P + D training for VLM 2013



  • 12 miles in 1 hour 1.52 for me I was going to do a 10 mile race but due to unforseen circumstances so to speak I couldnt go had to run this afternoon instead, but I am sure the LSR was more benefit to me than a hard race anyway...I do all my long runs at 70% max heart rate does anyone else use a HRM for these runs ?

  • I followed P&D70 for my first marathon in October - did 2:49 and now considering a spring marathon to try for sub 2:45.

    Bring it on!

  • KeirKeir ✭✭✭

    Nice work MXB. Where was the 2.49 ran?

  • I'm fine ta Tek. Just getting my legs back after a disapointing Chester marathon, I'm back up to 60 miles this week and thinking about whether I can squeeze another (not raced) marathon inbetween now and Manchester marathon at the end of April.

    I'm going to give Hadd a go until Febuary and then hit the P&D 70 mile schedule.image 

  • TeknikTeknik ✭✭✭
    Welcome mxb : what's the weather in Kenya ? Lol

    Gaz. Hadd base then the pfitzinger 12/70 worked out really well for me (although I'm imagining your 70% runs are my goal pace...)

    NN loads on here are using HRMs. I try to keep under 70% for the first 10m, then 75% ceiling ( which fits in with p&d's mp +20% to mp +10%)

    Al Jesus take care!
  • I'm at roughly 8:15 for 70%, 8:00 for 75% and, once a week, 7:15 for 85%. Really enjoying the training so far.

  • TeknikTeknik ✭✭✭
    Gaz I guessed right! Glad you're enjoying the high mileage/ low tempo...
  • Its the type of running I like mate, you can listen to a bit of music and daydream a bit while you're doing it. None of this running round like a lunatic!image

    I was umming and arring about trying Hadd over the summer then I saw what it did for you at Frankfurt and that was the final clincher!

  • I did a steady 11.5mile run this evening in 1h32 made a little more interesting by being locked inside Finsbury Park by the local council parks lockup person meaning I had to climb through a gap in the fence to get out image

    @Teknik - I've been doing intervals on a Tuesday so I've been doing a little speedwork too just out of enjoyment.

  • TeknikTeknik ✭✭✭
    ...gasping fat man turns into an aerobic machine! Albeit 2 cylinders...hoping to grow another 2 this winter image. We'll both have AGF to thank...
  • TeknikTeknik ✭✭✭
    Sorry Ship-star x post. Sacrilege! No speed work during base period ! Lol.
  • Nobody ever could give me a conclusive reason why one VO2 max session a week would hinder my base building, it seems I'm making a faux pas! I'm upto 30miles a week now which is actually the most I've ever run in a week, it seems I'm a long way behind the mileage of most of you guys in this thread!


  • Very true Tek. My training for my last 2 marathons has been more miles slower for the first and the less miles faster for the second. No prizes for guessing which marathon turned out better for me...image 

  • Ship, thats never seemed right to me either. I can understand that you could be using to the time more effectively for base building instead of running intervals but I can't believe that its actually counter productive to your general fitness.

    God knows though!!image

  • Keir wrote (see)

    Nice work MXB. Where was the 2.49 ran?


    Tek - Sadly I live in SE England, not Kenya.


  • macemace ✭✭✭

    YP - image, aren't we all !! image

    Tek - hope your recovery from Frankfurt is going well and the knee is holding up. What's the short term plan ?

    Nurse - HR monitor ? what's that then imageimage .... never leave home for a run without it. If it was a choice between clothing and HR monitor, the clothing wouldn't stand a chance image .... euggh, what a horrible thought, my poor neighbours image

    GazOC - the VO2 max stuff is freaking me out. How the hell am i going to get my head around that when all i know is Hadd image


    Nice 5M recovery at 6am HRav 65%. 

  • Mace - I have my first HR monitor on it's way from Amazon, I can't wait to get my hands on even more data because I'm a geek when it comes to training statistics! image

    Is the best way to monitor progress while base building by comparing BPM of similar workouts over time?

  • Ship star, No One individual run matters. Its the average drop over time.

    So for example at the start of the year my BPMile were 1400-1500. Now they are  1200-1300....for normal runs. However At the extreme I might get 1150 for a 5K race or 1400 if very tired/have a cold...but I ignore these - its the "normal runs " that you see improvement in over time- at that underpins your base fitness improvements / race times !!


  • YoungPup wrote (see)


    Shouldn't this be way too HADD core?

    Teknik wrote (see)

    Chick / Keir thanks...Chick LOL that's WAAAY too hardcore for me,

    hahaha - I love being HADDcore image

    Ship-star wrote (see)

    Mace - I have my first HR monitor on it's way from Amazon, I can't wait to get my hands on even more data because I'm a geek when it comes to training statistics! image

    Is the best way to monitor progress while base building by comparing BPM of similar workouts over time?

    Enjoy your new gadget image.

    4 weeks after my marathon I'm still slow and shit but at least I am building the miles back up. Hoping to hit 50 this week and that's where it will stay till January image

  • macemace ✭✭✭

    Ship - garmin and HR monitor was one of my all-time best purchases image. I use mine for HR control and, yes, to compare over a period of time against the same workout but also, as AGF says, to log monthly averages.

    I remember when i got mine, the excitement was unbearable image

  • macemace ✭✭✭

    Hi chick' image, 50M after 4 weeks is great going. That's my target as well.

    image imageimage @ "slow and shit"

    Did my LSR yesterday and realised an hour later my weekly total was 49 image !!!!!! Was tempted to do a 1M recovery in the afternoon to satisfy my OCD image

  • Morning all

    Lots of good miles going on by the sound of it.

    I have managed a total weekly mileage of 8 image However, legs felt pretty good on both of those runs so start to build the mileage again this week - about 20 I think then back to normal. I must get the HRM back out, haven't used it in ages. Still waiting on book to arrive.......maybe today.

    Ship - my average weekly mileage is probably only about 35 so I wouldn't worry. I've done more recently as been marathon training and hope to keep the mileage more towards 40 from now on.

  • Mace - cross posts. Don't you just hate when you are just short.  The worst for me is when an interval work out is over and you find you finished at 5.92 miles say.  Arrrrggggggghhhhhhh.

  • mace: Oh no! Epic OCD failure image

    Fiona: 8 miles is plenty in the first week after a marathon: I think I did about the same.

  • Ok Ok I know it was a silly question image

    I have had mine for a couple of years garmin 310xt a present from my OH I love it but this will be the first time I have trained for a marathon with one...I have seen my 70% runs drop from 10.30 min miling ( very annoying having to run that slow )to 9.15s in the last year and on a really good day...sub 9s..

    48 miles for last week

    easy 6 in 54 mins today 

    No vo2 max sessions !!!! image I am gutted  NOT !!!


    mace I WOULD have done that extra mile  , if I say I a going to do 6 miles ...5.99 just wont do.So I am as OCD as you

  • TeknikTeknik ✭✭✭

    I'm amazed at just how much a mara sets you back in pace/ HR terms...it's going to be a long road back againimage

    some good base miles being put in here- can't wait to join in...

    mace - the Vdot intervals are at 5k pace (P&D p24)...you won't be able to focus on the HR monitor image,but that should be 93-95% max-ish. My goals are to get back up to 65m pw (all slow except maybe one sub-LT pw), jump on the P&D 12/70 (with extra LSR miles), and I'm thinking of doing Hamburg on 28/4 - goal time to be determined by how much I take off my Half pb in March (not "raced" one for 2 years)image


  • Tek, you think doing more Hadd and the 12 week P&D program would be more benefital than less Hadd and the 18 week? I'm sort of leaning that way myself to give Hadd every opportunity to kick in.

  • TeknikTeknik ✭✭✭

    Gaz definitely more Hadd for me - having said that if you stick to the lower end of the HR ranges in P&D there isn't much difference, really...just the subLT vs LT question...

  • Phew after a couple  of days not looking at this thread I'm lost already.  I haven't HADD trained so not sure of how much it differs from P&D.  I'm only at 30 miles a week off 4 day training currently but starting to push up slowly from this week onwards, will add another day in to the mix for an initial increase

  • Funny you should mention that Tek. I'm going to give the sub LT a go for as long as possible rather than the LT runs. I always struggle with the speed of LT runs and my legs/ feet arn't right for days afterwards so they sometimes cost me miles in training. 

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