Overdone it?

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  • Wow, that sounds like a tough session in terms of remembering what you're meant to be doing as much as anything!

  • image It was the first session ever where I actually wrote it down on a piece of paper and took it with me!

  • That was a top workout on Tuesday Skinny. I think the balance of a big session once a week, supported with a ligher session later in the week is the way to go.

    We need to stay on top of the niggle, as otherwise it's all full steam ahead to unchartered pb land

  • Well that Tues session inspired me to get out of my comfort zone Skinny, but at 5:30am no way was i remembering that lot so i went for 6x800 off 90seconds jog.

    Intervals were 1,3,5 with a stiff breeze, 2,4,6 against

    3M w/u 8:42, 8:36, 8:09

    3.8M inc 6x800 3:04, 3:06, 3:00, 3:06, 3:00, 3:10

    1.5M c/d  9:30

    Total 8.3M

    Last interval was hard work and during no.3 i was thinking 4 would be as much as i could do so pleased to stick with it and managed to work the HR zone i was looking for. Thinks them paces may be a bit stiff for a 5k though image

  • Hi Mace - sounds like some good speeds on those intervals - particulalry for 5:30 in the morning - whilst I do a lot of my easy running early in the morning I jut can't face the intensity of the Tuesday session first thing - have planned it a couple of times but the thought of it makes me knock off the alarm and roll over!

    Whether its intervals, or tempo or just an LSR I always think the second quarter of the run is always the hardest mentally so that would tie in with number 3 being toughest.

    Have you got a 5k race lined up?

    Got another memory test for tonight. Hoping the groin (or whatever it is) holds up.

    Cheers, Skinny

  • To be honest i actually prefer the mornings now, but it's taken me a while to get used to it.

    No race lined up - at the moment i'm just taking it day by day

    Have done a couple of parkruns since Brighton. First was 21:4x about 3 weeks after and that was tough ( not surprisingly) . Then 3 weeks ago i did 20:20 in something like 6:50, 6:40, 6:15 + bits. Obvious target is sub 20.

    How many quality miles are you looking at this week ? Was thinking last week was a fair bit for a 40M week on just the Tuesday, and if your groin is dodgy .... ? 

    Let's hope it holds up ok

     

  • I'm same for easy runs - I'm running within 10 mins of rolling out of bed - however just the thought of running low 6:XX before 7am just sounds wrong!

    That parkrun 3 weeks ago looks like a sub 20 is within your reach with a properly paced effort. I've read about some parkruns that have 20 minute pace makers but never seen one at ours.

    The running tonight is at a fastest 10k pace (total quality of 4/5 miles- I think (am hoping) that it has been the 300m and diagonal sessions that have just aggravated my groin a little and it will be okay with the more normal running paces and a week of stretching will get me back to normal but I'm ready to bail out tonight if MP pace is painful.

    Cheers, Skinny

  • skinny, i thought it was the core stuff you'd been smashing that you thought was the route cause?

  • Hi Coach - less sure now because laid off core work completely from last wed as per your suggestion - fact I can still feel it now suggests may have been the faster shorter stuff or even a complete lack of groin stretching until thursday last week but I just don't know.

    So am heading out tonight and will play it by ear and report back - its fine at easy pace but need to see what it is like at faster paces - tonights run is perfect as it is graded so get to test it gradually at each lift in pace.

    Based on tonight we can then decide on the 100s set for  Friday.

    Cheers, Skinny

  • yep, if it's in any way discomfort or pain we'd definitely scrap those 100m walkbacks.

  • Session done - pleased I did it as clearer now what symptoms are - tonight don't feel like I've done any harm but won't overstate that till I see how it feels in morning.

    Basically at easy to steady pace I'm not really aware there is a problem. At all other paces I am dimly aware something  is not quite right  but no pain and at the faster paces that feeling is overridden by the pain of running at those paces!

    However where do notice it is the initial pick up of pace - I don't seem to be able to accelerate as quickly - the strides were a bit of a joke! 

  • Sure its groin related but feels like both of them? Anyway rest day tomorrow and then will message you as to where I'm at but pretty sure the 100s won't  be happening on Friday.

    Off to stretch my groins!

    Cheers, Skinny

    PS Only time it does actually hurt is if I sneeze - ouch!

  • The sneezing thing certainly sounds like a light strain.

    Keep up some icing, and a lot of stretching, both the groin and supporting muscles.

    Will certainly cut hard work until you lose this niggly feel.

  • Good thread Skinny.  I've just noticed it and will have to take time to have a proper read as we seem to have similar times, goals, experience and training mileage.

    I surprised myself just before Christmas by getting 40:15 for a 10k: That was after about 9 months of training.  This Sunday will be my first opportunity to try to improve on that so obviously I'm hoping for 39:xx.  It's the big local race with about 4000 runners and point to point; net uphill so not an obvious pb course, but I'll give it a go.

    I admit that I share your feeling of not being quite good or experienced enough to contrubute in on the Middle Ground and Stevie G's thread. Though that doesn't seem to stop me dishing out the benifit of my experience elsewhere. Would you be prepared to reveal what you consider to be good enough?

  • Agree with Lou...good thread as well Skinny - tend to read a few of the others from time to time too, it all helps towards ideas for training after all!

    Started posting on the Middle Ground thread to help motivate me more than anything, certainly not in relation to how experienced I am with my running though - I am still relatively new in terms of taking it more seriously, that's if 40 miles a week roughly as what I am running at the moment can be counted as serious! Getting some good ideas/advice from that thread along with upping the mileage with marathon training seems to have helped quite a bit this year so far though in knocking a fair bit of time off my PB's!

    My time targets are rather similar to yours too in that i'd like a sub 1:25 for a half as an A target in October! Keep up the good work!

  • Hi Lou - do you mean good enough to join me on here in which case pretty much any standard is good enough but it would be good to share training with people at a similar level which you are so welcome.

    OR

    Do you mean the targets I have set myself before I am allowed to post on either MG thread or SG thread? They are a bit more secret - I don't want to be making public statements about silly goals - that would risk ridicule although doesn't stop some!image

  • Hi WJH too - I read the MG thread every day and I must admit that catching up with your times is one of my stretch targets! Both threads are excellent for training ideas but both are dangerous (particularly the SG thread) if you don't know how easy it is to get injured.

    Even with SG help when I have finally gone short intervals at speed (and I would have done it a lot earlier if I had been working out my own training schedules) I've picked up a groin niggle - I'm sitting out this week (actually I'm doing a couple of very slow 1.5 mile jogs with my wife) and stretching and strengthening to try and get it right again - seems to be working already but like every runner with a minor injury I'm nervous it is going to linger on or get worse.

    Cheers, Skinny

  • PS Lou - good luck in the 10k on Sunday - big field for a 10k should give that adrenaline the magic PB BOOST!

  • Indeed Skinny - avoiding injury with the quality sessions is alway's on my mind! I found that not having any structure a few years ago got me injured...ITBS or something similar which would not go for months at one point and a sore achillies too! This was caused by running races at distances I had not properly trained for properly or targeting the totally wrong pacing in both training and races! Listening to my body has been half the battle since I started running properly again last year up to now - although I still lack any real training structure such as a training plan! Sounds sensible resting the groin - hope it clears up quickly!

    As for being good enough...isn't it more about determination? I personally have more respect for someone transforming their lifestyle (e.g. being overwight) and getting fit than someone who may be elite in their times but arn't prepared to put in that extra effort to make the most of their talent! An unfair example here but the only thing I can think of at the mo...as much as I admire what he's done, Usain Bolt sometimes fustrates me when people say he could run a fair bit faster than 9:58 but he seems too laid back to want to achieve that (time will tell over the coming years too)! Then again, none of us are in his position of being a Double Olympic champion! image 

  • Hi - re good enough - I think you're right - think determination and dedication probably overlap (possibly desperation too at my age!!).

    Totally agree with Usain Bolt but I wonder (despite his laid back appearance) if he actually does spend the time putting in the hard yards (or whatever sprinters do!) - he must do some work to hit sub 10 secs you would think?

    The not posting on MG thread originally was because the thread title is something like collaboration for improvement and I didn't have anything to offer (still don't really seeing as Stevie tells me exactly what to do) but since I set a goal time to allow me to post there have been many times where I've read a race report by one of you and I've wanted to say well done/fantastic times etc but have stopped myself so that when I hit that target time there will be Runners World forum way to mark it.

    Seriously don't think I'll ever be posting on SG thread because the target for that to happen is ridiculous but this time last year I thought a sub 1:35 HM was only just about in reach so you never know!

  • Skinny....there isn't a minimum entry requirement to the thread!

    If there was I might have to leave the way some of those chaps are progressing image

  • Yeah, I'd have to leave too, and then where would I learn my dodgy regional swearwords?

  • No - but I've set myself one and if I ever accept that I will never make that time then I may make one simple post saying I have given up!

    Lit - you are a supreme specimen of the fairer running sex and your position in races certianly gets you in there on merit!image

  • Skinny, I hope you haven't set a Tom style target time!

  • Skinny Fetish Fan wrote (see)

    Lit - you are a supreme specimen of the fairer running sex and your position in races certianly gets you in there on merit!image

    I like this. I might hang around here more often. They don't know how to talk to girls on that other thread...

  • Stevie G . wrote (see)

    Skinny, I hope you haven't set a Tom style target time!

    imageimageimage

  • I was thinking of what standard you had set for yourself. I have a couple of long term different world type goals that im sure won't be achievable without seriously neglecting the wife and kids.  I keep them to myself.

    Tomorrow's race is a big event and I doubt that will help. I'll need to make sure i line up in the right place. I did Stratford half a few weeks ago and started way back. First mile or two were about 1min down on my target.

    Just realised I've also got a 5 miler on Wednesday,  which I hadn't realised was so close. Will probably have monday off then easy 4m on tues, though I'm tempted to have two days rest. See how I feel.

     

  • hi Lou - good luck today  - I am spending my day in airports,planes and taxis travelling to germany for a meeting tomorrow.

    Would love to be running a 10k race instead. hope you get the sub 40.

    Cheers Skinny

  • Managed 40:10 which was a pb but still not quite managed to break the magic 40.  Excuses, excuses: Only one really and that is the point ot point route and the net increase of about 30m all of which comes in a steady climb through the middle of the route. 

    The rest of the course is undulating, but not overly so.  Slight congestion at the start and bit of a few sharp turns into the finish (about 100m from the finish I went round the penultimate corner, which was round the end of the castle wall and I was expecting a 90 degree turn: it was a full 180 degree U turn.  I amost ended up the moat!)

    Splits were: 6:30, 6:18, 6:39, 6:35, 6:17, 6:10, 1:41 (6:17 pace). 

    I'm happy with that - extrapolating 'what if' the route didn't have the net incline I'm comfortable that I could have run miles 3&4 in line with my target pace of 6:20, knocking off about 30-40 seconds.  Maybe next time.

    I've decided on two days full rest then a nice flat 5 miler on Wednesday evening.  I'm going to aim for 31:30 (6:18 pace) which is based on the 'what if' 10k time of 39:30.  Prepared to blow up, but hopefully not.

  • hi Lou - always good to run a PB and at least you'll have the fun of breaking 40 mins next time out - still 10 seconds has a bit of an ouch factor - once the race is finished its always hard to believe you couldn't have found 1 second each km.

    Although could have been a lot longer if you had finished in moat! 180 degree corners at end of a race??? what were they thinking about!

    Good luck with the 5 miler - really enjoyed it as a distance when I ran mine earlier this year.

    Cheers, Skinny

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