Sub 3h15



  • Nice run Efe col, it's not exactly a flat course. Nice one too SJ, but still a mad event.

    Minni - alas no Town Moor mara as Im going to Kenya for the opening of a new school funded by UK donors. Quite a humbling experience and not to be turned down. Might even sneak in some altitude training but won't be challenging any local runners to a smackdown.....I shall miss your drinks station though

    Seems to be some good training going on, it's so much easier when the weather gets colder.

    21m in 2.38 this morning, training has been as random as ever but this felt like a key session to nail, good to have it d&d.
  • Evening all. Been too busy trying to sort my life out to post

    Looks like lots are still working hard at it. Great stuff. Top notch racing from col and SJ

    Ran the crathes HM on sat. Surprised to find it was 21 degrees ( in the North of Scotland!) and turned out to be a semi multi terrain/off road affair. My time of 1.24.27 was pants but that got me 6th overall , 3rd vet - winner only did 1.22 something. For the first mile or so I was in first place! Very disconcerting

    Managed a10k pace session with 3* 1.5 miles at 5.55 pace on Wed which felt surprisingly ok

    Week and a half before Abo taper starts - think I need a brek from maras for a wee bit after that. Two in a year is plenty for me

    looking forward to catching up with poacher, SJ and ?? Others in October
  • MinniMinni ✭✭✭
    Shame Poacher. I'll miss you.

    Nice HM Fraser. Everything looking good for Abo? Hope life gets a bit easier for you - it's a bugger when it gets in the way.
  • OO54OO54 ✭✭✭

    Glad you enjoyed the North East efc-col- good run.

    That sounds like a lot of my marathons too Dylan man, usually around 1:30 at the half but then drift off in the last 4-6. image

    It's the rersults that count Fraser- take a bow.

    9 miler tonight averaging 7:45 pace- with some speedy track work in the middle . 

  • Philip_M_Jones wrote (see)
    Dylan man wrote (see)
    He said he felt so fresh after taper stormed off and completed half in 1.26. (6.30). Ended up finishing in 3.08 after wheels came off. Took 52 mins for last 10k! Hard lesson learned which I have absorbed.

    Any one else have similar tales of disaster? Although 3.08 is by no means a disaster he would argue otherwise!

    If you look at VLM 2012 then there are 93 guys finishing 3.08.xx and the splits at half range from 1:24 to 1:37. Only 6 have negative splits. The average split for these 93 males is 1:30:03 for an average finish time of 3:08:24.

    There are 7 guys faster than 1:26 who fished 3:08.xx so it isn't an uncommon event and all of these list running clubs so are not totally naive.

    I'm assuming PMJ only looked at men who finished in 3.08.xx because he knew my splits would ruin the pattern image

  • OO54OO54 ✭✭✭

    Minni this might tempt you to the Whitley Bay parkrun;

    Parkrun has arrived in WhitleyBay

    And all the runners can come out to play.

    On Saturday mornings admire their pace,

    The strain and effort is etched on their face.


    Come to the seaside as the posters all say

    Enjoy the sea air at stunning WhitleyBay

    There’s lots to do and places to see

    Have a pint of lager or a nice cup of tea.


    Enjoy the beach life on the golden sands

    Where children play and parents hold hands

    Try out the surfing, or sail and canoe.

    And on Saturday morning there’s a 5K too.


    The tidy short course has it all en route

    With turns and slopes and inclines to boot

    You can get blown along on a windy day

    Or the sun may come out and brighten the way.


    With the sea as a back drop, it’s a stunning race.

    The Links are spacious and the volunteers are Ace.

    Run along the prom with it’s iconic café

    Take in the bridge and it’s rugged pathway.


    You can even go shopping and buy yourself a treat

    Pop into Roger Russell where the service is unique.

    The shops are enticing, yes the stories are true.

    Come pay them a visit in trendy Park View.


    So if you’re a regular or just passing by

    Whitley Bay parkrun is well worth a try.

    Try it one morning or make it a day

    Get fit at the parkrun then you might like to stay.

  • Lorenzo - pleased to hear the knee is OK.
    EFC-Col - fantastic result in the GNR. Enjoy your jolly in France.
    SJ - you must be very pleased with your official results. Training looking good too.
    Poacher - excellent LSR.
    FW - nice HM and congrats on the podium placing.
    OOlg - Whitley Bay always reminds me of the Dire Straits song about the Spanish City; haven't been up that way for quite a few years now.
    3 mile recovery run for me this morning; I meant to do some core work too but got sucked into a paper work session image

  • CC2 - Speedy Goth wrote (see)
    Philip_M_Jones wrote (see)
    Dylan man wrote (see)

    If you look at VLM 2012 then there are 93 guys finishing 3.08.xx and the splits at half range from 1:24 to 1:37. Only 6 have negative splits. The average split for these 93 males is 1:30:03 for an average finish time of 3:08:24.

    There are 7 guys faster than 1:26 who fished 3:08.xx so it isn't an uncommon event and all of these list running clubs so are not totally naive.

    I'm assuming PMJ only looked at men who finished in 3.08.xx because he knew my splits would ruin the pattern image

    Without being sexist, you are hitting 72% WAVA for that run and an equivalent male doing the same is scoring 66%. For a male to score 72% he needs to do 2:52. So yes, I deliberately only used males as females finishing round that time are quality and I expect they would do better.

    For the record, VLM 2012, 12 women finished 3.08.xx and the half times range from 1:28:48 to 1:34:43 and only two did a negative split (and we know who did that best, don't we).

    The average split is 1:31:59 which is almost two minutes slower than the men.

    Just goes to show what we all knew anyway: if you want to run a good race find an elite woman who will pace it evenly, follow her and then out sprint at the end to avoid being chicked. Do not follow Nell, 1:25 and 1:29 is not crash and burn but it does have room for improvement.

  • Oh boy, these flat races really expose your running credentials. Until now I've hidden behind the "there was a big hill " excuse for my positively positive splits.

    8 miles today trying to nail my MP. Seem to either run at 6:55, or 6:30. I'm wanting 6:45. Think I might need to replace the sprockets in my gears (if that is how we work?)

    Nice podium work FW, and a great race report Col

  • PMJ - I think I will forward you as the thread statto (if this hasnt already been done), You just need to change your picture to one where you are wearing PJs and a dressing gownimage

    Nice report EFC and great result Fraser

    The Kenya visit sounds wonderfully cathartic Poacher.

    Off to Fizz today to manipulate shoulder - Consultant next Fri and then, fingers crossed, back at itimage

  • Kudos for a 'cafe' and 'pathway' rhyme!

    5M easy last night, although both last night and Wednesday night I've done a 15M round trip on the bike going to and from first aid training.

  • You've all got me nervous, well more nervous, with all these tales of second half fade!

    Hope you all have a good weekend running, good luck to any racers.

  • Oh, well, that's all right then. I quite like being called 'quality' image

    14 miles tonight with 12 @ MP. All came out under 7 min miling except for mile 9 (7.03), which was uphill and also the mile in which I really started to need the loo. Urgently. Mile 10 was faster as I trod the fine line between sprinting to Sainsbury's as fast as I could get there, and not jiggling my insides too much. Mile 11 was 7.00, starting uphill on legs that had stiffened up having been sat in a convenient convenience for a good 5 mins. I pity the poor sod who was in the cubicle next to me when I got in there image. I think maybe I need to eat a bit less during the day when I'm doing a session like this at night. I couldn't help but think of MM and his sacrificed hat...

  • Speedy - sounds like you've discovered the technique for the assault on a sub-3! Tough session, well executed.

    Not so sure whether to go out for a 2 hour run tomorrow (as I need to get back in time to leave the house again at 8.30) or whether to wait until Sunday for a proper length long run. After a recovery run this morning, followed by badminton at lunchtime and a slight niggle, I suspect that I'll make tomorrow a rest day and then try and avoid going mad on the vino tomorrow evening.

  • Nice 14 miler Dylan Man. Agree 3.08 is still a good time, but with expectations of a sub 3 would be a tough one to swallow. Another proof of go off steady & negative split. BUt good point Minni about not doing enough long runs. I think it's okay to assume a possible sub 3 off a low 1.2x half time, but you have to do the respective training to back it up

    Good statistics PMJ.

    Good report efc col. 11 seconds off a PB has got to be celebrated - 2nd fastest half marathon ever? Maybe without the volume of runners/slow pen runners etc you might have cracked your PB? Hope you enjoyed Toulouse!

    Good tri results Sloakey image And good simmering going on!

    Hold on Fraser a 1.24 off road (ish) half marathon is an awesome time - don't knock it! And cracking out a midweek sppesession too - looking good at the moment.

    Poasher, get out there and do some Kenyan hills!

    Also-ran That sems a big difference in MP mile splits. Was the course you were running undualting?

    Mennania - does the fizz normally cross your fingers at part of your session - is that part of the treatment?

  • Good session there Speedy. I've always found McDonalds to be the saviour of inner city public toilets. I know what you mean about getting going after a lay off.

    Usually go down the track on a Tuesday night, but had to postpone this week. Anyway, turned up tonight and no one else about. Bloke in the office reckoned there would be others comig down, but no one did so had the whole tarten track to myself! 25 x 200m in 39 seconds each with 20 seconds recovery inbetween done & dusted. Was on the cusp of it going dark and they only had one spot light on, guess they were saving money as my £3.40 fee doesn't stretch to all 4 lights being on!

  • Good works on the HMs EFC-Col and Fraser.

    Nice dilemma to have on the MP pace AR

    Looking good on your MP Speedy

    Fraser - I will also be at Abo

    Back home after 26 hours of travel yesterday , and 7 meals image.   Not really what I would call a rest day as most of it spent in an aircraft seat.  38 miles in 3 days Tuesday to Thursday is quite a bit more than I'm used to so proper rest day today before tomorrow's LSR.

  • Speedy - excellent MP run; glad you made it to Sainsbury's in time.
    KR  - stonking set of reps; well done.
    Bike It - have a good recovery from a day or so in an aeroplane.
    10 slow miles for me to round the week off this morning. Now into base training and my average pace for the week has dropped by over 30s per mile.

  • OO54OO54 ✭✭✭

    Man flu has struck here- not the same one you got I hope Speedy. So I'll volunteer for parkrun this morning and hope it lifts tomorrow. Another challenging week for mileage image

  • JD3, the fade won't happen if you set off slow enough - taken me 8 to learn this and to remember a thread motto "don't be greedy" (and "don't try and bank in the first half cos you'll pay for it" but that's not quite as catchy)

    Cutting it fine by the sounds of it Speedy! Won't be long before you start to enjoy the fun of outdoor pursuits and have to improvise on cleanup material a la Keirimage

    27hours - uurrrghhh

    Enjoy the plods Gul!

    Get well soon OO - currently on high dose Vit C and first defence here with house full of I'll people. This time of year is always the same with those pesky school kids mingling together. image
  • Hope it doesnt linger OO

    The fizz has tried everything else KR! Poor core is their current thinking so am strengthening that - hopefully the extended layoff will do the job by default anyway. Nice set of reps too.

    Eventful MP session speedy -  but arent you taking Sainsburys 'no quibble return policy' a little far?image



  • CC2 - Speedy Goth wrote (see)

    Oh, well, that's all right then. I quite like being called 'quality' image

    The second you came inside 3:15 at VLM 2011 was the precise point you went from good to quality. Abo 2011 and V:LM 2012 were just steps up from that. If MP is 7 spot on, that give 3;03 or 3:04, is that the plan for Abo and then 2:59:59 in VLM 2013? I would love to be able to get into the same thought process and groove that you are in and just lower the time by a few minutes each time.

    parkrun for me today in 19:26, going in the right direction but all taking far too long for my liking. Nevertheless, it marks the end of a 13 day streak of running each day and 80 miles in total which looked improbable only a month ago.

  • good work Speedy, and impressive streak PMJ

    Bromley Park Run for me and a certain overseas guest (had to dash off mate to watch son's rugby - couldn't find you to say ttfn).  It was a mob match for our club vs another one, good turn out for both, results awaited.  I struggled to keep the early pace going and a couple of the 'other lot' got a gap on me that I couldn't quite close.  Didn't see the 1km or 3km markers so took splits at 2km (7:21 ..... bit quick) and 4km (7:36) and a last km of 3.44 (if marker accurate) for total of 18:42.  Happy with that, equals season's best and best ever is "only" 18 secs faster. 

    Will pop out for an hour & a half after lunch as that's my best option of getting some miles in this weekend

  • Nice parkrunning from Jezza (long time no see!) and PMJ.

    Speedy: we've all been there (well, not that particular branch of Sainsbury's, but metaphorically).  Hopefully just a one off.  Incident aside, you're clearly in good shape for Abo and over the man flu.

    Mile reps for me this morning.  First was an absolute shocker (6.38) and my quads felt awful (I think because I did quite a lot of cycling on Wednesday and Thursday for the first time in ages to get to and from a first aid course); I then gave myself a bit of a talking to, because my lungs felt fine, and the next two were more respectable (6.22 and 6.20), although I'd rather been hoping for 6.25, 6.20, 6.15 to move up through the gears.  Still, for an early morning solo session it'll do.  Short-ish long run tomorrow (10M) and then an easy week before the Bristol half image

  • I'm not doing Abo, I'm doing Munich. But otherwise, yes, 7 min miling is the plan. BUT, I think that will get me 3.05.xx as I'm bound to run over distance. I may have a crack at sub 3 at VLM (if I can ever enter the bliddy thing - still says 'keep checking back') but realistically it's more likely to be 3.05 at Munich and 3.02.30 at VLM. Between Abo 2011 and VLM 2012 I only took off two and a half minutes, and the faster I get the more difficult those minutes are to shave off. 

    It's always hard to do solo reps Jools, and first thing in the morning has to be the worst possible time! 

    Gentle recovery run this morning, then a weights session in the gym with a GB athlete. He's recently had surgery on his knee and can't run until next summer. Can you imagine having an international elite level career ruined by... wait for it.... standing up funny from sorting out his pile of DVDs. Seriously. I think he's bored. He's also almost qualified as a personal trainer and until recently was an elite 1500m runner and pretty decent 10k runner too (I think his PB for 10k is just over 30 mins). If he'd like to be bored in my direction more often I certainly won't say no! 

  • OO54OO54 ✭✭✭

    Trying to imagine what the shoppers thought when you burst into Sainsburys and sprinted to the toilets image

    Well the parkrun was an education today. I was recording finishers at the end and stayed for the very last ( 40+ minutes). I'm usually away in 20 after my run, so it was interesting to see what an effort 5k is for some people. Quite uplifting really.

    Still feeling a bit crap and full of snot but with the Redcar half next Sunday I need to get out tomorrow and salvage something from the week. See if I can last for 18.5 to give me a 35 mile week image.

  • Sorry, Speedy, I do know you're doing Munich really, just had a mad 5 minutes!  

    In Cambridge for a uni reunion and just off to do my 'long' run of 10M - I daren't wait until I'm back in Bristol because the heavens will have opened!

    Take it easy, OO - you don't want that cold getting any worse.  Lap course for you, and bail if the breathing gets too bad.

  • OO - I wouldn't even bother with the long run. Just let the cold run its course and it will be gone by next weekend. Running now will only prolong it (she says from very recent experience!!!)

    Luckily the loos in Sainsbury are right next to the door. 

  • 17 miles with 11 at 'MP' by feel which came out at average 7:12 with 2 small hills.  It was a good boost mentally after a number of poor runs in the week.  Mostly it felt quite comfortable but my legs were tiring toward the end over the hills, but thankfully there are none of those at Abo.  I'm just not 100% confident to run that pace from the gun.  But the hard training is almost done and with a bit of recovery things should slot into place.

    My wife is sick in bed so my fingers are crossed to stay healthy this week.



  • Doing the fizz exercises re glutes this morning but just cant seem to isolate or use the muscle, all exercises seem to put strain on hams and lower back instead with little feeling in glutes. Anyone withe experience of this got tips?  There is an unhelpful overabundance  on the web

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