Overdone it?

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  • DT19DT19 ✭✭✭

    Sounds nasty, Kevin. Hope you all get well soon.

    O think parkrun returning will be the spark a lot of people need to get their mojo back, Mr V. I'll give it a few weeks to settle down then get along to one for a sub 18 crack.

    About the same here, Muddy, 38m for the week.

    Sounds like a speedy session, Tommy.

    Building my long run back up so 12.5m on Sunday. Didn't get out until midday and the sun came out last few miles. Even though it wasn't hot by any means, it certainly takes that bit more out of you.

    Decent session lunchtime of 8 x 1k of 90s slow jog. Reps came in 3.33, 3.33, 3.29, 3.28, 3.32, 3.28, 3.26 and 3.36 giving me bang on 10k in 38.48. I was a bit annoyed by the last rep however I was leaving my loop and it was entirely directly into the wind whereas the others had enjoyed a bit of everything. Decent sharpener for my 10k in 16d days though.

    Few easy days now before a return of Friday tempo runs.

  • DT19DT19 ✭✭✭
    Decent 10k over lunch at mara pace/effort. Progressed things along in second half for splits of 6.24, 6.24, 6.26, 6.22, 6.15 and 6.14 for 39.27 overall.  Nice to be back doing these again.
  • Tommy2DTommy2D ✭✭✭
    Very decent session that, DT. 

    The fourth of the Soar sessions yesterday for me yesterday; 5*3 minutes off 90 seconds jog recovery. All went pretty well, the reps felt controlled and reckon I could have eased out a couple more if requested. 

    Fingers crossed that parkrun does return on 5th June as the plan seems to be getting me in some sort of 5K shape. 

    The 10K I've entered for July pinged out an email earlier this week saying that the event is in doubt as it's unlikely that the repair work to the paths which much of the race is ran on will be completed by mid-July. Will have to try and find another!  
  • DT19DT19 ✭✭✭
    Nice session, Tommy. Found anything else?

    46m for week with 10k at mp on Friday at 6.21mm and an easy half today at 7.44mm. Feel more tired than I'd expect from running in the warmer temps. Reminds me how hard training for an Autumn mara is. 
  • Mr VMr V ✭✭✭
    DT I know what you mean about the warmer temps. It felt very humid on my 11 miler yesterday. Sounds like you are now pretty well recovered from your marathon. Is the 10k this coming weekend?

    I was back on track with 40 miles for the week. Had hoped it would all be feeling a bit easier by now and sessions would be a bit quicker. But we all know patience is key with running so I'm sure I'll get there. 


  • Tommy2DTommy2D ✭✭✭
    Morning all

    DT - Nothing to replace the fast flat 10k at the moment. However, I've seen that the Dartmoor fell race series is going to take place from June - September, which is 10 races, which hopefully I'll be able to do most if not all of them. Bit different to what I had in mind but I love running on the moors and these races will be pretty low key so it will be a good chance to ease myself back into racing ahead of an early autumn half marathon or something. 

    6:21min/miling for marathon will put you close to 2:45?  I'm assuming you're doing Berlin next year rather than this?

    40 mile sis a decent total, Mr V. What sort of sessions are you doing?

    25 miles running and 15 miles cycling for me last week. I'm enjoying the two speed sessions per week but am a bit conscious that they do make up quite a lot of my overall weekly mileage but I'm surviving so far but will keep an eye on things. 
  • DT19DT19 ✭✭✭

    Mr V, Yes I certainly feel ready to get going again. 10k race is a week Thursday and half mara is 30th May, albeit the one I entered at Chepstow race course cancelled last week due to on-going restrictions in Wales. After a short panic I found one on the same day at Kempston race course. Slightly further drive but later start at 11.30.

    40M is a decent volume for non mara training. It'll just all click into place out of the blue. That's the oddest thing about all this, nothing for a while, then suddenly you wake up one day and something has happened.

    Tommy, 6.21mm was pretty much the pace I ran the last 10k in Dorney so I felt for a standalone 10k training run it wasn't an outlandish pace and HR was below the 160 line.

    Yes, I fancy a decent crack at what will probably be the only ever October VMLM. I'll do Berlin next year then have deferred my NY spot hopefully to 2023. I don't really want all the will it won't it nonsense that a foreign event comes with right now. I'd rather things settle and when I do get there have a near normal Berlin/NY experience.

    Yes, 2 speed sessions off 25m is a lot if by speed you mean 1k reps or below. If you mean quality sessions and one is say a mp run then not too bad given half the people I know still seem to run everything at around that effort anyway.

  • muddyfunstermuddyfunster ✭✭✭
    I saw something on FB about Glastonbury Flats 10k Tommy - is that reachable for you ? I think it's a new one.

    14 miles of running for me last week - busy at work so couldn't make my usual lunchtime runs. Grrr. I'll be able to do more this week.






  • Tommy2DTommy2D ✭✭✭
    DT - the plan typically has 1 session of shorter reps and one tempo / fartlek run per week so not too bad. However, the volume and/or speed that they suggest can be at the tougher / impossible end of the scale so I modify them as necessary.  

    Sounds like a decent plan with the marathons. You'll have to get yourself booked into Tokyo and Chicago to complete the set. 

    Muddy - yeah I did see that, I think it took place on BH weekend and I already had plans. I did see somewhere that they're hoping to hold another event on the same course in the autumn, which I'll keep an eye out for as it does look a good fast course. 
  • Mr VMr V ✭✭✭
    Tommy - mainly tempo and long intervals at the moment. Pretty much making it up as I go along but with a vague plan in my head of the types of session I want to cover. Looks like you should be in good shape for a quick 5k when oarkrun returns.

    DT - yep tends to work that way doesn't it! I've had a couple of really promising sessions but they seem to be one offs with the following sessions being slower again. Probably just accumulated fatigue as the body is adjusting to more regular running  I guess. Glad to see you've found a replacement for the HM. Looking forward to seeing some new shorter distance pbs for you!
  • DT19DT19 ✭✭✭

    Mr V, yes looking forward to improving some other times and also hopefully getting some 'threshold times' such as sub 80 half.

    My loose plan was to run all the majors by the time I am 50, however that was on the basis that I was doing NY and Berlin in 2020. I've effectively lost 2-3 years off an already tight schedule.

    Incidentally, it seems very unlikely that parkrun will recommence as planned. Apparently, despite parkruns slightly strong arm approach to event hosts, only 20% of parkruns have received permission to go again from 05th June. Based on parkruns own argument to landowners as to why they should give permission (being that it is essential that all parkruns start at the same time to ensure that individual events aren't overwhelmed with participants) then on those number they cannot really sanction a return.

  • Tommy2DTommy2D ✭✭✭
    Yes I saw that they were struggling to get approval for a lot of the events. From what I saw they hadn't got approval from some pretty major landowners such as the National Trust, I'm sure it's not straight forward but I would have thought engaging with organisations such as that in the first instance to gauge what their position is rather than the very public way they've gone about it would have been a better approach. 

    I'll keep following the Soar sessions, they may decide to carry them on beyond the proposed target 'race' day of 5th June, in which case I'll continue with them, if not I may run it as Time Trial and see how I get on. I'm going to have to get some hilly off road runs scheduled too in advance of these summer fell races. 

    Mr V - longer reps tend to be my go to interval type session but I have enjoyed the 70 seconds and 200m reps prescribed by the plan over the last couple of weeks, might be worth giving something shorter a blast. 
  • DT19DT19 ✭✭✭
    Tommy, yes I'd see national trust were a straight no. I guess their priority must be getting up and running first of all for their core business activity. 
  • DT19DT19 ✭✭✭

    First poor session today in some time. No idea what was wrong, just didn't have a top gear, which is reflected in fact my HR topped out at high end tempo hr, however effort felt much more.

    Was 6 x 1m of 1 min walk, aiming for HMP moving towards 10kp. After rep 2 I was struggling and ready to pack it in and by reps 5 and 6 I had to double the recovery time which helped, but didn't improve my enjoyment.

    Reps came out 5.56, 5.49, 5.53, 5.53, 5.52 and 5.50, which doesn't look all that bad, it was just more how hammered I felt, proper hands to knees stuff after rep 2 onwards.

  • Tommy2DTommy2D ✭✭✭
    Good to see that you are human, DT! Good effort to modify and complete the session even if it did knock you about a bit. 

    Next of the Soar sessions for me earlier; 12 *45 seconds at faster than 5k pace off 45 seconds recovery. Up and down a wind blasted park a few times, managed to get all the reps in the 5:20-5:30 mixer which seems about right I think. 
  • Mr VMr V ✭✭✭
    Sounds pretty decent to me DT and well done on toughing out the session. I've not been so disciplined in recent times and cut short a few sessions.

    Tommy, sounds nippy. I took you're advice and did a shorter session of 12x 90 seconds today @ 5k ish pace. Quite enjoyed it and covered exactly 5k in 18 minutes which seemed about right.
  • Tommy2DTommy2D ✭✭✭
    Good stuff, Mr V, good pace on those reps. I quite like 90 seconds as a rep length as you can stuck in to them but know that they're not so long that they're going to be painful. 

    DT - just seen on FB that the insane parkrun not far from you that I did a couple of years ago, Churchfields, isn't going to be restarting. Shame as that was a bit of an infamous course with all the twists and turns and up and downs. Also Exeter won't be restarting. Can see a few more getting canned over the next few eeks and months. 
  • DT19DT19 ✭✭✭

    Tommy, yes they announced that quite a while, or at least the business that's based on the land did. They cited reasons along the lines of that coming out of the pandemic, outdoor events etc that they had developed to keep things going, such as fairy trail etc were going to remain and as such it was their intention to concentrate on their core business area.

    So equally I can see other host venues who have perhaps adapted their land use over the last 15 months may also take the same view.

    Decent session there, Mr V.

    Recovery run yesterday then 7m easy today. Standard Friday tempo tomorrow.

  • Tommy2DTommy2D ✭✭✭
    Next of the soar sessions for me last night; 20 minutes at 'tempo' as I haven't really got a good idea of what my current fitness is at the moment I just went by feel / perceived effort (muddy will approve I'm sure). Came out quite nicely with all the miles within a couple of second of each other at an average of 6:22, which I guess is the right ball park. 

    I've had a message from the organiser of the 10K I've entered in July. Almost certainly the original route is a no go but they have found an alternative location. No idea what the course will be like but they have said it will be measured etc. Once they release more details I have the option to get my money back if it's not what I'm after which is fair enough. 

    My mate from Nottingham is doing this tomorrow (and into Sunday)

    https://www.climbsouthwest.com/events/devon-coast-coast/

    I'm going to hopefully do a few miles with him first thing tomorrow and then wave him on his way. 
  • DT19DT19 ✭✭✭

    Good session there, Tommy. That event looks 'fun', how did it go?

    You can't ask for fairer than that from them really. Hopefully it'll be a decent course.

    Tempo Friday went well. Usual execution is to be trying to work at 160 bpm. Felt sluggish at first and like a bit too much effort but settled in after a few miles and gradually progressed it with splits of 6.18, 6.22, 6.23, 6.20, 6.18, 6.15 and 6.13 for 6.18 average and 158 bpm. Possibly the slight upgrade in pace of mile 1 was the issue as the first mile normally comes in around 6.30. I suspect had it been a  peak level 10m tempo it would have come out around 6.15 and just over 160bpm, which looking back isn't out of line with what I was doing in March so still in good shape.

    I was out all day Saturday with a few friends, starting off with a lengthy game of footgolf, followed by an afternoon/evening of beers with the footy. So Saturday I Just did my s and c work first thing. Luckily as I am racing Thursday, yesterdays run was just an easy 8m.

    A few easy days this week now then 10k Thursday evening.

    Where's Skinny gone? Hope it's being busy not being injured.

  • Tommy2DTommy2D ✭✭✭
    Morning all

    I headed over to meet my mate on Saturday morning and did about 4 miles with him as he started his journey across Devon. It was all a bit odd at the start as it was a staggered so people could start as the pleased after they'd had a kit check and their number scanned, the first footpath was really muddy and a bit of a hill to go up so everyone was running v slowly / walking. My mate unfortunately DNF'd after about 80 miles (still another ~30 miles to go), he'd been injured in the build up to the race and the weather was utterly appalling for them over Dartmoor so understandable why he called it a day. Just had a quick look at the results and the winner finished in about 25 hours, madness. 

    Looks like a decent session in the end, DT. Wonder if you still have a bit of residual fatigue from the marathon as your last couple of sessions have felt harder work?

    Got a bit of a busy week this week so had to juggle things around a bit, which meant I did the next of the soar sessions last night rather than today. 6*800m at 5k pace with 2 mins recovery. First three were into the wind and second three were wind assisted. Massively overcooked the last 2 reps as they came out at 5:30 pace which definitely isn't my 5k pace, but I did have the wind at my back and I was trying, unsuccessfully, to get home before the impending heavy rain. Feeling a bit goosed today but think that's a combination of sticking the session in a day earlier than normal and on Sunday evening (won't be doing that again in a hurry). 

    Yes hope Skinny, Kevin etc are all ok.  
  • DT19DT19 ✭✭✭

    Tommy, yes Saturday was not a day for being out running for many many hours! 80m is a big investment to cut your losses from, but then 30m remaining is also still a long way.

    I think it's OK to slightly overcook the last two reps, particularly when wind assisted. It's the first two reps that ned to have a lid kept on.

    Could be that, or just accumulated fatigue from getting back to decent sessions and not quite having recaptured my rhythm. Easy 4m today and spin later.

  • DT19DT19 ✭✭✭

    Ticked over and kept it light this week. 4.5m yesterday with 4 x 1m at effort off 1 min. Rest day today ready for tomorrow night.

    Sadly the weather seems to be over involved with 19mph winds forecast in the area, so throw in running around an airfield and i'm left with probably not being able to seriously challenge those just ahead of me on the TTT.

  • kevin70kevin70 ✭✭✭
    DT good luck on Thursday hopefully weather changes, regardless you are running great.

    Tommy you are building up sessions, massively overcooked sounds like my reps all the time.

    Managed to get out over the past couple of weeks to build up miles, also bought a bike and looking to get out on it too.

    Hope everyone else is doing ok
  • Tommy2DTommy2D ✭✭✭
    Fingers crossed the weather is better than forecasted for you, DT. 

    Kevin, glad to hear you've built back up after illness. Enjoy the bike, I'm hoping to get out on mine a bit more but the current weather isn't really conducive to road cycling at the moment. 

    Easy few miles for me on Monday, legs were feeling pretty battered after the reps on Sunday. Club run last night was pretty tough going but brilliant fun; 6.5 mile fell run with about 1250ft of elevation gain including a massive and steep climb after about 5.5 miles.

    Rest day today to coincide with getting my Moderna vaccine. Currently feel ok apart from being a bit tired, fingers crossed I feel ok tomorrow for a 'split tempo' 
  • DT19DT19 ✭✭✭

    Good to see you are getting back out there, Kevin.

    How's the post-vaccine situation, Tommy?

    Well the forecast has now worsened for tonight a little further. Nothing I can do to change and I've got nothing to lose in going hard. I've a half mara in 10 days so at least this'll serve as a decent training effect for that.

    To counter the wind, I weighed this morning and i'm 11lb lighter than my last 10k, which was my pb run. I am setting my expectations, in view of the weather, on my pb time as opposed that time trial I knocked out at end of February as that came with perfect conditions.

  • Tommy2DTommy2D ✭✭✭
    Yes all good thanks, felt a little bit spaced out last night but other than that feel fine. Will head out for a run later and see how everything feels but hopefully have got away with minimal side effects.  

    The wind is properly gusting around here at the moment, not particularly looking forward to my tempo session shortly. Good luck battling it tonight!
  • DT19DT19 ✭✭✭
    edited May 21

    No real glory to report sadly. 10 mins before the Start, whilst vested and standing around, the heavens opened and the wind picked up. 

    I had kind of talked myself out of a big effort due to weather and prospect of getting anything out of it

    We started slightly uphill but also directly into an obscene headwind. At 400m I wanted to go home and felt I'd capitulate and do well to run sub 39. 

    I persevered however with splits of 5.53, 6.01, 5.47, 6.06, 6.02, 5.54 and 6.19 for the last 400m (uphill and straight in the driving wind and rain!) and hung on tightly to a 37.22 (5.58mm) so a nominal 12s pb. Not what I was after but the weather was atrocious. I really did feel like I was hanging on by the skin of my teeth the whole time however.

    Finished 10th and 2nd in age. Some basic po10 stalking and it appears I faired relatively better than my fellow runners. I think I'm one of 2 pbs in the top 15 with most 60-90s off theirs. So hopefully I'm not as far off a strong 36, pushing sub 36 as that time might suggest. 

    What was interesting was that my average hr was 168,  5 less than my Feb tt. I've noticed this in spin and running sessions in last 2 weeks, as per my recent poor session, I can't seem to work hard enough to take my HR into that top end zone. 

    There was a guy in 4th in a HP vest who finished in 35.xx, Tommy.

  • Mr VMr V ✭✭✭
    DT sounds like a decent effort all things considered. I always think it's hard to really push when conditions are bad as you know the time won't be as good as it could be.

    Do you have any other 10ks in the race plan or is that it for now?
  • Tommy2DTommy2D ✭✭✭
    Nicely one, DT! Never knock a PB, particularly when it was gained during those conditions. Next time out I'm sure you'll take a significant chunk off that. 

    Yes, the lad who finished 4th is one of my good mates, he gave me the lowdown on the conditions, sounded pretty grim! I know a couple people who did the 10 miler, that must have been soul destroying. 

    'Split Tempo' for me last night; 9 minutes at ~10k pace, 3 mins walk recovery, 7 minutes at ~10k pace. Managed to plot a route with a lot of sections with the wind behind me for the 10k paced efforts but still felt like hard work. 

    With parkrun not returning until late June it gives me 3 extra weeks training to hopefully get closer to 5K PB shape.   
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