Sub 3h15



  • Gul - good running, regardless of the time. Some days just don't work out to plan - I'm sure you'll bounce back stronger though.

    PMJ - excellent, controlled run and thoroughly enjoyed the report. congrats on the GFA spot, I guess it must be really nice having a whole year to plan for London now. I'm doing London this year but need 3.05 for GFA, hoping to bag that and return a more experienced runner the following year and go sub 3 with you.

  • Leslie HLeslie H ✭✭✭

    Badbark- nice race report and great result image

    Gul-sounding more positive already and there is always more in your legs just our brain's holding us back from needing the ambulance image

     I found adding intervals this mara campaign put me under a lot of strain for a couple of weeks so I made sure I wasn't trying to ramp up miles as well at the same time as its very tough to do both so I ramped the miles a few weeks before to get used to it.

    19m cranked out this morn,I had to move the long run to the front end of the week as I have a half mara next week (not flat out racing it though ) Found it hard going today but held on with a long uphill right at the end for extra pain !


  • BirchBirch ✭✭✭

    Gul - " effectively benched for most of February, I also lost a couple of weeks in December and didn't do too much over Christmas."
    I think you have your answer  . . . .
    and bearing in mind your statement, your result was actually pretty decent ! 

    Badbark - fine half mara raced there, and good start to the week from Leslie

    no run yet here - been faffing with tasks & errands this morn, now drinking cups of tea & prevaricating  . . . .


  • MsEMsE ✭✭✭

    Massive congratulations to our weekend racers.  Great report from PMJ (it's details like that that relative newbie racers like me learn from!) and a GFA bagged.  Well done.  Badbark is also looking in good form for VLM with a new HM PB.  Well impressed with a double day of racing from RFJ who is looking strong. And super pleased for OO with the 20 mile time and promise of a fast VLM.  I really feel for Gul on what was still a fabulous marathon time.  It is more the execution though isn't it when training shows such a fast runner there?  Everyone has said what I have thought could be contributory but all I will say is be kind to yourself.  You haven't failed anyone and it is just a learning exercise is working out how to get you to race the fast 26.2 you are due!

    Leslie - I am also being very careful about intervals with the extra mileage I am doing.  Nothing too major (mid-60s is the max) but I have dropped the P&D speedwork and am doing a mini version instead with the running coach.  Last week I just did 6 x 0.33 mile @5:15-5.27m/m w/2 min recoveries.

    I ran 18 with 12@MRP yesterday and tried to see if I could hold sub-3 pace. I just about managed it with 12 miles ranging from 6:41 to 6:54m/m.  Actually, 6:54m/m won't do it will it?! Then again, the median pace was 6:47m/m so maybe it was OK after all.  Recovery runs today from home to train station, tube station to Vietnamese Embassy and back again (with visa for holiday on Friday).

  • MsEMsE ✭✭✭

    And forgot to say HURRRAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHH to Minni's return to racing! imageimageimageimageimageimageimageimageimageimageimageimageimageimageimageimageimageimageimageimageimageimageimageimageimageimageimageimageimageimageimageimageimageimageimageimageimageimageimageimageimageimageimageimageimageimageimageimageimageimage

    And Lorenzo has officially turned to the darkside with that 31 miler.  

  • Badbark wrote (see)

    PMJ – Well done on the GFA target and thanks for the great detailed report.  They are always my favourite reads on the forums

    Thanks for popping up a week or so ago and shouting orders at the Jantastic Consistently Consistent sub-3:15 team. Monday pm and everyone except Minni has logged all their runs so 12 out of 13 at 100% for week 2 and comfortably over the 75% we need. Looks like Boston Illuminati may have it sewn up and second place for us. I note they are a private team, whatever that means, so maybe they are stricter.

    Gul, on the results,, there are splits from the mats so you can get accurate 5k splits. As you say, nice and smooth up to 25k.

  • Thoughts on raceday photo costs. Saturday and the guy is looking for £18 for photos. Good value alongside say £30 for but still a lot. I understand these people have to make a living but there were 700 runners out on Saturday and if a photographer can pocket £350 for a day's work and expenses then he has to be happy with that, so 50p per person and free photos for all?

    I have to admit that we now have a studio photographer who does photos at parkrun when he is injured so I get great photos there, a few club supporters who take good photos at races and at other times I trawl flickr for the odd shot, so the professional side just turns me off now.


  • OO54OO54 ✭✭✭

    Don't think I've ever paid for a photo PMJ except when I lived in France and wanted some souvenirs photos.

    Fantastic run Barbark, that's a really impressive time.

    MsE I can't run at that pace outside of a race- so for me at least it looks impressive.

    Trashed legs here- rest day called for.   

  • Leslie HLeslie H ✭✭✭

    PMJ-£30 for a photo in this digital age is proper taking the pi** ,id think the take up is fairly low so they make the costs so high  to compensate.

    Birch-crack on , its time for miles image

    MSE- 6:47m/m average is spot on ,speedy reps too image

  • BirchBirch ✭✭✭

    just back from a steady 7, Leslie - salvaged something from a possible CNBA day !

  • G-DawgG-Dawg ✭✭✭

    Badbark, that's great running, that is! 

    Positive vibes heading your way Gul.

    Top bombing from MsE too!

    Photos for the Thames Meander Marathon aren't up yet but they're only £3.50! Bargain!

    Managed to get a cheeky 8 miler in at lunchtime. Legs were a little stiff from Saturday's marathon but I've felt worse doing a recovery run from a regular 18 miler. Indeed, I felt worse the week after a HM last year when I pushed too hard in the race.

    Only 7.18 pace today but I'm a lot stronger than last year which is to be expected going from 3 to 4 runs per week.
    My running pal has requested we do our 18 miler on Friday night. That will mean a 64 mile 7 day week for me.image Roll on the taper next week!image


  • AbbersAbbers ✭✭✭

    Had to pop in to say well done to the weekend racers, notably PMJ and Gul who went the distance.

    Really solid performance from PMJ - it was never in doubt, was it? image

    Feel for you Gul, but as others (not least yourself) have pointed out, your impaired build up was most likely the route cause. Under the circumstances, I'd say that was still a pretty impressive effort.

    Lovely stuff from many others too, everyone shaping up nicely.

    Still doing a bit, trying to work out how to fit the training in round the new contract with the much longer commutes involved and no chance to train at lunchtimes (I've been spoilt in my previous jobs!). Glad I'm not trying to fit in mara miles. 42 for last week, including a 13.5 "long" run early on Sunday.

    Might be a sporadic visitor for a while, but I'll keep popping by... image

  • OO54OO54 ✭✭✭

    One advantage of a 20 lap race is that you get very accurate split times- so here they are from y/days 20 mile race by mile; 

    6:48 6:40 6:43 6:42 6:45 6:38 6:39 6:40 6:45 6:35

    6:38 6:36 6:42 6:41 6:46 6:55 6:51 6:54 6:52 6:43

    Overall pretty even, which is not surprising as each mile was identical. However interesting that my best patch was miles 10-15, then struggled 15-19 before ralying for the last mile. I think the take out for VLM is that this was overall too fast. OK for a 20 miler but I would have suffered badly if the race was longer. Better to aim for 6:45-6:50 pace and build up a miniute or 2 in the bank. Welcome any views from the data.

  • Very consistent mile laps OO, which you should be really happy with. Did you have a cargo load going into this and did you take gels etc? Could be just getting to that 20 mile mark if you were bonking?

    Brilliant pace miles MsE - you are rocking at the moment.

    Super half marathon time Badbark and good to see you are still the mileage king!

    Good19 miler Leslie.

  • Gul DarrGul Darr ✭✭✭

    Badbark - cracking HM - sounds like you're back on top form.
    Leslie - well done grinding out the 19 miler. I find tempo running often leaves me crocked during high (for me!) mileage; daren't even think about speedwork!
    MsE - looking very strong. Enjoy the holiday.
    PMJ - the final Jantastic placings will be down to any negative scoring for missing time challenges, I think. And I've never bought any race photos.
    Birch - nice steady run.
    GD - recovering well.
    Abbers - hope you find a way to fit in the training.
    OO - very impressive stuff.
    Hopefully ready for a recovery run tomorrow.

  • OO54OO54 ✭✭✭

    I had fish and chip the night before KR, porridge for breakfast and 3 gels on the run.

    Will be running today Gul- 6 recovery miles at lunchtime- how are the legs?

  • Gul DarrGul Darr ✭✭✭

    OO - legs are very good actually, thanks. Then again, with a target pace of 7:45 m/m, I was hardly thrashing it!

  • OO52, the raw data shows you slowed and the last mile is just the push for the finish.


    I think any analysis is going to be hard without knowing what your aims and plans were. You said sub 2:20 was the target so that is 7 minutes per mile and all miles were inside this. 10, 11 and 12 were fast, any particular reason for this? My trace form the weekend shows that when I was chasing other runs down I was faster so maybe you were chasing another runner at this point?

    The simple maths says 2:14:22 for 20 miles is 2:56 pace for the full and the calculators predict you just inside 3 hours.

    I agree with banking a bit of time and I think we are similar runners so profit from a little bit of speed but lose out on endurance. I recall that something like 1:28:30 was a good target for halfway which is 6:45 pace as you say.


  • JoolskaJoolska ✭✭✭

    OO: I'd hazard a guess that the faster miles at 10-12 took a little too much out of you, hence the slowing, so I'd go for 6.45s.  Perhaps aim to split in 1.28-1.28.30.

    5M recovery home last night to bring up 10 for the day.  Club session tonight.

  • Leslie HLeslie H ✭✭✭

    Birch- that's the spirit image

    G-dawg-only 7:18 m/mile ..sounds fast to me image

    0052-looks a great run and nice graph too.

    Gul- the p&D style runs where you do x miles at mara pace(16 with 8 ,18 with 10,18 with 12 , and 20 with 14 at mara pace) and  and run the rest easy are maybe worth a try next time ,I hardly run any at mara pace now but some miles every week lots quicker,will need to get more mara pace in though soon.

    Jools-nice double run.

    12 hilly mile mlr to back up my 19'er on  tired legs image


  • OO54OO54 ✭✭✭

    Thanks PMJ, great to see it visually. When I did the same race last year I ran 2:21 and put it down to the course being tough, twisting and turning around a small park with lots of corners and small bridges. So I would have been happy with 2:20 this year and I planned to run 6:52 per mile- 2:19 was my real target. But it was a completely different race this year, I just felt great on the day and 6:40's felt effortless. Even if I feel the same at VLM I would definately hold back- that's the learing point, because I overcooked it in the third Qtr. This is fine for 20, but I would not have lasted 26.

    You are spot on Jools, I have 6:45's in my mind as my race pace.      

  • You must be finding a bit of form if the 6.40's felt effortless OO.

    7.18 is a great pace so soon after your non-raced marathon at the weekend G-Dawg.

    Some more good mileage there Leslie. You're banking some good miles.

  • Well, I stepped away for a few days and the thread ran away from me!

    Congrats to all the racers!

    OO, you get it done at all distances. Nice 20  (and parkrun!) and I'm sure you'll hit your mark on the day.

    PMJ, loved your report and glad to see your plan went as expected. Looking forward to your 50 yr sub3!

    Gdawg, very impressed with the casual 3:3X marathon. Now please listen carefully: no fast running...time to recover!image 

    Gul, no need to hang your head at all. You did well by going out very controlled. If not for the lost training, I think you would have had a great shot to make your goal. You lost a lot of time to injury. In my case, if I had lost that much training time I would have pulled up my tent and looked for another race. I definitely think you should have another crack at 26.2. Maybe next time around you can HADD with me? I'm predicting that we could not only keep you injury free, but steel you for the last 8 miles of the race. Just a thought though!

    RFJ, impressive racing load there.

    Minni, nice return to racing. If you are really getting ready to HADD, I'd be happy to lob any suggestions you may need your way. I'm basically rebooting on that program now so may be in a similar situation as you. Looking to round out for a fall marathon if possible.

    GM, really nice effort in the second half of that race.

     Oh, and Lorenzo, you have indeed crossed to the dark side.

    Leslie, you are the new Moof!image Really consistent weeks and high volume. I'm impressed. You must be massively fit at the moment.

    Sorry to any that I may have missed!

    On my end, still rolling along every other day with my return. Last 3 runs have been 8.6, 9.4, and 8.8 M. Have some weird numbness in the skin on my previously (yes please note the tense) injured foot, but nothing to be too concerned about (and not related to the original injury). My Fizz is practicing dry needling on me and thankfully she's pretty good at it and it actually does help with this nerve stuff.

  • Bike ItBike It ✭✭✭

    Morning All,

    That's a very impressive 20 miler OO - nice consistent splits and if 6:40s are 'effortless' then things are looking good for London.  

    Likewise Badbark you seem to be going to plan with a fine HM performance.

    Massive blisters (thanks Addidas) are on my toes.  I'm debating just taping them for Saturdays 50km.  Does anyone have another idea?

    There is apparently some danger that I might start working from April 1st as a university lecturer.  Visa troubles are slowing down the contract.

    And I agreed to buy a house. Probably 70-80% bigger than my house in the UK, 3 times the ground area and quarter the price.  It was a bit of a bargain as the current owner lost his job and got a new one at a distant mine so he has to suddenly sell.  It needs a lot of renovations though.

  • Gul DarrGul Darr ✭✭✭

    Leslie - 12 hilly miles on tired legs is good going.
    VTr - steady progress. Thanks for the encouragement.
    Bike It - all the best for Saturday. Lecturer's post sounds promising - hope it gets sorted.
    A couple of slow recovery miles d&d and feeling good.

  • G-DawgG-Dawg ✭✭✭

    Fear not VTr, I'm totally on message! image
    The taper starts on Monday and the emphasis will be on getting used to race pace. Looking at my stats, most runs are faster than MP while LSRs have been about time on feet.

    My pal is a member at our local running club and his coach has also stated that we need to get race pace to feel natural. There will still be some speed elements in the shorter taper runs to keep sharpness but I'm really looking forward to seeing how my body recovers.

    Even though I didn't race the marathon on Saturday, I can cetainly feel the extra work to get the extra miles done. that combined with the HM race still in me from the week before makes me glad I too the "respect the distance" approach, as at times the temptation to pick off runners up ahead was incredibly strong.

    7 easy ones planned for today with a slower runner to calm me down.


  • OO52 wrote (see)

    I just felt great on the day and 6:40's felt effortless. Even if I feel the same at VLM I would definately hold back- that's the learing point, because I overcooked it in the third Qtr. This is fine for 20, but I would not have lasted 26.


    I do think that experienced runners can judge pace and distance pretty well so would somewhat caution against using raw numbers over feeling. When you run 20 miles you set out with a pace to complete 20 miles. When you set out to run 26, the mind and body know that and do a fairly good job without the Garmin. If you set off at 6:30 pace that is way too fast, and 7:00 is way too slow, but 6:40 or so for the first few miles (especially at London where it is new downhill) is not a recipe for disaster if you are shooting at sub 3.

  • Leslie HLeslie H ✭✭✭

    VTR- going well with the recovery there with 27m in 3 days image I'm feeling fitter yes though look forward to the easy days image

    Bikeit- damn addidas too narrow at the toes ,cut the toes of the shoe out and use then like big sandals image Good news on the job front though image

    Gul- sounding positive again image

    G-dawg- taper time image

    8 easy recovery type slower ones .

  • BadbarkBadbark ✭✭✭

    I've just ran and logged my long run for the week which has (temporarily) made us the number one team in the world! image

    TEAM NAMEMEMBERSWORKOUTSJANTASTIC SCORE Consistently Consistent sub-3:15 team 13 810 86.2 Kilbarchan AAC 6 279 86.1 Racing rabbits 6 294 85.8 Ballymena Runners AC 8 401 85.5 Clee Bells 8 193 85.1 Smiley Paces Old Birds 14 565 85.1 Conkers parkrun Girls 56 1898 84.8 MVH Tri Club 38 2319 84.4 Pollok parkrun 12 453 84.4 Conkers parkrun Boys 45 1914 84.2 Gaillemania 7 336 84.2 Boston Illuminati 11 721 84.1 St Andrews Streakers 74 2802 84.1 Chichester parkrun 21 880 84 Sheffielders 7 175 83.8

  • Gul DarrGul Darr ✭✭✭

    Leslie - "easy recovery type slower ones" - OK, think I got that!
    Badbark - well done! Let's enjoy it while we can.
    Well, my resolve is starting to wobble already and I'm thinking perhaps I could do the Autumn Shakespeare...?image

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