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im not an expert, but I would suggest that you dont need to be doing that sort of mileage to get quick over 10k
Perhaps moraghan will be along to support me or shoot me down in flames
seren nos wrote (see)
out of interest............how many miles were you running before
...and what's your current 10K PB?
This would be interesting but we need lots more info please!
ahem...Mr Twatt...are you for real?
As in your last post you said the below...doesn't look to be the "casual" training you state
"My approach to running has mellowed quite a lot over the years though. I used to read all the physiology and training books and spend a lot of time thinking (possibly obsessing) about my training. Now, I just have a vague plan of what I am going to do for the next couple of days, and sometimes this can change. I think this is partly because I feel I have got to the stage where training principles have become more instinctive, but I think it is mostly because I can't really be arsed spending much brain space about whether my tempo runs should be 10 seconds quicker per mile or my rests on mile reps should be 3 minutes or 4 minutes, or whether my easy pace was slow enough. I still enjoy running and racing as much as I used to and I can train very hard when required, so it's not a case of losing motivation, but I prefer to be more casual in my approach.
I think that a good proportion of people on here may also take a slightly more laissez faire atitude to running. It is an outlet from our normal duties in life, and who's to say that a person who likes running marathons can't do it on say 30 miles per week if that's all they want to commit on a weekly basis."
Is it time to post this?
I'm not watching the calories now. I've lost over 2 stone and I'm a few pounds under 12 stone. In fact I am eating about 3,000 cals a day.
My approach is still fairly casual but obviously I now have more than 'a vague plan'.
This thread isn't any kind of wind up. It's just to give a bit of feedback on how things go.
How do you intend to break the 100miles down per week then boss?
And what times have you done and what are you looking for?
I think your answers to those questions will prove whether you're serious or not
The plan is actually to run around 100mpw for two weeks and then drop it down to about 60mpw in the third week, and then repeat.
I'm doing a fair proportion of steady running, one maybe two tempo runs, a fast session, and some easy running.
10k PB is from a long time ago so doesn't mean too much. I could probably get round a quick course now in about 35.
Since the beginning of the year I've increased the mileage steadily from about 25 - 40 - 60/70.
Far be it for me to pretend I'm anywhere near an expert...but I do 70 miles a week these days, and surely your week should mainly be easy running rather than "some" easy running.
Probably 2 fast intervals/repeat sessions, one LSR and then the rest easy running.
What age are you? If your pb is from ages ago and 100mile weeking is getting you an estimate of 35, i'm guessing you were a fair bit faster?
If you were a fair bit faster than 35, then surely you remember what you did in those days to get to that
I was running very casually up until doing about 60 miles a week and it was trying to increase the mileage which made me realise I needed a bit more of a plan. I tried getting the miles in and ended up running 15 milers every other day - which I knew wasn't the right way to go.
I tried putting together some plans and I found that it just got too complicated and I wanted to avoid that. This is what I came up with:
Weekdays: 7 mile easy (am) 9 mile steady (pm)
Saturday: 6 miles (total of 3 miles fast with warm up and down)
Sunday: 13 miles
The tempo runs are the middle five miles on the Tues/Thurs pm runs
My pace is generally quicker than recommended: easy is about 7.15; steady is 6.30; tempo is 6.00 and fast is 5.30.
Presuming you're serious...and from what I've been taught off a good coach I'd worry about the following
Finally, those paces look a bit off....your easy pace might be ok if that's the top end of it...but tempo would be quicker surely, 5.45 ish if you're aiming to hit a low 35 10k. The fast pace you mention might be your 5k pace, but do you not train above that pace?
Just my initial thoughts based on what I've been prescribed...but it is all about what works for you sometimes!
The saturday session will be either 3 x 1 mile repeats or maybe 6 x 1.2mile.
With each block of three weeks I will aiming to increase the tempo pace and the speedwork but keep the rest about the same. Probably aiming to get tempo down to about 5.40 and speedwork down to 5.15 in about 3 months.
as far as I know they do
100 miles a week takes what, 14 hours tops? it's not that much.
millions of people spend more hours than that every week staring slack jawed at the chav box.
I've temporarily traded in my life for running so I'm glad to see another in the club.
Twatt - you'll no doubt do what you want, but if I were you I'd drop the pace / number / length of your quality sessions down to 'maintenance mode' until you get a few weeks of your goal mileage under your belt.
Moraghan - you're right - I dropped the saturday fast session last week and did a steady run. It wasn't that I felt tired I just didnt want to push my luck. I kept the tempo sessions though.
Nearly at the end of the second week of this mileage. Although it's early days, I'm not nearly as tired as I thought I was going to be. I don't feel there is any tiredness carrying over to the next day's training.
The easy runs every week day are working well. I was going to make them shorter but 7 miles seems to feel the right distance, and it means I can get the miles in. I have finished these runs feeling quite peppy which I think is a good sign.
I am conscious that I don't have a rest day but I am hoping that the easy third week will allow me to recover and get stronger.
I'm not finding running 100mpw easy. It feels like I am working, but I'm not getting particularly tired.
I think I am eating about 3,000 calories a day, maybe a little more. I'm still losing weight, so i'm less than break even. Once I get down to about 11-2 or 11-3 I'll have to eat more.
The problem Twatt is that you've only a small handful of posts, a nickname that's hard to take seriously, and you're talking about 100mile weeks without anyone knowing of your past and pedigree.
You may well be genuine, but you can see why the doubt surely? I asked a few questions myself earlier and you just ignored some and answered very vaguely on the rest.
I didn't see those things as problems to be honest.
The only positive post on here has been by your coach.
Think somebody suggested running 100 mpw wouldn't do your 10k times any good.
Below is example of Bredon Foster's training:
Training in July 74Sun.:20miles steadyMon.:a.m. 10m steady to workp.m. 8m steadyTue.:a.m. 5m steadyp.m. 5m steadyp.m. 3x800m(avg.2:01 with 4min rec) + 4x100mWed.:a.m. 9m steady to workp.m. 2x8x200m(fast with 20sec rest)+ 4x 100mThu.:a.m. 6m steadyp.m. 5m steadyp.m. 5m steadyFri.:a.m. 6m steady to workp.m. RaceSat.:15miles fastand he was 1500/5000 runner.
Interested to see how your training goes.Read more: http://www.letsrun.com/forum/flat_read.php?thread=272426#ixzz14gclmtHG Buy your shoes from LetsRun and save 20% everday http://www.letsrun.com/save
so that's around 100miles a week for just 1500/5k running.
But no easy running at all, just steady? Surely not, even for an elite runner!
15miles fast the day after a race? Sheash.
I've read how Brendan used to train. Another very good 10k runner from that period was Bernie Ford. He used to run to work and back which was 14 miles each way. If he wasn't racing he wouldn't train at the weekend.
In the link above someone mentions that Brendan liked to do mile reps with long rests. That is what I am doing for my speed sessions. Last Saturday I did 3 x 1 mile (5.32/5.11/5.33) with 4-5minutes rest between each. They were all supposed to be at 5.30 but I opened the taps a bit of the second mile because I thought I had slowed. I started my watch on the first rep and then kept it running through the reps, so that I started my second interval on 10 minutes, and my third interval on 20 minutes. I think most runners would have a shorter rest, maybe 3 mins max, but I prefer a quicker run and longer rest. When I used to do this session I would be in bits towards the end of the third rep, but this didn't happen so I think there's probably 5 seconds I can take from each mile.
This will be the key indicator session for me. When I can do 3 at 5.00 I know I will be around sub 33 pace.