P + D training for VLM 2013



  • Blimey Ten are you reading it now, that's the second page/para quote from you today!

  • TenjisoTenjiso ✭✭✭

    I wear it next to my heart.

  • stutyrstutyr ✭✭✭

    One thing I've found useful is the following link:


    It summarises the 55 to 70 plan on one page, and also gives the summary description of each run type.  For the Medium run, it says follow the guidleines of the long run.  The long run is gradually accelarate to MP + 20% after five miles, accelerating to MP+10% for the last five miles.

    Although, I just run it a bit faster than an Aerobic run, and then aim for a negative split for the second half of the run.

    JF50, I had the same thoughts on the warm-up race, there's no Parkrun close to me so I was going to do 10 mile run with a 10k "race" effort in the middle as well. 

  • literatinliteratin ✭✭✭

    Hello everybody,

    I only have the first edition so can't look up the page in the 2nd edition that Ten just quoted. But for my MLRs I tend to pick whatever pace I feel like between 10% and 20%, by contrast with the long runs which I tend to do progressively as per instructions. That's partly because I tend to do MLRs at least partly with my club, though, and it's hard to insist they all stick to the pace I say! I do sometimes stick some marathon paced miles in there too, for similar reasons.

    For the warm-up race I was planning to just do it as a tempo, though perhaps not 10k's worth like JF50. I was thinking 1 mile warm-up, 5 miles at about 6:35-6:45 pace and then 1 mile cool down.

    My run today is 5.5 miles recovery with strides to get to trapeze class, then another 5.5 miles home. It was that or go running at 6am and I'm not a morning person. I'd been taking a break from trapeze to concentrate on the running, but was kind of missing it, so this is my compromise to fit everything in. Hope I haven't forgotten how to hang by my ankles!

    HeOw, hope the run goes well later. And Caz, I think 1 minute off PB is still impressive running and anyway lots of the recent HM PBs came from people ditching a week of the plan to taper.

  • TenjisoTenjiso ✭✭✭

    I've checked from cover to cover, and I can find no reference to trapeze anywhere! image 

    I guess it must be in the first edition only. 

  • literatinliteratin ✭✭✭

    It's the bit where it says about cross-training and core work.

  • Hmmmm I type a whole post and it seems to have vanishedimage.

    Well done on all the running. I've mixed up this week to allow for holiday travel on Sunday image and to do the 22 miler I missed last week.  Legs a bit tired now. Day off tomorrow and then 22 miles Saturday.

  • Thanks for the replies, great help
  • No PainNo Pain ✭✭✭

    Well done  on the running peeps, HeOw hope the foot is ok and today I did a 6 mle recovery run and 5 mile progresive tempo run to 6:00 pace total 5 miles in 33 mins. Tomorrow is an easy recovery day with a swim and easy runimage up into the 80's again this weekimage.

    CAZ if you ran 1 min off a PB well done but don't let it effect you It means your there or there abouts and it was only your B race, give it your all in Aprilimage

  • literatinliteratin ✭✭✭

    Right, I did running to trapeze class and back. Now feel knackered and hungry. As I was running back through a dodgy area of town a man was staring at me and I was expecting a nasty comment but then he said 'I wish I had your energy', which was actually quite lovely. I still don't quite see how 10+ miles in the same day with strides counts as recovery, though.

  • Did 6 miles recovery plus 10 by strides.  Did 10 strides rather than six as I wasn't sure so thought it best to do too many than too few.

  • Fucking twatting bastard foot. That is all. 

  • literatinliteratin ✭✭✭

    Fucking twatting bastard Mizunos, more like. image

  • Ahhhh that feels better.  

    Craig, I am very chuffed at how you have submerged yourself into the P&D plan and seem to be loving it.  I was always worried that you would hate it and I would feel guilty! 

    Ten - you make me laugh.  

    Everyone else - you must stop running until I am off the bench.  That is the P&D LAW.

    Re foot - thank you for your kind, wonderful, truly heart wrenching posts image - I have yet to put the prosthetic order in, I ran on it, only 3 miles, I even RAN/WALKED (what has this done to ME?!) and it hurt a little bit but as time has passed this evening, it actually seems to have helped, the creakiness has subsided a lot.  Fingers crossed.  I will start cross training like Lance on EPO tomorrow.

  • LIteratin - I am such a drama queen, majority of other runners would be zipping up their man boots and grooving down the mean streets of Cheshire, it is not painful enough to stop me running but I won't run with ANY pain at all. I think that is only one of the reasons why I have never been injured. 

  • literatinliteratin ✭✭✭

    HeOw, is there actually such a thing as a 'sensible drama queen'?

  • Evening All

    Nothing much to report from North Devon since Sunday's half - back to the schedule (deviated slightly last week due to a 'slight ' taper prior to the half) with a 1:45 14 miler yesterday, the 6 + 4 today (without the strides) and have the 9M V02 max session tomorrow (saved this from Tuseday as I swapped the sessions round to aid the post 1/2 recovery)

    Great running from everybody this week (as usual) - keep it up! 

  • Wish I would of got on the P&D for my 3 other marathons I have done, I have done 4 weeks on the schedule so far and have to say I have never felt fitter and stronger. I am starting to feel more confidnet about this marathon now, really can't wait.

  • Heow hope that foot is sorted soon. If not you are going to have to think about chopping it off.

    6 of the slowest miles of my life tonight near 9 min pace. Just a case of getting the miles in after the day from hell - an 8 hour round trip in the car for a one hour meeting! The last thing I wanted to do tonight was run, but I did so go me! Well it was a plod and everything is continuing to hurt, but I'll class it as a run anyway and chalk it up.

    NP I am starting to suspect that you are actually a machine.
  • Go CazGo Caz ✭✭✭
    Thanks for the positive comments everyone. At the end of the day it was just a tune-up race and actually didn't go too badly. An hour after the finish, I felt I like I could have done it again!

    Nice progressive MLR tonight for 12 miles.

    HeOw. All the best with the foot. Sounds like it is improving.
  • Lit - no wonder you were hungry after all that. isn't it nice when someone compliments you when running, so much better than the usual tirade or horn tooting. I once had a young lad (think 14 or 15) shout that I had a fantastic rear.  It was very funny cos I was old enough to be his mum. image

    HeOw - glad to hear that the foot seems to be getting better.

    NN - how is the tum?

    Chris - I think you are right, NP really is a machine

    Craig - you are not the only one wishing you had found this plan a few marathons ago.

  • Anyone have any opinion on this

    Did a 5 mile tempo last Thursday averaged 5:59 for the 5 miles and felt fine.

    Did a 4 mile tempo today averaged 6:00 min/miles and found it a right stuggle.  

    Any ideas/comments.



  • 15West15West ✭✭✭

    Morning all. 5 mi recovery run today. 

    HeOw - when I first saw your first message this morning thought that foot must be totally knackered after your run last night, but sounds like you are slowly and surely recovering. I often run through pain unless really bad (i.e. makes me limp when walking)....so far no injuries but probably only a matter of time!

    I never get compliments when running, or even when not running come to think of it. When I'm out on my runs I usually get looked at as if I'm some sort've wanker...or maybe I'm paranoid. Or naybe I am some sort've wanker.

    Forecast is lots of lovely rain tomorrow...so not sure whether it will be a park run or some sort've tempo run. Set to get nice and cold sunday.

  • 15West15West ✭✭✭

    Craig - maybe you're just more tired this week...?

  • Yes possibly, I did feel fairly tired after the 16 on Wednesday, 5 mile recovery yesterday and a week of work. 

  • MennaniaMennania ✭✭✭

    HeOw - Glad the foot is getting better - let me know when you are wanting to do the Delamere PB! Ther is a closed road 10k at Wrexham on 7th April which would prob be bang on for you doing Manchester. 2 weeks out from VLM may be a little close for me.

    Craig - Fatigue? - as we get closer (only 3 weeks of pre taper training left) you should be feeling it a bit. Or you could just have had one of thise days! Its bagged, move onto the next seesionimage

    8 with 6 x 600 at 1.55-1.59s for me yesterday. Felt ok but was pleased to finish the last one, It was that wet I was almost swimming.

  • I'd second (or third) fatigue as well Craig. The miles are piling up now and they are starting to take their cumulative toll (for me at least). Being busy in work doesn't help either and it sounds like you have been. Still, I wouldn't complain about 6 minute pace for a tempo session!

    On the issue of fatigue, there is a local cross countray race on Sunday. Doing this would mean doing the long run (20 miles) on Saturday afternoon and then racing on Sunday morning without recovery in between. Not sure its such a good idea the way my body is feeling at the mo. Anyone got any advice re racing the day after a long run?

  • 15West15West ✭✭✭

    if you're tired and aching now Chris then you are risking injury more. How long is the cross country race - can't you just make that the latter part of a 20mi run?

  • literatinliteratin ✭✭✭

    Chris, I haven't done this but I don't see why it wouldn't be okay as long as you don't mind if you don't race as fast as you're capable of when rested. P&D say that doing two hard sessions on consecutive days works okay because there isn't time for DOMS to set in before the second hard session (the race, in this case), so you kind of sneak it in before the cumulative effects hit you. You'd probably want to rest on the Monday, though.

    Meanwhile, my leg hurts. image But I think it is just a bruise low down on my shin bone rather than a running-related niggle. That's what it feels like, anyway.

  • literatinliteratin ✭✭✭

    Oh, x-post with 15West, who has been a lot more sensible than me. I answered the bit about the race but didn't think about the fatigue issue too. How much do you want/need to do the race?

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