Talkback: ASICS Target 26.2 Team: Emma

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  • Emma- well done on your 10.1!

    Happy new year everyoneimage

  • Happy New Year Everyone.

    MWW - It was sooooooo slow and felt so difficult!

    I was going to pop out for a cheeky trot around the block but my leggies are a bit tired - think a rest would do me more good!

  • Morning and Happy New Year

    I too plan my long runs to allow for toilet stops although mine mostly involve hedges rather than garden centres or Macdonalds!  Like MWW I use Immodium before races and mostly have been ok plus the thought of the Portaloo I encountered around 20 miles in Paris in 2009 helps too image

  • Another vote for immodium- I always use it for marathons, and carry a couple of spare "instants" tablets with me- probably not a good idea to use it too regularly, so need to find a different approach for training runs ( no pun intended)- do you think it's a dietary thing?- I reckon that the caffeine gels were a probelm for me- I've stopped using them, and things seem better.
  • Happy New Year everyone
  • A question for Sam.

    I noticed that for Emma's long run next week she has 10 miles in 100 minutes which isn't that much slower than marathon pace for a 4.15 finish.  I've always been told that long slow runs ought to be at least MP+ 60 seconds if not more.  Is Emma's quicker because she is faster over short distances or do I need to reevaluate my idea of an 'easy' pace?

  • Debenhams online sale great for crockery Emma bought some last weds delivered Friday.
    Eldest daughter and hubby back from skiing trip to Austria what cracking pictures.
    Ten minute miles is a slow long run pace for a four fifteen finish isn't it? USB......
  • Exact pace for a 4:L15 finish is 9:44 min miling (engraved on my heart image ).  That is why I was wondering about the pace suggested.
  • USB - I'm worried about the pace suggested at the moment as I really found it tough going yesterday!image

    I am running with a friend and she is keen to try to stick to the pace but we will take headphones in case we end up running at differing paces. Based on this we might review our future long runs. I managed up to 16 miles at 10 min miles in training last year but ran along the downs link which is flat and with no traffic and was with a different running partner.image

    I am not sure that I can managed 9:44 for 26.2 miles but Sam is so I am going to believe in the training annd give it my best shot! Already I have felt that the running it different, with much more purpose as opposed to the 'more of the same' plodding miles that I was guilty of last year.

    The faster sections in runs really focus the mind and I find them more interesting so hope that it will keep my motivation up. Think tomorrow is 5 miles steady - 9.30-9.45 pace.image

  • If 9:44 is planned marathon pace, it seems a bit fast to be doing the LSR at 10 min pace. Is that the pace suggested for all the long runs? I'm doing my long runs by HR at the moment, and they're much slower than that (I'm aimng for  4:00-4:15).

    Do the runs slow down as distance increases?

  • Found the run so tough today - we set out to do 5 miles at steady pace (9:30-9:45 min miles) but I couldn't manage it at all. My lovely chum appologised for slowing me down - truth is I think I was slowing her down!image

    I'm a bit worried about the long runs based on this - last year the runs I did at 10 min miles were horrendous (I wasn't allowed to stop at all) and I endured them. But the runs that my chum and I did at a conversational pace were really lovely even though we were shattered. So I think we will aim to run at 10 min miles and see how we go!

    Tricia - seeing as the short run today I couldn't even get to marathon pace I think it is likely that the pace will slow as the distances increase!image

  • Ultra Sparkly Bridget wrote (see)

    A question for Sam.

    I noticed that for Emma's long run next week she has 10 miles in 100 minutes which isn't that much slower than marathon pace for a 4.15 finish.  I've always been told that long slow runs ought to be at least MP+ 60 seconds if not more.  Is Emma's quicker because she is faster over short distances or do I need to reevaluate my idea of an 'easy' pace?

    tricialitt wrote (see)

    If 9:44 is planned marathon pace, it seems a bit fast to be doing the LSR at 10 min pace. Is that the pace suggested for all the long runs? I'm doing my long runs by HR at the moment, and they're much slower than that (I'm aimng for  4:00-4:15).

    Do the runs slow down as distance increases?


    Hi everyone... lots of discussion about long run pace here so I'll try to clarify.

    The 'long slow run' pace is 10.45-11 minutes per mile and runs at this pace are described on the schedule as 'slow'.

    Long runs described as 'easy' are slightly quicker, 10-10.30 minutes per mile.

    I'm quite a believer in doing some long runs (or bouts of long runs) at a faster than LSR pace - not so much for a first timer just trying to get round but for those looking to achieve a new PB. So the schedule varies the long run pace from LSR to Easy (and later on to some specific MP, too)

    So the answer to tricialitt's question is no, the pace doesn't necessarily get slower as the runs get longer, though I normally suggest the LSR pace when I significantly up the length of the run (eg. by 2 miles).

    Another factor is the surface of the run. I generally recommend doing LSR pace runs off road so you don't 'pace watch' as much. Just run slow and enjoy it! And that brings me to USBs point about Emma's long run -  next week she has 10 miles in 100 minutes which isn't that much slower than marathon pace for a 4.15 finish.  I should perhaps have put 100-105 minutes to stick more closely to the pace range I have outlined for 'easy' runs ie. 10-10.30.  And for the 'easy' pace long runs, I recommend a more level, firm surface so you can monitor pace more easily. (This surface variation is also good for strength, stability and injury resistance.)

    No one aiming for the same kind of time as Emma should worry if they are at the slower end of the ranges suggested. If you feel the pace suggested for the 'easy' runs is too fast, you could try doing a 'slow start, faster finish' long run, in which you do the first half at the LSR pace and the second half at the easy pace. That goes for you too, Emma!

    I hope that helps. Will check back tomorrow morning to see if I need to clarify further!

  • Thanks Sam.  I think I'm someone who prefers the mixed approach, partly because although it is not excessively hilly round here the early part of all my long runs involves a certain amount of climbing and overall my routes are undulating at best.  The only way I get round this from time to time is by driving a few miles away to flatter places!
  • USB - Totally understand. I think it's important to heed the session 'descriptor', ie. easy, steady, brisk or whatever, in addition to the pace guidelines. The pace guidelines don't hold true if you're running up and down hills or over boggy terrain for exmaple, but as long as it still feels 'steady' or 'brisk' then that's absolutely fine. We are not machines!

  • Perfect and very clear particularly good the point on varying surfaces for long runs, I have tended to do the long runs over the last couple of years on the same surface. Going to vary things in future.
    YOU can do it Emma or you will be able to once the training is done, keep at it.
    Time for work.
  • Don't panic Emma - it's just one run!  Remember that you're gonna get fitter as you go along so try not to self sabotage yourself by  telling yourself you're too slow.  Slower can be good if you need your body to produce more capillaries, mitochondria and aerobic enzymes - and it will - if you let it. (These are the bits and bobs which allow your body to transport oxygen and make you energy efficient). That's why you're training after all - to get your body ready. It's not ready right now at the moment - but then it doesn't need to be as Paris is not until April.  Trust Sam - she'll look after you.  image
  • Emma - SB is so right, it's only one run and believe me we all have bad days now and again - even bad races as well - and you just have to get philosophical and move on.  Remember also that you were ill last week so maybe it was the after effects creeping up on you.  Plus Christmas in a young family household is a stressful as well as enjoyable time and that can have an effect as well.   Don't change everything based on one short run.

    So, keep your spirits up and look forwards - we're all rooting for you!

  • Thank you so much for all the positivity everyone - it means an awful lot to me!image

    I will do it - or at least do my absolute best!

    Hope the rain goes before my run tonight - planning on one mile warm up, 3 miles at 1/2 marathon pace a mile jog recovery and a mile cool down. Rain, rain go away ....

  • Some great points made above.

    Training is the method we use of getting from A (starting point) to B (goal/destination). You are not expected to already be at B at the outset, otherwise there'd be no need for the training 'journey'! The fact that you've completed the full week (and a few extra miles, methinks) in adverse circumstances shows commitment and tenacity.

    Yes, me too hoping that the rain and gale force winds abate. the forecast says it should be drier later...

  • Running home tonight four miles minimum at 5pm so will be out in the wind and rain with you Emma in spirit. Check out page 91 to see me and my daughter in the Feb RW mag and page 53 being quoted at the Birmingham boot camp day.......just like to say that I did make some comments about Steve and Sam too but they have been edited!!!

    To quote my new desk calendar(sorry if they bore you, I wont mention them every day promise!)

    No one is useless in this world who lightens the burdens of another.

  • mcs - nice article and photo on P91 of RW mag - at this rate you'll be vying for Editor!!

    Lovely 7 mile hill run at MP+10secs with 7 min strong uphill.  Managed to avoid the rain storms which is the beauty of being retired.  I love getting back from an afternoon run at this time of year as the day darkens and I get stuck into soup, crumpets, cake and loads of tea..  Makes the evening Guinness taste better as well !!

    Am thinking about doing a marathon a couple of months after the spring one (May 6th) - not a PB one but an interest one to use the benefit of the early year training and after a recovery period - saw an advert for the Lakeland Trail Marathon at Coniston on July 1st - mcs, do you know anything about this one ?

  • Great - just looked at my meetings for January and I have two parents evenings to deal with - so training already being juggled!

    I suppose that's my category!

  • mcs wrote (see)

    Running home tonight four miles minimum at 5pm so will be out in the wind and rain with you Emma in spirit. Check out page 91 to see me and my daughter in the Feb RW mag and page 53 being quoted at the Birmingham boot camp day.......just like to say that I did make some comments about Steve and Sam too but they have been edited!!!

    To quote my new desk calendar(sorry if they bore you, I wont mention them every day promise!)

    No one is useless in this world who lightens the burdens of another.


    Hope they were nice comments, mcs image

    Emma, oh you poor thing. It's tough innit, marathon training. Let me know if I can help you reschedule the sessions.

  • Thanks Sam- it's in a couple of weeks. I've got try and sort out child care too which is a pain as mum and dad do so much already! Think I may have to try and get up at 5 that morning and do a run then! Just need to develop motivation for a silly o clock run!
    If not I'll squeeze the run in on the Friday morning - got a shorter run that weekend so should be fine. Couldn't find a ten k (or any other distance) that weekend. Any suggestions? Thought of asking a friends hubby to pacemaker at just over 8 min miles? This teaching lark gets on the way of marathon training!
  • Has everyone got their February RW? I haven't got mine so didn't think they were out! Hubby's train up the spout so I am waiting to go out for my more pacey (I hope) run tonight! Middle section st about 9 min miles! Fingers crossed and the Garmin doesn't lie... Or does it?
  • Yes, got mine last week and mcs has his.  Good luck on run tonight.
  • Yip got mine too! image
  • I'll ask Alice about my copy of RW - deliberately didn't ask for subscription for Christmas as I thought it was one of the goodies! Is there a bootcamp write up then?

    Thanks for the positivity for tonight's run - plan was 1 mile jog, 3 miles at 1/2 pace followed by 1 (or 2 not totally clear) miles jog recovery.

    The Garmin say ...

    10:41,8:48, 8:49, 8:34 ,11:15, 9:45 

    Hoorah! - I was rather slow in the warm up (found it hard to get going) and don't know what happened in mile 5 (might have stopped for a gossip or for lights?!) but last mile better. Really pleased with the mid section - although I did think 'not a chance I could do this for another 10 miles'! So faster than 1/2 marathon pace really - but I'm pleased that I was able to pick up pace a bit (also a gentle down hill for a fair bit - maybe do the route in reverse next time and see if there is much change) especially as I have been feeling so tired!

    2 runs down - 2 more to go for the week!image

  • Hi all,
    Please can I come in?
    I'm just writing a message to activate notifications so I can listen to you chat and work out who everyone is from the safety of the shadows.
    Congratulations EmmaC, I am hoping to train with you all in the thread though I've had 6 months off proper training so am nervous about whether I'll be able to get back into a routine (and regain fitness) in time for Dorset Village 6th May.
  • Nice run tonight Emma.

    I was feeling antisocial so didn't go to intervals at my club tonight but  went out and did sort of fartlek for about 8 miles instead.  There were patches where the naff street lighting meant no chance to go faster in case I fell over!

    Good idea to ask Alice about the subscription.  Mine started partway into last year but that may have been because I already had one paying quarterly and it needed to get to the end of what i had already paid for.

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