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Minni - but to be fair there's not many women on RW chasing sub3, and only very recently have there been more than the odd one or two chasing sub 3:15, which is the equivalent of a male sub3. Its difficult for most women to find the time to train for marathons so there will always be more men chasing the equivalent marathon times.
EFC-Col - indeed, no rocket science required. Do something every day, day after day.
Top marks, Col !!
DS2 - good luck with the asics boot camp.
I would like to wish you luck with your sub 3 hrs at 50 but of course we both know there isn't any luck in marathon running. It is all about effort, commitment focus and aching legs.
In 2008 I failed to do sub 3 by some seconds (absolutely gutted although it was a pb by some six minutes) soon after that I got my one and only serious injury that put me out for the best part of seven months. Managed to walk/run London in 2009 just to see if my achilles would hold up. Got around in 03:23:xx - my worst ever but no surprise and the achilles was okay. June that year I decided I was going to train for 10 months with the sole aim of doing sub 3 hrs in 2010.
And that is what I did.
Obviously, it was my first and I have to say as feelings go it doesn't get much better than that moment I came around the bend at Buck Pal with the official clock showing 02:57:xx. Its true what they say - the harder you work for something the more it means when you achieve it.
Agreed. I guess that I must have been within a few yards of you on The Mall in 2008.
DS2 - exciting stuff; bit of a shock for the wife though!
One Gear - welcome; impressive record there. Please keep posting and don't re-lurk.
I'm planning to run all my best maras in the MV50+ category - that way I can look forward to reaching the big 5-0
A steady 8 miles for me this morning. Back to the really slow stuff for the rest of the week.
Minni, I think that there is a big distinction between running sub 3 at 50 and running sub 3 for the first time aged 50. On the runbritain rankings there are 94 V50 with sub-3 performances in 2012 but a lot of them have faster times from younger days.
Finding those with no previous marathon experience who broke sub 3 at VLM 2012 shows:
Fred Zalokar 2:37:35 age 51 first timer according to po10 but well known masters runner form USA http://www.all-athletics.com/node/446454
but behind him a lot of impressive runs and PBs but a lot have previous with sub3.
Fastest I find is Colin Ridley: 2:53:50 after 3:00:22 in 2010. This guy sort of fits into the classic mould of middle distance going long in his later years so he is fit but does not have the tiredness in his legs of lots of years running long.
I am told that a minute a year is expected drop off when the drop off starts, so most V40 who can run sub 2:50 can sub 3 at V50. I am 47 and almost 2:50 so am looking to be well within 3:00:00 at VLM 2016.
One Gear - Thanks for the background. It made an interesting read and another huge inspiration in my quest to go Sub-3 again (along with so many on here!). I think, although I try not to dwell on my old PB's because they were such a long time ago, the one advantage it does give me is that I've done it and know what commitment it needs. I have carried on intermitently running but never with anywhere near the same commitment levels. For the first time this year my life will allow it - and so will the wife, Gul - we had a good chat and a laugh about it last night.
I'm definitely stronger at this stage than I've been since 1994 and feel really confident that I'll get to sub 3;15 this year. I suppose my legs aren't overly fatigued either considering most of my marathons since have been run on an average of 3 runs per week!
PMJ - I'm not sure if I really fall in the category of sub 3 previously. It was by some margin I suppose but still a long time ago. Do you have any stats on whether being previously sharpish has any benefits. I've always stuck to the belief it does - but I need to start proving it.
A nice steady 5.77 in 43;11 (7;29 mm average) this morning on a hilly course. A bit quicker than I've been running but wanted to stretch the legs a little. Felt enjoyable even the uphill sections.
PMJ, sorry to hear that you had a relapse in your comback - must be frustrating after the controlled buildup you had. It does sound though, that with the combination of cycling and requests for stats (as thread Statto) ,that a few weeks will pass by quickly before you are back
DS2 - good luck with the thing we are not talking about
One Gear. Welcome - you seem to have selected thre right gear if you only have the one available to your running engine. Impressive stuff
Thanks for the welcome guys.
Gul Darr - interesting to read your comments on "reaching the big 5-0". In my case doing my first marathon at 50 was to celebrate getting to that age pretty much in one piece. (My father first had cancer in his mid forties and was only given a fifty/fifty chance of survival at the time.)
Also ran - just to reinforce the "one gear in the gearbox". There is in fact only about 20 secs difference between my 10k race pace and my marathon race pace and when it comes to hills - don't even go there!
Don't believe that minute a year nonsense PMJ, otherwise I'd be a pack horse by now
Not really. There is anecdotal evidence to support both camps. Noakes says a few times that the masters records are held by people who come to the sport at a late age with no previous involvement and yet you see people who have long histories of running at a high level from junior to senior to masters.
I do agree with the theory that you have two ages: real age and running age and that a younger running age does help.
There is a good article on
http://www.sportsscientists.com/2009/02/exercise-and-aging-part-1.html
http://www.sportsscientists.com/2009/02/exercise-and-aging-part-2.html
http://www.sportsscientists.com/2009/02/exercise-aging-and-humour.html
So in that article above there is a chart that shows decline per decade. Let's say we are all 3:20 runners (as that is 200 minutes) so 40 to 50 you expect 8.3% drop off which is 16.6 minutes or 1.6 minutes per year and it gets worse as you get older
That's fighting talk: my plan is to be on the champs start alongside Race Jase for VLM 2016 when I am 50 so think we will be on different starts
Loving the fighting talk
As a 44 year old who's marathon PB has improved by 24 minutes since the age of 40, I'm hoping I can buck the aging process and keep getting a bit quicker for a few more years before the inevitable decline
PMJ
I might regret this, but have decided to face my demons....
Jan 20 - efc-Col- Four villages half - sub 82
Jan 20 - Minni - Brass Monkey - sub.... OO- sub 80??
Feb 2 - Poacher - Thames Trot 50 - sub 7:15
Feb 10 - Moof - Wokingham HM - sub 83; Jools tbc , Also-ran maybe, PMJ same or better than this year 79:34
Feb 17 - Also-ran - Bramley 20 - PMP
Mar 3 - Dylan man - Bath half - sub 1.22; Jools sub 85 (mebbe)
Mar 10 - Minni - Northumberland HM - sub...
Mar 17 - Moof - Reading HM - sub Wokingham
Mar 17 -??Also-ran - Reading HM - sub 1:22
Mar 17 - Lunchtime - Reading HM - sub 1:30; Jools PMP
Mar 25 - CC2 - Loughborough HM - sub 86
April 7 - Dylan man - Taunton marathon (prov) - sub 3.10
April 21 - Poacher + Keir - VLM - TBC
April 21 - efc-Col - VLM - sub 2:57
April 21 - Moof + Jools+ OO??+ Also-ran - VLM - sub 3
April 21 - CC2 - VLM - sub 3.05
April 21 - Lorenzo - VLM - sub 3:10
April 21 - SBD + Minni + LB70 - VLM - sub 3:15
April 21 - Freemers - VLM - sub 3.20
April 28 - Slokey Joe - Manchester - sub 3:00
April 28 - Knight Rider - Manchester - sub 3:10
April 28 - Bike It - Manchester - TBC
May 6 - Lunchtime - Milton Keynes - sub 3:15
May 12 - DS2 - Halstead - sub 3:15 25 -
May 25 - Poacher - GUCR - sub 35
June 2 - Bike It - Comrades - sub 8:30
PMJ - interesting stuff. I will have a good read later. I came into work today thinking I should try not to spend all day on the forums..... oh well, it is Friday and there have to be some benefits in working for yourself! Loved the fighting talk, also!!! That's a great goal - I'm sure you'll achieve it! One thing on the ageing thing. If you never actually reached your full potential before reaching V40 then I would assume it all goes out of the window and since so many on these threads got more serious than ever post 40 I reckon we could buck the trend. Well that's what I'm hoping.
Although physical peak may drop off, I am sure that life style factors, commitment, experience and the awareness of the ticking clock are all mental factors which help the older athlete to counter the aging process in endurance events.
Running age is an interesting one. Obviously as an impact sport running ages the body much quicker than cycling or other endurance sports and therefore the lifetime running athlete is at a disadvantage when compared to running newbies. However I am convinced that an experienced athlete returning to the sport who has 'done it before' can regain or get close to their previous best easier than a newbie due to muscle memory and the neuro-muscular pathways which can be rebuilt easier than they can be forged from new. For example an experienced runner probably would regain their efficent stride / foot placement, leg speed and body position easier than a new runner. Again this would help to counter the aging process slightly.
Keir - encouraging words indeed! I hang on to that theory. I think there is one other thing that comes into play as well and that is the fact that having done something previously we are not constrained by what our brain tells us what may be possible. As we all know once Roger Bannister broke the 4 minute mile it was no longer an insurmountable barrier and was broken more than 50 times in the following couple of years. (Can't remember the exact numbers but no doubt PMJ will). Similarly with scaling Everest.
I think I can run sub 3:00 eventually (maybe unrealistic) but because I did it before I think I can. I know deep down that ageing will probably stop me ever getting much lower than that but I'm trying to put the age thing to the side. Other 50 year olds have run much faster (many fellow forumites) so anything could be possible.
Happy to be shot down in flames - I will see it as a challenge!
Similar to Freemer at 43 I still hope to get quicker and in the last year my marathon time has improved by 11 minutes.
OO - I might not make it on Sunday. I've been a bit under par for the past week and have a chesty cough. I can't afford to be ill at the moment so might have to put my sensible head on.
Sorry to hear that Minni- hope it wasn't the fear of our head to head that did for you
Not been running great myself lately Minni and hopes of a sub 60 minutes for the 10 miler are fading for Sunday. Might have to try again next year when I'm a much faster 50 year old
.
OO - Sub 60 at 50. That would be an achievement. I think sub 60 at any age is pretty good!
Minni - hope you recover quickly.
Who can name the person who beat Bannisters record? He is so famous, and yet John Landy beat his record just 46 days later. That record stood for 3 years so I can't imagine the floodgates opened.
We seem to be at another of those plateaus: El Guerrrouj has held it since 1999, and nobody in the UK gone faster than Cram in 1985, and Seb coe is still #10 on the all time list.
Stady on DS2 you are ageing me prematurely. I'm not 50 for 7 weeeks
PMJ - I knew you'd know more PMJ. I did read a book of the story a number of years ago and had led myself to believe that the floodgates did indeed open. It must have been that it was beaten not long afterwards.I think I need to dig the book out and read again!!!
Still, I'm sure you know where I was coming from. Sometimes the biggest barriers are in our own minds. I love the fact that you're planning to be on the championship start at 50. Why not? Nothing is achieved with pessimism is it?
48, but who's counting
DS2, I am looking forward to the same with the 2:00 marathon. Reckon once one is done, then everyone will be doing it. Having said that, Paula did 2:15:25 in 2003 and the closest behind her is still 2:18:20 so no sign of a spate of sub 2:15 girls.
6:15am....must be time to run
OO - made me laugh. Off out for 15 now m
yself. Have a good one.