sub 4 hour group,if anyone wants to get together



  • are insane. 120 miles on a bike PLUS 90k running? If i ever make it down to RP i'll feel like the coyote chasing the roadrunner
    Crazy Addick...what time you looking for in the watford half? whats a decent sub-4 time for a half? 100?
  • WaboWabo ✭✭✭
    Thanks CA, at least spurs limped along a bit better than me yesterday - well that's debatable!
    possunt quia posse videntur - we can because we know we can 
  • JPVD, Not to sure on that one, as it will be my first, have managed to do 1:46 in training before x-mas so hope to do around 1:50 will see.

    I will be using this race as my first pointer to see if my ambitions for the marathon are realistic, after that I have booked to run in the Hastings Half, RW training run in RP, a mcmillan trainnig day at Greenwich and the Worthing 20 miler, these race & training days will I hope all help me decide what I can achieve in the FLM while enjoying the day and experience.

    What time are you looking at?

  • Wabo, yeah the bad news is that the Addicks game against Spurs will now have to be moved ,and as we normally finish our season ten games before everyone else that give you 3 points.
  • Ca, did the Marlow 1/1 in 2 hours...but what a nightmare that was.
    pouring rain, running in ankle deep water for miles on end, fighting waterfalss up some very steep hills, and slip-sliding down.
    did my itb in and took until now to recover! just going to take it easy on the watford cuz i dont want to mess my FLM up...
    would like to chart a decent time to see where i am at, but the chilterns dont allow it, looking for a decent time at silverstone or the kingston brekkie run...
    does anyone know a *realistic* half-marathon time for a sub-4 marathon?
  • JPVD - RW marathon schedules say:

    Sub4: capable of sub 1:50 half
    Sub 3:45 capable of sub 1:45 half
  • Hi Percy, how's the calf?, had a look at the Greenwich Park thread, may ask if I can join them in a couple of weeks after Watford.

    JPVD, you 've now got me think what the hell have I done entering Watford, sound like we're in for a treat this weekend with all those hills, maybe I will settle for 2 hours plus.

  • CA - calf's improving thanks, but I'm still resting it. I'm also going back to the sports masseur for expert advice this evening. Sounds like a straightforward over use injury !?

    Some good training getting reported now people - keep up the good work. I will be back soon ;-)
  • Percy

    Hope it is good news I have just come back from my sports massage,I injured my calf yesterday during my run,anyway he is so good was able to pin point the place it is my Soleus so after some deep massage I have to ice it for 8 mins at a time tonight and no running or stretching until Wednesday...sob sob sob I am going to go slightly mad!!!!
    Live each day as if it was your last  give it all you have to reap the rewards.
  • Poppy,

    Sorry to hear about the niggle. I hope that the ice and rest clears it up. Looking on the bright side, you might miss the worst of the cold snap...
    Coincidentally, the bloomin' Soleus muscle was also responsible for my foot problems a couple of weeks ago so you have my sympathies, as do Percy and all other injured forumites.

    Did a quick 5.5 today (42 minutes) in order to see whether I could cope with Lucozade whilst running.
    Frankly, the jury's still out (but on the positive side, the Lucozade's still in!)
    Having read some stuff in forums, I tried knocking it back quickly but that may have been a mistake. I'll try sipping it a bit next time and see if it's less unpleasant.

    Ah well, off to use the ice packs.

    Best wishes to all.
  • Hmmm, my sympathies to you Poppy. Take it easy and don't go back before it's better.

    Can't remember which muscle I've "torn a few fibres in" but it's sort of behind the knee and responsible for knee stability. Will start with a gentle jog tomorrow if it feels ok, otherwise more rest and ice.

    So all in all a week lost and a lesson time I feel a slight niggle I'll know what NOT to do...;-)

    Take care everyone.
  • WP, PC, hope you both make a speedier recovery than you could possibly hope for.

    This thread IS jinxed! I was fine till I came on here, and within 48 hours I was barely able to move. Nothing whatsoever to do with the weight-training, of course - that was just co-incidence.

    Still got aching glutes and adductors, but I'm going to go out for a run tonight anyway - can always walk if it hurts too much to run, and call it fat-burning, cos goodness knows I need to burn a bit of fat if I'm going to keep up with you chaps. And more weights tomorrow.
  • Thanks V-rap. Go easy on that iron pumping. We can't afford any more thread injuries as there's no more room on the bench!
  • WaboWabo ✭✭✭
    Ok PC and WP maybe we start a new club, the 'I'm going slightly mad' club!
    I went for a foot scan last night and I am quite a slam your foot down pronator! Now I am getting Orthotics. Boyfriend (who weighs considerably less than me) says 'bah humbug'. I say I give it a try.
    any thoughts peeps?
    possunt quia posse videntur - we can because we know we can 
  • Sure it's worth getting your gait analysed and making sure you have the right shoe.
    I had this a few weeks back and discovered that I do mildy over-pronate. Luckily the shoe I'd always bought was the right choice.

    If you only go out and jog a few miles each week it's probably not worth it, but if you intend serious training mileage like us lot then you'd be crazy not to IMO.

    Mind you I never mind paying for expert opinions - knowledge is power and all that.
    The only thing I'd say watch out for is when the "expert" says you need regualar treatment or see this other expert in the same practise...etc. etc. In other words tries to sell you stuff you don't really need.
  • Hello All, May I join your group?

    I plan (hope?) to do FLM (first marathon ever) in sub-4hrs this year.

    Last sunday's long run was a major milestone for me as I ran 11.6 miles, 8:40/mile pace at low comfortable hr.

    If I double the distance what would my expected pace be?

  • Nrg-b, Welcome to the party from a fellow first-timer!

    That run sounds good, particularly the "comfortable hr". I'm down for a 12-mile run this Sunday and I think that it will be anything but comfortable...

    As for doubling the distance, that's something I'd do gradually. If you can build up whilst keeping at about 8:50 - 9:00 then you'll be well set for the big day.

    Are you following a particular training schedule?

    P.S. I'm impressed that your favourite race is already the marathon!
  • Welcome nrg-b. Good to see you here. I remember from our discussion at the Social that you intend to do no speed work and run FLM like a long BT training run, but still achieve sub-4 ? Given what you've achieved so far I reckon this is quite reasonable. The big question for you (and all of us really) is can we build the endurance to be able to sustain our desired pace all the way to the finish line.

    As your long run pace is at a low comfortable HR then why shouldn't you be able to run at the same pace for longer?

    Only more LSD training miles will answer the question for you.

  • WaboWabo ✭✭✭
    Thanks for advice PC. I do a lot of running and quite a lot of races. I have started to get probs recently (plantar fascitis) and new shoes did deal with that but I really want to nip these things in the bud as my training is suffering already.
    But as someone once said " I'll be back".
    ps I don't look like him honest!
    possunt quia posse videntur - we can because we know we can 
  • JTS: Thanks about the pace info - will give it a go in the coming weeks as I try out a 20 miler sometime in mid-March.

    I am a 'new' runner. My one and only race was the Nike10k round Richmond Park last Sep. done in about 52 mins and very nearly collapsed at the end.

    As for favourites, I just clicked on whatever took my fancy on that profile page. However, it would be interesting to compete at HM and M levels.

    I'm following the Stage2 schedule for aerobic base-building (see the Base Training thread on Training). It won't give me a best time for FLM but hopefully a PB later on in the year.
  • Thanks for get well wishes....|I have my traditional day of tomorrow and hope to do a long run but will play it by ear!!

    Welcome NRB-G and anyother new comers I have missed on previous page;-)

    Hope VR you are fighting fit and yes the thread seems to be jinxed at the moment with injurys.


    Best of luck for tomorrow wishing you a speedy recovery

    And all the rest injured get well soon

    Hope you are fighting fit and well done on run yesterday-I have always trained with Lucazade and actually like it although did take a while to get use to sweetness.
    Live each day as if it was your last  give it all you have to reap the rewards.
  • Gosh, a few days away and everyone is injured.

    Used to train with L.Sport. Hate the orange flavour, best is the Grapefruit - in my view that is.

    Used one of these high carb drinks from GNC on races, seems to work ok. Red Rooster, about double the strength of red bull (and half the price), good for me 1/2 hr before a run.

    Must report that I am now 'fit on the inside'& 'more regular than big ben' after W.P.'s Kiwi Fruit cold cure recomendation !

    By the way, I love the skin - nice and crunchy. No one I have talked to believes I can eat and enjoy the skin. All started because I lost the motivation to cut it off.

    1/2 M last night, fairly hilly, in 1:52 with some vary lazy plodding toward the end (apart from the last mile when some amateur in a bobble hat fancied a dabble). Feeling pleased.

    Thinks; where do I find a fast,flatish, non-boring, non treadmill, 1/2m in Swansea ?

    Hills, I love 'em (really), but occasionally could do without them. Then that's Wales for you.

  • Alex,

    Glad to have you back wondered where you had been!!

    Also glad you are fully fit and regular...LOL

    That is a good time and on a Hilly course well done sounds like you are back on track:-)

    All I could think of Alex is on the sea front from Rugby ground to the Mumbles pier and back is 9 miles just add on another 4 miles it is flat and fast but I find it very boring as done most training for 6 months on that route..

    But as training partner Is away this week I have to do my long run on my own...sob sob so will be cycle track to pier to leisure centre and back and see where I go from there about 17 miles just need to add on 4 miles to be on target with last week but after running fanatstic route over in Port Talbot it is going to seem very boring indeed!!!
    but will play it by ear after my calf problem!!
    Live each day as if it was your last  give it all you have to reap the rewards.
  • Hi everyone

    Not sure if I want to post on here!

    Am I likely to get injured? Eeeeekkkkk

    Ran 12 miles today. Feeling better as I didn't manage to do a long run at weekend only a 7 miler.

    Running Watford on Sunday but not as a race as a training run! :)

    Anyone else running at Watford? Would be good to meet beforehand even if it is just to say hello.

  • Evening all.
    I hope that everybody's niggles are mending nicely and immense respect to anybody who actually braved the arctic gales outside this evening.
    It's my rest day today but I've got a long run tomorrow (10 - 12 miles) with the added bonus of trying Lucozade again.
    I'm a fan of the Maxim gels (citrus flavour) but I'll persevere with the Lucozade for the moment.
    Anbody know whether the FLM only supplies orange flavour?

    Poppy - 17 miles? Blimey, respect is most certainly due. That's Mudchute already and there's still 2 1/2 months to go...
  • JTS

    Yes, unfortunately, Lucozade Sport provided at the FLM is Orange, Orange or Orange flavour :) You won't get any other type which is unfortunate as other flavours are easier to drink. I find the orange one very strong. However, you will find that stations alternate between water and LS sport and I can assure you, there are many stations. Infact I couldn't believe how many there were. Towards the end I didn't bother because I was full to the brim. It was invaluable last year though as it was a hot one!
  • Didn't they provide the red one in 2002 ?

    Anyway, Poppys suggestion of the seafront (10k +) as the basis for a long run is great for times.

    The problems I have with this bit is

    1. If it is going to be windy anwhere it is windy there.
    2. Track slopes sideways so ideally I need one leg shorter than the other.
    3. Most of my running is at night and it is poorly & you have to pass literally bushfulls of 'undesireables' at that time of day.

    The cycletrack is great and I use it alot in the summer, however light is the problem now. Typically I am setting out between 8:30 and 10pm.

    Penclawdd way is flatish but boring. Hmmm.

    Must try to get some long runs done in the day. Generally only manage hills and similar shorter sessions daytime, and mornings ... don't talk to me about mornings.

    How on earth people feel good or work effectivley in the morning I will never understand.

    Did I mention I was using my slow shoes yesterday ;-)

    Have splashed out on a pepperoni pizza and 2 yoghuts this evening. Even had a caramel slice for lunch.

    Got a garmin forerunner thingy. Very good but beeps a-lot. Shame it does not understand when I am going up a hill - if you use the speed warnings it goes mental because I slow down. Concequence is that I have truned this bleepathon feature off and I have a nast habbit of degenerating in to an infinatley maintainable but slow plod after a while.

    Tried a cold bath after running yesterday. Bottled it after putting one foot in. Mnagaed to cold sponge my legs (which killed) as a cop-out. Maybe it helped as they are great today, but maybe they would have been fine anyway.

    Have bought piles of gels but not seriously used them. Must have a go.

    Must admit my I play it by ear on times. Sundays run was a long run come 3 miles; diverted home overladen with Kiwi fruit.

    Goodnight all & Good Luck.

  • Afraid not doing Watford to far away for me:-)well done on your run


    I did 21 miles last week and the same on Wednesday if calf holds up;-(


    So thats why I have one leg shorter than other:-)

    That is jolly late you are out for runs,some of us are morning people and enjoy running at 5.30-6AM before work;-)

    Now cold baths are not that bad once you get used to them:-) okay I have not had one since summer but I do shower cold water on legs especially knees after runs...yes it does make me scream as it is icy cold;-)then hot water then cold again.

    I have a box of gels not used as yet must start using them.

    Good luck with training everyone:-)
    Live each day as if it was your last  give it all you have to reap the rewards.
  • Phew! Welsh Poppy. You make my attempts at training look VERY INSIGNIFCANT....

    My 12milers vs your numerous 21'ers!

    Well done...
  • Poppy, 21?

    "We are not worthy. We are not worthy....." ;-)

    As for the alternating hot/cold approach onthe legs, my masseur recommended a similar approach using hot/cold packs.

    The routine is 3 min hot followed by 1 min cold and then repeat a couple of times.
    He said that the important thing was to finish with a cold one as this clears out some of the accumulated junk from the muscles.
    It's a lot easier doing it in the shower than trying to maintain the hot & cold packs for 10 minutes and it seems to do some good.

    Not sure whether I'll get out and about tonight as we've got a couple of inches of snow and ice at the moment. I'll see how it looks when I get home tonight.
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