Is Lance Armstrong now a toxic brand?

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  • he contest them for years

    he have no chance with the game lets prove lance guilty

    even if wee dont have prove

  • MillsyMillsy ✭✭✭
    I suppose you think Jimmy Saville was a saint as well.
  • Yes he did contest them for years, I agree. Funny though isn't it that he stopped contesting just before this lot came out?
  • hes full of shit,he was a good actor always playing the victim against the french who all along were right.

  • Can't tell if Yoel is a troll or a 'believer' but either way, it doesn't change anything. LA did fail tests, at least twice. The testing protocol was in and of itself flawed in that riders could simply hide from testers and get away with being doped. Oftentimes they were notified when testers were coming so wouldn't dope. They also knew how much leeway was in the tests themselves so could still dope at smaller dosages and be within the limits. So the flawed testing system let everyone down by not identifying cheating. Which is the not the same thing as saying - because the tests never caught me, this is proof I never cheated. That assertion is based on the wrong assumption that the tests were effective.

    I see now that one of the lawyers for the KingoftheDopers is suggesting he might do a lie detector test instead. Which is just a scummy way of sidestepping all the proof that is stacked against him. He isn't sure if he'll do the test or not yet - because he's probably had insufficient time to practice lying and beating the tests - or hasn't yet experimented with the relevant drugs that allow you to defeat the tests.

    Which is all a bit strange isn't it - I mean, he's been practicing this lie for over 15 years now. What an utter scumbag. I refuse to buy anything with a Nike label on while they still support him in any way. He is the antithesis of sportsmanship.

  • Millsy1977 wrote (see)
    I suppose you think Jimmy Saville was a saint as well.

    No, but he was a pro cyclist.  bunch of evil cheating horrible ba5t@rds, i refuse to ride a bike ever again lest I be branded a druggy paedo

  • yoel yavnieli wrote (see)

    when you get asmple let me see

    Here you go buddy .... this do ya ?

    http://www.mountainside-medical.com/product_images/uploaded_images/urine-specimen-cup.jpg

     

  • The whole story is really sad and i now have very litle rspect for Lance. 

    i am also saddened by the attitude of Nike and also some Nike sponsored athletes namely Paula Radcliffe.Perhaps money is more important than principles for Paula?

    Maybe its time to boycott Nike and discard any Nike products I do have?

  • There were failed drug tests, one was answered with a back dated doctors note for saddle sore cream, and they carried out test on blood taken and stored from the 1999 TdF (when they didnt test for EPO). these test showed up positive for LA, but were used to perfect the test and he wasn't charged as a result.

  • I'm sure Nike must be shitting itself that a few people might stop wearing it's livestrong gear, i mean its not like they have any other lines of buisness is it.

  • Graeme Stevenson wrote (see)

    The whole story is really sad and i now have very litle rspect for Lance. 

    i am also saddened by the attitude of Nike and also some Nike sponsored athletes namely Paula Radcliffe.Perhaps money is more important than principles for Paula?

    Maybe its time to boycott Nike and discard any Nike products I do have?

    Not sure what the issue is with Paula Graeme? - she is always pretty quick to speak out about doping issues. Maybe with LA and the fact she has a common sponsor, she is keeping her trap shut so as not to embarass her 'employer'. Not a stupid thing to do really.

    As for boycotting Nike, I'm already on that game. As for chucking away Nike stuff I already own, well that will only hurt me, not them. Best you can do is continue to make a noise in social media about how you will stop buying Nike products until they distance themselves from #DopeStrong.

  • Yes Radcliffe CAN be quick to speak out however is she prepared to speak out if it will cost her money?

    I dont think I own any Nike gear at moment anyway as I really dont like their philosophy or lack of on sport!

    Interestingly they have just been announced as clothing providers to the IOC & Olympics!

    http://www.olympic.org/news/nike-to-become-ioc-supplier/179406

  • MillsyMillsy ✭✭✭
    I wonder if TK Maxx will be getting a job lot of Livestrong stuff in the next few weeks?
  • i will buy from you all your livestrong items

  • what actually is cheating?

    caffeine used to be banned...I use that...so do many of you.

    Armstrong & co used to store and use their own blood. That's cheating apparently. It was used to boost red blood cells.

    Is training at altitude cheating?

    Wiggo, apparently, sleeps in an oxygen tent to boost red blood cells. Is that cheating?

    But I guess taking non-natural stuff is cheating and it seems that armstrong and pretty much ALL the tour riders were guilty of that. That's why the 7 Tours will be declared void with no winner because amny of those below were also tainted. (look at Vinakourov the 2012 TT winner...he was banned for drugs a while back!!) 

    Why treat armstrong differently? Puinish him, yes. But be consistent.

    ----------------------------
    Running 5k Better
    More: http://the5krunner.com
    Goals: 82% Age Graded 5k and an open water Triathlon. 

     

  • Cheating is using anything that's outlawed in the rules.

    Caffeine - thats fine.

    Altitude training - no thats legal.

    Oxygen Tents - I'd not heard of him using one and I know they were getting confiscated by Italian Police in the giro one year.  I dont think its banned though. Or effective. 

    Taking non natural stuff ? Not cheating unless its against the rules. 

     

    You seem to be being deliberately stupid on this whole thing. 

    The 1000 pages that has come out has shown Lance to be a cheat, a bully and very much at the centre of the teams doping. He wanted it. He forced his team mates to do it. If they didnt comply - they didnt ride. 

    Yes many of his competotors have been busted - so why shouldnt Lance ? 

    There were clean riders around - Lance bullied them out of the sport. He needs to be punished or we havent learnt anything.  

    We need to send messages to todays and future competitors - if you cheat - you will be punished. 

    I don't like Vino either - but at least he served his ban. 

  • So, Armstrong steps down from Livestrong half an hour before Nike announces they've dropped him.  Co-incidence?

  • marshallini wrote (see)
    Millsy1977 wrote (see)
    I suppose you think Jimmy Saville was a saint as well.

    No, but he was a pro cyclist.  bunch of evil cheating horrible ba5t@rds, i refuse to ride a bike ever again lest I be branded a druggy paedo

    Was he ever a pro ?  I know he's supposed to have ridden the Tour of Britain - but back in the day I'm guessing that plenty of amateurs rode that.   He claims to have ridden 300 pro races (according to Wiki) but you can't believe that - he'd have had to have been racing full time for quite a few years to do that in the UK - which he couldn't have been given all the other stuff he is supposed to have done - coal miner, Wrestler, dance hall manager, DJ etc.   

  • Do you think it is the right decision that some of the riders caught up in the Armstrong case are being sacked ? Is it going to encourage other, possibly younger riders, to come forward and admit to doping knowing that they are likely to be sacked ? I think there should be an amnesty that will allow a line to be drawn under the doping issue and they cant start again from scratch. Obviously, anyone caught after that point gets suitably punished

  • I take your point...but....the likes of Leipheimer haven't come forward voluntarily - they've pretty much been caught and given evidence for a reduced punishment - but what a reduced punishment - 6 months in the off season means they hardly miss a race!

    Most of those that have given statements are not poor, far from it, they've done very nicely from cycling.  They didn't have to dope, most of them were good enough to have a job without being doped up, albeit not one that could command such a high salary.    Armstrong didn't twist their arms - sure there may have been pressure - but Leipheimer actually came back to an Armstrong/Bruyneel team so it's not as if he had no option but to ride for them.   

    Personally I don't mind riders coming back from a doping ban - when the ban has been fair - but this lot have escaped a ban for effectively squealing on their old mate Armstrong.   I personally don't want to see any of them riding again for 2 years the same as any other rider who has been caught.   I accept that in practice they may have to have some kind of reduced punishment but I think 6 months was a joke.

  • "I accept that in practice they may have to have some kind of reduced punishment but I think 6 months was a joke."

    I suspect that in the fullness of time, WADA and/or UCI (*gah..*) may have something to say about that and recommend a 2 year ban as per the rules.   I can't see why USADA should let them get off so lightly even if they did fess up.   

    when Marion Jones fessed up to doping (despite never testing positive "technically" (she failed one EPO test but the B sample was negative)) as her input into the Balco affair - she didn't get 6 months - she got 2 years athetics ban (she'd already retired), a 6 month jail sentence for perjury, and all her wins back to 2000 annulled including her Olympics titles.

    the guys who have fessed to USADA should equally get the full duration ban and any wins annulled imho

  • There is very compelling evidence in the USADA report that LA took EPO and testosterone, both banned substances, so please don't let us go down the path of "what is cheating anyway?"

    Someone told me that LA actually testified under oath that he did not dope during a lawsuit against sports performance insurers, who refused to pay his bonus for winning the TdF in 2004. But he'll probably get away with perjury because it must be timebarred under the statute of limitations.

  • In the paper now it's saying that Nike have terminated their contract with LA, claiming he misled them.

  • They have, but will still "support Livestrong" (... "until we have sold all the Livestrong products cluttering up our stockrooms" is what I read into that)

    http://www.cbc.ca/sports/cycling/story/2012/10/17/sp-uci-usada-cycling-nike-lance-armstrong.html

  • xine267 wrote (see)

    There is very compelling evidence in the USADA report that LA took EPO and testosterone, both banned substances, so please don't let us go down the path of "what is cheating anyway?"

    Someone told me that LA actually testified under oath that he did not dope during a lawsuit against sports performance insurers, who refused to pay his bonus for winning the TdF in 2004. But he'll probably get away with perjury because it must be timebarred under the statute of limitations.

    Yes I've read that too - the best we can hope for is he has to pay the multi million pound bonuses back and that the Sunday Times recoups the damages (preferably with costs) it had to pay him for calling him a doper.    

    I see he has now stepped down from Livestrong (annoyingly I always read it as Live Strong - as in Live Aid) - maybe paving the way for a confession as he tries to rehabilitate his reputation.   Who knows - give it 3-4 years he could be heading up a charity for people who have come off drugs..

     

  • Ultra cougie wrote (see)
    I don't like Vino either - but at least he served his ban. 

    Did he? I thought he conveniently retired, thus avoiding a ban, and then made a come-back once the time period had elapsed?

    Might be splitting hairs though, he wasnt riding for that two years.

    You do have to be really dumb to forget your secret blood-bag name though.

  • image God I hope not, dwain chambers was bed enough while he was trying to prove the world he was a nice person honest gov. 

  • Aaah - I think you're right flyaway ! The Kunning Kazakh did. 

    And i think its probably a problem with the names of his dog. Maybe him and his team mate had Rover and River or something. Easy mistake to mix up the blood bags then eh ?

  • popsider - I'm glad he's stepped down from Livestrong, I think they need to distance themselves from him (as much as possible) in order to survive this.

    Cake - I think its fair to say that LA is finished as far as professional sport is concerned. I can't imagine that he will have any public or peer support if he returns, its not just the drugs but the lying, bullying, coercion, and I'm sure a lot of sour grapes from people who were caught doping while Lance was still the golden boy. Plus he made a lot of people look like idiots for believing him and publically supporting him.

    BUT, whether he makes a big comeback as a celeb selling his redemption story, and telling people about his "drugs hell" and how he only cheated for charidee is another story.

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