RW Forum SIx – 3.30 – 4.00



  • Carter - I reckon about 7:50 pace. Do your intervals tonight at Half Marathon pace - no quicker, no slower.

    Carl - that's fine - don't worry. It can't always be easyimage

  • Sod times, paces, nutrition etc. How the hell do I get that James Blunt song out my head ???

  • I have to admit I don't know the song. Sounds like I don't want to either!

  • Youtube it - but make sure youre not feeling low or sad when you listen to it, it might send you over the edge image

  • Ok gang, next topic for discussion - sports massages. Good thing or bad thing ? Too expensive ? Frequency ?

    I had one last year and to say it hurt was an understatement. I didn't really feel a benefit to my running afterwards but that was before I was running 5 times a week, maybe it would help now ?

    Anyone else had one and found it helped ?
  • I have quite a lot. Mostly because my mate does it so it's cheap! I find one a month is really good. Helps to fix niggles before they turn into injuries. Different people seem to have different styles. Some are better than others. The more you have them the less they hurt.


    carterusm wrote (see)
    Ok gang, next topic for discussion - sports massages. Good thing or bad thing ? Too expensive ? Frequency ?
    I had one last year and to say it hurt was an understatement. I didn't really feel a benefit to my running afterwards but that was before I was running 5 times a week, maybe it would help now ?
    Anyone else had one and found it helped ?

    Depends if there's a happy ending? imageimageimage

  • Seriously though, can't help out with that one Carter - never had one.

    So - finally back out on the tarmac tonight for my usual Wednesday hill session - added in a tempo mile on the way back in to liven things up :

    1.2 miles warm up @ 9.30 pace
    1.2 miles of hill reps
    0.5 mile recovery @ 9.30 pace
    1 mile tempo @ 7.07 pace
    0.5mile cool down @ 9.30 pace

    Much more satisfying than treadmill running I have to say.

  • Nice one Ricky, you really can't beat getting out on the road can you.

    Spoons - would you recommend an 'all over leg massage' or just focus on one area each time ?
  • Spoons - your advice has been spot on so far & very useful!

    Here's another for you (and back on the topic of bonking) - I normally do a MLR late on a Sat afternoon at MP and then do my LSR the following Morn (Sun)..... do you think this increases my chance of bonking? Should I move the MLR to Friday (normally a rest day) and use Sat as rest day instead?

  • Carter - I usually get legs, gluteus and lower back. Sometimes upper back too...

    Good run there Ricky - I'm a big fan of mixing stuff up like that. 

    Ricky - how long is the MLR? The answer is - if you're used to it and it works then it's fine. The more you increase your chance of bonking without actually bonking the better the training benefit. When I'm training I usually do something similar but the other way round with a LSR on the Sunday and a MLR on the Monday. When Carter starts his Ultra training he'll be doing back to back long runs on Sat and Sun. Running a long run on tired legs is perfect marathon training..... As long as you can finish the run!

  • Spoons - I'm just reviewing my plan for next week. As you know, I have my HM on Sunday so I was thinking I might need to cut back slightly for a few days afterwards, or should I just carry on as normal ? My normal weekly routine is:

    Monday - Rest

    Tuesday - Tempo (currently at 30 mins)

    Wednesday - MLR (currently at 8-10)

    Thursday - Intervals 

    Friday - Rest

    Should I cut down on effort/intensity or time/distance ? 

  • Spoons for now the saturday MLR is only 7 mls although that builds to 10mls within the next 5 weeks or so.

    Carter - if it were me I'd change tues to a recovery /easy run given that you will effectively had an extended tempo run on race day. Rest of the week I would continue as normal as long as you are not feeling any ill effects from the race.

    That's just my 10ps worth though - Spoons will have a more experienced take on it hopefully!
  • Ricky - that will be fine then

    Carter - have a rest on Monday and see how you feel. Best bet would be to carry on as normal and train straight through but if you're legs are trashed then make Tuesday and easy run.

  • Carl DCarl D ✭✭✭

    Ricky - great session last night.

    Carter - Spoons suggestion very sensible. Got to listen to your body.

    I decided to change things about this week and give my body some recovery time. With the kids all being sick with flu/virius for the last week, I have been running and not feeling 100%. When running on Tuesday night it was the first time that the cold got through to me. So I took a night off.

    I am going to do my interval training at the track tonight.

    I will be doing a 20 mile LSR real slow on Saturday morning and I am going to change my recovery run on Sunday into an 8-10 mile MLR.

  • Hi all - wondering if you can help me. I've hit week 6 of training, having been laid low with the lurgy last week, and with a half marathon next week. I'm looking for a bit of help and motivation as I'm doing all my training by myself and also nursing a bit of an injury. I have a place in London and am going to give it until mid March for a final decision, hence my LSRs are still pretty short, but would be great to able to share some experiences, training and chat to others aiming for a 3.30-4.00 marathon. Am I in the right place?

  • Hi Hannah. Spoons is mentoring and giving help and advice on here and I know he will be more than happy to help you where he can too.

    So, where are you at with your training ? What is your current training plan ? Which half are your running next week ? What are you current PBs for races you have entered ? What injury have you been suffering with ?


  • Hi Carter - Well.....where do I start?

    Lower back injury mainly (probably just weak glutes, and very stiff s-i joint, but it through a disc out last year which meant I deferred last year's VLM).

    Been running for about 13 years though, and have done 3 marathons with P.B of 3.54 in Berlin 2009. Paris 2011 should have been a PB, but got severe dehydration and crawled last 7 miles, finishing in 4.00.00.

    Other PBs (mainly from 2010-11) 21.41 Park run 5k, 45.06 10k, 1.40 half marathon. Doing Portsmouth next week and hoping for a 1.50ish 

    Doing 4 runs a week at the mo, tending to run at lunch time during week as can't get out much in evenings.

    Sadly LSR is only up to 12, however as I tend to do a Sat run and then a Sunday as I find body deals better with shorter LSRs and going into them slightly fatigued by Saturday run. 

    So this week I've done:

    7 miles on Tuesday in 1.00.54

    6 miles build-up today on treadmill (9.00-7.30)

    planning 12 on Saturday

    then 4-5 miles recovery on Sunday

    plus pilates and sometimes a 45 min swim   

    That's enough from me now!

  • Big_GBig_G ✭✭✭

    I've been lurking on here and have read the whole thread over the last few weeks, so thought I'd finally post.  I'm not really sure if I'll get sub-4 but it's a target anyway....I may be way off, but we'll see.

    I'm following the Shades plan, and I'm regularly participating in that thread.  I'm doing the North Dorset Village marathon on 5th May so looking forward to that.  It's my second marathon and the first one was a disaster so the primary aim is to enjoy this one and then see where I go from there.

    I run 4 times a week and am a member of a club and I'm currently doing 30-35 miles per week, with the plan leading up to about 43 miles.  I have a half marathon this weekend where I'm aiming for a PB - if I get 1:45 I'll be delighted, but I expect it will more than likely be something in the region of 1:48.  My current PB is 1:50:16 at this distance but that was on a hilly course in October 2012 and I've dropped a few pounds in weight since then and generally feel fitter/quicker.  The half this weekend is billed as being pancake flat but I'm already getting my excuses, as the weather forecast doesn't look great.....  Shades has said she'll review my training paces based on that result, so that should be good.

    I have no questions as such (yet!!), but just thought I'd say hi!  My main quotes that I'm keeping in mind at all times are "to slow down on the LSRs" and "go quicker on the faster runs".  I know that's not particularly scientific, but I'm a simple soul and those quotes are something even I can grasp....!

  • Hi Hannah and welcome - 12 miles isn't panic stations. Just need to keep building them up. I also have lower back issues and weak glutes. image

    Hi Big G - I'm originally from Dorset. Lovely part of the world. Not done that marathon though.


  • Thanks Spoons. Any strengthening exercises and other guidance would be much appreciated. I guess I'm still living a little in fear of the LSRs. Will do 12-13 this weekend then at around 9.15-9.30 a mile and then aim for the half marathon next weekend and I suppose that will give me a good indication of pain levels and fitness.

    Hi Big G - I'm also from near Dorset - on the edge of the New Forest - lovely part of the world, so really shouldn't have any excuse for not running, apart from the copious amounts of mud everywhere at the moment!

  • Big_GBig_G ✭✭✭
    Hi - I'm actually from Devon, but I've heard the North Dorset Village Marathon is a great event so I'm going for that one to enjoy the event.

    The half I'm doing this weekend is in Exeter. I haven't done it before but it's got PB potential I think.
  • Hi all,

    As today seems to be a day for new recruits do you mind if I pull up a stool?

    I have been perusing the thread and there seems to be a lot of good advice being dished out and as I'm a little tired of the smartarsery of some of the threads good, friendly advice and tips would be much appreciated.

    I have until now some been running mileage, 35 miles per week there or there abouts but could do with some suggestions on speedwork as I plod along same pace any distance like a clockwork toy. It sounds dumb but I struggle to run anything but "my" pace

    I have a half marathon St Paddy's day (March 17th) and a marathon May 12th.

    Plus half my family are from Dorset, I'm not sure how this info helps but who knows?

  • Hannah - this will sort you out:

    plus loads of squats of course

  • Hi Oirisheyes - Having Dorset blood proves you're a little odd which can only be a good thing. You are suffering from the most common thing I see and hear in runners trying to improve. The one pace syndrome. Easiest way to get started is simply to try and chuck in a few 1 minute bursts of fast running into a run. If you need to stop and have a rest at the end to get your breath back then do so. Plus try and start your runs off slower than you normally would. Like really slow. Once you've done this a few times ask again and I'll suggest a few simple sessions to try.

  • Whilst we are talking Dorset - I am from a tiny hamlet near the Cerne Abbas giant, moved to West Bay, Bridport when I was 12. Then moved to London when I was 15 and never went back!

  • You've been around a bit haven't you Spoons image

    Welcome to the Dorset contingent. I think this is a good thread for you all to be as Spoons has been guiding and advising me over the last few weeks and already I can see a big improvement in my times. The only thing I am struggling with is that I dont run my slow runs slow enough !!

    Anyway, feel free to ask any questions and I'm sure we will all chip in and then Spoons will tell us the the right thing to do !

  • Intervals tonight so I thought I would mix it up a little. The plan was 2 x 400, 2 x 800, 2 x 1000 @ HMP, 2 miles @ MP. Here are the results.

    Split 1 (400) - 5:53

    Split 2 (400) - 6:07

    Split 3 (800) - 6:29

    Split 4 (800) - 6:28

    Split 5 (1000) - 6:46

    Split 6 (1000) - 6:48

    Split 7 (2 miles x MP) - 8:41

    Whilst I hurt during these intervals I feel really good when I've finished and feel like I really enjoyed myself at the track. When I check the times I am even happier as I wasnt expecting anything like this. The good thing as well is that I didnt feel too tired after the session and I still feel ok now, no aching or stiffness at all, happy days.

    The 2 miles @ MP also felt good. The first lap I had to keep looking at my watch to check my pace but once I had 'locked in' on the required pace I maintained it well and didnt have to check my watch again.

    So, 2 rest days now and then Liversedge HM on Sunday.

  • How are things with Will, Ricky and Carl ?

    Spoons - hope those blisters on the palms of your hands are getting better image

  • Very speedy session there Carter. A lot quicker and longer than I suggested though. Hopefully it won't affect your half too much on Sunday...... 

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