Is Lance Armstrong now a toxic brand?

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  • xine thats my fear. Used to do some work with folks that involves drugs and all you need is a few people d*cking about saying how easy it is to overcome there drug hell in there dream world in some glossy mag that doesn't bear any relation to reality for people to suddenly doubt themselves.

    Know it won't be the same drugs and won't be caused by the same issue's but won't matter to the people involved. Luckily I'm on a break from that stuff with personal things so won't be the person who has to deal with then. image

  • The charity thing has always been a good support for the legend of Armstrong being Mr.Nice Guy, butter wouldn't melt and all that. It's not like there is only one cancer charity in the world to support either.

    Have to say i am delighted that LA is going to take a hit in his bloated bank account, as well as having his personal brand washed away. He deserves no glory at all. Next I hope that SCA bring him to trial for perjury in the 2005 case where he lied under oath about not taking drugs. A jail sentence could follow.

    Which makes me think of the other guy who was in freefall at high speed this week. At least with Baumgartner jumping out of his space balloon, he had a parachute. The only thing that will slow LA down is the ground when he hits it. I won't shed a tear.

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  • yoel yavnieli wrote (see)

    i will buy from you all your livestrong items

    Yoel. Ya ain't funny, not even close. It's not ironic, it's not satire, it's not parody even. You're just a bit sad really. Sorry about that. image

  • Well the UCI have now ban him for life and stripped him of all his Tour titles.

  • did they have much choice???  the UCI still needs to look itself in the mirror and do something about their own history and management as they have been complicit in the whole affair despite waht McQuad says.  and as for McQuaid not resigning - let's give him a few weeks until the shitstorm overtakes him as well

  • I am not surprised that he said he wouldn't resign (McQuaid) as people like him tend to be in it for the power rather than the good of the sport. But as you say, FB I can't see him lasting to long.  

  • He won't resign, more's the pity. But with a pinch of luck, he won't be re-elected next year either.
  • RicFRicF ✭✭✭

    Probably find out they were close friends of Jimmy Savile next.

  • The UCI Management Committee meets this Friday in Geneva. The British representative on the committee is Brian Cookson and you can get through to him via the email address: info@britishcycling.org.uk

    Why not write to him and ask that Honorary President Hein Verbruggen and current President Pat McQuaid be removed from their positions? They have been at the helm for the entire period of LA's systematic doping and were therefore responsible for the effectiveness of the anti-doping campaign that should have prevented the cheating that took place.

    7 invalidated Tour de Frances are part of their legacy. As are the departure of major sponsors like Rabobank. That's their record. Time for a clean slate and totally new management. Time for the libel case against whistleblowes like journalist Paul Kimmage to be dropped.

    Why not drop a line to Mr.Cookson and ask him what he is going to do (for British Cycling) about it?

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  • Tour de France winners tested positive, been sanctioned or admitted doping in recent years

    1996 Bjarne Riis

    1997 Jan Ullrich

    1998 Marco Pantani

    1999-2005 Lance Armstrong

    2006 Floyd Landis

    2007, 2009, 2010 Alberto Contador

    It's no wonder people think they all cheat when you see that list.

  • What money on Cadel Evans, have you seen his eyes?

  • RicFRicF ✭✭✭

    Not his fault, but then again, he's only an Australian.

  • RicFRicF ✭✭✭

    Hang on a mo, that could be racist. send the thought police.

  • HalfRunnerHalfBiscuit wrote (see)

    Tour de France winners tested positive, been sanctioned or admitted doping in recent years

    1996 Bjarne Riis

    1997 Jan Ullrich

    1998 Marco Pantani

    1999-2005 Lance Armstrong

    2006 Floyd Landis

    2007, 2009, 2010 Alberto Contador

    It's no wonder people think they all cheat when you see that list.

    And surely the fact that Contador won this year's Vuelta off the back of his drugs ban has got to raise some serious questions about what's still going on.

    Or is it just me that was highly suspicious of that result and his performanceimage.

  • Didn't seem that suspicious to me - he struggled to beat riders that he would have beaten easily at his best and he couldn't sustain the attacks he put in whereas in the past he'd just keep it going to the finish.  I expect there are still riders doping - but I wouldn't have picked Contador at the Vuelta this year as a performance that stands out as almost certainly doped.   Contador is still probably the best grand tour rider of his generation as well as being a cheat.

  • If you dope in training - and have done so for years - you'll be able to train harder.

    I'm not sure how long these benefits last but it must help.



    I think Cadel is clean - I've heard no rumours about him and he's more human when he rides. Lance didn't have a weak day in 7 years. Cadel has a couple every tour.
  • mcs wrote (see)

    What money on Cadel Evans, have you seen his eyes?

    It's the size of his chin and eyebrows that worry me. I'm not even trying to be funny about it, or cast doubts. But one of the acknowledged aspects of riders taking HGH (Human Growth Hormone), especially at an early age when bones are still growing, is that they develop big hands, lower jaws, long limbs and often, a ridge above the eyebrows. Apparently Tyler Hamilton's hands are freakishly large like shovels on the end of his arms.

    Maybe the idiots who consider that everyone should give up and allow all riders to dope, should try living with such lifelong deformities, just because a rider wanted to be able to compete. It's really unacceptable. And the less money you have, the less you can afford to have doctors watching over your drug abuse for side effects and dangerous outcomes.

     

     

  • Tyler Hamilton says Cadel is clean. He'd know better than us ?
  • PhilPubPhilPub ✭✭✭

    ^ Totally. The ultimate consequences of a drugs free-for-all don't bear thinking about.

    I think this article written by an age-group athlete who decided to experiment with PEDs puts it quite well w.r.t the so-called "level playing field" argument...

    "As for the larger issue of drugs in sports, eight months in the world of the artificially enhanced convinced me more than ever that it's critical for an organization like the World Anti-Doping Agency to succeed. This group, founded after the Salt Lake Olympics by Canadian anti-doping leader Dick Pound, represents the most serious international attempt to come to grips with sports doping. WADA is the logical response to an argument that gets aired from time to time: that since cheating is impossible to eliminate, the only recourse is to simply legalize everything—that way, no athlete has a hidden advantage over another, since everyone would be free to try anything that might increase endurance.

    "Like a lot of powerfully bad ideas, that one has a certain mad logic. But it would turn every sport into a test of how much damage an athlete was willing to risk to improve performance, and would basically force every serious athlete to cheat and risk his or her health. Athletic contests would have a strange life-or-death quality. If we don't keep drugs out of these events, they become freak shows, the athletes like gladiators—with us playing the role of decadent Romans, urging them on."

  • PhilPubPhilPub ✭✭✭

    That was in response to Tricky. What's happened to the bloody editing function?  Sort it out, RW!!

  • Interesting listening to Prudhomme at this mornings TdF presentation...



    2 trips up Alp Dhuez on a sinle day would have me reaching for the pills
  • The concept that a doping free for all creates a level playing field is utter rubbish but thanks Phil for the confirming evidence. Even now, riders who pursue a micro-dosing approach to EPO get competitive advantage over their fellow riders if they have a naturally low Haemoglobin count. They can take more EPO than other riders and still fall below the threshold levels where detection is registered.

    DaveTES - missing you on the Paris thread. The comment you didn't like was utterly ironic, the polar opposite of it's surface meaning. image

    All in all, I can't avoid the feeling that the UCI leadership has to be swept away as corrupt, partial and incompetent administrators. Only after they have gone does cycling have a chance of becoming credibly fair. We should all be disatisfied with long winning streaks on Grand Tours, of sustained dominant displays. It all indicates highly suspicious and unnatural physiological conditions. Superman doesn't exist. Our heroes should have recogniseable flaws and weaknesses.

  • Cav interviewing Brad on Eurosport at the moment is hilarious
  • popsider wrote (see)

    Didn't seem that suspicious to me - he struggled to beat riders that he would have beaten easily at his best and he couldn't sustain the attacks he put in whereas in the past he'd just keep it going to the finish.  I expect there are still riders doping - but I wouldn't have picked Contador at the Vuelta this year as a performance that stands out as almost certainly doped.   Contador is still probably the best grand tour rider of his generation as well as being a cheat.

    Maybe I am wrong, but I was more thinking about the way that he didn't seem to fade as the tour progressed, but got stronger and didn't fatigue or crack in the way that Rodriguez finally did.

    Maybe my viewing of it was tainted by knowing about the recent ban. Anyhow, it was a great race, very enjoyable to watch. I actually enjoyed it more then TdF as a viewing spectacle (despite the Wiggins win) image

  • Phil interesting comments well quoted. Agree entirely.....cast out all the top boys and start again for me please......Contador should not have been allowed to ride this year he could have been taking them in training up to this spring and still not tested positively......

  • I wonder to what extent that dope tests are still considered to be the equivalent of an IQ test for an elite rider? Just how easy is it to pass them? My understanding was that the blood passport baselining system has really closed the window in which riders can dope, so they get much smaller benefits as the testers are now looking for the impact of doping, rather than the residue of the drugs themselves.

  • See it's cost Julich his job now
  • Well credit to Team Sky for being willing to take a hit for the sake of squeaky cleanness. I can only hope this spirit of change sweeps over the UCI and that Greg Lemonde's words snowball through Switzerland tmrw.

  • Suppose Sean and Shane later today will follow him
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