Overdone it?



  • DT19DT19 ✭✭✭

    I have been on diazepam since Friday. I have been suffering with a very tight middle back since January and following various physio sessions to loosen it off I went to the GP with a view to getting muscle relaxants, which these are.

    They have completely messed up my running this week with anything faster than 8.30 pace feeling like a big effort. Last day of them today, back is possibly 10% looser at best!

  • You lot are a mess! 

    Well done Mace, starting to sound like you will be the only one who makes London.

    I ran 2.5 miles last night with 7 intervals up some steps - I survived but I don't think my foot would stand a run today. Anyhow I wasn't planning on running again until possibly Saturday anyhow so that doesn't matter :smile:  
  • macemace ✭✭✭
    edited February 2019
    2.5 miles so soon after a parkrun is excellent considering where you were

    Do you have any pain that's telling you it wouldn't stand another run or is it a gut feel ? I think leaving it until Saturday would be wise whatever the answer.

    DT - maybe worth mentioning that i had a problem with my upper-middle back a few years ago. It seems to have been caused by my desk layout, i was turning my upper body ( without swivelling my chair fully ) ever so slightly to the right when using my screen which was positioned to the right side of my desk. It was fine a few days after re-jigging the layout. Before OH noticed this, i went to my doctor who showed me a diagram of the potential source of upper-middle back problems - pretty much everywhere, it's spaghetti junction central  !!
  • Pain is too strong but more than a gut feel.

    Funnily enough my desk layout is almost exactly what you describe except that screen is on my left and I don't swivel my chair fully either - I'm doing it now whilst typing this. I filled in one of those EHS checklists once and that was one of my red boxes but no-one ever came to see me about it - perhaps I was supposed to sort it myself......................... :/
  • Well done on the 2.5 miles Skinny.  Heading in the right direction.

    I have been a little off colour too.  Not sure why and I'm just going to put it down to tiredness after a couple of consecutive nights of hardly any sleep.  I had to stop several times on Monday's run, felt hot and sick and just couldn't find a rhythm.  

    Yesterday's run was better albeit slower.  Today's run felt easy but again was slower.  Hoping that after a day's rest tomorrow I'll be back into the swing of things.  Slightly worried that I've pushed things too much over the last few months (not doing easy runs easy enough) and now suffering.  Next couple of days will tell.


  • Sorry everyone is crocked. Get well soon! 

    I did some more intervals today. Only 5x600m in the interests of a mini taper ahead of Warwick half on Sunday. I had a bit of a tight lunchbreak to fit them into so was only 4m total. Getting up early tomorrow for 9 before work. Should be 12 but mini taper. I'll just do a short run day before. 

    I had to pop the massive blister as it was truly obscene. Hope they heal before Sunday. 
  • Hope everyone gets their niggles sorted soon.

    Not posted for a wee bit, more lurking but still plodding away with running. Club tonight fartlek session which I do like.

  • mace said:
     Is it possible you're at your limit ?

    10M progression out and back along the seafront this morning was supposed to be 12 but i missed the alarm and still had to squeeze that in. Did the last 5k in about 23mins which felt like it was somewhere around threshold effort.
    Well done.

    I think it's reasonable to suggest I've reached a limit. Son was ill with a stomach bug earlier in the week too. The combo of work stress and running stress has probably left me vulnerable. So I took 48 hrs of rest then got out for a LT test last night after work. The good news was LT pace is still creeping up and I felt decent for 7 miles. The bad news is that the weather is looking shocking (strong winds, heavy rain) for this weekend's half. So it may be a case of mini-taper becomes no taper and just use the half to get the long run miles in.
  • DT19DT19 ✭✭✭

    Yes, no doubt work is contributing somewhere. When I was off Friday-Sunday last week it felt so much better then come Monday afternoon it was solid again.

    It does however feel a fair bit better now and more like I just need a sports massage to iron it out.

    I managed an lsr last of 12 miles. Kept the pace and effort very very low at 8.40mm/126bpm. Not sure what i'll do today, possibly a light session as I have a big run sunday.

  • 10 miles at just over HMP (7:18 instead of 7:15) done today.  Quite happy with that.  40 miles for the week or thereabouts.  Feeling much better at the end of this week compared to how I felt on Monday/Tuesday.  
  • Well Newport was a soggy one though thankfully the wind wasn't too bad until about an hour into the race.

    It was an interesting course, staying mainly riverside with a run around a castle and then sticking mainly to the valley floor.

    Still, there were a few energy sapping short hills to deal with and a few bottlenecks and cycle traps to negotiate which wasn't really too bothersome- with no tapering it was never going to be an all out run with something riding on it.

    I  managed to hold the effort quite well, maybe dropping off towards the end as I ended up in no man's land and relaxed. I was pleasantly surprised to round the corner to the finish to see that I had a chance to just dip under 1.18 on chip with a sprint finish. There appears to have been a hiccup with the results processing and they have yet to emerge, so no idea whether I accomplished that  nor the position I finished but possibly top 10 ? There weren't many people around at the finish though it seemed like loads had steamed off ahead of me at the start.
  • McFloozeMcFlooze ✭✭✭
    Well done, Muddy. It was indeed very soggy today. 

    10 miles at HMP, David? Wow...that seems like a very hard session! 

    Warwick half today was wet. And as undulating as ever. I didn't quite feel recovered from the week, tired legs and tried hard but my heart rate never passed 160. Managed to get 1.39 but had been hoping for a bit faster. But all said am fairly pleased. Hopefully in better shape after a rest. 

  • DT19DT19 ✭✭✭
    edited March 2019
    David, that is a big session if the pace is right. Remind me what is the target half? 

    Mcf, well done on a tough morning. 

    Well done also, Muddy. My mate finished about 25 seconds ahead of you looking on strava. 

    20 with 12 at mp today. Started with an easy 5. then into a session of 5 (1), 4 (1), 3 (1). Was feeling pretty comfortable with it all (relative of course to the session) so the last mp mile (so mile 19) i decided to open out the legs for a 6.28 but just to be clear im not suggesting that was sustainable. 

    Off to Edinburgh Friday morning so just 4 day training week to come. 
  • Great time Muddy and well done.  I'm sure the official time wont be too different.  I was feeling quite good about my pace until I saw your entry on Strava so cheers for that! 

    DT -target for the half is 7:15m/m. Because I only had around an hour and a half to play with I set out quick and just turned it into a bit of a training session.  I've done 8 at HMP before so thought I'd try and hold on for 10 and see what happens.  Was slightly under but that's ok, didnt feel too drained after it either.   HR was pretty high throughout though.   

    Great time McFlooze.  If it was as windy there as it was here then well done.

  • Well done Muddy and McFlooze - sub 1:18 in a I can't really be arsed way is pretty ridiculous!

    I would suggest, as I'm sure would others, that you have trained beyond your true current training zones David. HMP is clearly not HMP for you now.

    Is the race soon? If so no need to change anything but I think you will find that you will find 7mm fairly comfortable in the actual target HM.

    I did parkrun in 31:09 with the littlest Skinny - her first one. Foot okay afterwards - going to try 3 miles tonight before UniChall.
  • literatinliteratin ✭✭✭
    OMG, I'd forgotten all about UniChall. Was just about to comment on everyone's runs (well done to the half marathoners, and that's a bonkers training run David) but now I'm too excited. In running news I accidentally took 2 weeks off (except for two short runs) and don't even care, so that tells me just how enthusiastic I am about London. I was meant to be doing a 10 mile race on Sunday but I decided to stay home and eat cake instead.
  • macemace ✭✭✭
    Top stuff muddy, not a lot wrong with you if you can knock out a comfortable sounding 1:18

    DH, unless you're some sort of training monster, i'd have a significant wager that your HM pace is a fair bit quicker than 7:15, probably sub 7.

    sounds like a good training run, marathon training is all about running on tired legs

    43 for me last week so i've averaged 47 last 3 weeks. Totally shattered yesterday after a 6am start Saturday with 16M then the rest of the day up and down ladders round my parents' place overboarding ceilings. So a total doss day yesterday watching the wind and rain from the sofa in between football on the box.
  • Tommy2DTommy2D ✭✭✭

    Muddy - good gong for a non raced half marathon. 

    McF - Good stuff, an undulating half marathon on tired legs in the middle of marathon training is never going to be easy. 

    David - as per the above. Based on your 5K time and you seemingly be able to crunch out many miles of 'HMP' at ease then you'll be well under your goal time when you come to race the half. 

    I been plugging away with the training, although I did have a very low mileage week (15) a couple of weeks ago but hopefully nothing too damaging. I ran a local 10k yesterday, after a 17.5 mile run with 9 at MP on Thursday I wasn't ever going to be in any shape to race it properly. However, I thought HMP would make for a decent workout, and as I'm not DH I can't run further than about 3 miles in one go at HMP in training I can only do that sort of session in a race environment. Ran it with my mate and it went pretty much to plan, although I did end up running a touch quicker than HMP as I finished in 39:45. Felt comfortably hard, but definitely a bit sharp for HM effort closer to 10 mile I guess. 

    The course was a bit of a joke, it used to be a perfectly good 2 lap 10k course organised by the council with around 300 people doing it. The council have contracted the race out to a commercial venture and in order to get more entrants they have re-routed the course around an industrial estate and local roads, with motorcycle barriers to dodge round, two way running on a narrow footbridge etc. The lead bike had to stop at the water station for a drink and then gave up as he couldn't keep up with the front runner?! The lead runner then got sent the wrong way and ended up only running 5.9 miles (but was still given the win), he was not happy...  
  • McFloozeMcFlooze ✭✭✭
    31 minutes is a great time for a first Parkrun, Skinny.  Congrats to her!  

    Lit - maybe you needed the rest. Also you have a puppy to play with.  Will you still do London?  
  • literatinliteratin ✭✭✭
    McF - no, it's a long way to go just to jog round, and expensive too if I have to pay for accommodation. I'll see when I can be bothered to start running again and maybe look at some races later in the spring/summer which I normally wouldn't do because I'd be recovering from the marathon.
  • macemace ✭✭✭
    lit - i can sympathise with that, 15 months ago i was starting to feel quite fit in December and considering maybe being able to pace a then clubmate V70 to the British Record in London ( i think it was about 3:10 ) then a couple weeks of virtually no training due to illness followed by Xmas and the CNBA fairy was in like a shot. 

    Been close to giving up this time on a couple of occasions but this is my last go on GFA and i always said i'd like to jog one and take the atmosphere in so this is the chance.
  • Skinny - race is on 24 March.  Well done to little Skinny on her first Parkrun.  May it be the first of many.

    Thanks for the advice everyone.  Just so I can get my head around what a two week taper should look like, am I looking at mostly easy miles with perhaps some strides?  Should I be reducing the mileage as well?  Say perhaps 30 the week before followed by another 30 but with that including the race?

    Thanks as always.
  • I should perhaps have mentioned that the littlest Skinny is 21 :-)

    David - taper is always a personal thing that is hard to get right but you want to be fresh for race but still sharp.

    I think your plan sounds sensible. SG always had me doing a progressive 14 the Saturday before a big Sunday half (so 8 days before) with 4 at Easy, 3 at Steady, 3 at MP, 3 at HMP plus 1 CD.

    Then race week had maybe a 3 * 1 mile at 10k pace on the Tuesday and some strides in a short run the day before plus maybe 5 miles on the Thursday so about what you describe.

    Cut the volume, keep a little intensity - don't do much at all in 4 days leading up to race but don't do nothing.

    Lit that's a shame but if crossing the line holding hands with Mace can't tempt you then I guess you really shouldn't be giving up a weekend pus all the expense to do it.
  • muddyfunstermuddyfunster ✭✭✭
    edited March 2019
    Good work McFlooze, all those hills and rain - a 1.39 is massive !

    DT - I could see a chap in a cap ahead of me towards the end, that him ? Dare I ask age category ? That's a big session to be getting through.

    David, I like to keep mileage down by about a third in the two weeks before a target half. Workouts tend to be in the short, sharp area rather than long tempo runs. Ideally my 'taper' would be a 10k race 2 weeks out (with 3m before and after), then a 6x400m fast session within the penultimate week once feeling recovered from the 10k, and a parkrun all out. Because of that all out park run, I'm not fond of a big long run the day after - that would be 10-12 miles with no heroics. Finally 3 miles half effort on Tuesday of the race week, then a two or three recovery bimbles before the race.

    I'm not feeling too shabby today so will get a bit of recovery running done.

  • Thanks for the advice guys :smile:
  • DT19DT19 ✭✭✭
    edited March 2019

    Muddy, he posted 1.17.36 on Strava. I am not certain on his exact age, however the first comment on his strava post for the race was someone wishing him happy 40th birthday Vet. His comment under the race was 'bad day, must be my age catching up with me'. So I am going out on a limb here and saying he turned 40 over the last few days.

    Yes, it was a big old session, but mentally was much easier than a straight 12 at mp. Physically, the 1 mile intervals didn't help much as they broke up momentum and meant starting again on increasingly tiring legs. Obviously they did provide some cv recovery though.

    Tommy, sounds like a decent outing and solid time for the effort involved.

    Stick with it, Mace. You'll regret it come 28th April if you let it go now.

    Well done, Skinny and daughter!

    7 miles at recovery effort first thing, spin tonight.

  • Stevie  GStevie G ✭✭✭
    edited March 2019
    Great time Muddy and well done.  I'm sure the official time wont be too different.  I was feeling quite good about my pace until I saw your entry on Strava so cheers for that! 

    DT -target for the half is 7:15m/m. Because I only had around an hour and a half to play with I set out quick and just turned it into a bit of a training session.  I've done 8 at HMP before so thought I'd try and hold on for 10 and see what happens.  Was slightly under but that's ok, didnt feel too drained after it either.   HR was pretty high throughout though.   

    Great time McFlooze.  If it was as windy there as it was here then well done.

    When your training paces level out in a year or 2, you'll find that 10miles at HMP is one to file in the "insane, bordering on nigh impossible solo" folder

    A local nutter did that exact sesh pre the local half, then 10 days later managed to go slower in the actual race

    Muddy - another cracking HM turnout for you
  • Stevie G - I definitely do not want to do what he did and go slower.  In my defense I didn't set out with that in mind and the paces did fluctuate (it's rather hilly in some parts too).  It was more "if I get to 8 miles and I feel good then I'll crack on and try to simulate race pace for another 2".

    I'm fully aware that 10 @ HMP is ludicrous.  I shudder when I  think about doing 6 or even 2 x 3.  Though those sessions now don't seem as daunting as they used to a few months ago.

    What I don't want to do is pin too much on this race and then for whatever reason, be it wind or heat, miss my goal time and then get dejected.  This is just one race and there will no doubt be others.  There's a local parkrun that I have my eye on winning.  I reckon a time of sub 19 should do it which is very achievable.  
  • McFloozeMcFlooze ✭✭✭
    Sounds sensible, Lit.  The expense and the recovery for even jogging around a marathon is off putting.  

    There were fun and games at Warwick.  Two guys at our club came in 2nd and 3rd place, switching places the whole way round.  Turns out they BOTH broke the years old HM club record along the way.  Just shows the power of friendly competition and race day magic!  

    4 miles super-easy recovery at lunchtime has transformed me from a creaky mess to feeling just about ok. 

    And in feet news (I know you'll be excited to hear) the new Saucony Guide's, the DT reco'ed foot cream and some of those Ininji toe socks have meant yesterday's half marathon has left my feet completely unscathed.  The toe condoms I had earlier in the week protected them whilst they were healing through a couple of longish runs so would recommend those as well.
  • Well done on the sub 40 10k Tommy - missed your post. Likewise Skinny setting up a running dynasty !

    McF - That sounds like a very good combo for a wet race scenario, I was starting to develop a blister yesterday as chafing took hold.

    The real damage was done elsewhere  :( That was purely through lack of prevention - the long drive to the race and the search for parking left me in a bit of a rush and I neglected some crucial dabs of bodyglide.

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