe v Cheltenham on Saturday, so might be the best bet to restart with a short one Sunday.
    Somewhere random, so that if it turns tight, i can carry on walking for a bit after to make it worthwhile.
  • Stevie  GStevie G ✭✭✭✭
    2.5 days of just walks, tried a 1mile warm up walk, then gave a run a go.

    Seized up from 0.4miles in, did a mile, slowing coming to a tight halt.

    Deffo a physio job I think now.

    Irritating, but at least i'll put in 4miles a day walkies on week days in the meantime, and maybe go out for 90mins or so on a sunday.

    Have had a surprising lack of muscle injuries over the last decade, so it feels quite out of my experience base this one. In footy days tight thigh/quads were no doubt quite frequent, but the difference was often that you'd not do anything for a lot of the rest of the week, so it naturally eased off.
  • Not sounding great on the injury front, SG. Definitely time for the physio. Are you staying over in Cheltenham?

    I definitely couldn’t walk at anywhere near the paces previously mentioned. Although what amazes me is the speed of the race walkers. Sub 7m/m - incredible!

    Good to see you are back on the parkrun and festival trail, Jools.

    A big 74M week closing with a couple of easy five milers over the weekend before a couple more on Monday and Tuesday. Thought this might recharge the legs a little in advance of Wednesday’s Bugatti 10k, but it seems not!

    Put on by my club, it is a great event. Road, downhill opening couple of miles before a tough and long drag over the last half including a couple of short but sharp ascents. I think I have run 38:18 before, perhaps quicker, but could manage only 39:25 for 10th. Frustratingly I got pipped right before the line - didn’t even realise I had anyone on my tail! 

    Lovely social though, and with warm up and down, it came to 11.8M for the evening.

    Thursday was the only opportunity for this weeks long run, getting out at 10am. With only 14 hours recovery, certainly didn’t plan any faster sections and it was somewhat of a grind for 22.5M at 7:31 pace. Managed to drop a gel somewhere, and felt my blood sugar level getting low in spite of some dextrose and a few salty dried apricots. Fortunately found a garage and paid used my watch to pay for a lucozade. Disgusting stuff. 

    So 34.4M in 17 or so hours. Does that put me in ultra territory! Not sure how specific it will have been for the marathon, but certainly good practise at grinding out a run on tired legs and a tired mind. 

  • Stevie  GStevie G ✭✭✭✭
    SQ - I might need to borrow your username for a bit :)
    Although I do feel a little bit of a "fraud", as I'll be walking thinking, what's the fuss, but that's start and end of the week I've had to stop very soon into a run, so Big Phil is right that walking v running is totally different, and should probably only be used as a "this isn't THAT severe" sort of indicator.

    Quick in and out for the Cheltenham game, though I do plan to get there early, park up, and watch United's game on my phone, before meeting up with my Bristol mate training it in.

    If you are anywhere in and around the stadium between 12 and 5 do pop around and i'll say hello
     though :)

    It wasn't so long ago you had some niggles, so I'm pleased how well you're now kicking it!! 74mile weeks. Superb.
    Mentioning your race has already got me hungry fir a few turnouts when I'm back! I'd settle for the 1730-50 5ks I was moaning at now being fast enough a few weeks back! That's running eh!
  • The BusThe Bus ✭✭✭
    Good work SQ - solid race and a BIG long run shortly after!

    I've been doing SOOOOO much walking since this hamstring thing SG. It's damn lucky that it uses different muscles!  Oddly, I've been completely disinclined to go for a bike ride for several weeks now, largely because walking is so much simpler and easier! 

    Just trying to decide whether to risk a run tonight or go for a walk instead as it happens. I felt like an 80 year old running last night - hamstring ws no more than a niggle, but seemed like everything else was hurting and all as a result of doing an 8.5 the night before at a slightly harder pace than usual I think!  I was thinking of walking tonight and then doing a parkrun tomorrow instead - but that might just be delusional!!!
  • Stevie  GStevie G ✭✭✭✭
    I think for us experienced runners it gets to a point where you know for sure whether it's a seek an expert stage or not. 

    It's how long it takes to get to that stage usually.

    For me it only took 2 weeks to be certain. 1 week seeing off ITB, 1 week starting and finishing with a stopped run, despite half a week resting in between.

    Spent today exploring the Bupa protocol. I've had it for 16months, but never even looked how it works, let alone used it.

    Pretty brilliant in fairness. From an online GP call a few hours after booking, to gaining the referral in minutes, then finding out where is approved, to a quick ring around, settling on a place for Tuesday lunchtime, having had to turn Monday down.

    That's quick results.
    Just hope the actual session is the same!
  • The BusThe Bus ✭✭✭
    edited August 2021
    That's good work.

    Well, my CBA last evening led to guit tripping myself into a parkrun this morning, despite a bit of a hangover! 

    First one since 2019, and my first "race" since Wokingham last year. Given I've done on speed work whatsoever since March, and have only averaged 25 mpw since then as well I really didn't know what to expect.  I thought a realistic goal was sub 21, but told myself not to be disappointed with anything sub 22 (whilst really hoping for a sub 20 of course!).

    Did the usual warm up, and actually felt quite good, but was determined to start sensibly, which I did.  Somewhat surprised to start easy, about 30 places back and still see sub 6mM pace on the watch! Clearly not sustainable and so it proved - less than 1km in and I thought I was going to be sick!!! Reeled it back in though, got the heart rate and lactic under control and pressed on.  First mile came out at 6:24 and I was actually beginning to enjoy it as I was in control and overtaking a fair few people.  Mile 2 (with the steps!) came out at 640, whihc was still faster than expected.   Mile 3 started well and I was pulling ahead from a couple of guys who'd overtaken me earlier. I actually thought a sub 20 was on the cards, but that proved a bit too much and mile 3 was a fairly pleasing 6:19, with the 0.1 at the end meaning I crossed the line in 20:08.  I'll take that as a marker and intend to get back under 20 next time out.  Hamstring was niggly, but no more than that. Interestingly, I chose not to wear my racers so I'll claim the heavier shoes cost me the 9 seconds :smiley:  

    20:07 official time, 9th and 1st V50.
  • PeteMPeteM ✭✭✭
    Excellent parkrun as a comeback Bus in what must be a harder than average course with those steps. Augurs well for low 19's in the next few weeks there if you can stay largely injury free. 

    Not much happening for me. Downtime after all those recent races. Last week took on a deliberately tough parkrun but was surprised just how rubbish a time I delivered (21'3x). Today went to a flat course, Crane Park, and a nondescript 19'25. Ok I suppose, but nothing to get excited about; makes my 18'36 at BP  few weeks back look a flash in the pan when given a super fast course and perfect conditions. 
  • Reg WandReg Wand ✭✭✭
    Nice parkrunning chaps.

    102 miles on the bike today. We had a bit of a nightmare, one chap got his chain all twisted up which took 20-30 minutes to remedy. Eventually he turned back as his rear derailleur was a bit knackered. Next another guy got a double puncture and due to the depth of his wheels we didn't have enough spares to get him going properly so he ended up on the train home. I then had a rattling cassette which hadn't been put on properly, luckily we were only 2 miles from a bike repair chap so got that fixed and the remaining three of us had a blissfully uneventful 55 miles back.

  • JooliganJooligan ✭✭✭
    Better than my parkrun Bus. I could only manage 20:34 at the Medina. Rolling grass & gravel course, warm & humid but I’ve no spark this week. I then cycled 8.5M back across the Isle before doing another 68 miles around the entire coastline.
  • The BusThe Bus ✭✭✭
    Impressive (and eventful Reg!) cycling there chaps.  Complete circuit of IoW sounds a great idea Jools and, typically, 76 miles is not enough for you on its own so has to be tagged on to the back of a lumpy parkrun :smiley:

    Lots of rain here for a dry day!  LSR later and see if yesterdays parkrun is still in my legs!
  • The BusThe Bus ✭✭✭
    It was!  First 6M was OK, but the last 7 felt more like the last 7 of a marathon than an easy Sunday 13! Hey ho, got round and a few miles of recovery walking later helped. 

    Where is everyone today then?
  • Reg WandReg Wand ✭✭✭
    I think my Saturday ride wiped me out along with a lack of sleep as I had a headache all day yesterday and went to bed at the same time as the children! I really should drink more than a bottle and a half!

    Seismic shift on the forum, Bus with a new profile pic! There's me thinking nothing ever changes here. Good work getting the long run done after the PR.
  • The BusThe Bus ✭✭✭
    Shucks, you noticed :smile:
    Just thought the beard was out of date! (though this pic is even older!)
  • A bottle and a half on a century seems too little, Reg. But perfect for some recovery 🍷. 

    Bus - your profile pic must be dodgy. My phone is blocking it for some reason! Very impressed with that parkrun and long run combo. You are managing things and returning nicely. 

    Hope the session with physio goes well, SG. And that you enjoyed the Cheltenham trip. The hill above the stadium in your photos is Cleeve Hill, a running favourite. 

    Hadn’t run hard since last Thursday, so was looking forward to this morn. Standard jog to and from track, with another tempo sandwich on the cards. 

    Session is written as 20 mins MP, 5 x 3   mins 10k, 20 mins. Rough conversion gave me 5k (600 jog), 5 x 800 (400), 5k. 

    Fist MP felt cruisy: 20:58 or 1:40 a lap. 800s bloody hard and couldn’t locate top gear: 3:01-3:04. Then the final 5k in 21:01 was tougher but still in control. Suspect the HR from that section is a good indication of race day target. 

    All in 17.7M at 6:59 average, albeit with the pauses to walk in and out of the stadium. As I wore the Adios, I suspect my calves might know about it tomorrow. 

    Got home to an absolute treat. My wife’s friend is doing a Level 5 Sports Therapy Massage qualification. £20 for 90 minutes! Felt quite the professional athlete. Quickly dispatched this feeling by then looking in the mirror. 

  • Stevie  GStevie G ✭✭✭✭
    That new pic with the jazzy coloured top certainly stands out hugely if you have the thread selected as a favourite, and get the notifications in the top right section!

    I should probably change mine, bearing in mind it must be from almost a decade ago. But I sort of like the barren nature of the shot, classic tough end to a half marathon, over at Gosport.

    (Although i hadn't remembered you even had a beard on your pic Bus, or got so used to it it glazed over)

    SQ, when I read a fan's account about the supposed views, I thought, what? I've been to Cheltenham's ground a few times and wasn't sure 1) you could see out of the stands anyway, 2) there was nothing there.

    But now I realise that I must have simply been the other side of the stand, and couldn't see over the stand to the right.
    Wycombe have a decent view behind the small stand, but yours is just miles of rolling scenery as far as the eye can see!

    Sounds a decent session. I've only ever done sessions the other way round to that. Where you do say 4x200m hard, then you do say a 4miles tempo, then end 4x200m hard.

    The early bits of the tempo are a cruise compared to 200m rinsed pace, but it soon catches up on you!

    Right, physio at 1.30pm and hopefully back on the road to sorting things out, and contributing something vaguely run related!
  • Stevie  GStevie G ✭✭✭✭
    Physio done. Basically not a "thigh strain" as such, more likely just tightness accumulation etc - your classic runner thing basically!

    A range of motion checks showed particularly tight on the left side, so I have a set of exercises to smash through.
    Then back next Tue for hydrotherapy. No idea how and what that will show.
    But will do a couple of days of these exercises intensely (not mad, but a lot), then perhaps try a little run Friday and see if we're looking at any improvements.

    Again, can't believe it's "that" bad at all. But then it did stop me on 2 runs over 1 week, at half a mile, which in the context of my last 3 or 4 years is "pretty bad" on the scale!
  • alehousealehouse ✭✭✭
    Just popping in to say that the Last Friday of the Month 5k in Hyde Park resumes from August 27th. Hopefully will be down there in a couple of months!
    Progress is rarely a straight line. There are always bumps in the road, but you can make the choice to keep looking ahead.
  • Reg WandReg Wand ✭✭✭
    I also saw the physio yesterday as my back is still grumbling on, this time I saw the one I prefer though and I think she made more progress on my back in one session than the other lady did in 4. I have an issue between the lumbar and thoracic spine. She had to use all of her might to get it moving and let out a few groans of effort  :D I was like, 'what exactly are you doing back there!'

    I also have hamstring strengthening work to do, if I can sort these two things it will be interesting to see if anything else goes instead or perhaps I'll get a injury free run.

    Easy run 5 and a bit miles before breakfast.
  • The BusThe Bus ✭✭✭
    Any lurkers out there - not all runners are always injured :wink:

    Dilemma time!  For months now I have had the Coombe Hill race in my calendar, planning to do it if the hamstring allowed.  I've planned this week around it, with a day off today, and a slightly shorter long run on Sunday, so I can race tomorrow and still get a reasonable 40 miles in without putting undue stress on the hamstring.  Only trouble is, the race isn't tomorrow - it's Sunday and I've only just realised this! 

    So, do I do a medium long this evening or a medium long tomorrow and compromise the race a bit (though it's more for fun than any sort of target!) or just a short run tomorrow and accept reduced miles and no long run this week?  I'm not really fancying a medium this evening, as that would be 4 hardish days in a row and, as well as being a ball-ache, might risk the hamstring grumbling.  |Running tonight and tomorrow, albeit short, is probably a bad idea as that would mean six days in a row and I've not done more than 4 since the hammie started.

    Another alternative is to bin Coombe Hill and parkrun tomorrow with normal LSR Sunday.

    Decisions, decisions.......
  • Never injured if I can help it Bussy Boy!

    Good ramblings you crocks - hopefully it all clears up for everyone soon.

    Not much to tell over the last 10 days or so - down to see the folks 2 weeks ago, so was 11th in the Poole Parkrun in 17.11, 750 odd finishers, bit different to the 80 or so at Dunstable Downs. Few other long runs.

    Watched Bmth at Forest last weekend, so that put paid to any running. Did a hill session Tuesday, 11 miles of commuting Wednesday and back over to Luton last night, 16 x 400 off 80, then 6 x 200 strides. Probably better than I thought first one 74, last one 67, the others slightly more 70's than 71's. 

    Good news about LFOTM - Lets get a few of us down there. Definitely can't do 24/9, so what about 29/10? Was superb last time having a beer with Alehouse and PeteM after. Might even meet Bus in the flesh in the planets align :) 
  • 17:11 giving you 11th, SC 😯. Unlikely I can do LFOTM until Nov at least, but is anyone around for a beer after VLM?

    Bus - if the race is a good’un then ensure you do it, MLR or not. Life is too short to worry about weekly mileage when there is fun to be had. 

    Some good mental imagery there, Reg! Hope it is sorted soon. 

    Good run this morn: 10 easy, 10 MP, little warm down. 

    Felt humid and sluggish in the first section, in spite of the very early start. Pleasant enough lap of some quiet lanes and parks. Completely dark for a while, which was a shock, but nice and peaceful. 

    Lucky enough to have a friend to pace me for the tough section. Whilst he has only managed 3:20 in a (virtual) marathon, he did run a legit sub-17 5k in Hereford last weekend. I must get on that course!

    Ten miles came out at something like 6:39 pace. If I am honest, I was working too hard at the end for it to be MP, but a great workout nonetheless. Almost certain I couldn’t have held it without a mate, so kudos to him. 

    Total of 22.5M at 7:12 pace, so solid endurance training. 

    Back to plodding for a few days at least. 

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