RW Forum SIx – 3.30 – 4.00



  • Going slow is difficult - I was beginning to master it but have done my last 3 LSRs with company( which is great in that the miles seem to fly by as we chat and great for encouragement/pacing during the final few tough miles ) but.... he's faster than me with a recent 3.17 marathon so he naturally finds it hard to stick to 9:30 and we both really have to focus to keep it close to that.... very easy to drift to 9 m/mls or faster!!

    There's your answer Hannah - get a running bud!

    Late run for me tonight - working to 8.30pm image...... 0degC when I went out but bright & dry.
    I did my hill session tonight, having switched it with my MLR, so I don't run two consecutive speed sessions.
    I have to say it seems to have helped me run a much higher quality hill session than I normally would - I ran 16 x 100ish reps with jog down recovery (normally only do 10 x100) and felt much stronger and really up on my toes driving up the hill particularly in the last 6 reps.
    The hill is in the middle of a 3 mile route - add in the 16 reps and the garmin showed 5.4 miles total. So I suppose 2.4 miles must have been up & down the hill - 1.2mls of up & 1.2 miles of down)

    Carl - I wouldnt carb load for an HM but I would take a few gels immediately before the start and then another one on the run after 45mins or so.. What's your pacing strategy are you going to go out at an even pace and try and run even all race or slightly slower than goal pace for the first few with an eye to building up to a faster finish?
    p.s. Carl - that was quite a cool down you did tonight image

  • Carl - I carb loaded for two days. Not sure it's necessary for a half but it can't do you any harm and its good practise for the big day in Paris. Have you signed up on Garmin Connect yet ? It's great if you like your stats.

    Hannah - I have a 405CX. I go into Garmin Connect and set up sessions in there then transfer them to my watch. I find it really useful when the watch beeps at you to speed up it slow down or when the interval is finishing etc. I found I could focus on my running and that in turn improved my sessions

    Ricky - glad to see that moving your sessions around helped you have a decent run tonight.

    Piroshki - get a Garmin, you know you want to.

    Spoons - I'm certainly ready for Saturday already. I've only had one day off and am missing it already ! Glad to see things are going well for you in the pool and the gym. Are you planning a tri or an ultra ?
  • Spoons - I guess with me it is breaking old habits on the LSR, last night as I was getting to the mile markers I could guess within a few seconds the split time so I am getting a feel for pace now and maintaining it throughout the split. Sunday we'll put that all to practice hopefully.

    I appreciate all the advice offered here and my training plan has been changed dramatically, I doubt it'll ever get me to a 6 min split though!! image

    Carl - I do get how it works and the benefits from it after lots of reading the penny dropped and I am determined to master it, what I find is that if my mind drifts and my concentration slips and I speed up to my old pace if I am not careful. I take it as a positive that the hardest thing for me at the moment is to go slower rather than having to search for some speed or stamina. Good luck for the weekend.

    Carter - I had a dream about Garmin watches last night image  "Piroshki"? I think I might prefer that. Sounds like a Polish lager.

    Hannah - I have tried to wean myself off of noise when I am running, thanks to a many times smashed hooter my breathing is awful so it freaks me out when I have to race without one and I haven't heard my snorting noises for a while. Honestly it ain't pretty.

    I am just using Audiobooks on my long runs now, it's quite calming and doesn't get the blood pumping like music, I am listening to "I Alan Partridge" at the moment read by Alan Partridge I keep bursting out laughing and scaring passers by which accompanied by grunting and snorting must scare the hell out of people.

    All - Gels? Reccomendations? I hate carrying drinks around on runs but for my Marathon in May I can leave them at water stations so that takes care of that but I want to incorporate gels into my runs as well so all advice and experiences greatly appreciated.

  • Oirish - experiment, and the sooner the better. It's all well and good me telling you how great High5 gels are but they may make you puke ! Or worse ! I have trouble eating when I'm running, I can feel hungry but struggle to force food down me, so I've gone for some High5 liquid gels. Just try whatevers out there and you should fine one that suits you.

  • Today is a shopping day. I'll pick some up and see how I get on.with them over the weekend.

  • Carl DCarl D ✭✭✭
    Ricky - pacing strategy no what's a good question. Have not decided yet. It is going to be bitterly cold so this I a factor. It is a hilly course so a consistent miling pace is not going to be achievable. The first 4 miles or so are are uphill there is some off road stuff a 3/4 mile climb at mile 10 and then the last 2 miles are downhill.

    As I have not seen the course it is a difficult one to work out.

    I am thinking of starting off slower than HMP, picking it up a little bit when it levels out but not going mad, trying to conserve enough for the climb at 10 miles and hoping to have enough to let loose and go for it in the last 2 miles.

    Does this make sense ?

    It Is snowing here. Might need some extra layers on Sunday.
  • Carl D wrote (see)
    Do I need to carb load for the HM like you would for a marathon ?

    Just have a good breakfast and eat sensibly the night before

  • Ricky W wrote (see)

    There's your answer Hannah - get a running bud!

    Just remember though that the marathon is as much mental as it is physical and if you're running bud isn't there to help you in the last 10km you will struggle.

  • carterusm wrote (see)
    Are you planning a tri or an ultra ?

    I'm afraid all my plans are top secret. Mostly because I haven't decided yet!

  • In a half marathon I usually take a gel around halfway. No more than that though.

  • Spoons - you're meant to be setting me a good example, none of this going off to London Town on the lash image
  • Carl DCarl D ✭✭✭
    Spoons. wrote (see)
    Carl D wrote (see)
    Do I need to carb load for the HM like you would for a marathon ?

    Just have a good breakfast and eat sensibly the night before

    Just been skimming through the RW Aiscs 26.2 threads and the nutitionalist (Ruth McKeen) was advising them to carb load. This was the advice for the day before their recent HM at Dorney Lake.

    RUTH MCKEAN wrote (see)

    Breakfast: Large bowl of cereal /porridge (60g of dried cereal) with milk & 1 full bagel with generous spread of honey & jam & 200ml glass of orange juice (approx. 130g)

    Mid- morning: Nibble on half pack of jelly babies (100g of sweets) and 500ml of low fat milkshake (approx. 120g of carbohydrates)

    Lunch: 100g pasta (dried weight) salad, low fat fruit yogurt & large banana & 20ml glass of fruit juice (approx. 120g of carbohydrates)

    Mid afternoon: banana sandwich and 400ml of fruit juice & 3 jaffa cakes (approx.110g).

    Dinner: 100g of pasta or rice or large jacket potato with usual foods but keep vegetables and meat/fish to small portions. Large glass of fruit juice (300ml) or full sugar diluting juice and low fat fruit yogurt (approx.115g)

    Before bed: large bowl of cereal or 3 slices of toast & jam (approx. 60-70g of carbohydrates).

    What do you all thin of that ?

  • Carl DCarl D ✭✭✭

    Carter - best of luck with your LSR tomorrow morning.image

  • Yes carter, good luck! How you can stomach the High 5 stuff is beyond me! I am a real fan of SIS gels, they are just so much more pleasant!

  • Carl DCarl D ✭✭✭

    I am trying SIS gels in my HM on Sunday.

    I have tried High 5 in the past but did not fancy them. I once tried the lucozade gel but that was the worst. image

  • Thanks guys. I don't think I could carb load to the extent that Ruth mckean suggests Carl. How is the man flu now ? Do you think you will be up to 100% for Sunday ?
  • My high5 pack of 4:1 drink & isogels arrived yesterday image ... Will try them out on tomorrows LSR (isogels aren't as bulky as I feared)

    Good luck with your long un today Carter.
  • Ricky - I ordered my 4:1 drink yesterday and I'm going to pop out today and pick up a selection of gels from the local Runnersworld store and begin experimenting with them on my LSR tomorrow.

    Carl and Carter - Good luck with your runs guys. 

    Spoons- I'm doing a 13 tomorrow. Gel wise would you say one about halfway is about right?


  • Carl DCarl D ✭✭✭

    Carter - it is a difficult one that. Not sure that I am 100% fighting fit. But lets see what another day of rest does to that.

    Going to go and get my race number today and have a look at the course. Want to get a feel for the first few miles to work out what my starting pace should be.

  • Carl DCarl D ✭✭✭
    The white stuff is coming down and is getting heavier.
  • Carl - each to their own but that sounds like a lot of food. I thought I ate a lot. I don't like racing feeling bloated and full. 

    Oirish - I take a gel halfway round. I've seen people carrying 10 gels on a half!

  • Hi all

    Having a nightmare this week image  Did my 14M sunday hungover, don;t think I warmed up properly and my calf was twinging (where the calf and shin bone meet near the front).  Played netball Monday and it was fine but hurt afterwards.  Rested Tuesday but then did some sprints Wednesday and 8 M thursday and now it's sore.

    I have iced it and rested yesterday and today.  Any advice on how long to rest it for and what do I do about missing my 16M run tomorrow?  Do I run when I feel ready and do the run my plan tells me to or do I try and get a 16M in this week when I am fit again?  Am a little worried, just need someone to say it's ok and that resting it will be fine and I won;t lose all my fitness!!!!!

  • Rest it. Massage it. Stretch it. Ice it. If in doubt, go and see a sports masseur or a physio. Cross train (non impact like elyptical or bike) to keep fitness up. 

    Carter - how did you get on?

  • Should I use a roller on it?  Thanks for the advice!

  • Carl DCarl D ✭✭✭
    Spoons - agree it seems a bit much so will just be doing my own thing.

    It is going to be freezing tomorrow struggling to get above -1 C. Would you wear an extra layer and maybe a running cap ? It will take miles to warm up if ever.
  • Carl good luck tomorrow - look forward to reading all about it!

    Oirish - just watch gel types .. Some need to be taken with water only in order to be absorbed. Hi5 isogels are ok though to take with a sports drink.

    Dobster - rotten luck... Rest up for a few days & cross train if it makes it easier to mentally cope without running!

    Hope Carter didn't get lost on his LSR today!

    Just took an easy paced 8 miles this afternoon in prep for another 20 miler in the morning. Pace worked out @ 8.53 today with a nice low HR of 146 which is close to my LSR HR (20 mls last sun avg HR was 143). Based on the HRs I appear to moving in the right direction image
  • Carl, good luck tomorrow.

    Dobster, hope you're feeling better.

     I'm having to miss my LSR this weekend (or at least cut it massively short) as I can't get out for long enough with nobody to look after my little one. Still, my wonderful friend has just watched mine plus her two kids whilst I escaped the house. Three kids under 6 years old for 24 hours and it's no surprise I ran a bit fast on my 30 min steady run.

    It ended up being a 4 and a bit miles at 8.54, 8.27, 8.26, 8.08 , so 8.30 average.

    I'm going to try and get out early tomorrow for 10-12 miles, but might be a bit tricky.

    Still, I feel a lot better after today's exercise.

    Hope you're feeling okay ahead of tomorrow Carl and all those doing LSRs tomorrow are ok



  • Dobster - yes - foam roller calves, shins, hams, quads and glutes. Search on YouTube for advice.

    Carl - re: the cold, I'm not the right person to ask as I would wear shorts and vest. Not because I'm hard but because I'm always too hot after a couple of miles anyway. Best of luck for tomorrow. How are you feeling now? Better?

    Carter either got lost or took the slow running idea a bit far.... image

  • Carl DCarl D ✭✭✭

    Maybe I will bump into Carter tomorrow when I am runninga round in the middle of nowhere ..... image

    Have picked up my race number and had a drive around the course or at least those bits I could drive on.

    There is absolutely no way I will get a PB on this course and may even struggle to get close to my PB.

    It starts rising from the start and immediately goes onto a narrow gravel path that can probably take 2 /3 side by side that climbs up to get over the motorway. It rejoins a road (narrow and they will be open to traffic) after about a mile. It then has two hills over the next 2/3 miles. Only good thing here is that what goes up must come back down.

    It then climbs up into another village and there is a short downhill stretch before going across a field. Once back on the road it climbs again and then plateaus out for a few niles through another village but this is where there is about a 1km stretch in woodland and loads of sharp bends on the road.

    There was frozen water on the sides of teh roads in this area. This is the furthest point out on the course and it turns back for home.

    Back through the village and then a different route back that descends for a good distance but is twisty and then comes to a T junction and just starts to climb and climb (this is around 10 miles). This will be brutal as there has just been so much hilly stuff before you even get here.

    Then down / up / down / up over the hills from the early few miles and then back down to the start / finish via the narrow gravelly path.

    So it is going to be a really tough one and a very cold one.

    I think this is going to be as much mental as physical as it will not allow consistent miling. I think I am going to have to try and use the downhills to make up time but without going crazy and use the flat sections to recover.

    If I can get to the climb at 10 miles in reasonable shape I can then begin to pick up the pace to strike out for the finish. But to get to 10 miles in good shape....

    Spoons- re your question on how I feel. The manflu is not 100% gone. Its tail seems to be taking a while to depart.

    Now completely confused on pacing strategy. Hopefully a good nights sleep will get me in the right frame of mind.


  • Hope so. Run on feel rather than being a slave to the garmin. Whatever your time it's a good training run for the marathon which is the main goal.

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