Sub 3h15



  • TRTR ✭✭✭
    edited October 2019
    SBD - not sure i believe you re the weather, ive run the last 2 Worthing 1/2s, althoygh i guess you dont race those. No pink shoes here either, normal trainers.

    GDawg - nice one, ive been waiting for the penny to drop. You posted some rapid 10m tempos before vlm, a lot quicker than mp, which shouldnt happen. Fwiw i did a sub3 at yeovil in june as an M50, im doing 80something mpw at peak and at least 70 are 8:XX pace, and i would rarely see anything beginning wirh a 7 too. Id like to think this has got me into 255 shape for sunday, but my back may scupper that. Some more miles including lots more slow miles snd you are sub3.
  • OO54OO54 ✭✭✭
    G Dawg, I’m not sure it’s he only way to get there but high mileage is an unavoidable necessity to faster marathon times. I’m not deliberately slow, just tired and lazy on most of my solo runs.
    Good luck to the Abo guys, there should be some good race reports coming on Sunday. I’m going to pace my daughter to a 23 min. parkrun tomorrow then set off for York mid afternoon, with dinner at the hotel.

  • Leslie HLeslie H ✭✭✭
    edited October 2019
    0054 epic swimming and do you just use the flyknits for racing only ?
    Dt I have a similar issue in that ive lost a lot of fat but clearly fat weighs sod all lol as scales are not showing much lower , I know before when the miles went up there was a big lag where hardly anything shifted then a rapid weight loss after that ,here's hoping !
    GUL Nice 14 on a school day , no need for insurance as they were only 67 quid ,only thing I would be worried about is the very minimal grips <1mm you could slip very easily in the wet and I make some fast 90 turns on my 1k repeats so will need to watch out .
    Gdawg almost everybody who runs gets injured ,this is a reality !!! Others on here have got fast a bit at a time over decades of running too and many campaigns Id say a few tweaks to your strategy and that sub 3 is yours as you are close now .You can't run anymore miles as most days are too fast tiring you out when you should be recovering  but still not fast enough to get a good benefit from ,more black and white and less grey runs ...
    SBD colds are out enemy ,I know one of the guys in our club lost 3 weeks to manflu and any chance of a sub 3 with it. I need to see if I can run in the magic shoes first as they might cause more injury .

    Flyknits pulled on for a recovery run , they feel very cushioned on the balls of my feet and clearly my Pegasus are done ,the soles are bald in places now and need replaced as I feel the tarmac battering much more on even an easy run so the cushioning foam has had it , with hardly any grip depth these clearly won't last long so are not for every day use , the soles are almost unbendable with the carbon plate but you don't seen notice it when running  . I think I am maybe ? running more on the balls of my feet but that's probably my imagination and  they feel fine even on today's battered legs after last nights hard  tempo and with 5 hard strides to max  all seems good so far. Still need new Pegasus though ... Looking at Nike pegaus are 104 quid yet id have though the flyknits would be more expensive but they were not .strange and not paying 104 for them !

    5.5m at just under 9m/mile.

  • OO54OO54 ✭✭✭
    Yes Lesley racing including parkruns
  • RichNRichN ✭✭✭

    Thanks for the feedback all – was worried I’d bore everyone off. Really helping me shape my plans. 

    Joolska – that’s positive feedback for P&D and a cracking PB. Noted re halfs. I’ve only ever raced HM mid marathon training, so never tapered for one. My PB was at the back of for me a big mileage week. 

    Leslie – Agree lack of mileage is potentially holding me back. Nice idea re halfs run at mara pace. Doing long mara pace runs solo in training is always tough, although mentally rewarding if you complete them. Thanks for the coach tip. Will investigate. Nice tempo session too. Enjoy the flyknits they will feel even better at pace. I have some box fresh next% (green thankfully!) waiting for a race. The old vaporfly 4% got me my 10k/HM/Mara PBs. They definitely make you faster. 

    TR – Good luck for Sunday. My 2nd edition copy of Advanced Marathoning (note a 3rd editions has just been released – sod’s law!) only calls for a race pace HM in the over 85 mile plan. That mileage is way beyond my current running. Shortening/Dropping some of the recoveries is a good point. Maybe I could sub x-training for one recovery. 

    OO – good luck Sunday at York and thanks for Seville feedback. I think if I hadn’t fluked London ballot, which also gives me time to build my mileage up I would of gone for Seville on a lower mileage plan. 

    DT19 – I recall we were in about a similar place last spring, except you paced the heat at London much better than I did Vienna, so encouraging to hear you have cracked sub 3 twice now. Well done. If you don’t mind who is your coach? Re weight, I’m also about 72ish (at 181cm). I have got down to 71kg with focus but can’t seem to get much lower. One thing I’ve learnt training for marathons etc is you can’t out exercise a bad diet. I actually dropped 4kg a couple years ago post marathon once I focussed on diet despite my exercise levels decreasing.

    Gul – thanks. Had similar thoughts to create my own plan based on the up to 55 and 55-70 P&D plans and come out midway on distance but keeping the principals consistent. That said got 8ish weeks till I need to start London training which is plenty of time to gently push my mileage up and maybe make the 55-70 doable. 

    G-Dawg – glad someone found it interesting! Good reminder that’s it’s definitely about running the easy runs easy and the hard runs hard. 

    SBD – good luck Sunday. Thanks for the P&D/RW feedback. Yes, its consistently consistent that counts. Not managed that for the last couple of training blocks in truth. Looking at my records last time I nailed it was when I planned to run 5 times pw and only missed 5 runs over the 16 week block. Food for thought. Maybe 5 runs plus X-training might be better than 6 runs pw for me…

    One more question before I head off to ponder all the helpful advice – thanks again – how do people handle knowing in advance they won’t be able to run one week of their training block. Basically, going skiing in March. There is no way I’ll knock out more than a couple of easy (probably treadmill) runs that week. Should I just start my plan a week early and allow for a week of x-training (although skiing is really not aerobic unless you go cross country)? 

  • DT19DT19 ✭✭✭
    edited October 2019

    G-Dawg, my thought process is that whether I run my bulk mileage at 7.30mm or 8.10mm will have utterly no difference to my fitness in my opinion, however I can feel the difference in my fatigue when I do occasionally let go on an easy run so can imagine doing that repeatedly will have consequences over time. Plus, why feel more tired than you need to for the same outcome.

    Look at stevie, just ran a 2.47 mara. He still rarely dips below 8mm on easy runs.

    Leslie, on the point, nice easy run.

    Completely contrary to my point, just over 9m at lunchtime with 7m at tempo, aiming for the standard 160bpm. Best run I've had in ages coming in at 6.32 average for 159 bpm. Lately these runs have been coming in at around 6.35 ish for about 163 bpm so definitely feeling fitter this week. Maybe it's the reduction in booze and the loss of bodyfat.

    Splits today were 6.41, 6.34, 6.33, 6.27, 6.33, 6.30 and 6.29. 

    I had to stop during mile 4 because a women with a pack of 4 dogs clearly had no control over them. As I went passed them they all one by one started running at my feet then the bigger one (some sort of staffy) started jumping at me. I stopped and just stood still looking disgruntled whilst they kept jumping up on my waist line. Eventually she got them off me and brought them under control. No apology, just the usual 'it's ok, they don't bite'. It's not ok, I still don't want 4 dogs chasing me and jumping up at me and I had to interrupt my run. I'd have been very apologetic if they were my animals!

  • OO54OO54 ✭✭✭
    Had the same issue on the beach today DT, mad sheepdog chasing and barking and owner smiling at me wondering why I can't see how funny this is...
    I'm sure you can plan around the missing week Rich especially early on the plan. Good luck and keep us updated 😉
  • DT19DT19 ✭✭✭

    It's annoying, OO. Not everyone loves dogs, especially unknown ones chasing you whilst you run.

    Rich, yes I recall you and Nicko were also in same place as me. Nicko has also since gone sub 3. In terms of planning that missed week I think it's pretty easy to work around when you know this far in advance.

    My coach (and also Stevie's) is a chap called Lewis Moses of New Levels coaching. He is a former track athlete (briefly for GB) and his wife who has run for England also coaches under the banner as well.

  • Ian5Ian5 ✭✭✭
    DT-I had a bad fall a year or so ago due to a woman having a dog on an extendable dog lead,dog than ran just as I went past and the lead tripped me,went over it and smashed my watch and phone that was in my pocket,legs all cut up and she seemed shocked when I got up and had a go at her.
  • BirchBirch ✭✭✭
    SBD - he enjoyed going off the Champs start at VLM this year, and, as far as I know, its same again or Berlin in 2020.  
    hope you're feeling relaxed - just remains to reverse your forum name & state the time-honoured exhortation - DBS !!  
  • DT I actually had to hurdle a little dog that ran right under my feet at the last second on Tuesdays club session while doing the mile reps ,luckily it was small as Id never have got the lift to get over a bigun lol ,owner did say sorry though ,the other dog I meet regularly is the German shepard who if the owner sees me coming towards them stops and holds the dog in so fair play there . I have hit the deck years ago due to an extendable lead as well as Ian though dog ran across my path and owner pulled the lead up sharply just as I was going over it , she had her back to me so didn't know I was there .
    Rickn always a good idea to start a week early as there is always something crops up and the biggest danger going  skiing is broken bones not lack of running ...Just take the week off and chillax.
    0054 the flyknits get a fair few runs out then with parkrace every week .
  • Managed to finish 2 huge projects that were due this week at work and fell off the thread as a result:(. Not much sleep early in the the week combined with 24/7 white knuckle mode wasn't ideal, but got 7 hrs Wed night and 8 last night and hopefully 10 tonight. 

    Other than feeling a bit run down, body is in good shape. Got final session at PT today. All green lights. Eating lots of carbs. Starting to get nervous. But weather looking absolutely perfect. Hope the body and engine feel that way too when the gun goes off. 

    Good luck to all racing this weekend! 
  • SBD.SBD. ✭✭✭

    Sounds like you're ready to go VT - good luck for Sunday.

    Good luck for Sunday OO - just stay the right side of Sub 3.

  • TRTR ✭✭✭
    VT - all the best, youve done the hard bit in getting fit enough to run a marathon again after a long break ( i was in yr shoes a year ago at Abingdon 2018). So remember to smile inside and enjoy this. Control the controllables, gels, fluids, relax and get yr head up, gels, fluids........and yes the first 1/2 really should feel that easy, dont go looking for the race, it will catch up with you.
  • JoolskaJoolska ✭✭✭
    10 miles for me this morning with 4 X c 1500m in there: 5.58, 5.50, 5.50, 5.45.

    To those racing tomorrow: trust in your training; run to effort not to pace; be brave but don't be greedy; and Don't Be Shit. Looking forward to some cyber stalking and race reports!
  • OO54OO54 ✭✭✭
    Heading off now so good luck all and follow Jools top advice 😂 Though poo really is important.
    Easy 24 min parkrun today. All feeling good.
  • Good luck tomorrow racers, I'm sure you'll all do great.

    Slow week as unfortunately twisted my ankle when I went too tight on a corner on Monday's run so no training for me. Just lots of wallpaper and paint stripping.
  • MsEMsE ✭✭✭
    Briefly popping in as I am taking the weekend off to baby a little niggle.  I see some are racing this weekend so will take this opportunity to wish you all GOOD LUCK! Run relaxed and let it flow. 

    Jools - just to say, it will come back. You cannot overestimate the effect of your working (ha! autocorrect changed that to "boring" :D ) week on your training. I am an old lady and hoping to rescale the heady heights of wherever so I have no doubt you will manage it. Hang in there and look after that ankle.

    Speaking of ankles, I hope yours is nice and tightly compressed now nicko. <stern look>

    Great to see you popping in Birch. 
  • Best of luck tomorrow SBD & OO! Enjoy it and I'm looking forward to hearing the reports!
  • Leslie HLeslie H ✭✭✭
    edited October 2019
    VTR all sounding very positive just trust in the training and go for it.
    Jools nice bit of speed in your 10 miler 
    Nicko sorry to hear that but I'm sure you will bounce back soon enough being a youngun ,get the chores done now in the downtime and out the way !
    MSE welcome back ya stranger ,been getting much done lately ?

    SBD and 0054 have a great race and well DBS !!!

    Up after first nightshift and would usually try to avoid a session the first one but went out to test out the flyknits at max attack as its nice and dry out ...

    10 x 400m completed 

    1:26, 1:25, 1:28, 1:26, 1:27, 1:26, 1:28, 1:26, 1:29 and an all out 1:25 to finish , most had around 80 sec recovery although the first 2 were more like 65 sec due to counting errors ...65 is too short at the effort level I'm at and I certainly felt it ..
    Flyknits felt very comfy ,paces are up but then I'm starting to get into 400 reps now after a few goes at them and getting faster by the week anyway and finding my stride is really starting to stretch out ,before I had no power at ends of leg travel for that so its a strength fitness improvement thing.

    Max hr was 181 for last one with 178 for most reps and 6.5 miles in total.

    Found some rather fetching "racing blue" zoom Pegasus 36's for a more palatable 73 quid on pro running ,most were looking 105 which is a piss take so these are now hopefully on their way soon .

  • All, thanks for the last minute words of wisdom and encouragement . SBD and OO, will be sending good vibese across the pond. Good luck!
  • Just popping in to wish SBD and TR, OO and VTr all the best today. Some great training by all - now go out and reap the rewards :) Weather looking good this side of the pond. Not so good in Abingdon, Virginia. Hope it's okay in Vermont or wherever you are racing VTr!
  • OO54OO54 ✭✭✭
    I'll write a full report later but very pleased and surprised with 2:58:40 at York marathon. Just being driven home by Mrs OO & about to doze ZZZ
  • JoolskaJoolska ✭✭✭
    Hurrah!  Well done, OO.
  • BirchBirch ✭✭✭
    top stuff, OO  
  • PoacherPoacher ✭✭✭
    Good work OO, life in the old fella yet. And York ain't as fast a course as is sometimes claimed. Excellent run.

    Still nowhere near running, had an MRI scan on the knee this morning which is a strange experience, but seeing the consultant soon so fingers crossed.

    As you were, and good luck all.
  • SBD.SBD. ✭✭✭

    Well done OO - that's a great result.

    Hope VT is going well across the pond.

    Didn't manage to say hello this morning but hope it went well TR.

    Conditions good at Abingdon although there was some wind in places. A good day for me - 2:51:14 - a good 7.5 minutes off the 2010 PB - still trying to make sure I wasn't dreaming! 

  • PoacherPoacher ✭✭✭
    SBD that is a daddy PB - very well run sir.
  • DT19DT19 ✭✭✭
    very well run, oo.

    SBD, that is remarkable!!! GFA for Berlin as well. 

    Huge well done both. 

    I'll read back further later. 
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