Ultra Trail - Tour du Mont Blanc

[Deleted User]

fb - Yes, 21hrs is an awesome time for TMB.

I wouldnt be trying to win though, just to get round.

In my experience of other ultras eg Jordan Desert Cup (168km), MdS etc. whilst the winners run most of the way the majority end up walking for significant portions of the race.

What I am trying to work out is what proportion of running vs walking I would need to do to get round before the cut off. If it turns out that it its only possible if you run virtually all of it then I'll knock the idea on the head now. On the other hand if I could walk the uphills and run downhill then I'll probably give it a go.

fat buddha

have a natter with JC - he did it in 44hrs so that would be my first port of call......

John Cunnane

FB, I'll definitely consider your suggestion of drafting something up on my experience, and thanks for your offer to look over it before anything gets finalised. It may not be for a little while, though, as I have a lot on my plate at present with work commitments, and I will admit to being nervous about it as I have absolutely no experience in that area.... As you say, it is a harder event than the LDWA hundreds, basically because of the amount of climbing - 28000 ft as opposed to 14000 ft at the Exmoor LDWA 100 last May.But it is manageable. As I had done Exmoor in 32hrs 39 mns, I thought I'd at least try to get to Courmayeur, and if I managed Champex as well I was determined to get to the end inside the time limit. Also it is 97 miles, which saves about an hour on the full 100 events, so 44hrs seemed possible. According to the split - times results, I was about half - way down the field for the early parts of the event, 700+ ahead of me until after Courmayeur where significant numbers seemed to want to give up (despite magnificent weather & good food,drink, showers). After this there were 500/400-ish in front of me - I was never anywhere near the fast folks. I saw nobody running up any of the steep pulls on the route,no-one at all up the Col de Voza, or from Notre Dame de la Gorge all the way up the two Bonhommes, or the Col de la Seigne, Bertone, or up to Refuge Elena, the Grand Col Ferret, Bovine or Les Tseppes. Any running was confined to those sections of downhill where the under-foot conditions and your own physical state allowed. For anyone who can manage to finish the LDWA Hundreds in 32-36ish hrs, it is a walking event with a small element of running, maybe 10-15% - just like the Hundreds. UW - you'll be well able for it - I would recommend that you recce the whole route beforehand, and you will be at a tremendous psychological and physical advantage - you will know precisely what is coming at each stage, and will organise your progress from experience & knowledge. That way, the steep sections become tolerable, not something unknown and to be feared. J.

[Deleted User]

Thanks JC,

I think I'll put this on my list of things to do for next year.

fat buddha

cool post JC..almost makes me want to do it!!! look forward to your report if you do it...

btw - did you get any kip at all at any point?? or did you just keep going in a hallucigenic state that sleep deprivation brings on???

John Cunnane

FB, no kip - on the LDWA 100s I've noticed that nobody sleeps at all around the route, although personally I do lie down to rest my body for a half hour at the breakfast stop, and am the only one to do so, dozens overtaking me at this point. The tight time limits on the UTMB militate against taking much of a break. However at 1:21 am at Champex, I did need a rest and as well as making sure I got a shower and a change of clothes, food and drink in some quantity, I put my head down for 15 minutes, remaining awake even so. It was enough to be a real help; the adrenaline and the determination not to lose the time advantage I'd built up were enough motivation to keep pressing on, even if very slowly and with blistered feet up Bovine in the dark. My feet were so painful that I resorted to painkillers, to the maximum quantity I could get away with. This was a major factor in making me feel rather woozy, especially on the bl....y Sentier des Gardes. It was all well worth the pain in the end, though; I've felt similar many times on LDWA events, have never given up on a challenge walk or run, & was not going to let that happen on the UTMB. Next time I hope I can find better ways of keeping my feet in reasonable condition; we live in hope! J.

John Cunnane

Just managed to complete the Cardiff Marathon, first long event since UTMB. Sneaked a PB, 4h09.40 (told you I was slow), about 50 seconds better than Paris 2002 (4.10.31). Might consider the Snowdonia next but as it's only 4 weeks away I may pass on that. Will definitely do the Round Rotherham in December, my 7th year on the trot - marvellous event, hope to improve on last year's pb of 12.39 All good preparation as well for the UTMB 2005. Caspar, you do the RR regularly I think? (much faster than me). Are you hoping to do that one this year? I'm coming up the night before with 2 of my colleagues from the South Wales LDWA, staying in the Travel Inn at Wombwell Friday, & also Saturday after the event (long drive back after the RR). Might see you at the start if you are a 7am starter? Cheers, J.

[Deleted User]

Jogn only did the RR last year anddid it in abaout the same time as you - we may have come in together, there were about 7 of us who all converged in R for the last coupleof miles

cant do it this year as I will be out of the country but will do it next

fat buddha

ah - this is the better boing.....

Matt the Brum

My friend has just bought a chalet in Chamonix so may well be up for this next summer.

fat buddha

he must have some dosh then with the way prices have gone up over the last few years.......have had an apartment there for 10 years now so seen the lovely price rises!!!

Flying Ant

Ed_m are you contemplating this one too ?

[Deleted User]

JC I have entered the UTMB 2005 and need some advice. What kit should i carry with me and what should i put in my drop bag. cheers ash

Matt the Brum

When is UTMB 2005?

fat buddha

26-28 August (Bank Holiday weekend?)

http://www.ultratrailmb.com/

Matt the Brum

Thanks, I'll go and whet my appetite on the website.

fat buddha

I hope to be close by doing the Passy Triathlon down the valley at Sallanches......

John Cunnane

Wagger, you can keep your rucsac pretty light as there are regular refuelling stops all around the course.The compulsory items (or their acceptable equivalents) need to be carried. A light waterproof /windproof coat is important in case of inclement weather - 2004 was brilliant weather with no rain, but apparently 2003 was partly rainy. As you are moving pretty quickly, the only times you feel the cold are in the night coming out of the warm checkpoints into sub-zero temperatures. I took the stategic decision not to carry a fleece, and it worked out fine. I carried the 1/25000 maps of the route with me, but because the route was so amazingly well-waymarked, I didn't need the maps at all. The main thing to be wary of is, to be SURE to carry enough liquid at all times. You mustn't forget, as I did, to fill your water bottle at the Les Chappieux stop. I had a spell of semi - dehydration all the way up the Col de la Seigne and down to Elisabetta.You could opt, as many did, for a camelbac. The major stops at Courmayeur & Champex provide a great opportunity to clean yourself up and get a new set of clothes on. I suggest a full change of clothes and shower - gel, &c go into the bag that you send on to both destinations. You could put another pair of shoes in for Courmayeur if you feel you would benefit from that, but shoes are a very personal thing and for myself, I find that if my feet are bad, and I swap shoes in mid-event, it makes things worse, so I stick with the one pair. You can put spare energy bars/biscuits/&c and drinks in the send-on bags. I didn't actually use much of the food/drink stuff I put in, & ended up retreiving it with the bags at the end. Most important, is tocarry some really good torches. Beware of getting torches that only do an adequate job. Get the best illumination you can for the two nights of darkness. Hope this helps. J.

fat buddha

boing for hill runner

John Cunnane

Hillrunner, in answer to your questions;
1) The cut-off times are OK in the earlier stages as long as you keep moving with determination. You need to create and maintain an attitude of mind by which you will know that you can, & will, complete the event. Keep walking at a good pace , and where you can, do a bit of running.Pace yourself relative to the cut-off times. It is very realistic to get to La Balme (below the Cols du Bonhomme) 2hrs - 2hrs 30mns ahead of the cut-off if you stay in the middle of the pack.
Later, as the climbs take their toll, you will need to withdraw time from what you have banked. Keep an hour up on the cut-offs if at all possible. At Courmayeur (71km), I was 3hrs up on the time limits but slowed after that & by Trient (129km), I was down to a 29 - minute advantage. I did everything to speed up after that and pulled back to just over 1 hr by the finish. But they will not allow anyone to continue if they are still at the checkpoint when the time comes to close it. You need to be out of Vallorcine (139km)at closing time or you will be stopped. However, everyone who got out of Vallorcine in time was allowed to finish, including several who missed the official 44hr finish time but were still classed in the 420 who were accepted as having completed the full route.
However, I believe that most who did not complete the 155km gave up rather than being terminated by the organisers.
2)You need to get your doctor to write a note, on headed notepaper,
"This is to certify that (your name), date of birth --/--/--,is fit to participate in the Ultra Trail du Tour du Mont-Blanc on 26/28 August 2005. Signed (name of doctor); (date)". He can use a sick note and cross out the references to "is suffering from........" and to "is unable to work......."
He may or may not ask for a fee, but is essential to get in the event.
3)Plenty of opportunities to jump on a bus if you give up - you may have to pay, though, unless you give up at Courmayeur.
4) I am an LDWA walker more so than a runner, but was able to finish ok (384th of 1400 starters). Forget running except where it comes easy on some of the more manageable sections.
I can certainly recommend a place to stay - send me an e-mail.
By the way, I hope you've entered already ; entries are on the point of closing (medical cert. can follow if you get registered in time).
Cheers, J.

[Deleted User]

Ok cheers very much for that. I will get the entry in now!!

[Deleted User]

Well the deed is done and ive entered it online!

I will take some time to read through the report you put on here John you did really well. I will need all the help i can get.

Anyone else going................?

fat buddha

nope

but will hopefully be doing the Passy Triathlon just down the valley at Sallanches that weekend on Sunday 28th so will get up to Cham on Saturday to see you fools start........is one hell of an undertaking!

[Deleted User]

I've entered this too.

JC, whats the score with the medical certs, I was under the impression that you took them along when you registered. Do we need to submit them in advance?

John Cunnane

CP, get your medical certificate in as fast as you can. Registration is almost closed & they will be rejecting applications very soon. If 2000 entries complete with medical certificates are lodged, those without certificates will lose out. J.

John Cunnane

There is a very informative thread on the UTMB website Forum page - (headed "UK"), all in English - www.ultratrailmb.com - loads of details from participants from last year with tips on what to carry, equipment, training &c. Recommended(essential)reading for anyone doing this year's event.

[Deleted User]

Thanks JC,

I'd better get the medical cert sorted out asap.

[Deleted User]

These guys were great last year and 5 minutes from the start line
(although go and buy your own breakfast elsewhere)

http://www.hoteltouring-chamonix.com/

[Deleted User]

So who is doing it this year?

Does anyone one know of any places, as I missed the registration cut off thinking I had a place held open from last year.

(I pulled out of the year's event through injury)

John Cunnane

HI, Caspar - think it's too late for 2005 now (entries closed early April). Go for 2006 - whack in an early entry to be sure - www.ultratrailmb.com will have details in a few months - keep checking. I expect 2006 will fill up in a few weeks after entries open so need to keep an eye on the website.
Lots of Brits are in (40-50) - mostly new names but a number of us are going back from 2004. All are busy training in their own ways, trying to avoid injury & looking forward enormously to the event.
Cheers, John.