Running and rowing (erging)

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  • 2k race last night on the rower. No one to race against though. More girls need to get rowing.image

    Running I did my short loop (3.8 miles and about 250ft of hills) at 8:15 min/mile pace. I'm thinking that I might have a sub 4 hr marathon in me if the training goes well. Long run tomorrow.

  • 2K races hurt.

    Plenty of girls rowing round here in Reading. My standard run takes me along the Thames and by two boathouses, and I get to see the ladies' crews training on the river. Some of them are quite rapid and by the look of them are seriously competitive.

  • Muttley, I had a good look throught the Pete Plan. It looks like a flexible enough plan to fit around my running and I'm going to drop the row pro plan I started out on as a bit of 'practice'.

    Do you just use the PM monitor to set up your sessions, or do you use rowpro. I thought about RowPro first, but last night realised racing against a previous session didn't seem to be possible for intervals. Also it doesn't seem possible in RowPro to have distance intervals, and timed recovery where RowPro can record the recovery metres.

    Just wondered how you set this up. After a 3 week cycle it will be great to pace/race against the previous session.

    Hannah I had a look at the BORC results. I was surprised to see how few competitors there were in any category. Still, a win is a winimage. When I was looking at buying a Concept in September, there was a little waiting list on Model D's due to post olympic interest in rowing. It doesn't seem to have translated to more people rowing the pixel river.

  • If you were to buy a rower which was not a concept one what would you buy?

     

  • Also-ran: I use RowPro to set up the sessions. You're right, it's not possible to set the pacer on intervals or record "paddling" metres during rest periods. Pity. All my Pete Plan sessions are in the PC and I don't use the PM at all to programme workouts now. I keep track of my paces in the logbook in RowPro and online for reference when I next do that session.

    In my current training cycle I'm on the third week of the third set of Pete Plan workouts. They're called "lunch hour" but I usually need a pretty generous lunch "hour" for each go.

    I've never tried out the online rowing, quite content to chase myself on steady distance pieces.

    Hannah: - hey, you won ... you can only beat the opposition that turn up on the day. And you would have beaten me as well image.

    Spen: I'm biased but only a C2 will do imho. There is also the Waterrower but that's more consumer than competitive. The magnetic rowers you see in the department stores look okay but they lack the motivation tools of the C2. If you shop around you can sometimes find refurbed C2s for about £750.

  • Oh, forgot to say - yesterday was a rowing day so it was a spot of running today. Seven and a half miles including 10K tempo. Felt good image

  • Spen. You need a C2. If you buy a used one you wont loose money if you want to sell it again. They hold their value so well.

  • Slowly coming back with the running, 6 miles this morning with 4 somewhere between my MP and HMPace to blow out some cobwebs. No pain for the firt time in 2 months.

    This evening I did my 1st Pete Plan session, it was the 8 x 500m. Before I started, I thought the 3'30" recovery was going to be way too long. Turns out I needed every second of itimage. That was a hard session - thanks Muttley for introducing me to a new world of pain!

    spen71 - the only other rower I considered was the Oartec Slider. It had some good reviews, but I felt more confident going with Conecept 2 as a company, because of its integration with RowPro, a large user community, and because of their proven quality. They also have good resale values. I figure they should last a lifetime given the misuse and abuse the C2's get in Gyms.

  • Also-ran: - you're welcome image

    It took me a while to get the pacing right for the various shorter and longer intervals. Best advice was from the man himself - first time round do all but the last one at a pace you know you can hold easily enough and then hammer the final rep, average out the paces and there's your target for next time. When you resist the temptation to go faster than target until you give it the beans on the final rep, average out the paces and, etc etc ... The shorter intervals I quite like, it's the endurance intervals that make me hurt.

    Nothing for me today. Had a really good run last night but still trying to shake off an annoying low-level sniffle that's now in my throat.

  • Got back on the C2 tonight so I could do a 20 min session whilst the dinner was cooking. Long way from anything serious but did manage some intervals resulting in 3200m and a sore bum!

  • Argh, still fighting the annoying low-level sniffle. It's on my throat now. I think it's finally on its way out but still, nothing for me today. Frustrating.

    Unless I feel really crap tomorrow I shall resume with a Pete Plan steady 10K.

  • Pete Plan Week 1 now done. I did a 10k which I felt in the backside the next day. I quite liked the 5 x 1500m, being able to stand up and stagger around for a few minutes. I probably didn't go hard enough, but in 3 weeks time when its repeated, I know what I have to beat.

    I much preferred this week  to the RowPro cardio plan that I had generated. Busy this weekend, otherwise would do one more long steady row.

  • Well you're doing a lot better than I am, Also-ran.You might not think you went hard enough, but you'll soon begin to feel the pressure on the PP intervals image

    Feeling reasonably okay and thinking I'd got the better of the man flu I sat down and started a steady 45-minute row. Five minutes in, sweating profusely and with hr 15 above where it should be, I down handled. Obviously not fit to resume yet. Maybe tomorrow.

    Pah image

  • Ah Muttley hope you feel better tomorrow. image

  • It's amazing what 24 hours and a day's sick note does for one's recovery. Yesterday I was at hr 140+ just five minutes in at paddling pace. Today it was in the mid 120s, as normal. I set the machine for 45 minutes but stopped after 30 mins as the hr was creeping upwards by then. Best not to push my luck.

    Gentle run tomorrow morning and then, all being well, to resume the Pete Plan.

    Wahey image

  • Back on the Pete Plan, yay. Standard 45-minute steady distance row done, hr well within the norm, recovery complete.

    Next session is the 3k, 2.5k and 2k intervals ... which always hurts.

  • Good to hear you are back on the water Muttley.

    I did the Pete Plan pyramid speed interval yesterday. After doing that, I will be glad to do a steady 10k row tomorrow. I haven't looked yet to see what speed endurance intervals come next .... one day at a timeimage

  • Ah, the pyramid.That's my favourite session! You might think the rest intervals are long but jeez, go fast enough and you definitely need them.

    I've just done the 3k, 2.5k and 2k endurance interval session, av pace 0.5 second per 500m quicker than last time so mission accomplished.

    10k steady row for me next but will try to get in a run tomorrow.

  • I row as well as run. Earlier this year my club 2k test was the day after the London marathon. Painful. 

    For non-rowers this (expletive-ridden) account sums how daunting a 2k is, with helpful illustrations

    http://somethingaboutrowing.blogspot.co.uk/2011/12/2k.html

     

  • Charles Jans wrote (see)

    I row as well as run. Earlier this year my club 2k test was the day after the London marathon. Painful. 

    For non-rowers this (expletive-ridden) account sums how daunting a 2k is, with helpful illustrations http://somethingaboutrowing.blogspot.co.uk/2011/12/2k.html  

    That has to be the best blog I've read in a long time - didn't know whether to laugh or cry at the pain. I've decided I'm not trying hard enough!

    Question for you rowers. What is the best test to establish your Max heart rate on an erg. Tried doing a step test today and it all seemed to go wrong at the end (don't think I let my heart rate rise enough before I blasted off in the last step - crap pacing).

    I read about another test: row steady for 1'30", increase power by 25 watts for next 1'30", and just keep upping the power till you explode

  • Hi Charles Jan

    I loved your blog. I do a bit home rowing on a C2, mainly intervals pyramid fashion as cross training. Haven' t done anything like a fast as you can 2K but can imagine it hurts a lot. Note to myself to work harder! Thanks for the link. image

  • Interesting how the 2K is the only pb that matters for rowers and how all other distances are kinda pushed aside. I'm not a fan of 2Ks - too short, fast and furious. I'm more a long slow take-it-easy guy image

    I do enjoy a good thrash on the Pete Plan short intervals but when it comes down to it, this is training not racing so I'm not going to wreck myself on them.

    Even then, if we assume that rowing is 60 per cent legs and 20 each of torso and arms/shoulders, then a good 10K on the erg is equivalent to 6K running. I've found that if I do this on a Saturday evening I usually have a good race on the Sunday - the rowing seems to flush the legs out nicely.

    Also-ran - I use my running max hr for the erg. Imho max hr is max hr regardless of how you achieve it.

  • My main purpose for buying the erg was also for the longer cardio rows. 12k today. Amazing how I couldn't bear more than 15 minutes on the seat just a few weeks ago.



    Putting together my next marathon plan at the moment and will be including some steady rows each week, and to cycle through the Pete Plan speed/endurance intervals over a longer period than the 3 week rotation.



    For max heart rate on seated equipment its going to be lower, similar to biking. Just interested to know the rowing max for me to refine the rows. At 140bpm I feel I'm working far harder rowing than running - no doubt that's partly down to being a more efficient runner than rower.



    Really liking the integration between the PM monitor and my Garmin. Nice to have all the run and row data together.
  • I've never monitored HR whilst rowing but I can imagine it being similar to cycling, i.e. effective max being a fair bit lower / perceived effort being higher for the same HR, especially for a good runner.  If I wanted to get an approximation for max I'd probably just do a 2k flat-out after a good warm-up.

    I've got back into the habit of erging as part of my gym sessions and I'm doing a 5k a couple of times a week.  I may consider doing a longer session once a week as well, although that would need to be sacrificed when I need to start working more seriously on duathlon fitness in the new year.  Today's 5k done in 19:00, although my best (only!) 10k time is 36:51, when I was doing a lot more rowing a year ago for running rehab.  Got a way to go to get that level back again I think.

  • I entered the RowPro Race Night Series last night, and managed another 4th place. The handicap system really plays in my favour (lightweight / vet), otherwise I'd be at at the bottom end of the pack.

    This months event was 3 x 10min races. I paced fairly well, and managed to increase distance in each race. I went completely flat out in the last race at the end, and got my heart rate within 9 beats of my running max heart rate. Slightly mistimed it as I was slumped over with about 5 seconds to go! That will teach me.

    That's a tidy 10k Phil.

    Back to the Pete Plan now the fun is over.

  • I also get the impression that at a given hr I'm working harder on the C2 than I am when running.

    Those are decent times, Phil. I'm working on getting my 5K time to below 20 minutes, a couple of seconds each session as part of the Pete Plan.

    But yesterday's attempt was a failure. It felt really heavy going and the hr was very high for no apparent reason. Just a bad day. Another go tomorrow. I had a fairly long easy run today so should be fresh.

  • So glad I found this thread as I am so looking forward to having my C2 delivered this Saturday - Yay!.  Am doing a half ironman next year and decided to include rowing in my cross training (yes, another sport!) as I cannot always get to a pool.  Having googled before I have come across the Pete Plan which I thought I would start using.  Also at the weekend I plan to download RowPro for the 20 day free trial.  Will also be using my Polar HRM so all the discussion over your max is perfect image

    I ended up with the C2 as I know I will use it (have had a treadmill at home for 10 years and have been using that all this time) and as you have already pointed out, they hold their value well so I took the plunge and purchased one online Sunday evening.

  • Another 'erger' joins Mutley's foldimage Let us all know how you get on Beck Boo

    A steady 10K at lunchtime for me. Had I pushed it I would have been a couple of boat lengths (plus several minutes) behind PhilPub's 10k!

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