Missing Maths Teacher



  • Why would God be looking for bar work ?

  • I thought God was a DJ?

  • Of course God is a woman, have you seen the proportion of women's clothes shops to men's on the High St ?
  • Going back to the original topic...

    Is the girl guilty of anything in all of this..?   I very much doubt that she is a silly naive 'child'...  very foolish and will probably look back on all of this with much embarassment...  but she must have known what she was doing and probably wasn't coerced or manipulated etc...

    Its a fascinating story, from a legal perspective as much as anything..  I wonder what the Courts will do about it..?


  • kaffeegkaffeeg ✭✭✭
    Yeah, guilty of being a child. Children are well known to 'influence' and 'manipulate' adults into all sorts of sticky situations, I hope they lock her up before she corrupts more teachers. Or a priest. Danger to society she is and all teenagers like her who male adults like to pretend look and act older than they actually are.

    Silly silly stupid and dangerous man.
  • Do you think it's equivalent to the paedophile priests who have made news in recent years then ?

  • kaffeegkaffeeg ✭✭✭
    Is one form of abuse better or worse than another? Is that what you're asking me?
  • I'm asking you if you think what this guy has done deserves the same level of punishment as a serial paedophile.

  • kaffeegkaffeeg ✭✭✭
    And we know that he isn't a serial peadophile because....?

    What I'm trying to get at is that people like to say that teenagers are provocative, that they are flirtatious, that she was able to say what she wanted as she was mature. In the eyes of the law, what he has done is illegal. In the eyes of the law, he will be likely to be treated differently to someone who abuses several children or younger children.

    I'm not going to say that he isn't different to a serial peadophile or that he is. I'm just trying to get the blame shifted onto the adult and not the child.
  • Well we don't know for sure he isn't a mass murderer either but let's not throw the key away just yet.   

    Yes what he has done is illegal - but so are lots of things.   Was it wrong - in my eyes yes, deserving of prison - yes - so I'm not pretending this is something that can be ignored.    But we don't know he represents a danger to other teenagers and for me anyway he isn't on the face of it  deserving of anything like the punishment that a serial paedophile is.      



  • popsider.if he felt that he could not stop himself ......then that indictaes that he is dangerous...........he knew it was wrong and illegal and is an intelligent man who has all the training for these situations.......

    but he could not stop himself.............so if the next time he fancies a 13 yr old or a 11 yr old..why will he be able to stop himself anymore than he could this time.........he knew her age.....he hadn't met her in a nightclub in makeup etc and been fooled into thinging she was 19....he saw her ina  school uniform......as a pupil.......


    i agre not in the same league as a serial paedophile.................but if someone came up and shot one of your kids as they had an urge to shoot someone..........would you say......well they are not in the same league as the serial killers so we should go easy on them

  • I've got to rush off but I'm not saying we should go easy on him - I'm saying comparing him to a predatory paedophile priest is over the top.   I'm not saying he isn't a danger to other teenagers - just that we don't know that he is - what has his previous behaviour been like.    Sorry but no time to give a longer response than that or the kids will be late for school !

  • kaffeegkaffeeg ✭✭✭
    He IS a peadophile. Unless I got it wrong, a peadophile is someone is is attracted to children. He is attracted to children (one child?).

    I agree with seren.

    Popsider-I understand what you're saying. When I put in my post 'or priest'. I wasn't comparing him to a priest who has abused several children over many years and had a whole institution cover it up. What I was getting at is often (and I work with people who have been victims and perpertrators) perpertrators (and sadly society at times) like to convince themselves that the child has inititated the abuse in some way and therefore they have not been responsible for their actions.

    When you look at how many children have been sexually abused (by whoever, at whatever age, in whatever way) and how many people actually get arrested, never mind charged or convicted, of those crimes, you would be shocked. Part of that is how our justice system works. Part of it is perceptions of sexualised children.

    In my humble opinion.

    What I was doing was responding to Dark Vader's post where he asked if she was guilt in any of this and put child in inverted commas. I was trying to get the shift away from thinking children are responsible for how adults behave.
  • If he's been persuaded either by lust or as he would have us believe the love of his life to abscond with an underage girl, then he clearly is a danger, ad KK he is a paedophile by that definition. 

    His internal moral guide is not working correctly, this is a difficult one because how do you differentiate between a girl of 15 yrs and 364 days to one 16 yrs and 1 day? however the line is deliberately drawn to clarify this, and he has crossed the line.

    If it were open to debate and the interpretation of the law etc, rich paedophiles would walk, whilst poor ones would feel the full force of the law, at present it should capture most. 

  • Just as a point of fact I don't think being attracted to 15 year olds is technically paedophilia - I AM NOT SAYING IT IS RIGHT - just that it doesn't make him a paedophile - well not according to wikipedia anyway.  


  • Exactly, by definition he is a paedophile. The trouble is that word has become another form of abuse to throw against people. When we were kids we didn't know the meaning of the word. The kids hear it from their Sun reading parents and throw it as a term of abuse at anyone who dares to tell them off for vandalising the phonebox.

    But what is a paedophile. Someone who has sex with underage girls 15 years? Sex with 6 year olds? Someone who thinks about it? It's a blanket term that does no good to use.
  • it is not a black and white situation, more like 50 shades of grey.

  • It will never be black and white but in order to have some semblence of law and order there must be a limit beyond which you must not go, and setting 16 as the limit is that point. He can't claim he didn't know this, and so he (like everyone else) will be defined by whether or not he goes further than that point. Whatever you call him it is up to you.

  • kaffeegkaffeeg ✭✭✭
    Sometimes things aren't black and white. But teacher/pupil and adult/under age seem pretty black and white to me!

    And my understanding of peadophiliia is"attraction to children". Which she is. Therefore it makes him that. I think it is important to name him as such, as otherwise we get into this thing of "ahhhh, but she's not pre-pubescent so it's not too bad. Easy mistake to make" rubbish that does not excuse abuse.

    Anyway, I rant about this stuff quite frequently. I might stop doing it online now.
  • kaffeeg..  I don't think anyone is disagreeing with you, but its not necessarily as black and white as you suggest...   we have to wait for the facts to come out...  for example..:

    • what if they deny having had any sexual contact..?
    • what if she says that he never took her, but that she had run away from home of her own free will and that hi decision to go too was a last minute decision of his own - ie: it wasn't planned by him?
    • what if she defends him on every charge..?
    • the fact that she is almost 16 does change the circumstances rather than if she had been 12, and there is plenty of case law to show that the Courts are more lenient.  It doesn't change his responsibility as a teacher, but if there is no sexual contact then the charges against him are presumably less severe?

    If its actually been more innocent than it looks, then I can see him walking away without a prison sentance.   He has been stupid and his career and reputation is done in, and that is something that is now probably irrecoverable...



  • kaffeegkaffeeg ✭✭✭
    Dark vader:

    I'm sure all the things you put in above could be said by him or her. But how does that make this and less black and white? That just shows the difficulty in trying to prove cases in courts and getting convictions, or even being able to charge someone with something.

    My orginial point was in response to you asking if she was guilty in any of this. And my firm view that he knew he was doing wrong (whether or not he will admitt that to thew policegin court).

    And if we're all agreed - then great!
  • The fact he has broken the law is black and white - the punishment he deserves is not - I think that's the real point of argument.   I imagine most of us (if not all) agree that he knew he was doing wrong - but probably differ on the degree of wrong that was done.

  • I think he's innocent until proven guilty? With this amount of guilt assumption will a fair trial be possible?? I don't think what has been read in news reports counts as evidence...

  • Peter Everitt wrote (see)

    I think he's innocent until proven guilty? With this amount of guilt assumption will a fair trial be possible?? I don't think what has been read in news reports counts as evidence...

    I think he's guilty.

  • Of course he is already guilty, he went abroad with a known minor, against her parents wishes. Therefore he's technically guilty of an abduction, as to whether or not they had sex it's immaterial, he has breached a fundamental Teacher/Pupil relationship and so will inevitably end up jailed, sacked and blacklisted for the rest of his days. 12 months from now he'll be on a protected wing, and she'll be about 17 starting a new life at college, with new friends and he will be conveniently forgotten, while she giggles about the time she was in the news. Sad, cynical but true. Let's hope it's lessons learned.

  • There was a piece in the paper yesterday that he was detained under the European arrest warrant for child abduction, and if Sussex police / CPS wish to charge him with anything else they have to get the permission from the French magistrate in Bordeaux
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