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Paris Marathon 2013
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James B - it was, no sweat, well done.
Chris - welcome.
Daddsy - my long runs are the slowest ever; I'm hoping for 6min/km at marathon - but I always do and fail miserably... The vaseline mistake - indeed, only made once... (I don't wear plasters - some do, it seems.)
Daddsy - ouch
Iron Man 2 - I'm hoping for 6 min/km too and I'm doing LSRs at about 6:25 - what are yours?
James B as long as its filled in and has the doctors signature and stamp then you'll be fine
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If anyone here is missing from the list, or your details are incorrect, please let me know..
James - As Orbutt said as long as the form is filled in, signed and stamped you'll be good.
ATM - Sorry to hear your having to skip some training.
I went out for another 9 miles tonight and managed a 9:06 m/m average pace. A nice 24 second a mile improvement over the exact same route from last night. I felt like I was actually running slower. It's funny how the mind/body tricks you regarding what pace you're actually doing over what you think you're doing.
I must admit I never vaseline (unless we're taking about the band), bandage or invest in plasters for my tits! I only ever suffer runners nipple in extremely wet conditions since starting to use Brooks running tops for most of my runs.
Mausey, glad you are now in the connected world again. How has your first month living in the northern hemisphere been?
Did 6kms of tempo running today at lunchtime with a few kms each side for wucd. Was a bit of a struggle. Would say I am about 15-20 seconds down on pace per km compared to say, a year ago. But did I mention I can run again?! Coolio.
Cut short my run tonight. Knee hurting. Going to rest a few days as i think tiredness is an issue. Week 9 and 10 turning into weeks to forget.
Bring it on.
TD - Great to hear your back running again and 10-15 seconds down per km is nothing after the lay off you've had.
I did the Poole Marathon in 1993. I hated it! But it was a really hot (June) day and in those days when we didn't have mobile phones I couldn't find my companions after the race which caused a lot of stress. I did 3:21 but felt very very ill and so I have always wanted to do another to see if the problem was pushing myself too hard in the heat or if I really just don't like marathons! I was obviously pleased with my time though and so there was a part of me that wanted to leave it at that. I am under no illusion that I won't be able to do it as quickly now whatever the weather!
I've done a few random half marathons in between in Basingstoke (lived in Hampshire for several years) and in Bradford (where I live now) and a couple of years ago I did the South Lakes - a very hilly and very hot one!
I have always fancied Paris as I lived in France for a year and am a bit of a francophile. This is the third time I have had a place - first time I just never really got going with my training and the second time I got injured after making the classic mistake of trying to get back my miles too quickly after a combination of illness and then snow sidelined me for a few weeks. I have never really been one to learn from my mistakes so often get injured!! Too much too soon is pretty much my mantra but maybe just maybe I am now learning - and even acknowledging that stretching actually IS quite sensible.
I had absolutely decided that 7 or 8 miles was my new "limit" but I went on a trekking holiday to Nepal in October and when I came home I applied for a place on a whim because I was feeling all fit and motivated.
After talking myself out of it over Christmas I decided that I should do it afterall (not cheap to enter afterall) and so here I am. Booked my hotel today and now I hope to take advantage of all your experience to stop me backing out!
I have only told a handful of people I am doing the marathon as I don't want to tempt fate! And nobody will believe me as I have "cried wolf" too many times. Have backed out of Loch Ness due to injury so all in all my record is poor!
That's pretty much me - 48 years old, "my job is very boring I'm in office work"', run for relaxation and because I realised in my 20s that I had to do something to counter balance my absolute love of food. Think our family has the "never feel full" gene.
Objective this week - to wade my way through this thread and do 18 miles on Saturday.
Main worry - what to do about fluids on long runs. Know nothing about all these gels and things but I'm sure this is all discussed in this thread and so I will read and learn before badgering you with repeat questions.
Happy running everybody and sleep well
Chris - That's certainly a fair gap between marathons. As for fluids and gels I think experimentation on your long runs is the only real answer. Few people do the exact same thing and what works for some makes other ill. You'd be best to try a couple of variations on your long runs and find what works best for you.
Nice story Chris... join right in....
there is a world of useless info here... and some of it is related to running...!
TD.. you do worry me matey... your powers of recovery amaze me... I'm just waiting for the next thing to break... please take it easy... your body has been through a lot....
Hi Chris. Nepal sounds good fun. How long were you out there?
Danni (and other barefooters if it's of interest) - you said a couple of weeks ago that you'd bought some non-Vibrams for Paris. They weren't Vivos were they? Only reason i mention is that Field and Trek's http://www.fieldandtrek.com/ selling them from £20 ($30). If you want any and shipping's too expensive, I can pick you up a pair or two and bring them to Paris for you.
And for the book club - can anyone recommend a good book about the French Revolution? Fact, not fiction. Nothing too dry if poss.
ATM - extraction? Tooth extraction I take it? Ouch. Click on the picture below and give self-hypnosis a go
Weedy - no, they are the new Mizuno Evo Levitas. I am really liking them and using them twice a week, the other 3 runs being in Vibrams. I'm alternating my LSR's between the two.
Ah, no worries. Couldn't remember what kind you'd got
Chris - good Martha and the Muffins reference
Today's lesson learned is that if I'm going to attempt a 12 miler after work I need to fuel up properly during the afternoon, and not rely on jelly beans to get me round if I want to avoid a massive sugar crash. I'm thinking a mid afternoon porridge pot might do the trick.
As it happens I have a tube of Hammer protein chews already I got them when I bought a job lot of Hammer stuff (gels, endurolytes and yes perpetuem as well) never got rond to trying anything but the gels and endurolytes so I'll be doing some experimenting now!
Not sure cubes of steak and fish would agree with me though!
Anyway, thanks again and please do post more.
Chris - welcome and congratulations on going for Paris. I must be one of the few here who isn't running it. I came here for the advice, support and camaraderie and certainly have not been disappointed. Perhaps I'm also here early for next year
Emmy - sounds like a complete nightmare trying to find something tha agrees with you. I was about to say that I've bought Hammer stuff from the people you found online and had no problems. Also, the gels were really nice. Not much use to you now, sorry
Orbutt - I always go out too quickly and have only completed 22k and 24k as LSRs this year so far. Both have been tough (due to my crap training) and the 22k incorporated the Brighton Half. I was at 6min/km for the 22k and 6:47min/km for the longer - hence my fear of not getting around even in 4hr30m...
How are you pacing yourself?
My problem last weekend was mental. I thought I couldn't do it and I proved myself right. Thanks to those who replied,I think you were all right. Better preparation!
Welcome Chris.
I want to run a marathon but since joining the thread I'm already thinking of Paris 2014. Now I'm thinking of Brighton, Berlin, Medoc or Cork. I don't know if it's possible to hypnotize but I'm sure there are subliminal messages.
Chris - Nice background. What part of Bradfut, and where'd you do your long runs?
Malcs - I'm not running it this year either. Well, not all of it, though I plan to at least run part.
RR/Simon - I've got a red welt around my chest too! Wore the HRM for the first time since July on Sunday. Presumably I am rather...er...larger than I was then as by half way through the run it hurt and I was bleeding. For things like that, or nipple chaffage, when it happens there's nothing you can do. I've finished a couple of runs pulling my shirt away from my chest as I go, whilst looking like I've been shot. Generally for the nipples I favour micropore tape.
Welcome to the thread Chris Hollis. You don't have to read every page, every day. But you'll find friends here willing you on. You'll love Paris mara for sure.
Weedy - that's a fab graphic and really demonstrates how our brains are constantly manipulating our perception of the world. We see what our brains think we should see, which is not the same thing as what is objectively there. Any movement in the image is our brain massaging the (still) image.
For my job, I get to think about brain perceptions.... and risks.... and moving 15Tr.$ each day.
DV - no need to worry. I have millions of little nerve endings ready to sound the alarm at the first hint of a problem, and believe me, I'm paying attention to them. And you'll notice in Weedy's long list of races, my name isn't down against anything. Oh, apart from that 1,250km run this summer between Bratislava and Brussels... but I'm only a little part of the (growing) relay team.
Heard people things before about below and above the neck. If it's not chesty will I be ok? Or that a myth?
Rob - I live in Shipley! Where are you? Do my long runs around Wilsden, Thornton, Ogden if you know those places? Bit hilly but rural with lovely views.
I just had to google LSR so have learned something new already today and its only 08:00 am
Malcs... here is a bit more of the nutrition story..
The change from being vegan to being a meat eater again came from my first DNF. It was a Double Iron Man event and I pulled out at 180 miles into the bike ride. I was absolutely spent.. I've no doubt that I could have had a rest and finished the bike (224 miles) but there is no way I would have then been able to drag myself over a 52 mile run. So.. I pulled out at 180 miles and left my bike and all my kit exactly where it was and went to the hotel. I had four hours sleep and went to the loo. This reminded me that I hadn't actually been to the loo for ages and I worked out it had been 25 hours previously... I was severely dehydrated and my wee was a very dark colour, almost purple.
I went back to the event and packed up my things, while cheering the other competitors as they came through, and then I went round to the various support crews and asked them about their nutrition strategy and it became blatantly obvious that I had messed it up big time. Without exception, they were all eating and drinking normal foods and had an actual feeding plan. The husband of another pirate gave me a copy of his spreadsheet and it was a wake up call. I needed to learn from this.
I had trained properly for that event, but had failed miserably on the nutrition. I decided there and then that I was going to sort this out and to start eating meat again. Mrs DV and the children were on holiday in Devon and the plan was for me to finish the event and drive down to meet them. So.. on the way, I stopped at McD's and had a burger. My first meat in 18 years was a McD's burger..!
With a new nutritional focus, I had another go at the Double Iron Man three weeks later and completed it in a touch over 30 hours. The only difference was the food and drink. It was a significant moment in recognising how important nutrition and hydration is.
As time progressed, I experimented with all kinds of foods and drinks. The protein revelation came from drinking For Goodness Shakes during the run. They are designed as recovery shakes, but I would alternate them. One hour I'd drink my maltodextrin drink and then next hour I'd drink FGS and just keep repeating as often as required.
As further time progressed I learned more about how to fuel my body not just during the bike/run but also before and after. I'm now working on getting my fuelling simplified and quicker and am trying to get it mostly liquid and I find that the Perpetuem is working perfectly. Constantly sipping the electrolyte drink helps too, to avoid excessive salt loss.
Its been a long learning process and has involved many runs deliberately fuelled on different things just to see what happens. For example, spicy pizza combined with Red Bull failed terribly and I was physically sick for a while. However, Muller Rice is perfect, tastes good and easy to digest on the run. I did a 30 mile run solely on jelly beans.
The influence of additional protein has been hugely important in all of this. On the 87 mile A2A run (I did that run three times) I had three full McD's meals...!
Getting the nutrition and hydration stategy correct for your running is, in my opinion, just as important as the miles on your legs. It can influence your ability to have a good run or a bad run. If you have a bad run, try to think whether this could be influenced by what you've eaten or drunk. Alcohol is a killer for me. I avoid drinking alcohol during the week before a run. Even one beer or a glass of wine will affect my legs the following day.
Hope that helps and gives you ideas to
Welcome Chris ....
anyone up for LSR on Sunday morning through central London?
Chris - yes I know them. Live in north Leeds but we had 6 years living in Keighley and I used to do a lot of running from Greens gym or from Dockfield Lane along the canal. Most of my runs when marathon training are still done along the canal and though not fully fit at present my turnaround points are typically anywhere around Shipley/Saltaire/Bingley as I'm running from Apperley Bridge.
DV - once again, many thanks. Really interesting stuff. I love that you used 3 McD's for fuelling
. I was going to ask whether you had tried the Dean Karnazes style burrito rolled pizza, obviously you have. Do you eat while running?
I've done 5 marathons. The first I took nothing but water and lucozade on board and hit the wall horribly at 20 miles. The last 4 I have used gels and tried a couple of electrolyte replacement solutions (Nuun, endurolytes). No issues with energy levels since. However, on all 4 I had some degree of nausea, cramps and spasms (mosly in my arms of all places!) in the last 6 miles. This really slowed me down.
The difficulty with experimenting is that it only seems to be in a race situation that I get the chance to see what really works. All my marathons have been in April time so I've trained in the cold doing 20 mile runs on little fluid and the odd gel with no problems at all. Then I come to April, the sun invariably comes out and I sweat like a trooper.
I had assumed that all my problems were down to sweating because heat was the main difference I could see from what I'd done in training. Certainly the year I used endurolytes I miscalculated the number I needed and the above symptoms were all alot worse than when I used the Nuun tabs. However, I guess another big difference is the extra 6 miles (easy to forget those
). I also wondered whether I was drinking too much. I would take on only half a litre at most in 20 mile training runs but drink maybe 4 times that in my marathons for fear of dehydrating.
Whatever strategy I go for, I know I'll be very apprehensive standing on the start line.
Chris - I spent most of my childhood in Baildon so I know Shipley very well. I went to Salts school - which I now see they have finally bulldozed and replaced with a shiny new one!
Malcs.. if you sweat and then drink water to re-hydrate you are constantly diluting the remaining electrolytes. So.. you need to take them on board to replenish the stocks. The Nuun tabs are perfect for this. One tab per 500ml of water.
Also.. if you are using gels.. think about the fluids required for them to activate.
Obviously, the volume of fluid intake will be guided by the weather conditions on the day.