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Thames Trot 50 Training
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Lemony: glad my update was useful; yours sound like it would be also. I don't see myself getting near the path again before the race: the train tickets cost a fortune, for one thing, and I've got Winter Tanners next weekend
Sounds like you're doing some great running. My legs were a bit tired today, but I had run a 5+ mile cross-country race yesterday and a speed technique session on Thursday. I could have kept going today, but not quickly. I'm intending to fit in 10 miles tomorrow morning before work, so I'll see how that goes.
thanks for the update Debra. very useful
Anyone doing Hebden Bridge this weekend? Gets my trail running practice in and 3500-4000 ft hills, plus test kit out, also likely 0 degrees or colder plus snow...
Half marathon at steady pace the next day.
Fit-Running-Cat. You're welcome. No, I've got Winter Tanners this weekend - 30 miles, following directions, so it won't be fast, but should be good for time-on-feet. Good luck at Hebden Bridge.
Another vote of thanks Debra, esp for the navigation tips too. I saw on a previous thread that they sometimes pair runners towards dusk. May be good!!
Am umming and aahing re softshell vs active goretex for windproof trousers.
Have long miserable weekend at work coming up, but looking forward to 28/12 or 30/15 Monday/Tues, although slightly concerned that it's too close, and that I should be tapering already. The plan I downloaded from ultrarunningladies suggests tapering from 14th. Oh dear, oh dear.......
Route report - Oxford to Culham
I ran this part of the route in reverse order as the snow was starting to fall first thing this morning. The ground was semi-frozen, meaning that those places where it was reasonably dry to start with were generally easy to run on, although some sections with uneven ground were quite difficult. In a number of places there were still muddy patches, not all of them obvious as they were covered with a thin layer of ice and snow. This meant that I broke through the ice into a muddy muddle on a fairly frequent basis. This was only a problem on the odd occassion where there was a particularly large puddle and I suspect that these will become pretty obvious once the lead runners have gone through (assuming it is still snowy). However, I would stress that much of this part of the route is still very muddy, with no-where for the water currently falling as snow to go. Most of it will be OK to run if the weather stays freezing for the next couple of weeks. But if it warms up for a few days before the race, it will be very muddy and slippy. Either way, I would recommend off-road shoes with some grip. I fell over twice this morning: once on a muddy slope where I was trying to avoid a deep puddle; and a second time on some uneven frozen ground. I also ended up running a total of 13.4 miles at an average 10:15 min/mile pace, despite around 4 miles of this being on road or hard towpath (a bit each at the beginning and end, mostly off the course). My usual easy off-road running pace is around 8:45 min/mile so I'm going to revise my expectations for this race accordingly.
A few detailed points to note:
1) Iffley Lock (right at the start) is undergoing construction work and there's a narrow temporary bridge across it with no overtaking room. If you're planning to be one of the faster runners, you'll need to get yourself at the front from the start or expect a bit of a queue to get across.
2) Once off the cycle path (about 1.5 miles from the race start) is now easier to run than when I last tried in November (when it was flooded before the rest of the Thames Path). But there is still a lot of standing water and if heavy snow melts over it just before race day, you will get wet feet here.
3) The path from then on until about 1 mile after the Radley Boathouse is relatively OK (subject, as noted above, to muddy patches and some sections with uneven ground).
4) From that point up to Abingdon Lock, the path gradually gets muddier and wetter, even in these frozen conditions. There is a windy part just before the industrial estate comes into view which is still semi-flooded. You can get through and it is away from the main river a little so not dangerous, but it will slow you down (at best) and wet feet are likely. After this short section you go over a wooden bridge and then it is about half a mile to Abingdon Lock. Again this section is semi-flooded and passable but not runnable. There is an alternative route here along the cycle path which runs parallel to the Thames Path, but higher up the field next to the industrial estate. I might ask the organisers whether it would be permissible to take this alternative route (which is marginally further, but a lot drier).
5) Once over Abingdon Lock the route is basically OK again, though there is another field at one point which is still very wet and could get completely waterlogged if the weather gets wetter and warmer again.
In all, it was a long hard slog, and this was less than a quarter of the course. I was wearing Saloman shoes with climalite (ie basically waterproof) which kept my feet mostly warm and dry (though water got over the top on a couple of occassions). I'm planning to meet a friend with a change of shoes at Culham which I'm pretty sure I'll need. (I'll probably need them at every CP, but th
It cut me off! I was just goinig to say that I won't get a change of shoes at each CP.
I hope the above was useful and hasn't put anyone off! On the plus side, everything looked really pretty in the snow.
And if anyone's wondering what I mean by semi-flooded: I'd say that the two sections I mentioned were around 70-80% underwater, albeit generally shallow. It was possible, but difficult, to avoid going straight through any deep water by means of clinging onto trees etc and walking at the edges.
Great report, Lemony, that's really useful. And good run!
Lemony: Thanks for the update, and for your pace info. - makes me feel a bit less bad about how slowly I was running the Streatley to Henley section last weekend (my moving pace averaged a minute slower than yours, which is considerably slower that I was on the much-hillier NDW50 last summer).
Sounds like the section you did was wetter than the section I did. Likelihood of wet feet noted.
Have you sent this description through to the organisers? They asked for mine after I'd said I was going to run Streatley to Henley, and I'm sure they'd appreciate getting this.
Sending this to the organisers is a good idea. I'm not sure where they're based, but I guess it can't do any harm.
I should stress that because of the freezing conditions, most of the course was dry, but there were significant wet sections and there will be more of these if the weather warms up.
On my specific query about using the cycle path leading to Abjngdon as an alternative route, I was told that as long as we reach the checkpoints, we can use our initiative.
Winter tanners tomorrow has been CANCELLED "due to difficult weather conditions" - was probably going to be a problem to get the marshals in place.
Must work out an alternative run for tomorrow, although without the encouragement of an actual event, I doubt I'll make it to 30 miles...
Thanks for the up dates Lemony.
Debra - shame about the Tanners but the right decision, I will be attempting 30 miles tomorrow as well but with the current conditions it looks like I will be doing loops around Greenham Common. See you in 2 weeks.
Hi all,
I posted a while back...my training has been fairly steady at 55 miles each week.....with some longish runs but nothing very different from marathon training. I am super excited but also very scared (my first ultra!).
How well do you need to know the route? Is navigation a problem? I've ran bits and pieces of it but not the whole thing....
Do runners tend to run together? What pace is everyone aiming for? I think avergaing 8.30/9 min miles will be my plan with a few minutes to digest at aid stations.
Thanks!!
Karla: I suggest you go read my long post on page 9 (regarding the second half of the course, CP3 to the end) from last weekend and Lemony's long post further up this page. They give info. on places-you-can-go-wrong-and-how-to-avoid-that and on the present ground conditions. You may need to revise your expected pace...
As for running together, that tends to depend on whether you happen on another runner travelling at the same pace as you.
I'm aiming for sub 3:15 in April VLM, but won't be aiming for much more than 9-9.30 mm for a comfortable sub 9hr finish, probably with some walk breaks even for a minute or two if needed every 25-30 minutes. First aim for me is finish, after that, will see how I feel and press on.
I use my Garmin for backup navigation, load up someone elses course.
Oh, Hebden Bridge 22 miler was on today, did it with my Missus so at her pace but good test of kit, base layers, soft shell jacket, waterproofs and also lots of time on feet. Fab checkpoint food too, and a meal at the end for ??9-10.
Very tough underfoot with packed snow, treacherous in places, slippy. Tons of hills. Was doing a half marathon tomorrow but that's been canceled. Legs feeling good though.
Thanks - those posts are really useful.
I know the Reading to Henley part well but before that not so much. I remember having trouble with a church yard earlier on the route....I've made little notes on my map so hopefully won't get too lost!
I ran a 3.16.34 in Amsterdam in October and will be hoping for sub 3.15 at Manchester in April so I think 9 min miles will hopefully be manageable but very much expecting to walk/run. Its so hard to know how my body will cope with the increased distance. Doing my last back-2-back runs this weekend....looking forward to the taper and carbo-loading!
Fit-Running-Cat I used to live in Ripponden.....Hebden bridge 22 sounds like fun. Assuming you were supposed to be doing the Brass Monkey....sad it's cancelled. All is snowy with me in Edinburgh....pavements are quite treacherous and taxi drivers get annoyed when you run on the road.
Hebden was nice. Very picturesque. Most my wife has run was 14-15 ish miles, or an 11 at Moel Famau so jumping to 22 with big hills, must've felt like a huge ultra type jump for her. Was interesting watching her energy levels jump, kept her going with blok shots, plus emergency nuerofen when quads started tightening up half way.
Ultra wise, I'm not hung up on time, my 10k & half times according to some sites suggest low 7hrs and under but not planning anywhere near that, would be mad to even try. Completing, and finishing strong the last 8-10 miles would be fine.
Hi Karla,
I ran 3:09 at the Loch Ness Marathon in October, and my endurance (though not my speed) is slightly better after running up to 70 miles per week for the last few months. Even so, given conditions, I'll be aiming for no better than 10 min/mile for the Thames Trot (including time taken for stop breaks); and if it continues to snow I wouldn't be surprised if I were somewhat slower. This is also my first ultra and my aim is really just to get to the finish.
On finding your way, most of the route is well sign-posted (look out for wooden signs as well as the more common green ones), but there are places where it won't be entirely obvious. Given that we'll be following a river, my top tip is to make a note of every point at which you need to cross the river so you always know whether it is supposed to be on your left or right (and you don't get stuck on the wrong side). There are points where the Path leaves the river, but in relation to the parts of the course I am familiar with, these tend to be reasonably well sign-posted. Also, study the notes relating to the CPs. I realised on Friday that the car park at Culham isn't quite on the Path and whilst I assume that there will be marshals etc making its existence fairly obvious, it would be possible to run straight past (and you do need to 'check in' at each CP). I don't know the other CP areas, so I'm going to have to study the descriptions well.
Since Winter Tanners was cancelled I did my 30-miler from home today, through the snow. Slow, but I completed it. Aiming to get out for 10-12 miles tomorrow to give me my final B2B before TT50.
Karla: good luck. You're obviously faster than me (marathon 3.47) but to give you a guide, I finished NDW50 (hilly!) in under 10 hours. A couple of months back I was thinking I'd be going for 9-min miles on TT50, or maybe a little faster, with regular little walking breaks, like FRC is suggesting (on a hilly ultra I simply go for "walk the uphills, run the rest"). But the footing was so atrocious on my recce run, that I've revised my plan considerably, due to sections being more like skating through the mud than running. I also have a posterior tibial tendon strain or tendonitis, which is slowing me down particularly on uneven ground.
Sorry to hear that, baljc, that's a tough break, rest up and recuperate and come back stronger.
Good work with the 30 miler, Debra. I did a 20 miler yesterday, through deep drifts up on the Ridgeway, and then 10 today. I have to say I loved running in the snow.
I'm going to cut down the mileage a little bit now, but nothing too drastic, I'm not a huge taper fan, and sometimes it's too easy to think of it as an excuse to do nothing at all.
Looking forward to this one now, it looks like the conditions will be pretty extreme one way or the other - snowy or muddy - so I'm forgetting all about projected times, and am just going to relax, give it my all on the day and see what happens
baljc: sympathies; good luck for a speedy recovery.
Tiago: sounds like you had a couple of good runs. As for projected times - yes, I've given up on that. Finishing would be good; inside the time limit, even better!
I'll be tapering after this B2B - partly to give my posterior tibial tendon a relative rest. Also trying to find ways of strapping it that are sufficiently supportive, to help cope with rough ground, while not being too rigid.
I wouldn't normally start a proper taper for a long-distance event until 10 days to go, but couldn't face a +3-hour run in the weather at the weekend and settled for two 80-90 minute trudges through the snow instead, to add to the slightly longer midweek runs I banked in the knowledge that snow was coming. It's going to get boggy out there when this lot thaws out!
Ive just spent several hours going through this forum, I wish Id found it sooner, Im doing TT50 next weekend (sugar thats soon) and its my first ultra. Ive been doing training runs up to 30 miles in 4:30 with water and gels. I havent gone any further, just praying that on the day all my sponsorship money/running partner/atmosphere/excitement/nerves get me that extra 20 miles. although I ran 12 today and Im feeling a hint of ITBS so im coated in tiger balm. Cant wait to see you all on the line.
Sorry Baljc
Fred: I really hope you mean "weekend after next", 'cos according to everything I know, TT50 is on 2nd Feb, not 26th January (someone PLEASE correct me if I'm wrong...).
Have you done any B2Bs? My 30 on Sunday plus being okay running 10 miles Monday (well, okay once I'd switched from uneven ground which my posterior tibial tendon didn't like to a nice, safe, boring treadmill) is very comforting, particularly given that I did less than I'd planned during December.
Also, you may find that by 30 miles or so you really want real food, not gels - savory stuff like cheese wraps looked really good during NDW50 in the summer.
I think we all did less than planned in December but I did get out on the trails on Boxing Day!! Are you looking for a specific time on the TT50?
Fred, thanks for the reassurance re. the date - had me worried for a moment there!
Regarding time,initially I was intending to go for about 9-minute mileing, give or take, with short walking breaks. However, with the combination of (1) the atrocious conditions underfoot which I discovered on my recce run CP3 to end a couple of weeks ago (you'll have read the description on page 9), and (2) my posterior tibial tendon not being 100%, I'll now be happy to (a) finish; (b) within the cut-off time!
I'm just glad that after NDW50 in August I didn't let my fitness drop, but did a proper B2B about every third weekend. Otherwise, the week off at the end of November then four weeks of reduced mileage in December would have totally scuppered me. As it is, I think should be able to complete the 50 okay, if I don't try to push the pace and if my tendon keeps improving - it's a lot better today.
How about you? A time in mind?
just received another email from them to say that they are going to be strict about the cut off times at check points
I'm a bit worried now if the paths are that bad!!!