Sub 3h15



  • Jools, I agree pace is not so much of a factor but if Tony is feeling tired then it is either too long or too fast (or both). I now have P&D to hand so the first 6 weeks average out at about 40 miles a week and that ties up with 180 miles since June 1. The other 410 are spread over the best part of 4 months so a little over 100 a month so almost a 2x mileage increase and that will make you feel slow.

    Below is my training for the last 12 months. My marathon was March and you can see Nov and Dec are very even work, so base building prior to the campaign. Once the New Year has passed I ramped it up gently but even within that you can see cutback and recovery weeks.


  • MsEMsE ✭✭✭
    Welcome back, MadBark! That's impressive (a) mileage for holidaying, (b) racing while on holiday and (c) weight gain in such a short time!

    Birch - are your shoes ok or nearing the end of their useful life? I hope the niggle goes soon.

    I've had such interrupted weeks recently with school commitments and family stuff my running has really dropped back to just 6 hours a week. Combined with my new focus on protein and shakes and I've put on ballast too. Eek!

    Terms ends this week so I squeezed in 14 today which I ran gently but progressively faster to play around with my inner metronome. It averaged out at 7:24/mi ranging from 7:58 to 6:49/mi. before I reached the hill on the return leg which signalled time to warm down. I need to start doing some speedwork again but not before I've billy my volume back up. I've averaged 40-45 since VLM and would like to get up to 70 this time without falling apart.
  • MsEMsE ✭✭✭
    Hmmm not sure what billying volume up means.
  • PoacherPoacher ✭✭✭

    MsE = "teaching exercise to music"? Tell more.

    Good numbers Gul - on that sort of mileage you should cane the mara next time out.

    Impressive swimming SJ. The BB sounds terrifying, but also amazing. Quality race report too - you are one hard case. Interesting thoughts on comparing the difficulty of IM or other tri vs. a pure running event. Having done 100m or more a couple of times, I actually don't think it's that difficult (on the flat anyway). However once you get up towards Spartathlon distance/terrain/heat it becomes ridiculously tough.  As a rule, the really long races demand top class preparation.

    Nice VOGIT-ing Birch

    Nice use of the "liquid carbs" euphemism GDawg, we all know what you mean

    Good training BI - have you got a race coming up?






  • PoacherPoacher ✭✭✭

    In other news, I was considering posting a pic of the big toenail which is hanging on by a thread but actually it's too unpleasant even by the standards pertaining on here. So I will just say: I actually went for a run.  A slow 5m, in a biblical downpour. No particular pain during or after. Woohoo!

    Just realised the Coastal Run is very soon - should just about be able to bodge round 13m. TAR did you sort out any plans?


  • SlokeyJoeSlokeyJoe ✭✭✭
    Toenail! Toenail! Toenail!
  • OO54OO54 ✭✭✭

    Poacher, no photos please I am eating breakfast! Hope to see you at the coastal- I am in good shape, maybe 1:27- 1:28 if the tide is out. 

    Bad boy Badbark. Good miles while you were away but too many fatboy breakfasts by the sounds of it. 

  • Gul DarrGul Darr ✭✭✭

    Birch - nice run - sounds like you gave the foot a good test.
    Badbark - that's some mile tally for a holiday! Good racing in the heat. I'm sure you'll soon shed those extra pounds.
    MsE - good progressive run. I'm aiming to peak around 70mpw too this time. Not falling apart is always a worry!
    Poacher - great to hear you're back running and will do the Coastal Run.
    6 mile recovery run d&d.

  • Bike ItBike It ✭✭✭

    P&D also makes me tired.  We all know a training plan is to deliver challenging workouts that lead to improvements so we can expect tiredness.  The question I think is is it too challenging and too tiring that an lead to injury or over-training which lead to setbacks.  It's a fine line

    Impressive eating Madbark - I guess it wasn't your usual wholefood fare either.  Either way, 18lb gain is pretty impressive as is your 10km time despite the heat having an effect.

    Yes Poacher I am training for a 10km race at end of August.  Two years of inconsistent training due to injuries has left me very slow as evidenced by recent results.  My big dream is to challenge for another sub-9 at 2016 Comrades.  I need to get faster.  Previously I would just run 50m per week at easy pace more or less ad infinitum.  I turned things around to limit the volume and emphasise the speed. Improvements are happening already.

    So last night's session: 5x 2km at planned 10km race pace - a 45minute 10km is my target so 4:30 per km or 7:15 per mile, which is my PMP (Previous Marathon Paceimage).  Everything went quite well and the reps were manageable all between 4:19 and 4:26 per km.  The good thing about running fast is that it helps identify my limits.  My shoulders are too closed and I can't push my hips forward enough to build speed at the moment - dare I say that some strength work is required?


  • G-DawgG-Dawg ✭✭✭

    The Surrey Half has been rescheduled from the ridiculous date of April 17th to the far more sensible March 13th. image

    I'm in!

    18 holes of golf last night and feeling tired today. Have a track session planned for lunchtime and a 20 mile blast on the bike tonight. Makes me feel even more tired just thinking about it.



  • MsEMsE ✭✭✭
    Or yoga, Bike It?

    Glad you had a good outing, Poacher. The qualification is purely to see what is needed to bring a barre franchise over from California. Not something for the near future but I'm laying foundations in case an opportunity arises!
  • Bike It - That's the thin line isn't between tiredness then improvement or god forbid injury. I'm more on the cautious side at the moment with reducing mileage on a weekly basis to ensure I get in a training block without weeks of no running here and there. Glad you're seeing improvement in your training.

    0052 - Are you running a half marathon soon?



  • Leslie HLeslie H ✭✭✭

    had a bit of a read back :

    Slokey -epic effort and report image

    Madbark-extreme eating/drinking/weight gain combo.image

    Tony- a big increase in training will make you tired ,just review every week ,increase your rest and adjust the miles if needed 

    For me June stats 0.0000 miles image

    Consultation with a knee specialist yesterday and my kneecap is sitting too far up and my right quad had apparently wasted away and is much smaller than the other side which is possibly the source of the constant knee pain/tendonitis. Also had an mri so we will see where we go from here and the likely route is some sort of  tendon injection and a 3 month exercise ban then needed with the threat of tendon rupture if I dare run image

    Oh and apparently running 50 miles a week is abusing your body or so I was told image

  • Been busy over the past few weeks and just had a bit of a read back...loads going on and some fantastic running

    Blimey Slokey, WHAT AN EFFORT!!! Really impressive stuff and great race report, hats off to your sir.

    Good 300m and weekly mileage there Speedy

    Good to see you getting some runs in on your holiday and a decent 10k too Badbark.

    Welcome to the thread Tony.

    A good paced 14 miler MsE, your inner self is good at pacing!

    Good 10k training Bike iT. The 5 x 2k is a good session and prepares your body for running at 10k pace.

    GDawg - 18 holes of golf can be a marathon!

    Sorry to hear about your knee problems Leslie - a 3 month exercise ban seems a lot, but looking at the bigger picture will fix your problem.

    Been getting the miles in recently and built up to just over 60 miles the other week. Had a 7 mile league last Wednesday (hottest day of the year) which was very unpleasant and just managed to average 7.03 m/m pace. That night and for a few days was floored with a cold, but managed a 19 miler on Sunday. 5 mile race last night in 30.31 so still got a bit of speed left image

  • Bike ItBike It ✭✭✭

    That's an interesting idea to do Yoga MsE.  Is that one of the things that has lead you to to go from running a marathon in 3:15 to sub-3?  In the same period  I have gone from running 3:10 to 3:48 as a result of my injury hiatus.  Strength of the stabilising/non-power muscles and flexibility/mobility has always been an issue for me and that is one of the things preventing me from running faster.

    Loving the precision on the mileage Leslie, but sorry to hear about that knee.

    Take care Tony and certainly I think you are right to drop or make easier the intense sessions to avoid injury. 

    Good to see your speed continue to improve KR.  Are you the next to go sub-3?

  • OO54OO54 ✭✭✭

    That does not sound good Leslie, let's hope the pain at least will subside.

    Tony I'm doing the Northumberland Coastal run Sunday week. It's 13 or 14 miles depending on the tide. I'm also looking for late GNR entry but those are the only races I have planned at that distance.

    Another 5 miler today- taking it easy this week.

  • 0052 - Good luck.

  • JoolskaJoolska ✭✭✭

    I think a bit of cumulative fatigue isn't such a bad thing.  It means that a well-timed taper really has an effect.  If I don't feel a bit tired when marathon training I'm taking it too easy.  There is, however, a limit, and the trick is learning to recognise when you've reached it.  Sadly, only experience teaches you this!

    9M including 6 x c. 850m last night with the club.  Nice to hit 3K pb pace or better in all of them: hopefully that can become 5K pace soon...  Off for 11M very steady shortly - hamstrings feel tight as anything!

  • PoacherPoacher ✭✭✭

    See you there OO, although not during the race image Anything sub 1.30 on that course is a decent run.


    Nice miles KR - did I spot you over on a (shhh) ultra thread?

    Next post is for Slokey only - everyone else scroll down rapidly

  • PoacherPoacher ✭✭✭

    13 ultras to date. Reasonably hard mentally, but the body says I'm delusional image:



    (The brown stuff is paint, not a birthmark) 


  • SlokeyJoeSlokeyJoe ✭✭✭
    That is a suitably minging toenail Poacher. Good effort. image

    Epic holiday BB!

    Sounds like you are really stepping it up Jools and KR is on track too.

    Sorry to hear about the knee Leslie. A long road back but at least there is a clear path. Maybe an opportunity to spend your time doing something else for a while whilst you recuperate.

    10 minute run with no issues last night followed by a gruelling swim set (not particularly quick but hard work all the same). 90minute turbo this afternoon followed by a 20min run. I could feel the achilles grumble on the bike for a little while, less so on the run. Making progress.
  • Still got my eye on it BikeIt.

    I'm glad it's been a while since my dinner after seeing that picture Poacher image Shh, yes been on the Ultra thread to get some tips.

    11.5 miles tonight with 10 @ 7.30 pace. Was only going to do a few but it felt ok so carried on.

  • MsEMsE ✭✭✭

    Bike It - yoga is definitely helpful in stretching and aligning everything. It also will help you work out internal weaknesses when trying a pose and not getting it right until you engage the right muscles eg eagle pose and crow pose. I think you'll quite like it with your mindset. image

    I raced at Gibbet Hill today but on tired legs which brought me home  in 2nd but then that turned out to be 3rd when 1st was awarded to a phantom female who wasn't there for the prize giving. Hmmmm. The club won the team effort which gave a nice warm glow. image

  • MsEMsE ✭✭✭

    Leslie - image

  • Gul DarrGul Darr ✭✭✭

    Bike It - nice work.
    GD - sounds exhausting!
    Leslie - oh no!!! Hopefully you can get the knee sorted though.
    KR - good training and racing. Aren't you preparing for a 24 hour endurance race? Sounds like you'll be in good shape.
    Jools - good club session.
    Poacher - toe-nail on a hinge - cool!
    SJ - recovery going well.
    MsE - well done on the podium finish - bizarre first place award!
    Hill sprints this morning and 11 miles in total. Stats below with a strange anomaly during the warm-up. Just a blip/fault I presume!
    6M warm-up 50:43 = 8:27 m/m avg/max HR 145/214(?!)
    2M hill sprints 14:47 = 7:24 m/m avg/max HR 163/184
    3M warm-down 25:17 = 8:26 m/m avg/max HR 136/152

  • 10 k last night. 38:59 so just inside sub-39 target. First 5k comfortable and well under 19 minutes. Next 5k harder but no falling off the cliff.
  • G-DawgG-Dawg ✭✭✭

    Top bombing Jonesy! You make sub-40 for 10k and sub-20 for 5k look like a breeze! I haven't got the engine for those paces at the moment, especially the 10k.

    We've all probably 'had a toenail on a hinge' like the Poachmeister and they are curious things, but when you look at someone else's they're quite gross! image Fine work Poachy!

    Had a very good 5 miler at lunchtime. Went with a colleague who is training for a half ironman. He's done 26 marathons but is short of speed at the moment. He huffed and puffed while I drove him mad by talking too much and giving him time markers to hit. Got him round at 7.18 pace and I found it a doddle. Good sign that that pace and distance feels so easy.

    Golf day tomorrow image



  • We're now booked in at Bamburgh, Poacher, thanks.  I'll be happy if I manage to finish just half an hour behind 00.

    What's going on in Gul world?  That sounds like proper training.  Do you have a race lined up, or are you monkeying around with hills just for the hell of it? 

  • First post for a while as it's been somewhat manic whichever way I look recently.

    Great toenail shot Poacher; surely a video of it being pulled off would be even more impressive!

    Do I sense that KR is looking at a Comrades 2016 entry?!

    Good news on the Surrey Half G-Dawg. I'm tempted to do it again. 

    Impressive stuff over 10K from PMJ, and an equally impressive podium finish from MsE.

    Talking of 10K, I ran in a low key, well-run local 10K in Cranleigh on Sunday. Half road, half through the woods on the Downs Link so a decent enough surface, moderately rolling on the road and pretty flat off it. Managed a top 10 finish, albeit in 40:17 but I knew from about 2K in that sub 40 would be a big ask and I was cursing having gone out on my bike the day before.

    Still, first half in 20:05 (give or take) and second half in 20:12 suggests I got the pacing about right. Much better performance from younger Lorenzito (1st by about 2mins in the juniors 3K), and elder Lorenzito and Mrs L who both managed 10K PBs with Mrs L also picking up a bottle of wine as a spot prize.

    Couple of 20 mile each way bike commutes keeping me honest this week, and hopefully a parkrun on Saturday.

  • MsEMsE ✭✭✭
    Congratulations in order for all the Lorenzo family! Shame I missed that as it sounds a good race.
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