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Sorry Also-ran, x-post! This looks like good news to me. I hate making the extra time before a long run for food. I shall experiment with just getting out the door in future and see how it goes.
I usually stay well hydrated the day before long runs so don't usually need to drink before or during them - maybe just a couple of mouthfuls of water before I set off, but not really needed I imagine!
TR - that site has your name all over it!!
I'm an early morning runner. 16m+ and I will have coffee and porridge or readybrek - I can have this as I'm going out the door and don't seem to have to let it settle. Anything less is normally just coffee. If I feel I haven't eaten enough the day before I will have a bowl of porridge before going to bed.
But, this may all be about to change. I'm off work ill (second day) so putting my bed time to good use and reading Racing Weight with a view of reaching my optimal weight by VLM.
Keir - put the coffee in a flask?
I'm also scheduling a some reading on long runs. I know of a few people recently, myself included, who have run a marathon pb, or close to, with minimal long runs. I'm wondering if the more experienced one gets at long distance running the less important the amount of long run training runs become.
Minni - that looks interesting. Be interested what you make of it once you've read it. Is it about nutrician/training or combination (or indeed other factors?).
I'm sure the more running you have done the more miles in your legs and, therefore, the more likely you are that you will perform well on less long runs. Whether this is the most effective way probably differs for each of us and we need to try different strategies unless something really works for us and then why change it?
I'd love to be able to do less long runs and have tried that a couple of times in recent years (not through choice, though). Result - a rather painful final 3 or 4 miles!
More painful than normal I would add!
DS2 - Fortunately, I find my joints are fine; it's just a habit I have picked up of doing a few warm-up exercises, including one or two dynamic stretches, before setting off.
Cheers all, will just get out and give it a chance to settle in then over a few sessions. When I explained to the missus I was off on another campaign I suggested Iwould do the bulk in the morning for the same reasons as DS2, Keir and others.
I tend to do my long runs without fuel or water in any event so will probably just eat a sensible high carb based evening meal the night before. Will trial it tomorrow on a mlr of around 8-10 miles.
Woke up this morning with an awful pain in the neck; have very restricted range of movement and so, in the absence of physio/sports massage availability at the practice I usually go to this evening, am opting for chiropractor. Never been to a chiropractor so not sure what to expect but just hoping it does the job...
Hope you sort your pain in the neck Jools. Dodgy pillow? It appears as if Gul isn't the only one who is stiff first thing in the morning.
Jools
but hope it works.
Jools - ouch! Might have cricked your neck in the night? - I did that once and it was the most pain I have ever been in, couldn't move my head at all. I went to a chiropractor too - not that pleasant at the time but more because of the pain I was already in rather than anything he did to me. In my case he reckoned a couple of the facet joints in my neck had got misaligned and he seemed to do the trick adjusting it back to the right place. Ached a bit for a few days but as right as rain soon enough. I have also invested in a really good pillow that moulds to my shape - best money ever spent.
Minni - that site is defo not my doing. I am aware of Fanuary as a friends wife is an air hostess, her and her chums have (apparantly) been discussing which "do" they are planning. There's the Hitler, the landing strip, the Jackson 5 afro, the Kojak......
DS2 - no probs running 20s on no fuel, I build the long run up to 20 over a few weeks, and my early 20s are all slow too, so there's no sudden surprise. I only do a few progressive ones later on, if I feel the need I could always carry a bottle or a gel. But its more important to eat a lot the evening before really. Mind you at the moment I'm only running 5s and 6s mostly but some are doubles so I would struggle big time to run 20, however I will build up the long runs over Dec and January, so I'm ready come Feb.
Belated birthday wishes Lorenzo
Quite a few onboard are taking part in Movember. I will have to ask the ladies for their plans. As well as having to shave myself for a hernia operation I have also had the joy of a needle in the (look away now) scrotum.
I am currently running after work, as I struggle to get up in the mornings. However, I find if I have no choice, it takes me a week to get into early morning running and then I prefer them.
I was planning on a cut back this week. After working later than hope for I decided not to go for a run. The guilt got to me and forced me out. I somehow managed to go from running 8 miles slowly to running 10 miles progressively.
First mile was 7:37. Came out miles 0-5 at 7:22, miles 6-10 at 6:51 (aiming for sub 7, but for some reason 6:51 has a nice feeling to it). This included a 6:34 final mile through the tunnel at Monaco. Some event had just let out so the pavement was completely full, so I had no choice but to run on the road (in the tunnel). Not the most sensible but it gave me a focus, as for some reason drivers (tourists) have a tendancy to speed through that particular area.
Hope you get straightened out Jools!
Thanks for the tip SJ. I'll give it a listen.
I am absolutely not a morning runner. I like to spend my mornings asleep in my bed. I also can't run without fuel. I've tried it a couple of times and my form is dreadful and I bonk after a couple of miles. I have no problems training until 9pm though.
Gul - how is your dad in himself? Is he glad to be home?
Minni and Jools - recovery vibes coming your way.
Racing Weight - I've read it. It will tell you absolutely nothing that you didn't know already, but it tells it in a nice, concise way. If you need reminding about what you do actually know, then it's worth a squiz.
Hills for me tonight. Didn't get out of work in time to go to the intervals session, and I had vaguely decided that hills would be of more benefit than the scheduled 900s anyway. I can't say I enjoyed it, but needs must!
Definitely early morning runs for me - sets me up nicely for the day ahead. Endorphins and all that jazz. Unless it's a short recovery run (in which case it's a quick sip of water) then I'll have about 350ml of sports drink before I head out; like Minni, anything more than 15 miles and I'll have a bit to eat before I go as well.
Can't do solo evening runs - the only thing I've ever managed in the evening is a track session.
Hope Minni and Jools recover OK from various aliments.
Joolska hope it goes/went OK. Not used chiropractor but had been to various osteopaths over the years which must be pretty similar and they have worked wonders. Acupuncture is also worth considering.
Minni - IMHO there's a tariff on long runs a bit like carbon offsetting, meaning that fewer and longer can be as useful as more and shorter. Eg 1x22 might be worth 2x19. Or 1x26 could equate to 2x21. I find running a full mara at 15-20min slower than PB is really good training. But it's not for everyone.
Happy late birthday Lorenzo
As for food, have decided to experiment more scientifically with high calorie stuff. Next on the list is peanut butter and jam Sarnies - anyone tried that? Sounds gross.
Hope you had a B/day blast Lorenzo.
Don't mind getting up early for work (e.g. today) but if I run I'm cr*p early doors.
I'm also having an unpleasant operation at the dentist on Friday to fix a dodgy implant- may scupper my parkrun plans
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How'd the neck manipulations go Joolska?
I started out doing long runs on air but as they got longer I definitely felt tired at the end so I switched to having 500ml of water and a peanut butter and jam sandwich on the drive into work so it was 06:00 up,, 06:10 in car and driving, eating and drinking, 06:45 in office check emails, 07:00 leave for run, 09:30 back and in the office after 20+ miles.
I don't mind getting up and running on nothing more than a mouthful of water, but I've not tried it regularly, and haven't tried it on anything more than a recovery run. The time wasted digesting breakfast is one of my pet hates though.
I was just wondering two things - is getting up to maximum HR in training a good or bad thing?
and is it possible to edit the laps on a run once it's done (on a Garmin)- I did intervals yesterday, and for one reason or another I didnt get any lap markers, just the autolap miles, is it possible to edit the data so that I can seperate the run into Warm Up, Interval Rcovery etc, Cool Down
Jools - How's that neck this morning?
TR - that looks like good advice to me and a plan I could follow in building up to 20+ without food/drink etc. PMJ - similarly, and good use of time! A bit dangerous reading emails before you go out though? I could see myself getting drawn in if there was an issue and miss my run!
Scooby - Nice running there!
Slokey - thanks for the info on the carbs vs fat thing. I shall take a look.
Lorenzo - Happy belated birthday. Hope it was a good 'un!
JD3 - I always see breakfast as wasted time as well. However, my wife can't function at all without food & caffeine inside her so I try to avoid talking to her until she does! Going out early for a run means she's normally eaten and therefore civil by the time I get home!
Apologies if I've missed anyone!
Listened to my body this morning and resisted the temptation to run again. I had felt really tired and run down last night so made a decision not to run this morning. After a good nights sleep I felt much better but will settle for a core session tonight instead - in the warm and dry!
No miracle recovery. I was a bit underwhelmed by the chiropractor. I have a sports massage booked tomorrow anyway so I'll ask her to focus on my back, neck and shoulders instead of my legs. I need this fixed because I've got a concert this Saturday and another next Wednesday with a few rehearsals to go to in between!
Oh crikey Jools! I was expecting you to say thet clicked something back into place and everything is fine now. Maybe it could be good news and be muscular rather than structural then? Not good, either way, with the upcoming concerts. Hope the sports massage has better results.
I think Jools dodgy neck (get well soon) sounds more painful than Scoobys injection in the ballbag unless the doc also caught the nads by mistake. Although I would imagine it looks visually horrifying.
Three injections in your big toe, now that is the mother of all pain!!
Joolska, apologies for putting your neck and Scoobys scrotum in the same sentence.
Jam and peanut butter on toast is rather quite nice and much nicer than on a sarnie me thinks, but you need two.
Jools - hope the neck gets sorted.
No 6 am run for me this am as the missus has developed labyrinthitis which means she is out of the game and the kids duties are inherited by me. I did manange a pleaseant 6 miles last night at ave of 8.15 with a heartbeat ave of 131. Comparing the stats with sundays post beer run I was over 20s a mile faster with an average hb of over 10 less which means that through empirical analysis I can conclude that a pint of Timothy Taylor costs you 5s per mile over a 12 mile run for the same effort, and 8 pints costs you 40s
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Moof - That made me chuckle - but not the part about 3 needles in your big toe. That made me whince!!!
Mennania - no TT after a few TT's then! I think you need to test your theories a little more. Is the detioration linear or exponential. I think you need to experiment having had one pint leading all the way up to 8 pints over the coming weeks. In the name of science of course!
Thanks for that scrote refernce Dr Moof. Glad I've already had my breakfast.
Can't say I fancy the idea of a jam and peanut butter combo, but jam and Philadelphia is rather nice.
Out of the house at 5.xx this monring (well 5.50!) for a quick 6 and a little bit miles - same run as yesterday, but in reverse. Also happens to be one of the stretches of the 3 Mole Hills run on Sunday, so good prep. Raining to start with so a good baptism for my new running jacket.
Talking of rain, anyone else fancy a run through the mud and waist high water at the Brutal 10 on 8 Dec?
Thanks for all the birthday wishes BTW - I'm now officially in the 45-54 demographic group!!!
What is this "Running on Air" thing all about.I have a special system where unused energy is stored in the legs and liver, and I'm forced to use thay. I think Sweatshop sell them if you are looking for a Christmas Present.
First run into double figures since mid September (apart from the double marathon week). I've been running 2 mile loops from my door, quiting when my injuries start to play up. Only managed a max of 5 to 6 miles in the last month pain free . Today was 11 comfortable miles. Hopefully this signals the end of the most boring period of running to date and I can get out to some better scenery.
This injection talk is making me uncomfortable
Also-ran - that sounds like very good news. Well done on sticking at it. Must be good for mental strength though!
Work is so boring today. No clients in so paperwork, paperwork and more paperwork. I feel like sticking those needles in my eyes! Should have gone for a run this morning.... at least I would have accomplished something!