RW Forum Six - Sub 3:30

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  • Barry- you wouldn't have thought San Domenico took place in a valley in South Wales famous for its mines ,choirs and sheep . Back running I see 

    O4S- great way to win a prize and revive your flagging confidence for VLM.  Well run and won !I've run a bit of the Taff trail but that was for about. 6 miles into Cardiff where I once lived. 

    FRC - exciting race for you . I reckon the I would have been nearer 1.26 without the wind like last year. 

    Chick-Stick to your Boston target though where there are hills there are downhills too so the last 4 miles is pretty much all down or flat so you could give it a blast if you've left enough in the tank . 2 more 20's ? One 20 and an18 left for me. 

    Daren - really enjoyed your report. Must do mine. 

    Free - you'll regret not doing the 0.2 

    i have a feeling Minni May be happier 

    resting - again ! today- though may go for a swim tonight 

    whose marathon is next?

  • Afternoon All,

    Now that i can at least walk again, i thought it about time to stop sulking, and stick my head above the metaphorical parapet to see how everyone is getting on, and also get some much needed motivation to get my fat lazy arse back in the gym!

    Some great half times from Daren & Col amongst others.image

    Sorry to hear about the various niggles and injuries although there's still plenty of time left, and as i'm sure has been said before, all the hard work has now been done.

    Looking forward to watching the annual "taper meltdown" ritual from afar! image

     

  • Woosh big catch up.  The great thing about not running a long run at the weekend was I have a chance to do lots of family stuff.  I was reading yesterday but couldn't find time to get on the computer to comment.  It was very exciting reading, I can tell you.

    Wow, how many sub 90's at the weekend?!! image

    2old - 89:02 in that wind is pretty awesome.  You must be very pleased with that and its always nice to win a prize too. 

    Daren - really good to see you nail that fantastic time.  86:37 is serious stuff.  Very well done.

    Chick - that sounds like a brilliant time on a tough course.  I'd take that any day.  What a strange prize?  Its not like any winners are going to need gym membership!  Don't let yesterday's time knock your confidence for the marathon.

    Col - 89:00 eek, brilliant time but I bet you wish you were 1 second quicker!  Well done.

    O4S - sounds like you held it together pretty well yesterday.  Really good time and a bottle of wine is always welcome.

    Pink - wow that's a great PB.  Sub 2 next time?

    Ant and Freemers - well done for getting those last long runs bagged.  Its always a nice feeling.

    KFC -  Reykajvik will be awesome.  Does the OH not fancy that too?

    AA - I always feel like that at the end of 800s!

     Kiwi - How are you going running wise?

    Oompa - get your fast lazy arse into gear!

    So, an odd weekend for me.  Saturday's 5 miles almost killed me but the plan was to do 12-14 @ MP at some point this week.  Decided to have my first attempt this morning as I have a sports massage booked tonight.  Imagine my surprise when I managed 13 miles @ 7:14!  Game (back) on!  image

  • Minni - that's fantastic! Any pain?
  • Minni-great news and a fast 13. Sometimes you just have to rest and do a few less racesimage. Hope you wont try and make up for last week . It wouldnt have been the same without you leading the team at VLM. Not sure if I get a prize as I left too soon.

    Oom-what Minni said!

  • Minni - Bloody hell, that's a fast MLR!image Are you now targeting sub 3.00? Good news that you're moving well again. Any pain/soreness? 

    2Old - Not exaggerating when i say that i'm only just able to walk, so i will now have at least a month of strengthening and weights as there's a lot of muscle wastage in my quads, so i decided that eating lots of sugary shite and drinking copious amounts of alcohol was the order of the day (3 months)!image

  • Oompa: I like your thinking! Hope you are soon back kicking arse rather than sitting on it!

    have decided to bin my recovery run today, hamstrings and glutes very achey although no sharp pain, which must be good (?)

    Minni: don't go mad, but sounding good

  • O4S: a PB, Fantastic!

    Darren: youre getting seriously quick

    Minni: ditto.

    A easy 6 for me today, would have liked more but no time. Felt seriously cold in the Easterly wind.

     

  • That's great news Minni - a cracking run!

  • O4S - The only arse i've ever kicked is my own!  Glad you've got no pain after your race... I'd give anything for a touch of DOMS at the moment though!image

  • Minni - fab news. So pleased for you!

    Oompa - good to see you back

  • Warwick HM Race report:

    Decided not to travel up the night before & stay with my folks as I knew it would be a late nigh so drove up on the morning instead.

    Headed to my sister's to park but the road was closed so parked 10 minutes walk away from the race course. The HM was organised by the BHF.

    There were plenty of loos & the bag drop was well organised. Went & warmed up & heard the tannoy to prepare for the start of the race. It started on the actual horse race track but the signage for the pens was not that great so I found the 2 -3 hour mark & just guessed where to stand. I started looking for any pacers but there were none so I knew that I would have to pace myself. Barry had also given me advice so I thought I would follow that.

    Took a gel just after handing in my bag. When the race started it took a while to get out as the pen was a bit tight & it didn't help that I was trying to get pass 4 women dancing around in front of me.

    Finally I was out & had a nice climb up a short hill on the main road then headed down towards the outskirts of the town. Another incline was waiting but I knew that there was a nice run down the other side. There were a lot of spectators out along the route as we headed into the countryside.

    I felt good most of the way & my mm was better than I'd thought. I was really determined to get to the 6 mile point in under the hour. Ran into the village of Leek Wootton & nice to see some of the police cadets out cheering us on - the training centre is nearby.

    Continued out around the country lanes & it did get a bit lonely & seemed to go on forever but I made it to 6 miles in under the hour. Continued on & took a gel at the 7mile point.

    Into country lanes again & up a couple of inclines & I did struggle on one of them. There seemed to be no noise apart from the odd one from the nearby rifle range.

    I was really pleased when we were heading into the village of Hatton as more spectators appeared & the atmosphere was really good. It was also the 10 mile point, the last water station. Headed into another country lane & into the village of Hampton on the Hill where there was a steep incline. This was 11 miles & I struggled a bit. Ran past a Llama farm & the road led to a nice bridge across the motorway. As I got to the end I saw the 1 mile left marker & surprised myself by picking up my legs more & ran for the finish. I was disappointed though to find there was no clock. Even though my Garmin said 2.09 I knew I was under that.

    Conclusion: A lovely well routed race but disappointed with the organisation of it. I actually felt that I ran it really well with more confidence than the previous HM.

    The weather was cold & windy but not blowing a gale. Looking at my splits I think that I should have pushed myself more in some places especially where I got a bit too comfortable. Official time 2.06.41 a PB as I knocked 3 minutes off my previous time. Decent goody bag & a BHF medal at the end. Should have collected a T shirt but couldn't be bothered to wait in the queue. Would I run it again? No if it is the BHF organising it.

  • Slightly off topic, thought I'd pop by and say hi. VLM2014 will be my first marathon, and I've been having trouble deciding what pace I should run the marathon at so came here for a bit of advice/reassurance. I've just skimmed through the first hundred pages or so of this thread, some cracking advice and improvement there! Great stuff Minni!



    Briefly, my story is that I started running at the start of last year, signed myself up for the Great South run, got put in for a VLM ballot place by a friend (as a bit of a joke at first), got in, so started taking running seriously. I ran my first half on Nov 17th (1:40:20) and was due to start P&D
  • Hi Pinklady, Sounds a nice course, just a pity about the organisation. It is certainly a nice part of the world. I lived in the South of Birmingham as a child and spent many weekends around that area. The Rotary club organise a Marathon and HM in Stratford-upon-Avon at the end of April, which I believe has a nice route and pretty flat I think.  

  • Ignore my last post.  For some reason half of it disappeared, and now I can't edit it either.  Was great to read Minni's story, I hope to be another person dragged through the 3:30 barrier off the back of that.

  • Minni - that's great news. 

    Pink - good report. Definitely sub 2 this year!

    jack -hello! In all honesty with a 1:40 half and a lack of experience running I think aiming for 3:30 might be a bit if an ask. How many 20 milers hav you done? How many miles a week do you do?

     

  • Morning AA. That was only half the story. Basically 2-3 weeks after that half I tore my calf, putting me out for 6 weeks right when I was due to start P&D up to 55.  I was up and running again 13 weeks from VLM so I started P&D up to 55 12 week plan and did my best to make up for lost time.  I didn't fully stick to the plan, I moved a couple of runs around to accomodate races etc but most of it done, and religiously did the long runs and midweek medium-longs.

    I ran 1:36:53 at Reading half 3 weeks ago, training peaked at 50 mpw, my 5 longest runs have been 17, 17, 19, 20, 20.5. My last 20 miler on Saturday I did 4 at LSR pace then 16 at 8 min/mi. I didn't have anything left in the tank at the end of that, but was trying to work out if a marathon was possible at that pace.

    The question is really, is the taper, fresh legs, and the fact it's a race going to be enough to crash out 26.2 at that pace. I've always raced so much quicker than I'm capable of in training, as I guess most do, but is a marathon a different animal in that sense because you don't actually train up to that distance? Any advice appreciated!

  • Minni I would love a sub 2 - mind over matter I think especially when the going gets tough. I have to have a word with myself & stick with it to keep going & not have an easy option. Great run there for you

    Oompa welcome back how are things with you?

    Nell Blue I grew up in Leamington & Warwick but left when I was 19. Definitely appreciate it more now as an adult & great to have had the opportunity to run there. I have a place for Stratford Upon Avon HM at the end of April.

    AA Hopefully if I knock loud enough sub 2 will let me in image

    Welcome Jack.

    Barry has his first swimming session with my coach this morning - fingers crossed all will go well & he'll go back! image

    Back on it this evening after resting yesterday. 4 weeks to next HM.

  • Hey Jack - welcome.  Looks like you are in the right ballpark for 3.30, but theres no guarantees in the marathon - especially your first!  I'd say what to do depends on your goal - is it more important for you to go for 3.30 or to have a good day out?  If the second you could try something more conservative; if the first, go for 3.30 - it looks like a challenging but achievable target and my view is that the risk of crashing and burning is always worth it for knowing that you tried!

    This is a useful predictor if you havent seen it before: http://www.mcmillanrunning.com/

     

    Good to hear from you oompa.  Hope you'll be keeping us up to date on your comeback.

    Good stuff minni.  Game on indeed.  BH thought about reykjavik but preferred something closer to home.  Would have meant we'd have had to bike tour out in iceland too and we decided we arent tough enough for that image

    Nice report pink.  

     

    Still full of cold.  The way i'm going I'm have a 2 month taper...  Gotta get myself ready for a lot of pain!

  • Col/ Daren/ 2Old- very speedy halves, congrats to all of you!image

    Pinklady- very well done on the pb. Sub 2h is calling!image

    Chick- good time in tough conditions. I know we all want to nail that last half before the big day but it doesn't always quite work out like that. Don't let it get to you and keep your eyes on what is the main target.

    O4S- great race report.

    FRC- well done on the league race.

    Oompa- welcome back.

    Minni- very speedy mp miles there... and it all sounds a lot more positive!image

    Jack- your half indicates that you should be able to get 3.30 but it won't be a walk in the parkimage. If I were you I would definitley give it a good bash! 16m @ your target mp will always feel hard in training so I wouldn't worry about that.

    I'm back in a full swing this week with a cheeky double today and a tempo runimage tomorrow.

  • Jack - welcome....I'm a wimp and would probably take the opposite view to kfc and Brolish, and go more conservatively for your first one. If you blow up @ 20 miles it is a long way to the finish and really hurts! But a 1.36 half is the right time you need for a go at 3.30, so it's up to you!



    My feet are hurting at the moment - the PF on the left (which has morphed into more general foot pain) and now my right big toe feels like its bruised. All manageable I think but I definitely need to get it sorted after VLM.



    Rest day today - did a 5 mile RR yesterday so starting the taper nice and gently image
  • Minni - Good news, minor wobble over, that's a very strong run.image

    2old - Yeah back running, enjoyed the week off but missed the exercise, I've got a marathon to train for.image

    Oompa -  welcome back, take your time and come back strong.

    Jack - Welcome, your Reading time indicates 3:30 is doable, but the important thing for the first one is to finish and hopefully without walking.  It is so easy come race day to set off too quick and for the wheels to come off after 20.

    Well my first swimming lesson today, I mentioned before Barca I needed to change my training cause I getting fed up with breaking down every mara campaign. My lesson confirmed that I need a lot of work.  Swimming coach asked if I was thinking of entering a tri, I said yeah if I could sort my swimming out, to which he replied don't enter one yet.image 

    So my new plan is to run 3 times a week max(sounds like furman but is n't) and concentrate on swimming with a some cycling thrown in and if I can sort my swimming out enter a tri later in the year along with doing more races. Not sure if this will help my running but I have to try something else.

     

     

  • Barry - I think that sounds like a good idea for you. As you say, you need to try something different, and maybe less running and more swimming/cycling will do the trick. It certainly can't hurt, and the less impact stuff has to be a good idea.
  • Welcome back Oompa.

    Welcome Jack. I'm with Freemers on this one. Your half time does suggest sub 3:30 is possible, although with your lack of running experience, far from a certainty. Knowing first hand how crashing and burning feels in a marathon, it's something I'd go out of my way to avoid (the experience was horrendous and put me off running another marathon for ages - that was three years ago and I've only now finally signed up for another one after constant bullying from this lot image). If you've got the running bug, there will be many more chances to push yourself to a fast time, but for the first one, I'd say try to enjoy the experience and not put too much pressure on yourself.

  • back in the game MInni.  waooo

  • Jack - welcome and thank you!  My opinion for what its worth:  1:36 is certainly the right kind of HM pace for a 3:30 marathon but the question is are you confident of your endurance?  Really the last 20 would have been better run slower rather that testing the water, this way you help that endurance and can test MP in shorter runs.  

    However, if you managed 16 at that pace then that's quite a good indicator that you perhaps could on the day.  The key thing is going to be not to go off too fast.  The last 6 miles of a marathon is where its happening and pushing too much in the first 20 will make that a very long and painful slog.  Pace it right and you can enjoy it right up to the line.

    The challenge of the marathon is not about racing to your fastest time its about getting everything just right and nailing it.

    Freemers - watch that foot.

    Today I have a sore throat!  This is almost laughable now.  7:14 pace is too fast for me for a marathon- definitely.  I'll be looking at low 7:20s, all being well, and hopefully squeeze under 3:15.

     

  • Thanks for your input everyone! This is exactly the 2 trains of thought I've been playing over in my head, it's a dilemma. I'm sure I'll do another marathon after this as I'll be wondering what's achievable with an injury-free 18 week program, and I'm still at the stage when my times are improving quickly just by adding mileage as it is. That said, I think I'd be a bit gutted if I plodded round in 3:40 and felt like I could've nailed my pre-injury target. Tough one! Maybe I'll see how I feel about it in a couple of weeks.



    I'll keep up to date on this thread, it's busy and it looks like you're all helping each other achieve some brilliant times!
  • Barry-good idea mixing up the disciplines though if you are like me you will always want to default to running. Watch the calf as you increase the cycling. Cant stay away from marathons can you? I struggle to do one a year and you shell them like peas

    Minni-Good plan for your marathon pace .Watch that sore throat. Taper niggle?

    Jack-looks like you have sub 3.30 in you .Be very disciplined with pace-stick religiously to 7.58 .You'll want to race off fast at the beginning and will pay for it later if you do. Really Minni said it all

    Free-taper niggles/madness playing tricks on you as expected

    Bro-a triple ?Thats one way to get going again I suppose

    KFC-a two month taper followed by a marathon will be an interesting challenge but youre up to it

    Not sure about today-MP session or intervals-after Sunday's HM probably MP.

  • Minni: Brilliant news and boy, wotta run!! So relieved to see you back in the game image

    Welcome Jack. Echo what the others said. Generally it's harder for boys to convert their HM times into decent marathon times. 3:30 is a tough one to crack and it took most of us more than one attempt to get there. Once it's done, the floodgates open though and there's no stopping you.
    Give 7:58mm a go - it may just work but don't be too disappointed if it doesn't as you have not been running that long yet and may lack a bit of endurance. No matter what you do, you are guaranteed a PB since it's your first marathonimage

    Pink: nice report and congrats again on the PB image

    Ouch, Free. Taper time soon, innit?

    Bro: hardcore triple run!! What's next for you? BTW, thinking about Seville for my spring marathon next year image

    Trendy 5 yesterday and today. 6x1k intervals tomorrow (green face). Would have skipped those if I'd raced my HM faster but since I have no DOMS there's no excuse, really image

  • It's not a triple!!! Lol- double today and a tempo run tomorrow!image

    Chick- Seville was great I would very much recommend it.

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