RW Forum Six - Sub 3:30



  • xpost AA: image    poor you image   hope they can find out exactly what it is and if it's a stress fracture you should get over it with a few weeks of rest. Fingers crossed for you.

  • AA - Good luck with the consultant for a prognosis.

    Chick - Seeing the surgeon on Thursday, for removal of stitches, but still another 3wks  of immobility before any physioimage.

  • AA - fingers crossed you find the cause and the cure. A stress fracture at least is treatable with rest.

    Simon - that is really an epic injury, speed to recovery. The GB team really was sh!t, Wiggo just doesn't have the bottle to do any descending in the wet it appears. Mind you did you see Uran's cartwheeling crash - he was lucky that wasn't over an edge!

    Barry - hope you have recovered from Berlin 

    Minni - Great result - fantastic backdrop for the presentation as well image But the sub 90 remains elusive - do you think you might have gone out too quickly - that is surely faster than 10K PB pace? 

    kfc - yeah +1 with carrot - you just need to rest up now for the mara

    Spoons - at least it was sub-4! 

    O4S - sounds like a glamorous course image Congrats on the county bragging rights

    Shildon - at least you have kept at least some of your powder dry

    Carrot - that looks like an excellently executed LR. Nicely set up for the Dam

    2old - yeah I am looking at some offroad duathlons - liking the look of the grizedale duathlon in April.


  • 2Old2Old ✭✭✭

    Simon- sorry to see you're still in pain hopefully you'll be back on your bike soon. 

    AA- bit worrying about your foot. Have you tried total rest at all ? Being injured is such a drag. Hope its nothing serious 

    Spoons - good coaching of your GF there. you've got a solid base for the next round of marathon training

    shild- our bodies have a way of telling us to stop as I know too well at the moment. You've reminded me I have a Coniston place from the postponed march race. Isn't it on the Saturday. I know I won't be doing it though

    O4S - really chuffed for you. All the summer cycling is paying off. Podiums and no injury - perfect 

    Carrot- aren't you now tapering for Amsterdam ? What do they put in their energy gels?

    Ant- once got lost in Grizedale and had to be shown how to get out by two Japanese tourists on mountain bikes 

    KFC- nothing wrong with that Tri- decent run too after all that went before. I agree do some MP runs- not too long- and you're in with a good shout for your target time

    minni- your last few HMs have been similar times- did that happen before you dropped to 91/92 mins? It's what happened with me then the time dropped again unexpectedly. It will happen and in the meantime bask in the glory of your bling and fast times anyway 

    Chick- how's the back today ?


     Fleetwood Mac were amazing and worth waiting to see them nearly 35 years.. Gulp!

    have been limping since my run yestrday so pretty down about it. Had hoped to do our local 10k on Sunday - no chance -. Seeing Physio tomorrow but may need referral to a  psychiatrist if things ccarry on like this



  • hm - bits of my previous post seem to have disappeared ... image

    I'm sure I congratulated KFC on another tri and said chill now. I'm sure the tris will stand you in good stead for the marathon. FWIW - I started mine at 3:20ish pace, couldn't hold it, dropped down to 8mm at some point and still got a 3:24. You never know - you may have a cracker of a day. Nothing ventured, nothing gained image

  • xpost 2old: sorry you are limping again image  first time I drove into work again. Using the clutch hurts but with clenched teeth its ok. Back very stiff this morning, so no running but I will do a bit of shuffling when I get back home tonight.

  • What has happened to Barry?! Come on...

    AA, Simon, 2Old, Chick - sorry to hear about the injury woes. Wishing you all a speedy recovery.

    Minni and O4S - congrats on your first places!

    Spoons, well done on your marathon, and even more well done to your GF.

    Shildon, sorry your HM didn't go to plan and your tri too kfc - still sounds like a decent performance to me.

    Well, the house move went to plan on Friday, so been a busy weekend, but still managed to squeeze in a YKW at Ilford again on Saturday. 19:22 for 4th place out of 160 (and 1st over-30!) so pretty pleased with that, especially as I was knackered after moving on Friday and had to run all but the first k on my own, and feeling ready for a sub-40 attempt next weekend.

  • 2Old2Old ✭✭✭

    Daren- cracking YKW - and a podium keeping up the high standards of this thread 

    chick- thought you were driving with a crutch and then reread cluimprov getting there

  • Daren:  I reckon I could manage a sub 40 YKW image.  I am guessing I have missed the fact that you are doing a 10k next week.  Hope you enjoy the new house!

    ((( ))) to all on the injury bench

  • MinniMinni ✭✭✭

    AA - image  but a stress fracture will heal.  Keep up the cross training and you'll be ready for marathon training.

    Barry - where are you??????

    Daren - great YKW!

    Ant - did I go off too fast? image  I think not.  My 10k pb pace is 6:53 but that was from April, a more recent 10k had me running at 7:08 pace.  But my HM 2 weeks ago was 6:58 pace.  This HM was flat compared to any of those three so I felt it was ok.  It certainly felt right at the time.  I just think the wind was too strong for me to run a faster pace against, especially over a couple of miles.  But its knocked my confidence again. I've entered another half at the end of Octber.  The work continues....   (there has never been much between my 10k and HM pace and sometimes I've set a 10k PB within a HM so then they have been the same!!)




  • Minni - I was referring to the first 2 miles that you posted as 6:39 and 6:43. They will feel easy at the beginning of the race, but are both faster than your 10K PB pace. I am in a similar time boat to you - and for my sub 90 attempt in Nov, I think I will try and keep my first couple of miles at 6:50-6:55, even if that is below required target pace, it will hopefully allow me to pace the race better. Just a thought, like.

  • MinniMinni ✭✭✭

    yeah I know what you're saying but they were similar to the first few miles of the GNR where I finished a minute quicker. 

  • 2Old2Old ✭✭✭

    Ant/ Minni- on the pace debate- when I did my HM earlier this month I did the early part of the run with a sub1.30 pacer but he was about 10-15 secs too fast and after the first 3 miles I let him go I but I reckon it took just a little bit too much out of me to make up so I missed the target by 7 secs. when it is finely balanced those early miles can make the difference. Interestingly my HM pace was only about 3 secs slower than the 10k a few weeks before that 

  • 2old - very interesting. I had a quick look back at the GNR reports and saw that Carrot said that she did a 7mm average for the first 3 miles and she smashed 1:30. All grist for the mill image

  • 2Old2Old ✭✭✭

    Ant- maybe there's something in this-- are you going to put it to the test ? There's no doubting the temptation to get caught up in the surge at the  start. I tried to avoid it by going with the pacer but that did not work. However you probably then need to trust doing a negative split ...hmm. Might look back at some of my races 

  • interesting indeed - the few HMs which I loved because I got massive PBs were all negative splits (something that I still have to replicate in a marathon...)

    the best HM to date from April was a naked run as I'd killed my Garmin that morning so unfortunately no splits but I remember letting a faster group of girls go because I felt they were just a teensy bit too fast and I ended up running with a slightly slower group of guys until about half way. Then I reeled in a few of those girls that had gone off too fast image. Felt strong all the way to the finish.

  • Gutentag, tried to post from mobile but no good.  Been drowning sorrows/numbing pain at Oktoberfest with Pink.  Race did n't go to plan but really good weekend otherwise, will post race report tomorrow when back in uk.

  • I have certainly reaped the benefit of running without a garmin recently - running by feel and not getting obsessed with pace seems to suit me and I thin yesterday was the first negative split I have ever achieved

    Barry:  glad to hear you have been enjoying Oktoberfest - even if it isn't actually October yet!

  • MinniMinni ✭✭✭

    Barry - glad you've checked in!  Sorry to hear your race didn't go to plan but glad you've partied! Update us tomorrow. 

  • ((Barry)) looking forward to the report.

    Oktoberfest is always in September ... logic isn't exactly our forte ...
  • Sorry it didn't go to plan Barry, that's still a decent time to be fair if it didn't go to plan!  Enjoy Oktoberfest, I've been reminiscing all weekend about how good a time we had in Berlin last year.

    That's a long time to wait to find out AA, have they said it might be a stress fracture?

    Well done on yet another marathon Spoons, and congratulations to you GF on her new PB image

    2old you must be thoroughly fed up image

    Take care with that back Chick, driving doesn't sound like much fun image

    Looks good for your 10K next weekend Daren, well done on the speedy YKW after a busy moving day! House moves are knackering.

    Internet radio in the middle of the night Simon? Lots of phone ins?  Hope you sleep better tonight.

    Ant of the two HMs I've done this autumn the one where I set off slower that my eventual average pace was without a doubt the most comfortable, the most enjoyable and the quickest.  Conditions on the day do contribute - the first was hot and windy, with a headwind for the last horrible 3 miles.  The second was a point to point course with a very favourable tailwind.  I'll post splits for both soon....


  • Fleetwood HM - garmin measured 13.1 miles exact :

    1 - 6:45  tailwind
    2 - 6:53  tailwind
    3 - 6:51  tailwind
    4 - 7:09  headwind
    5 - 7:06  cross / headwind
    6 - 7:13  headwind
    7 - 7:28  head / tailwind
    8 - 7:18  tailwind
    9 - 7:19  tailwind
    10- 7:21 tail / headwind
    11- 7:34 headwind
    12- 7:29 headwind
    13- 7:09 headwind
    0.1 0:34 (5:46) tailwind

    GNR - garmin measured 13.18:

    1 - 6:47
    2 - 7:12
    3 - 6:58
    4 - 7:09
    5 - 7:06
    6 - 6:32
    7 - 6:24
    8 -  6:25
    9 - 6:51
    10- 6:38
    11- 6:44
    12- 6:50
    13- 6:35
    .18 1:08 (6:24) 
    Don't remember much about the wind apart from the feeling of it behind me on the odd occasion. 

    Fleetwood is very flat but as it's on the coast it can be a bugger in the wind, as I discovered last month!!

  • kfc.kfc. ✭✭✭

    Barry - look forward to hearing all about it, warts and all

    Shildon - its rubbish to have to DNF, sounds like the right decision though.  

    Sweet 21 carrot

    Sounds like I wasnt the only one shuffling yesterday spoons!  Congrats to your GF for her pb - GFA now?

    Simon, ant - it was a crazy road race eh?  I still think its kind of amazing that its getting coverage in the UK at all.  Shame the womens coverage still isnt even token.

    AA - oh no.  At least if thats it you'll know what it is.

    Nice YKW Daren 


    For HMs, I definitely run faster times when I start steady and negative split.  If I run too fast early miles I blow up and start going backwards at about 10M.  The first time I forced myself to hold back it was a revelation to still feel strong in the last few miles.

    Thanks for the thoughts on the marathon.  Yep, I'm going to focus on MP work over the remaining 2 weeks, but I've consistently come up short trying to run MP on tired legs, so I'll also need to get my head around having a tough day out!

  • Carot - Late night talk shows are on normal radio. On tuneIn radio app, you can listen to any genre of music from anywhere in the world, and record it too, it's brilliant. Eg there's a radio station called powerage, which only plays AC/DC. Or for 2old, Raven radio, that only plays Fleetwood Mac ....awesome 

    Ant - Yes Yrans crash was epic.

    KFC - Bbc did have 2hrs of the women's race on the Saturday! 

  • Hello all,

    Finally back in the UK after a late flight last night. I'm now over tired after 3 hours sleep.

    Minni - Barry was ok & did say he would check in when he could! As you can appreciate, not easy to find internet access & posting from mobile wouldn't work.

    It was my first ever trip to Germany & Berlin & we had a fantastic time. I can only comment as a spectator but the Marathon was incredibly well organised. I saw Barry finish & had no problem meeting up with him in the family reunion area after.

    It was a little emotional as his race didn't go to plan but I thought he did brilliantly considering that he has struggled with an injury. Obviously I know Barry very well, & I also know that he can be a little too hard on himself when he needn't be!

    He definitely did us all proud.

    Spent the rest of the time doing tourist things as we were there for 5 days & also joined in with the Oktoberfest as a few beers did Barry the world of good. image

    Back to work for me today. Will read back later but well done to all those who ran at the weekend.



  • MinniMinni ✭✭✭

    Yes pinklady it was to let Barry know we were thinking about him!!!  I can't do right for doing wrong!! 


  • That was not the case Minni as I took it you were worried by the way you wrote the post - we knew you were all thinking of him!

  • Barry - sorry it didn't go to plan. But least you can always say you ran in a world record breaking race image haille broke it when I ran Berlin. And I was in Paula's tooimage

    2old - killer hey - and so frustrating. image

    both my HMs this year where I ran 1:30 and 1:29 I ran nakedimage just saying!! My garmin buggered up. 

    Ref my possible stress fracture - saw my physio at my local 10k on Sunday and she's been on a clinic that week and was gonna ring me. Said I'm presenting all the signs of a stress fracture in the heel and researched it when I got home. Identical. Problem is I'm on my feet all day long. Looks like rehab is crutches image gonna go on as normal until I see the specialist on oct 16th. 

  • KFC - yes she got GFA although she dislikes VLM almost as much as I do!

    AA - sorry to hear of your woes. If it is a stress fracture - how long is the rehab / recovery time?

  • Tempo run last night with the club, which was not what my weary legs wanted image  Managed to hang on to the faster pace group that I re-joined last week, but it was a close thing. Recovery run or day off today I think.

    Simon: those British cyclists need to come on one of our holidays, that would teach them to be such wimps image.  Hope the daytime TV hasn't frazzled your brain too much yet and that you have managed to get some sleep

    2old: Fleetwood Mac sounds brilliant, which is more than can be said for your achilles woes.  Hope things start to improve soon

    AA: that is really weird given you were doing less running and lots of swimming and cycling, which wouldn't put pressure on the heel in the same way.

    Spoons:  sub 4 is still sub 4 and you obviously hung back to let the GF win, the same as I did at VLM this year to give BA his moment of triumph image

    Minni: if you were running at my pace in the HM you could probably have found a well built guy and tucked in behind for the headwind section - at your speed nobody is well built......................Great time in those conditions

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