RW Forum Six - Sub 3:30



  • old4speedold4speed ✭✭✭


    I couldn't manage a single mile under 9.15 and averaged 9.38, although it was 9.32 until I hit the headwind in the last few miles. Now I can barely walk and am in real pain, off to the Osteopath tomorrow to see if I have actually pulled the hamstring or it is all back related. Either way I won't be running for a while and VLM isn't looking good, especially as I haven't managed too complete a 20 mile run yet (off road ultras don't really count). At least Kiwi coming off the bench will leave a bit of space.

    Minni: why are you so clean in that XC pic??????

  • col.col. ✭✭✭

    O4S - hopefully the back and hamstring can be quickly sorted

    FRC - good recovery from the marathon

    Carrot - brilliant 10k time especially a few days after 15m with 10 at MP

    Simon - good long run. Excellent news on the achilles

    Barry - sorry to hear the calf is still not right

    Chickadee / 2old / Daren - fast long runs from you all

    Freemers- fantastic 20m race. Looking good for VLM

    AA - 1:32 is a great time for a half!

    Kiwi - great news that you are running again

    Ant - 2 good sessions from you. 6m is more than enough for a LT run. Your long run pace looks spot on to me.


  • 2Old2Old ✭✭✭

    AA-dont see anything wrong with that HM bearing in mind the wind, your injury and poor training conditions.If its any consloation I ran VLM in 3.14 after a HM in the time you did on Sunday and my HM was windfree.Be positive.

    Simon-that long run mustr have given you confidence for Manchester , a couple more and you'll be fine

    Free-nice cash win there-better than any bling. Cant believe you are thinking ofa 21 mile race so soon before VLM even if its only a progressive run ...I am too much of a coward to risk it

    Kiwi-great news , phase your running in gently

    Chick-Im of the same view about doing a 20 mile race though Im tempted by one the week after next but that then raises the question of whether I should do Liverpool HM the week after.I will probably stick with the plan

    Barry-good to see the calf was ok after the bike ride-what else have you planned for the taper?

    Minni-quietly banked a XC and 20 this weekend -well done.

    O4S-Fingers crossed for a quick recovery.Rest is probably the best idea rather than  a low key LR . If you can sort this out quickly surely you'll be ok for VLM with the time on your feet in those ultras and other runs and cycling. Rest fix it and be there!image. I do wonder i back probs become a greater risk the more people race

    Daren- did you build up to the 60or just do it? Anyway once you are comfrtable with 60 you'll e doing 70 plus-look at Chick

    Ant-Your training is righton the money-and no question of walking the fine line between fitness and injury

    Did my 'I dont want to do that session' -warm up followed by 3.5k at 10k pace(6.26), short recovery, 4k at just over HM pace(6.48), short recov, 5k at a 10 secs above MP(7.06), cool down. Glad to get that done as I was looking at my March schedule feeling a bit daunted.

  • old4speedold4speed ✭✭✭

    2old: back problems are more likely the more you run on hard surfaces, not specifically racing. However mine are due to that, plus the fact that my hips are not aligned properly. My right hip naturally rolls forwards when I am standing and puts undue pressure on the left side. My left leg is significantly bigger and the muscles on the LHS of my body much stronger than on the right - my back can't cope. My orthotics help, but better posture 40 years ago is probably the only thing that would have sorted it!  

    kiwi: thanks for keeping the bench warm, hope the return to running goes smoothly 

    Barry: hope the calf is settling down

  • PinkladyPinklady ✭✭✭

    Good race report Freemers  image

    AA your splits were good so don't be too down stay positive

    Worried about Barry's calf as Barcelona is getting closer but we will see what happens (sad face).

    Chick nice long run there & from you as well 2old

    Had a rest day today. Looked at going out early tomorrow but have decided to wait until lunchtime - yes the hills are calling! image


  • 2Old2Old ✭✭✭

    O4S- that's a complex physiology ,at least understanding the biomechanics gives you a good start to fixing it. 

    Did a bit of spinning and a couple of miles for recovery tonight 

  • 2nd lady, well done Freemers!

    O4S -my corner of the injury bench has been gathering cobwebs, i've occupied it that long! hope your back comes right.

    Mini hadn't thought about spinning aggrevating tge knee.. did work out tho that all my injury woes started the season i played netball!

  • MinniMinni ✭✭✭
    (((O4S))) you could do without this. Sorry to hear you're in so much pain. Do you think your shorter, faster races have aggravated it? My left hamstring hurts constantly but I seem to fe able to keep it under control - for now.

    Yes, it was quite a dry XC on Saturday!! There were a couple of muddy patches but only a few steps. I love the XC!
  • MinniMinni ✭✭✭
    Xpost Kiwi - the reason I asked was because I found it hurt my knees a bit. Netball has a lot of twisting and sharp turning.
  • Freemers scorching 20 miler. All set for VLM.

    AA 1:32 and not happy? Excellent time in tough conditions, strong stuff.. Carrot great 10k also.

    Simon good confidence boost the 16 miler.

    Good 22s by 2old Daren and Chic. Is 22 the new trendy session?

    Chic I await to see what you call mega mileage. 90-100m?

    2old. I clock you doing a 3:20-25 marathon if you had done the full distance. Just sayingimage

    O4S hope the back sorts itself out.

    15 miles trail Saturday, then Sunday marshalled club race, friends chose to do 8 miles there/ 6 mile race/ 8 miles back for a pesky 22m. I joined them for the 8 miles back, since sausage butties at the end. image

    Nasty session today with GB athlete (bbc2 at world champs this Friday) franken hills, the worst bits of 3 hard sessions spliced together. 2 miles warm up, 2 back, 4 miles + of tough hills long and short all flat out. Tapering. image
  • FreemersFreemers ✭✭✭
    I think 22 must be trendy FRC, that's what I am doing on Sunday image Sounds like you are getting some great sessions in with your GB guy - and thanks for the reminder about the world champs starting Friday. I'll watch some of it I expect, which event is he in (3000m I think you said?)

    2old - you got that session nailed! Any problems with the achilles?

    An easy 6 for me this morning - calves feel tight so got on the foam roller too, but apart from that I feel quite fresh which is good image
  • 2Old2Old ✭✭✭
    Minni- I'm with you on impact type sports not being a good idea on top of running. My patella tendinitis was set off playing tennis during a taper. Mrs 2O isn't very happy as it means I won't play her very often and she likes to beat me. I guess netball has similar jarring effects from the sudden movements involved like in tennis. I've been getting tightness in my right glute which coincides with tightness in my. right Achilles . They must be connected. Any ideas? What do you do to keep the hammy in order?

    FRC- yes I thought that if I carried on my LR to 26.2. I usually do at least one 22 mile run ideally a good time from the race to allow full recovery . It's more for psychological reassurance than anything else . Interesting running regime by you - very different from what most here are doing. Is it of your own design or planned by a coach ? Running with these top racers must be benefiting you a lot. I've got a similar hill session to do tomorrow all being well but on my own which I'm not looking forward to.
  • old4speedold4speed ✭✭✭

    Minni:  I'm afraid it is marathon training that does for my back - it is the same every year as my Osteo was able to confirm when he saw me in February.  He pointed out that he hadn't seen me since the last  VLM campaign and prior to that it was the 2012 campaign.  I'll see what he says today but I'd rather give up on marathons and be able to race shorter distances and pootle round ultras, rather than end up unable to run at all.  I will still do VLM but BA might find himself with a pacer.........image

    How much does divorce cost these days............................????????

  • MinniMinni ✭✭✭
    2old - I'm very good at stretching and rolling now and although it's taken ages to get into the habit it's almost part of my routine now. I can't imagine it ever being painfree but it doesn't really get so sore I can't run. The joys of getting old. image

    O4S - I've been thinking a lot about your back etc and thinking that there could be a lesson in there for all of us. So what do we do? Consider a few years down the line looking back and wishing we'd backed off the racing and marathon training.... Will it make us do that now? I think not. We never take the easy road.

    I'm in York while miss Minni has a Uni interview and did a lovely 12 miles along the river and pathways around York. Flat and traffic free - what a treat! Avg 7:37 with the last mile at 7:03. image
  • chickstachicksta ✭✭✭

    Wow Minni - what a brilliant run. That would be my MP image.

    FRC: sounds a toughie, that hill sesh. Well, I did 81 miles last week (was quite surprised when I found out - I thought I'd done 70ish but somehow it ended up being a tad more ...) that wasn't exactly mega yetimage   I think your ballpark of 90-100 sounds about right image

    sorry to hear about your continued back woes, O4S. Do you know what it is?

  • Minni -  Strong 12 miler. Looks very  good conditions to be running in.

    2old - Nice session.  Not sure what my plans are for the next week or so, apart from a long run on the 16th "wink face", hopefully will be able to attempt a run by the end of this week.

    O4S - Rubbish news about your injury, forget about Mo and the rest running VLM the cameras should  follow you and BA. image

  • Minni - hope she gets on ok. Sounds like a lovely run. It's all coming together at the right time for you image

    chick - 80 miles? Fantastic!

    FRC - what's your taper for?

    barry - really hope you get some improvement when you try a run. 

    O4S - look after your back (())

    i did the old trendy of 5 miles today. Legs still a bit mashed. I'm feeling a bit more positive today. Scot Overall won Reading in 1:04 and that's 2 mins slower than the normal finish time. Anyway onwards and upwards and back into training again now. 

  • 2Old2Old ✭✭✭

    Minni-that was a fast MLR-feeling confident?You should. Enjoy York though that run will have put a smile on your face. Ive never got into foam rollering though I am doing a fair few  squats and stretches during the week.My spinning session last night seemed to help...maybe my quads need strengthening

    Chick-huge week for you there and no niggles.Well done .I only managed 63 but I did only run 5 times and one day was a double ....though the total was 76 over 7 days if you include last Sunday as I rested this Sunday.( How to manipulate the figures!image)Cant see me doing much more this week either

    Barry-that race is sneeking up on us and especially you . It will be interesting to see how the long taper you are having works out. Im coming to the view that that its not vital to do much in the last two weeks .

    O4S-I think you might suprise us all a VLM.Are you still cycling with that back injury? Silly question I expectimage

    MLR and pancakes tonight..hopefully not at the same timeimage

    My Liverpool HM no arrived today image

  • old4speedold4speed ✭✭✭

    Just back from Osteo - back not as bad as feared, but have a hamstring tear to compensate for any disappointment on the back front

    Minni:  none of you need to change - don't forget I started running in the 70s, when orthotics, gait analysis and decent running shoes were still unheard of.  That was going on 40 years ago - and I sort of doubt that many of you will still be doing the mileage we all do when you have been at it for 40 years [except for 2old who probably has been doing it for that long image

    2old:  I have been told cycling is fine, I had a bike made to measure knowing my back problems and I can do over 100 miles a day on consecutive days with no issue at all

    Barry: cameras following BA and me round VLM would be taking reality TV to new depths........................

    Looks like Rhayader 20 on Saturday will have to be binned image

  • O4S - that sounds better newa. How long you have to rest your hammy for? 

    2old - when's Liverpool half? 

    New 5k and 10k pb set for me at Reading... 21:42 & 41:58 shame I died at 10k!

  • 2Old2Old ✭✭✭

    AA- the HM is on 23rd. Good to see you a lot more positive. Those pbs  are fast , I guess maybe the wind and a little shortage of endurance following your injury took its toll. You should sort that out over the next few weeks with a few more LRs. 

    O4S - that tear doesn't sound ideal- where and how is it fixed? Always impressed by your cycling Which must keep your endurance in good shape . That 20 sounds hilly so best binned 

    MLR done . Second run of the year back in shorts image.Started off warm but went cold when the sun set and wind picked up . Quite a hilly route averaged 7.23mm  over 14 miles and all but 2 of the miles under 7.30 mm ,the slow 2'were first mile warm up and the 11th,a mile climb 


  • old4speedold4speed ✭✭✭

    2old: the tear appears to be behind my left knee at the hamstring insertion - but it hurts all the way up the hamstring, over the glutes and in to the lower back. Basically I just hurt. Will probably lose a couple of weeks of training at least and even then will have to come back gently, so may not manage a 20 before VLM. BA is a bit worried at my offer to pace him - can't imagine why image

    Have just been told that the people we are buying the new house off want to complete in the first two weeks of April - I suppose we should have guessed image

    AA: great times at Reading, just shows you still have the speed, just need it to go a bit longer and plenty of time to sort that.

    Minni: has Miss Minni decided where she wants to go as first choice?

  • PinkladyPinklady ✭✭✭

    Minni nice 12 miles there. York is lovely

    O4S Sorry to hear that resting may help

    AA Great Reading times there. Your sounding more positive. How's the legs?

    2old Sorry but what's a MLR? Weather was nice for shorts today

    3 miles of hills at lunchtime today & the weather was really lovely & yes I thoroughly enjoyed it. image

    Disappointed that the Castle to Castle run is already full & the entries only opened on Saturday. So I'm on the waitlist (sad face)

    I am however taking part in the WRAFS Charity Tour which starts in June in Scotland & finishes in September in Stafford at the National Arboretum. There are various dates that are available to join in so at the moment I am looking at running possible 10 miles for them but not sure which leg yet as feasibly there are 3 counties I can take part in.

  • O4S - ouch. Healing vibes.

    Minni - watch that your hamstring doesn't turn into a chronic tear. Fab pace for an MLR - you're turning into 2oldimage

    Did my 5x1000m session today, preceded by a 4M warm up - 6:40 average on the 1000m, which is pretty much on the money.

    So we are getting scarily close to D-Day now. Anyone settled on a target yet? I am pretty sure that I am going to go for sub 3:20, but plan on confirming that with my 20M race this weekend (12M@MP) and hopefully a parkrun closer to the marathon. 

  • MinniMinni ✭✭✭
    AA - you now have a 10k and HM time I'd kill for!

    Ant - I've had this hammy for so long now (about 2 years) and seem to know how to play it.

    Ooh time to start thinking targets! Similar, I'm going for 10 miles at MP this weekend and might see if I can ramp it up a bit towards the end. That'll give me more of an idea.

    O4S - no not yet. This was her second interview and she has a third in two weeks time but is still waiting to hear from her favourite, so no offers yet. It's highly competitive with so few places so she may not have much of a choice. Today she was told they had 1400 applicants and short listed 120 for interview for the 20 places.
  • 2Old2Old ✭✭✭

    Pink- mlr - medium long run. Should be run at LR pace but in my and others case ........' What the hell' ! shame about missing the entry but the relay sounds fun

    Minni- what are you mulling over.. 7.15 mm? You can't be far off ..if not faster .The spinning I did last night seemed to help my right Achilles/glute/ hammy. Not sure I can do 20k of it too often and run though 

    Ant- spot on fast intervals. You should have 3.20 as a B target 



  • FreemersFreemers ✭✭✭
    It's always good to mull over target paces! At the moment I'm thinking 7.20s and see if I can hang on - it would give me a couple of minutes spare for sub 3.15 and I'll probably need them...but with 5 and a bit weeks to go things can still change.

    AA - nice PBs!

    O4S - sounds painful...not ideal preparation, but at least you have a good idea of what the problem is. And surely your injury means you can't possibly help out with any of the packing up of your old house?image
  • MinniMinni ✭✭✭
    2old - no way! At the moment I'm thinking low 7:20s but I'll see how things feel over the next few weeks.

    These marathons have come around fast in the end!
  • 2old - if I get sub 20 (or close) in a warm up 5K I will consider going faster than 7:35 for the marathon, but at the moment I think I will be sticking with that. Things can change natch. What about you?

  • 2Old2Old ✭✭✭

    Ant-not sure, this time last year I would have said 7.10-7.15 pace but Im aware of the effects of not running much from April on and even though Ive done a lot since January, I think that gap will tell. If I was put on the spot I would say -'A' target sub 3.15, 'B' target sub 3.20(VLM GFA) but I would like to beat my last Boston time of 3.11 which is near my PB of 3.09 .So there you have it, lots to go for with a range of 11 mins. My HM in a few weeks may guide me too.Why give a short answer when theres a long one?image

    Minni-Free-you are both well capable of smashing 3.15 , you just have to believe it.

    O4S-moving house is always a pain in the butt so you can add that discomfort to your hammy and maybe it will take your mind of it too. BA should be thrilled to have a pacer...will you carry a sign on a stick so he wont lose you?

    Bit short of time today so wondering if I will get any running done today

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