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Ant: no spring marathon for me as I'm rehearsing all day on April 13th. It'll be a bit odd not being at VLM either as a runner or a spectator for the first time in years!
Also-ran wrote (see)
PMJ - very nice last LR. Not sure I would class that as a time on feet run that you mentioned earlier in the week.
PMJ - very nice last LR. Not sure I would class that as a time on feet run that you mentioned earlier in the week.
Agree wasn't as slow as planned, but was really easy. Got in with a bunch of old friends and just chatted as we went up to about 15 miles when the fun began and a few dropped on the last uphill and then at the top of the course at 17 miles and 3 glorious downhill to go just let the legs run. Amazing how much difference there is between 2:10 (6:30 pace) and 2:20 (7 pace) for 20.
Jools - Sorry, I didn't realise that. What a shame, with the kind of form you're in. Abbo, perhaps?
Great long stuff from PMJ, Lit and her glute, TR (great to see the calf playing the game) and Rich, and good tempo work from AR - even if it didn't go exactly to plan, it is still a very valuable workout.
A bit pushed for time this morning, so apologies, but must send best wishes to Minni. Hope the taper madness doesn't get out of hand over the next few weeks.Recovery week for me, hopefully with a sub 40 10k time-trial for Jantastic at the end. 4 miles d&d today.
Gul - at the speed you've been doing recently, I would have thought that sub-40 was a gimme and probably more like 39:30. What's the course like?
Minni - just concentrate on getting yourself on the start line for VLM!!! Fingers crossed for you.
Jools - shame you won't be there on the 13th. What piece(s) are you doing in the concert? Tasty performance at Larne, especially if there were a few hills out there.
Ant - I wouldn't do the 10K if I were you. Sounds like it might be a little bit too risky under the circumstances.
TR - great running over the last few days. Hope everything holds together and that there are at least a couple of matches left.
Rich - great positivity. Sounds like you're flying at the moment.
Strange run for me this morning - 8 miles with 2 x 2 miles at HMP (6:45). The first set was pretty flat but I struggled to get an average of around 6:55 for the 2 miles; the second set was up and down and at no more effort than the first lot, but I ended up with an average pace of 6:45. The only reason I can think of for this is that it was pretty chilly and it took me a while to warm up, but I had done a couple of warm up miles before the first so I'm not that happy about using it as an excuse. Ho hum.
What's the general feeling about having a sports massage about 7-10 days out? No real aches and pains to sort out; it's more of a pre-VLM service check. Would it be worth having one, and if so, what's the optimum time before VLM?
Nice lsrs coming in TR, PMJ,Lit and Rich.
That 10k sounds like trouble Ant.
Minni -There is still plenty of time to get sorted for VLM.
Did 10 with 8 at MP on Sat (6.20 -6.34) and 17 yesterday in just over 2 hours to wrap up the training and just into taper now. Looking forward to a nice taper.
Lorenzo wrote (see)
Same advice as all things, if it is new don't do it. I have heard horror stories about people not being able to run for days after a massage and 7-10 days may be fine but it would drive me mad with anxiety if I got to 7 days out and wasn't able to run and worrying about when I could run again.
Main body of training now done. 11 weeks since Monday 6 Jan and 21 runs of 13 miles or longer and 5 longest of 3x20, 21 and 22 for 103 miles. 711 miles total.
Is there a copy somewhere of the check-list in advance? I recall that cutting the toenails is a good thing to do a week or more out.
Poacher & CC2 - #gymfail, the gift that keeps on giving! Great stuff.
TR - clocks change next weekend, which means outdoor nets will start the week after. Might give it a miss until after London though; don't want a yorker on the toe a week before my debut mara! Big miles from you last week. A normal campaign would bore you!
Rich - excellent 9 miler, backed up with your 18. Looking good.
Gul, Lorenzo, CC2, Lit, PMJ all recording impressive 20+ runs.
Yhsif - it would be an unusual approach to taper, but combined with TR's new 3 LRs per week plan, could be the start of something!
Moof - nice parkrunning.
Leslie - good 16 & weekly mileage.
OO-51 - another with a solid weekend, and congrats on the promotion.
Great to see Ant back to it. Put the 10k down and walk away; nothing to be gained.
BotF - nice long run from you too.
Consistently consistent miles from Birch, looking good.
Minni - good to have Edinburgh as a back-up option, any improvement with the hip?
Jools - super result at Larne. Did the weather behave? I remember you saying that the forecast was poor.
Menn - Some speedy work over the weekend from you. Enjoy the taper.
So, it was my last 20 of the campaign on Saturday, out at 05:30 and had a dabble with some Luco Sport and SiS gels on the way round, rather than being completely unfuelled (nothing new on the day and all that). These are feeling quite comfortable now, but they're clearly not at race pace, so we'll see! Then a weekend away, and got some swimming done at the hotel pool. Was breathing hard at the end of that without pounding the legs any more.
A taper question if I may. This is week 1 of a 3 week taper. Last 2 weeks have been 53 & 52. Schedule has this week as 49, then 37. The 49 in particular doesn't sound like much of a drop off to me, and I'm wondering if I should make it closer to 40? Keep the important sessions (intervals tomorrow, mara pace tempo on Thursday, 18 next weekend) but reduce/drop the easy runs (4 miles today, 7 Wednesday, 5 Saturday).
Rich - I know you're following the same plan and have already done this week. How did you find it?
A popular taper is something like 90%,66%, 33%, so if your peak mileage has been 53 then 49 is 92% and 37 is 70% so the figures are in the right ball-park. It is fair to say that reducing by a little more probably won't hurt.
Abbers, I prefer a 2 week taper personally. Mine starts today. Actually I'm travelling and didn't bother to bring my kit so will be 3 days without a run- which will be tough.I guess I'll still do the parkrun on Saturday, so that will be my last run in anger- or at least moderately ill tempered
Jools / OO-51 - thanks for your input. Peak week was 56, but generally low 50s, so the 90/66/33 fits. As usual, I should trust the schedule! Might just drop a mile or two off the Wednesday & Saturday runs, but keep everything else as prescribed. And with that, time for an easy 4...
Miles are not always the best indicator of work, especially in a taper. I run 6 times a week and so could do 6 moderate runs or 3 hard and 3 easy and hit the same miles butone is way easier than the other.
Abbers, 18 seems to be a very long run in a taper week, mine this week is 17 and I am coming down from over 70 miles per week, and I see no MP tempo at all.
A lesson in keeping your mouth shut. Last real effort before marathon was yesterday, 15 miles, 10 at MP. Was a bit stiff to start with and didn't completely loosen up, but finished no problem. First thing I said to my running partner: "Can't believe I have made it a whole 4 months of training with no injuries!". Straight away he gave me the look of "Don't say that you idiot"
Fast forward 24 hours, now when I walk it looks like I've just come out of an intense anal examination. The problem is my hams inner side near my butt are not happy at all. Painful and stiff. Not hurting when sitting though, and after couple of minutes walking the pain subsides quite a lot so there is hope.
Off to Sports Clinic at lunch to assess the damage. Wish me luck...
And NEVER get cocky about lack of injury!
Sorry I’ve been in lurk mode recently but just had to have a quick de-lurk after reading that Jools ran the Larne Half Marathon. Jools, I ran it too and finished only a few places ahead off you. – I’m number 199 and we are both near the bottom of this page of photos - http://www.nirunning.co.uk/apps/photos/album?albumid=15472061&pagesize=60&page=3 Great performance by the way!
Enjoy the taper madness VLM runners!
I would have been on a 2 week taper, with Tuesday next week being the last decent quality workout that would go towards improving fitness. Previously efforts would have seen next Sundayas the last LR. I just didn't get on with 3 weeks; I think it is one of those things you just have to work out over time
As I can't walk today I am on a severe taper. I think someone is trying to tell me to call it a day. I'm not usually an optomist, but who knows ...
SJT - hopefully is is just tightness that can be loosened out. I think you may need Lit's masseur
Well done Jools and Badbark on Larne , great results ,Will have to make it next year myself ,just didn't suit this year with work.
10 miles this morn @ 8:25/mile and very windy out there.
AR - Keep your head up, hopefully you can still get there.
SIS gels are 3 for 2 at Tescos btw making them 80p each.
Badbark: say hi next year! I like the fact that in the NI Running race report I am described as an 'English runner'.
Lorenzo - Re your question about the sports massage. I am not an expert in these matters but I would say what PMJ said rings true, well it does with me anyway. I suffer from problematic calf tightness and just general pain in that area, so last year when I decided to have one for the 1st time I thought it was a great idea. You may not recall , but I posted on here what happened, I will remind you. It was my first ever marathon and I was so excited about running London I wanted to be fresh and feel as good as possible, so I booked one 5 days before London. My masseuse said it would be fine and I would feel great. It was very painful at the time but I felt superb a few days later and I was really looking forward to the race. Fast forward to the day of the expo (Sat) I walked around and did the usual commute thing in and around London, by lunch time both my calf muscles seized up and I was unable to walk by 4pm, can you imagine the day before the marathon!! I was in St James Park & I sat there for about an hour on the grass and eventually hobbled to my friends house in Fulham. I went from feeling great in the days leading up to the race to feeling worse than ever. I was unable to race that day and hobbled around in 3:29. I would say for sure that the massage had something to do with what happened to me and I think if it's not something you have regularly then it's a risk. If it had not been London I would not have run that day!
Jools - Another very good result for you, improving with each race and very well done given the course and conditions.
I am starting to get excited about this XC inter insular race now as I have just seen our team. Collectively it's the strongest field of runners I have ever seen in Jsy to include one UK Ironman champion, one 3:5x 1,500m runner, several 2:4x marathoners and some very strong veterans and then me! I am probably the 5th slowest out of a team of 30 runners! Who cares as long as we win!!
30k for me over the weekend - 8k at 7:02 pace and the other 22 at 8:55 pace (one of my slowest runs ever, apart from when I ran the last 4 miles of my last marathon.
How is your training going Badbark?
SJT, what did the physio say?
My fingers are crossed for you AR....
PMJ - I wondered about that 18 miler too. Was thinking of cutting it off at 16.
SJT - news?
BB - good effort from you in Larne too.
AR - really hope things work out for you and you can make it to the start.
Nice 10 from Leslie.
Decent weekend there GM, and a strong sounding team for your XC.
4 easy ones done. As per Leslie's comment, windy out there!
5 recovery today, real easy, 8:16 pace.
Jools – I’ll definitely keep an eye out for you next year! Sorry I missed you this year. I had forgotten you were racing and pretty much ran through the line at the end back to my car (once the chip was removed). I rushed home to watch the second half of Chelsea v Arsenal. The hilly miles really take their toll in Larne.
SJ – My training hasn’t been great to be honest. Everything was going well until my 10 days all inclusive holiday which has deposited 5 lbs of blubber on my butt. I only ran 3 times on holidays and due to being hung-over never managed faster than MP for a few miles. Then on my first day home I ran too hard and strained both my upper thighs. This prevented any fast sessions for another week until the Larne HM on Saturday. I ran about 99% effort but still was slower than any of my 8 HM races last year. My legs feel like I’ve run a marathon at the minute with serious DOMS. I doubt I’ll be able to run fast this week until another HM race on Saturday! Oh well, racing to get fit! I’ve 6 weeks to a 50k and 12 weeks to the 100k so hopefully will be peaking perfectly by then.
Badbark - Meant to say, well raced too to you, even if was below par by your standards. Similar 10 day all inclusive issue here. Went to Tenerife with the intention of taking it easy and enjoying myself but didn't think that would effect my weight or fitness too much, but like you it did! I'm packing an extra 3kg's that won't shift . Good luck with the sharpening!
Just got back from physio. Good news, it's not my hamstring. Bad news, it's my adductors which is worse apparently!
Got a rollocking for not stretching properly (barely at all), told I'm completely lob sided (my back is much more built up on one side than other), sit wrongly, weird feet, etc...
Long and short of it was that the adductors take a long time to heal but should try a run in a few days to see how I feel. I think it will be ok, it's annoying but not debilitating at the moment and I think after a mile or so I won't feel it (wishful thinking maybe).
I expected something to go wrong, so grateful it's not completely game over tbh.
Take it easy in your tapers people (and great running btw!)
Popping in to see the usual taper madness playing its part here. I think you all sound to be in good shape despite this so I am keeping fingers crossed for you that you toe the line and have a good race! For those who need a good stretch etc, please foam roll. And if you are feeling brave, consider a Rumble Roller that acts rather like a sports massage therapist would in applying pressure to specific points. It is surprisingly effective and could prove useful to some of you (stern look at SixJamTarts).
Jools - nice result at Lanarca. Bodes well for the full. You can do it!
Not long until we leave California now. It has come rather too soon and it will be difficult to leave the place with its beautiful scenery. I have finally returned to racing and raced my first race since 2012 last weekend when I ran for the team in the Emerald Across The Bay 12K (1st Masters team). The time wasn't quick (50:xx) but I felt strong and didn't end up injured! I raced again a week later at the Napa Valley Trail Half Marathon and managed to come in 2nd female and 6th overall. It wasn't a big field and I actually was 1st female until the final descent when a young thing blew past me going down a narrow ridged trail. I am rubbish at descending and I couldn't catch her at the end. Official time was 1:37:01 which I am quite pleased with considering there was around 2,000 feet of climbing.
The next race in the diary is the Thunder Run with Minni which I am really looking forward to!
AR - I don't know what to say. I hope you are OK.
MsE wrote (see)
AR - I don't know what to say. I hope you are OK.
Thanks MsE. Great news on your first race and a solid time.
Re injury, I'm doing all of this under the guidance of my physio. They are a really decent Sports Clinic, so I don't feel it has all been my own pig headedness this time. I have raced some marathons in poor physical / general health and never learnt the lesson. Lets see what the Physio says this time.
I was intending this to be my last 'raced' marathon; and moving on to runnning purely for fitness (and pleasure if that feeling comes back). My two years of running have proven that I can run, but I can't control the running - it controls me.
SJT - Good to get a diagnosis and something to work on. If it is any consolation my right adductor, in particular the gracilis was "well mashed up". Rest during the taper helped me limp through to my first sub 3
I'm not going to bore the thread with injury woes so will summarise the next few days
Day 1 Ran an Easy 10KDay 2 Sore, RowedDay 3 Steady Run, bit stiffDay 4 Can't Walk. Feck.
Repeat Day 1 to 4.
Abbers - no outdoor net session dates here yet, but we do have some end of April fixtures on the list. The indoor cricket season finished y'day, although the younger one has been selected to play for the invitation team on Presentation night in a couple of weeks.
PMJ - I'm impressed, with the 8:XX, you dont post many of those. I note your 3x20, 1x21 and 1x22 how long did the longer two runs last time-wise, I too noted that you time on feet run was shorter than I expected this week. I managed to make mine last 2:48. I too have 1x21 (2:40) and the 1x22. I have a few earlier in the campaign 20s too but they were all 2:3X ish.