Talkback: ASICS Target 26.2 Team: Emma



  • Re: weight loss. Best thing I ever bought was an accurate, digital set of scales... Totally nailed portion sizes. But it's so depressing...

    Happy anniversary too!
  • I actually like the fact that my scales lie to me!image
  • Mine do too...

    Meant kitchen scales. I'm so dumb.
  • Ha ha - I see what you mean! Portion size when using scales in the kitchen is a real shocker isn't it!

  • I'm glad you clarified what you meant. I was wondering what kind of bathroom scales could tell you what your "portion" sizes were :0
  • I do eat quite large portions of food!
  • Tenjiso: I know, sounded sooooooo wrong.
  • Well done Emma just read through the thread. Sounds god so far. I am doing London and aiming for sub 4 but trying to forget time and enjoy (hopefully) finishing first marathon
  • Hi Emma

    I will get my email address to you.

    Thanks for food diary. I would say your diet is really well meaning and some good stuff in there! But you could replace some foods for example  on day one you had 100calories worth of sugar (5 teaspoons) and there is little nutrient value in this. A  far better use of calories would have been to have  2-3 pieces of small fruit (as your fruit & veg is not as high as it should be perhaps 3 per day and some days perhaps not even this). Aim for over 5 a day and ideally  of different colors (tomatos, yellow peppers, kiwi, apple, orange etc ) but increase this gradually so for a few days increase by one for example add one piece of fruit to breakfast. Then you could replaced your snacks in evening for a yoghurt and chopped up fruit . Increasing fruit (and veg)  would increase fibre, calcium, antioxidants and other minerals in your diet as well as increase carbs for training as opposed to biscuits which are just fat & sugar and often salt! Also the volume of a bowl of fruit and yoghurt should fill you up. If not try some toast  or rice cakes with banana on top? You may find the increase in fruit & veg gradually will be okay before a run unless you have IBS? therefore  we may need to consider type of snacks before run.

    One other suggested change for now would also be to use more tomato based sauces on the whole rather than white/ cheese sauces.

    Do you drink anything between meals?  .

    Perhaps you could try the above couple of changes for the next couple of weeks and then work on a couple more? image

    In regards gels I would not use them until runs over 90minutes!

  • Hi Emma

    Glad you enjoyed your run today - the paces were all under the 9-9.15 guideline.. (assuming this was the half marathon pace run an dnot the 10k pace one!?). I'd recommend sticking to the brisk/fast and 'race-based' paces suggested so you don't use up energy unnecessarily that you might then need on the long runs. It's not a case of 'if some is good, more must be better' if you know what I mean. But then again, if it's all feeling OK pace and mileage wise, we could revise the paces altogther? Get you on the sub 4 programme?!image

    Really good to see Ruth's advice above. I had also thought you might want to up your fruit and veg intake a bit. A great breakfast/snack I was given once - and now make quite often - is a fruity wrap. You warm a tortilla (I just stick it on top of toaster) and then spread it with natural yoghurt, chopped banana and other fruit of your choice (chopped dried apricots, strawberries, kiwi, tangerine segments, chopped apple...), sprinkle on some chopped nuts and seeds and drizzle with honey before folding up and scoffing! As I am not very good at running without breakfast, I was adviced to eat half of this before my long run and the other half on my return. Worked really well. Ooh, quite fancy one now!

    Assuming you jiggled Wed and Thurs this week, enjoy a rest day tomorrow..image 

  • Hi Ruth - I have fallen off the wagon a bit with my sugary foods. I used to have a family bag of minstrals every other day and then I cut those sort of snacks out of my life. In the summer I had been much better but have got back in to naughty foods over christmas break.

    On days that I word I tend to have to grab food on the go - have been trying to have the cottage cheese and rye bread as an alternative to sandwiches because of the wheat which seems to make me all bloaty.

    So target 1 - cut out the sugar in tea (don't drink coffee as it requires too much sugar) and cut out the choccy biscuits in the evening. I do like a little treat at school so might have malt loaf as my treat instead of the granola bar.

    Next target fruit/veg - I don't have too much fruit as it has a rather unpleasant effect on me and dried fruits are a no no! If I'm not running that evening or after my run I think I will try to have fruit, natural yog and some nuts/seeds as I actually do love this kind of food. Its the faff of making things that I struggle with and I can't have it if I'm running in the morning... will explain more on email! Thanks for the idea Sam - I do get stuck in a rut sometimes and its great to nick other peoples food ideas.

    When I'm at home I often make a veggie soup (throw in any veg on the way out at the end of the week to be honest) and that does 2 or 3 meals. Feeling a veg soup being made on friday!

    PS which nuts and seeds should I invest in?

  • Hi Sam - thanks for the fruit wrap idea sounds great. Perhaps not before a run for me but on a school day great!

    I know I was a bit pacey on Tuesday evening - I just kept on thinking about trying to do a sub 2 at Watford and panicking a bit I think! Kept on thinking got to be sub 9 for 2 hours can I do it?! Don't think I would manage sub 4 in a million years - Happy with my plan thank you very muchimage!

    I did the strength exercises last night too!

    Hubby out playing fottball tonight (Weds) and I have track this Thursday - will be rejigging next week about as have Parents evening. Tomorrow after school I shall collect the little beasties and take them to Jungle gym or swimming or  somethinhg else energetic!

    Are you back on top form now? How was the training weekend?

  • At thr risk of incurring Ruth's wrath - here is my food diary for today (hopefullynext few days will show a more virtuous diet!):

    Breakfast -  Special K and cuppa (2 tsps sug!)

    Snack - Go ahead garibaldi biscuits (see fruit!image)

    Lunch -  Rye bread toasted, cottage cheese (low fat of course), strawberry yoghurt and those dratted granola bars!

    Snack - apple

    Dinner -  3 bean chilli (from Monday eveining), with basmati rice and some chedder, Earl grey tea (no sug) and a fat free strawberry yoghurt. I did have biscuits yesterday evening but not tonight! Surely that's got to be at least 1/2 a brownie point? Will promise to try a better fruity breakfastimage - will also report on how tummy is at track in the eveningimage.

  • Breakfast today - chopped apple, grapes, low fat strawberry yoghurt, berry and nut sprinkle (from waitrose whole foods range ... been in the cupboard for about 3 years!). At first thought it was a bit odd - but by the end I really enjoyed it!

    It took ages to eat too - and at the moment I feel stuffed! Hopefully I will be ok at track tonight and the fruit won't have a nasty effect!

    1/2 a cup of tea - no sugar!image

  • SamMurphyRuns wrote (see)

    I know this week's not over yet, but here's what Week 3 is looking like for Emma:

    Week Three w/c 9/1/12 approx 29MMon Rest + strength trainingTue 1M jog, 3 x 1M or 1600m at 10K pace (or 8:20) with 400m (or 3-min) jog recoveries, then 1M jogWed RestThu 1M jog, then 4M at Half-Marathon pace (37 mins) then 1M jogFri 5M easy + strength trainingSat 12M slow (approx 2 hrs 10) (off-road would be good)Sun Rest

    Tweaks from the main sub 4.15 programme are a longer but slower long run (12 slow instead of 10 steady) and a slightly faster-pace for the 10km-paced miles, based on Emma's abiility (8.20 per mile instead of 8.30.) But 3 miles at 10k pace is quite tough so I've upped the recoveries to 3 minutes from 2, so she doesn't hate me! image

    Hi Sam

    In Emmas plan you have changed Sundays steady run for a long run. I am following the "ultimate RW sub 4 program". All of the long Sunday runs are slow runs. Shouls some of these be slow first half steady (marathon pace) second half or am I following a completely different program?


  • Hi Emma

     Wow that was a superhealth breakfast, well done! I am sitting here with a gallon of coffee - gotta do long run today because missed at wkd because of my training workshop (went really well thanks - got some great feedback) and am off to Scotland this weekend to see the in-laws. This is the only day I can do it and boy, do I NOT feel like it! In fact, I was out walking the dog, halfway through a train of thought justifying to myself that I perhaps wouldn't do a long run this week when I bumped into a guy from my Saturday training group and found myself saying 'yeah, got my long run today.' so I HAVE to go now!!image

    About the paces - not a big problem but just trying not to makeit any harder than it has to be. Try not to panic (9.05 would get you round sub-2, actuallyimage)

  • Hi Kevster

    I think you're following a different plan - I'm using the sub 4.15 plan as the basis for Emma's training, not the sub 4 or sub 4.30 which has a slightly different structure. But your question still stands.

    'Should some of these runs be slow start/fast finish runs or should they all be LSRs? '

    And my opinion is that it is v important to include some faster pace (marathon pace, or closer to it) within SOME of your long runs. Especially if you're trying to get sub-4. On Rosie's thread (who is one of the other Asics Target 26.2 runners, aiming for a sub 3.30) she has her first slow start/fast finish long run this weekend. I would probably wait another couple of weeks before introduicng this to a sub 4-4.30 programme - get a few more long slowies under your belt first. Hope that helps.

  • One day at a time Sam (with regards my eating!) - I think I'm just naturally greedy!

    Glad the work shop went well - I chum of mine from the running club said he had done one of your courses and really enjoyed it. It was quite a while ago and now he is one of our coaches!

    Oh dear - having pledged to do the run there is no backing out! I often tell my students what my session is for the evening and then they quiz me in the morning. The fact that it is written out for me makes it much easier - I am quite obedient really!image

    At the moment I'm still not out doing the megga runs so it is manageable... it gets tough at 15 and above for me. Largely being out for that length of time I think as much as anything else. How far will you run today?

    Tonight I am off to track - 1m jog, then 3 x 1 mile at 10k pace with 3 min recoveries, 1 mile jog! This is nice becsude they are all doing a 5 mile marathon pace session... hopefully I shall finish at a similar time to the bulk of the group if they also do warm up and cool down. Last week I was showing people my strength exercisesimage

    I'll try to be calmer about the paces - but as my hubby would testify I am a worrier!

    Have a great run!

  • Thanks. It's  a ten-miler today... I'm not doing a spring marathon - my main focus is a 10 mile race at end of this month and a march half marathon so alternating between shorter speedier long runs and slower longer ones.

    Have a good track session tonight - and really try to stick to the pace image

  • A ten mile race and 1/2 marathon sound much more civilised!

    After Paris I would love to try and crack 50 mins for a 10k!

    will def stick to the pace - working on 8:20 ish for each of the mile long intervals! will really endeavour to be consistent too. Garmin always looks hilarious for track sessions as round and round in perfectly neat patterns! 

  • Thanks for that Sam.

    Emma I agree. It is the really long runs which will be hard to plan around. Not just time on feet out running but also eating beforehand and eating/recovering afterwards. That is why I am doing my best to limit family disruption now.

  • Its tricky isn't it Kevster?I find myself clock watching on the last few miles of a run knowing that I need to be back to organise dinner, washing, reading to the boys etc. Hopefully in a few years they can come with me!image

     I also get anxious that i won't be able to do the distance or that I won't enjoy it - I know there are always going to be runs/sections of runs that aren't fun but I don't ever want to put myself off running.

    Sounds a bit mental but running has changed my life over the last 2 1/2 years and I want to do everything I can to keep running for as long as I am able! So dread thought that I'll not enjoy something and be put off! Each year I get a little more confident that I'll complete the distance but they remain tough.

  • Once you've done Paris - maybe you can go out occasionally without a watch and just enjoy it? image

    What is it about the runs that you don't enjoy? Is it when they get too quick to be comfortable?  You are allowed to slow down... I agree that enjoyment is the most important part - I might not be the best that I can be right now but I can say hand on heart that I always enjoy my runs even the hard ones but then I guess it's easy to say when there's no pressure on me!

    I hate to think of you not enjoying any part of this process. Try to remember that fitness is like a plant - it's inherent pattern is to grow.  The tricky part is allowing it to do so at the rate that's right for you as an individual!  When you start to worry just remind yourself that the more you enjoy it the more you'll want to do it and thereby the better you'll get!  Don't harder runs get more comfortable as you get fitter anyway?  You're going to be fine and do fantastically - repeat after me.... image

  • Sleepy Bear - You have really made me smile! imageThank you - loving the idea of my fitness being like a plant ... it needs right fuel and rest as well to thrive (eating has been better today!) and plan to get an early night!

    I think you are right - I am not very good at pushing myself out of my comfort zone (ie running in discomfort). Starting track traing has been a revalation - pushing till I'm pretty darned uncomfortable and then recovering. Making it manageable. You are right - as I get fitter (I think I might be a bit fitter already) I can push myself harder. When I'm out doing a run, I think I get frustrated that I can't manage the pace that I hope to be able to do in the future (or think I should be able to do now).

    When I am worried that I might not be back on time, for hubby going out to football etc. or later than we had planned so that I miss family time I don't enjoy the run. When I feel freer, know boys are having fun it is easier. When ever I finish a run I feel great - only about two exceptions to this over the last 2 1/2 years. The harder the run, the more elated I feel that I achieved it!

    I said in my application that one of my strenghts was being a perfectionist and that one of my weaknesses is also being a perfectionist - I put lots of pressure on myself. Before the Barns Green 1/2 in October I didn't sleep all night I wqs so worried about it!image

  • Hello all

    Emma - I can empathise, I feel exactly the same on LSR days. I usually head out early Sat or Sun morning, but always have to be back fo some activity or other!

    Sleepy Bear - love the plant analogy!

    I did 5 this morning before work, a bit tired this evening, but two of my chidlren are not well at the moment so a bit of extra stress!

  • "You can't fire a canon from a canoe" - build your base then fire up the pace stuff
  • Hi Emma good luck in Paris!! I like you did London marathon in 2010 and did it in 5.01, so we must have been close to each other, like you i got ballot place in 2011, but unfortunately was injured. I didn't run for 7 months and its taken me 6 months to get my fitness back and I am doing London again in April as I was able to carry my place over to 2012. Like you i would love to get a 4.30 marathon time, during my training for 2010 I was aiming and target for this, but found it difficult to obtain partially perhaps I didn't push myself due to the fear of hitting the wall, I hope you succeed and will be following your progress and taking on any advice that you may pass on!! One thing I have learn over the years of running is to just enjoy the run, the freedom it gives you and how lucky we are to have the gift of running. So just enjoy, and I am sure that with hard work and determination we will both get there, I will definitely think of you when I cross the line at 4.30. Lets hope i keep this confidence on race day LM, lol image
  • Just found out, Emma. Fantastic!!!! I know you will give it your all.
    Will pop back to see how you are doing. Xxxx
  • good luck to you
  • Hey Enmma,  good luck with th training.  I like you also turn 40 this year and I'm also training to be under 4:20.

    This is only my 2nd full marathon with my first time being 4:41.  With the support of everyone it's all achievable.   Think about the feeling at the end for a runner of of only 4 years there was nothing like it. ????

    Donna xx  

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