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RW Forum Six - Sub 3:30
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Life is getting in the way at the moment so not trying to keep up with the forums but good to see everyone getting on.
Chick - you are a HADD queen. I am thinking of doing done HADD style bars training. I have tried a Max HR test but I think it's a bit low so not sure if I put 100% in, although the pace would indicate so. If it is right it's giving me an easy running rate that is barely more than a walk. Does this sound right???
Hi all, good to see the thread busy again with some excellent training going on.
I haven't ran as still have a hamstring problem - seeing the physio next week so hopefully can run again. Been out on the bike which has been good. Managed 35 miles on Sunday which was great for me. Been very busy as we had to travel up north to sort funeral arrangements as my father has passed away.
Did manage to fit a swim in at the local pool to have a break from the running around. Barry doing really well now, I should get worried for the Tri. Only 3 weeks to go.
Minni-hope the rehab is going well.Doing your duathlon soon?
Pink-sorry the hammy is still troubling you but at least you are getting some cycling and swims done.If injury holds out the tri will be fine
Now Im streaming with cold again!!!
Dont think theres been a week this year when I havent coughed and sneezed.Think I need some sun.
oh, no 2old. Not another cold
Pink: Hope you can sort your hammy out with the help of your fizz. I am a big fan of trigger point release these days. Hurts like fck but keeps my hamstring niggle at bay.
No way! I just try to get back to normal fitness by doing 2 medium long runs per week plus something longish at the WE. The other days are short runs - trendy 5s mostly
I think the max. HR test is quite tough for people who've been doing proper training for a number of years and are generally aerobically quite fit. I found it easier (when fit) to run a race and just blast the final k like there's no tomorrow. Did that at the end of a 10 miler and at the end of a hilly 6k race. Both times I got HR figures that were about 10 beats higher than anything I tried on my own. So you could add 10 beats to your recent max. test and see how that feels in terms of slow run pace. There's also another guideline on the HADD forums that recommends 5k pace +3mins as your easy run pace. Maybe give that one a go? Even though you were injured I wouldn't think you'd run much slower than 9:30-10 mm.
Beautiful day here
Chick-even 9.30-10.00mm is tough to maintain for any length of time when you are used to faster paces.I guess other muscle groups must be involved and as I havent trained at that pace they and I arent comfortable. I would prefer run walk ,with the run at a faster pace.
100 lengths swum today.
Dunno, 2old. I never find it hard to run slow but bliddy hard to run fast
. I think it may be a girl thang though. I'm following tinyrunner's Forum 6 fred for sub 3:15 and she has no probs running slow if required (i. e. recovery sessions and medium long runs during the week) whereas the blokes on that forum do everthing at 7mm pace 
right now they are probably closer to 8:30 
but I'm not giving up just yet. My heart seems to be behaving rather well and I sincerely hope the meds continue to do their trick.
Minni may be used to running faster but don't forget that she's been injured and had quite a break so that HR approach may just do the trick. It takes about 4-6 weeks for the first "holy shit - I'm suddenly running 20 or 30 secs per mile quicker" moment. But they come and they come regularly if you stick with it. And if built from scratch faster running feels more natural. It's hard to describe but without the slow base fast stuff seems rather volatile and you never know how long you can hold on. A bit like driving a new high performance car where you can't yet trust the fuel gauge.
At the end of the day HADD isn't all about super slow running. Once you've managed a few 50 mile weeks all at an easy pace you introduce so-called sub-LT sessions where your run chunks at 80% of max HR. You build those but after a while they should be about 10 miles twice per week and they come pretty close to MP. About a year ago I did those at 7:20 pace
Another good double from me today
. 5 miles this morning middle 3 quick, splits 7:27,6:17,6:06,6:03, 7:24, think there maybe a 5k PB in there. Then pool this afternoon 2000m including 1400m pull buoy concentrating on lane position and then a few 100's all about 2:13 avg which is good for me. All going too well at the mo.
Chick - thanks for the explanation which makes sense to me. I really want to slow my long runs down but can't face another 20-30 mins out there. It's the progress up to the 10 milers which is interesting as many elite runners think quality 10 milers more important than MLRs for marathons and they seem to be the mainstay for other distances .I'm just not sure if I want to try to slow down to get faster at this late stage in my running career. Then again I do get injured a lot so maybe.
Barry- cracking 5and swim session. Tempted to do a YKW just to formalise a certain 5k pb?
I'm too tired after my swim to run tonight so I'll make do with the pub quiz instead .
Chick thanks. As I say I attempted the HR test last night. The highest I got it to was 167 on two stints of 0.3m. I ran about 6:40 pace for each and didn't expect them to be so fast, so that was a nice surprise. I'll wear the strap again on Sunday and see what comes out. The two runs are only 1.5m so I should be able to hit something quite high.
I can see the advantage of doing this and thinking about it for about 3 months and see where I am then.
I'm going to enter the Marine Corps Marathon lottery tomorrow.
You got those 7 x 1200 reps done though AA, that's a lot of fast running when you add it up!
Nell the target for the 3 x 2M reps was around half marathon pace, ended up running them progressive as the first was into the wind on a slight uphill and the last was with the wind behind on a slight downhill! Paces were 6:49, 6:39, 6:25. Might have been caning it a bit on that last one!
Nice pace on the 14M 2old! Pleased you're still injury-free, whether that's at the front of your mind or the back of it. Stay sensible, only a few weeks to go so nothing daft! Hopefully a streaming cold now will mean you won't get any more before London.
Good luck with the duration run Sunday Freemers, you sure you shouldn't be aiming to complete that nearer to 3:10?
Are your legs feeling any better O4S?
Hope the hamstring gets sorted Pink, your swim and bike training is going so well it would be a shame to miss the triathlon.
Keeping everything crossed we all make it to London in one piece Barry. Do you think the tri training has helped you to make it this far without any injuries? Nice tempo run, that would have been very close to 19 minutes for the 5K.
Minni the HADD training is probably a great way of getting back into running for you as you won't be chewed over pace, you just have to stick to the heart rate target which will probably seem really easy. Remember when Daren did it! Marine Corps Marathon? How did you wangle that?
Tempo went well on Tuesday, does anyone else prefer to just get warmed up then stuck into a tempo run rather than all this slowing down and speeding up nonsense of intervals?! Just over 10M done with the 10K done in 41:32. 13M easy done tonight. Hill reps planned early doors tomorrow, I may fall asleep at work by mid-afternoon.
HI AA, Nice interval session (7x1200) For some reason I find my legs ache more after a interval session on the TM.
Hi o4s, Hope you have had a rest?
Hi 2old, I can understand avoiding the interval session, not a bad session replacing it. Hope you can shake off the cold.
Hi Barry, Some fast miles there.
Hi Pink, Hope the hamstring gets better.
Hi Chick, Never really fancied the HADD training, but thanks for the explanation... I am sure the pace will come back
Hi Carrot, I embrace the recovery part of the intervals!
Busy week, but managed to get the early morning sessions in. Tuesday was intervals, 4 x 1.5 miles with 800M recoveries ran 9:52,9:54, 9:49 & 9:53 with 1.5 mile warm up and 2 mile cool down. Wednesday Easy to Moderate run @ 7:40mm average. Today was a change from MP run with the HM coming up on Sunday to 10 miles Easy to Moderate ran @ moderate pace 7:22mm
Quick check in from Belfast - over visiting family. When I arrived I found out there is a public sector strike today so no public transport, still trying to work out how to get back to the airport for a lunchtime flight. Diabolical weather here yesterday - ran 4 miles from the centre of town to my brother's (mostly uphill) then spent the rest of the day in wet shoes and socks. Today is glorious, but the rain has transferred to Bristol! Easy week to give myself a fighting chance in the 20 mile race on Sunday.
Good luck anyone racing this weekend
Carrot: I am entirely with you on tempo v intervals!
Hey gang - Malcs and Soups from the Asics sub 3:30 made me change my name. But I quite like it
sounds a bit more down wiv da kids 
. I'm also with you on intervals. By the time you've caught your breath you have to start the next one 
. Tempo runs are more rewarding but they still bliddy hurt!!
carrot: nice 10k time and stonking 2mile reps
Barry: brilliant splits, as ever. Just don't fck it up now and get injured!!
Minni: MCM, blimey
a good base can't hurt, 2old. Plus as we get older and more fragile all that tempo stuff my do more harm than good. But I totally understand your point about the runs being longer. That's the one thing that I wish was different...
No wonder it doesn't appeal, you are a Hansons man after all
.
Easy 6 this morning. It's cold and windy again
Hi o4s, Good luck with the 20 miler on Sunday
Hi Chick(sta) In my experience whether tempo or interval as you say they both hurt
Nice 6 hope it wasn't too windy.
Rest day today, and of course as ever on a Friday when I have a rest day the wind had dropped here
2old - Not tempted by a Parkrun at the mo, trouble fitting it in, and fell out with my local Parkrun last year when they messed up my time, yeah I know let it go.
Carrot - Yes definately helping with injury prevention and I am running/racing the fastest I have ever done. But the real test of reduced running will come at VLM. Very good running from you any ideas of your target for VLM? I have n't done any intervals this campaign just my weekly blast and longer tempo runs.
Nell - nice quick stuff from you.
Minni - Good luck and enjoy for tomorrow.
Chick - If you're getting bullied on the other thread we can send O4S over to sort them out.
My week of daily doubles continued yesterday with 1 hour easy bike then swim club in the evening
24.2 miles done this morning gels at 6,10,14,18, had a few hills in the run so very happy with 7:39 avg and miles 17 onwards splits: 7:22,7:22,7:22,7:10,7:14,7:11,7:20,7:18
That gives me a "massive" 44 miles for the week.
Haha, like the bullying comment
I like the idea of a slight name change as I'm hoping my shit streak has ended. New name, new me so to speak.
Hi Barry, 24.2 miles! Blimey and not hanging around? Are you running London? If so, what time are you gunning for? I must say your mixed training seems to be really going well
Hi Minni, Good luck this weekend
Out for 6 miles this morning, ran average 7:37mm. Met one of my o4s fellow runners and had a chat with him for a mile...nice run. At the moment it doesn't look like it will be too windy for Alloa tomorrow....kiss of death!
Nell - all the best for the half tomorrow. Gonna predict a time and see how close you are?!
Barry - cracking form at present. Almost cotton wool time. Brilliant run today.
Chick - loving the name.
Carrot - you are doing so well at present. Great 10k training run!
Pink - hang in there. Tough time for you at present, I'm sure.
Minni - go enjoy it tomorrow. Much more fun than you think it will be. Good luck.
O4S - good luck for you 20 race tomorrow. Hope you're well.
2old - hope your cold isn't too bad now. I've been doing circuit training the last 5 weeks to strengthen up my body for completing Boston and London. Hopefully that will help.
Another 2h58 20 miler this week. And I felt ok for it all. I did a 9 miler and tried to run 4 sub7 min miles but couldn't. Chest and cough still really bad. Peak flow is 350. Anyone else check lungs with peak flow? Don't think sub1:30 is on now at Reading next week, which is a bit gutting
Hopefully the puffers will help this week.
Got my start for Boston. Wave 3, corral 1. 10:50 start. And blimey security detail is amazing. No firearms/knives/weapons - who would have expected that?!
350 peak flow is pants. As a fellow asthmatic I tend to monitor mine especially when lurgified. I like it to be around 400 and at my height and age it should be nearer 440 but I have to accept that my lungs only work at limited capacity. Running really isn't the right sport for me but hey, it's what I do, limitations and all
Reading is next week, right? So you have another week to get better. All is not lost yet. Keep the faith.
I managed 18 today. Rather cold and windy even though I chose a sheltered route.
Hope Minni survived her duathlon
Hope your 20M race went well today O4S
Barry I've yet to decide on my target, it's that delicate balance of hitting the right pace so you run the fastest race you can and overstepping the mark and crashing and burning! Blinding 24.2 miler from you.
LOVING the new name Chicksta! You didn't have a shit streak, you were ill!! But it's great that you're into the light at the end of the tunnel, let's hope 2015 if a great year for you.
Five weeks until Boston AA? What is peak flow? Hope an easy week ahead of Reading helps shift that lurgy for you, don't lose hope just yet.
Finished first overall at my local parkrun yesterday which was nice, if not a little bit bizzare! Wasn't a fast time or anything, and there was only 85 runners, but still
carrot - omg that's an amazing couple of Races. Well done. And wow to that last mile today. On fire lady!! Peak flow is liked lung capacity measure
Chick - nice little 18 there. Glad you know about peak flow. How long will it take for the brown inhaler used twice a day to start working!?
8 hilly miles today bringing a 49 mile week.
Hi AA, Nice 20 and 8 miler there, hopefully you will be feeling yourself again soon, nice mileage for the week...missed the prediction request, I would not tempt fate anyway
Hi Chick, Nice 18, the wind thankfully dropped a bit here today
Hi Carrot, Nice couple of finishes there, well done on the Parkrun, superb! 20 x 1 mile laps??
Alloa today, and conditions were pretty good (well as good as you will get here!) Wind nowhere near as bad as last year, a bit of a breeze but nothing too much to worry about. First 5 miles are undulating, and then after Tillicoultry you get a good 5 or 6 miles of pretty flattish road. Mile 11 has a hill and then another slight hill shortly after, which is a bit annoying as you are still recovering from the first! last bit is nice downhill and flat.
Race went pretty much to plan really, even though at first was not feeling up for it I soon got my mojo.
Splits: 6:33, 6:26, 6:41, 6:33, 6:25, 6:34, 6:21, 6:33, 6:21, 6:29, 6:50, 6:33, 6:21, 0:56
Unofficial Finish Time 1:25:41 PB So pretty pleased with that!
And Carrot! What a run. And that mile at the end is just showing off!
Duathlon was great! I really enjoyed it. It was short but long enough for me at the moment. I didn't know what to expect at all, pace wise, but figured if I averaged 8:30ish on the first run I'd be doing pretty well and couldn't really predict the second what with my current fitness and having never done one.
The run lap was 1.65m and I finished in 13:08, so just over 8 m/m. First transition was over minute to pick up bike, get helmet on and run to the startline. 2 ladies passed me during transition but as soon as I was on the bike I passed them, and on a hill!! 6.5m bike - passed another few and got over taken myself by some powerhouses on carbon bikes, you know Dubai Dave types!
Nice running and great results Carrot and Nell!
San Domenico 20 mile race today. Not the easiest race - one steep little poke at 6 miles then a long steep hill [three quarters of a mile up the side of a Welsh valley] between miles 8 and 9. Pleased to get to half way in 85 minutes, but then we had 3 miles off road on rough track and I completely lost pace and rhythm. Another steep climb at 14 miles, up a flight of deep shallow steps, then the return leg was gradually up the valley into a head wind all the way back to the finish. Finished in 2.56.34 and won a bottle of wine for first FV55. Also set a course record, but only because the route is slightly different to previous years [more off-road]. It is exactly 4 weeks since the Reading 20 and I was 10 mins faster on a tougher course, so pretty satisfied. BA appeared back after the prize giving and appropriated the wine
Chick / AA: my peak flow hasn't been above 340/350 for over 8 months and I am currently going through a comprehensive series of tests to see if there is an underlying problem. Unfortunately each test is on a different day and it is taking up a hell of a lot of time.. CT scan of the chest tomorrow at 18.50, so missing running club, but have to go up afterwards for the AGM.
I've decided I will be relying on endurance and stupidity in 6 weeks time as speed is going backwards. Next 2 weeks include 2 ultras, one 20 mile race and a week of walking / running in the Peak District - what doesn't kill you wears you out.......
Hi Minni, Thanks on Alloa, you must make a trip up sometime to it, Think you would enjoy it. Very well done on the Duathlon, it sounds as though your recovery is coming on really well. Very brave to switch off the pace
Hi o4s, Well done on the first FV55, another race to put us in shame. Nice to see BA helped you out with the prize giving
After a night of DOMS, 6 miles easy this morning at 7:43 mm average....
Wow - some really impressive racing!
Carrot - that's a superb time for 20 miles. You really are flying....I can't wait to see what you can do in London
Nell - PB-tastic
O4S - fantastic result
Minni - well done with the duathlon. It must have felt great to be back racing again
I had a really good time on feet run yesterday - 23 miles in total in 3.16, very even pacing around 8.30s all the way. I felt really strong throughout, so it all went to plan. 56 miles for the week.
Wow, some really great running going on yesterday.
You are on track for a sub 3 now, surely?
. You like it tough, eh?
probably a reason why race times, especially over shorter distances go down the drain as we get older.
Nell: crikey that was FAST!!
carrot: congrats on 1st lady at parkrun and a great 20 miler
Minni: great first duathlon, well done! Nice consistency with the two runs. You must be pretty pleased.
O4S: congrats on first V55
Freemers: brilliant time on feet run
As for peak flow - it varies with age and height. I'm pretty tall at nearly 5ft 9, the shorter you are, the lower the numbers that are deemed normal. It also decreases with age
AA: I think it depends on the severity of your chest infection how long it'll take to improve. The brown inhalers (at least the ones I know and use) contain steroids to calm down the inflammation. I'm quite confident that another week will make quite a difference though. Fingers crossed for Reading
Carrot-You must have a great coach...so much outstanding running has been unleashed What are your targeting in the near future.Well impressed
Nell--what can I say?Quality Hm result as expected. Wonder what London target is lurking in the back of your mind?Got to be 2.59
Your splits are my approx 5k times times 13.1
Barry-amazing LR..you must be quietly confident. As Nell asked what pace are you thinking of for London?Bet you wish it was in two weeks. You dont need a ykw anyway
Minni-sounds as though you had a ball at that duathlon.Glad it went well.Just think how much fun you'll have with a swim added
.Whats next?
Free -very good LR by you too.Another confident one here.
AA-well done keeping things going inspite of the chest.I wouldnt rule out a fast HM.Keep the faith
Chick-you have ramped up your miles nicely--be careful though.Like you new name.Thinking of following suit ..how about Oldsta?
O4s-wow what a great race and congrats on the prize. Do a few intervals in the next few weeks and London will be a doddle
After going down with a cold late last week I revised my plans and dropped the LR-hope I wont regret that on 26th April!-and did a ykw (20.15) on Saturday and 12 on Sunday instead making 50 for the week.Im now panicing about missing it
9miles near mp today.Might squeeze in a longish one tomorrow.
O4S-interesting name for the race-does it reflect the large Italian historical presence in the valleys?Bet the place was buzzing after Wales victory over the Irish on Saturday
2Old: Its the name of the running club, which might well reflect the Italian presence in the Valleys, but really don't know.
Minni: our posts must have crossed last night, so belated congratulations on your duathlon. I love duathlons, possibly my favourite sort of race - but they tend to be really expensive round here. I am entering a summer series, one a month from May to August on Wednesday evenings.
Carrot: I simply can't imagine doing 20 laps in a 20 mile race
I couldn't evencope with the 5 laps in the Town Moor marathon!!
BA has just discovered that he was third MV60 yesterday - I didn't think it worth mentioning that there were only 3 MV60 in the race
Chick: looks like you are well on the way to recovery. My maximum peak flow is right at the bottom of the 'Normal' range for my height and age, which is one of the resaons the GP referred me for tests - she reckons it should be way higher given my weight and level of fitness.
AA: hope you continue to recover quickly.