RW Forum SIx – 3.30 – 4.00



  • Carter - It's either a case of great minds think alike or fools rarely differ with us two as I have been having the exact same train of thought re my HM as you.

    When I entered it it was actually just because it was on my doorstep and I was conjoling Mrs. O to enter, now as it approaches and where I sit in my training I want to give it a serious bash. I'm going to start at 1:40 pace and see where that gets me, in most of my training I have been either able to maintain a tempo despite feeling tired or find an increase in pace at the rear end of my runs so I suspect the stamina is there and with a good taper I can at least give myself  a fair crack at the whip. 

    I will have 8 more weeks after it until my marathon so it will one way or the other give me a good indicator of where I am at and what I need to do in the final segment of training. I'm hoping it answers more questions than it raises. 

    Hannah - Great to be out isn't it? I always seem to enjoy more the times I was reluctant to go out. I think your approach is spot on, what will be will be with your fitness so there is no point driving yourself nuts with stress about it is there? I do envy your running route. On holidays I use to run along the beach from Highcliffe to Mudeford quay in the mornings and buy my fresh fish from the stall there, from water to stall in 20 yds, fantastic, I'd  run back and have it for breakfast. Ahhhh bliss.

  • Ricky - If Arsenal started playing right now I'm not convinced they'd nick a win

  • carterusmcarterusm ✭✭✭

    4.8 miles @ 9:42 for me at lunchtime. A couple of little aches in the lower legs but nothing a couple of days rest wont cure.

    Oirish - go for it !

  • carterusmcarterusm ✭✭✭

    An interesting discussion point came up on another thread - some people take a gel a few minutes before they start their LSR. Does anyone here do that ?

  • I read the discussion and I have taken gels on the start line of races. I never really noticed much difference really. I sometimes sip a sports drink in the hour or two before a race. That seems to work better as it also ensures you are properly hydrated.

  • carterusmcarterusm ✭✭✭

    I might try with a Magners on Saturday image

  • thanks all for your advice and interest.

    i am afraid since the 20 miler on sunday things have been not so good.

    rest day monday, work function tuesday, then yesterday and today a really bad head cold (man flu alert I know before anyone else says it!). Hope to be well enough tomorrow and saturday to get back on the horse so to speak but have to work saturday evening and all day sunday so no long run this weekend. I have a half marathon in warsaw on 24/3/2013 and plan to do a 20/21/22 mile run on the easter weekend and I think will taper down after that.

    I have renewed fear of the marathon after last sundays 20 mile run. Based on the halfs I had done i was thinking, yeah, this is doable in a decent time, now, i am not so sure!

  • Carl DCarl D ✭✭✭
    Ricky - I do not think there has ever been a novelty factor with the dreaded treddie. More of a necessary evil. They are hard work when trying to do a decent workout as they are so relentless and it is in charge as the belt just keeps turning at the same pace all the time. No respite unless you press the slow down button and that defeats the purpose of being there in the first place.

    Carter - running outside is not teally an option at the moment. Too cold and a lack of sidewalks (this is what footpaths are called ). There is a park / woodland area not too far away that is a little hilly but very pleasant. But it needs to be warmer.
  • Carl DCarl D ✭✭✭
    Ran a progressive build up of pace session on the treddie this morning.

    Got thr tv working this morning but only channel available was Hallmark and had here is Lucy on in black and white.

    Started with a 1 mile warm up. Then every 0.25 miles I increaded the pace by 10s.

    Did 5 miles like this and finished up running at 6:50 pace.

    Then 1 mile at MP pace of 8:35 and finished with 0.5 miles cd.

    All at 1.0 imcline.

    So that is my midweek running done.

    Back into London om Saturday morming and looking forward to my LSR with 12 miles at MP outdoors.
  • Hey all- well with everything I said about giving the HM a lash I had a 7 miler planned and like Ricky I was kind of making it up. I waanted to throw in a little bit of speed.

    Anyhoo here are the splits

    8 Miles 7:48, 7:39, 8:09, 7:58, 8:10, 8:13, 7:37, 8:25 cool down. It was pretty good conditions for running; nice and cool but a little damp. it wasn't an all out pace and as it was my third day of running on the trot I had bags of energy before and after.

    A rest day tomorrow and 20 miles LSR (planned, route tattooed on my arm etc) Saturday. 



  • Evening all - well a rest day here, which is probably a good thing as it's been peeing it down all day and I'd have struggled to squeeze in a run with the day I had.

    Felt like a veritable country bumpkin with a visit to London for work (the second in 2 days), this time in the car which equalled a 5.5 hour round trip and made me feel as though my legs had had a work out any way.

    Got a call from the doc today when I got home, saying that the blood test I'd had for the dodgy tum the other day to rule out food allergy/intolerance had picked up anaemia (which I appreciate is fairly common for runners), so at least I have an excuse when I constantly say to the other half I'm tired. Having more checks because of something else to do with white blood cell levels, but starting to really think that I just need to listen to the old (not so old, 35 year old) body and enjoy things as much as I can rather than putting undue pressure on myself to run VLM (having deferred last year with injury, I can't defer again), this year.

    And yet, the debate goes on in my head!!

    My marathon PB is 3.54. My half is 1.40 (post child aka 2011), 1.38 (pre-child aka 2001), there's every chance that when I'm fit well, less busy with work (yeah right!) and my child is a little older, then I could get a time that allows me an automatic into London, but there's something in my head, that little demon, saying....'go on Hannah, push it, even if it hurts and you're knackered, and you know deep down you can't run that fast this year, push it'.

    Those wee demons, heh?!! 

  • Carter - stalk to your hearts content on strava! Gels - I normally take two on the startline and like Spoons don't really know if it helps or not.

    Oirish - nice run .... impressive that you had plenty more in the tank. Based on that a 1.40 half looks very realistic. The Gunners can beat anyone on the day - those days just don't come along as often these days!

    My thoughts on pace for my half in 2 weeks are 8 min miling in the early stages with a view to pushing harder from 6 milies'ish and running a negative split to try to get close to my 1.41 PB.

    Bruno - Warsaw sounds interesting...what sort of time are you targeting?

    Hannah - plenty of iron required then... sirloin steaks mmmmmm.

    Carl - sounds like a good last Stateside treadie session.. you got 'em done and will appreciate the fresh air running come the weekend. Safe trip home!

    So tonights session was hills. Found a new hill - twice as long as the usual one @ approx 250m and just as steep in the mid section. Did 10 x 250 with jog down recovery (0.6ml warm/up & 1.5ml cool down). Total run was just over 5 mls with 3 of those miles the hills- 1.5mls of up & 1.5mls of down.

  • Bruno - you'll be fine! You know what want wrong and what to do now.

    nice hill session Ricky

  • Carl DCarl D ✭✭✭
    Ricky et all - greetings from Toronto Canada. Am so looking forward to a run in the fresh air on Saturday.
  • Big_GBig_G ✭✭✭

    Carl - well done for keeping it going whilst away for work.  I have struggled with that in the past...the temptation of food and the hotel bar usually gets the better of me!

  • carterusmcarterusm ✭✭✭

    Carl - I've just realised that the Paris marathon is 4 weeks on Sunday !

  • Ricky - looking at some of your runs and stats you do seem to have the stamina to up the pace to the end of your race so it sounds like a plan to me. That was an excellent hill session yesterday.

    With my run yesterday it was really noticeable the difference I have felt since joining this thread and heeding Spoons advice. I was so use to running one paced and tired, to finish a three day set of really good runs still buzzing rather than feeling flogged is great.

    Even my LSR holds few fears now it is actually slow, it struck me how now all I think about is the prep and the mental side of it rather than my physical ability to do it, that said I have that nagging voice in my head occasionally that says things are going a little too well..........

    Spurs looked very good last night image

    Carl - 4 weeks eh? wow they are coming around fast now aren't they? I think my marathon is the last of the groups, not sure if that is a good or bad thing?

    You did brilliantly to keep it going through your trip. I doff my cap Sir.


  • carterusmcarterusm ✭✭✭

    I've got the route map for the South Yorkshire half and mapped it out on Garmin - it's dead pan flat !

  • Carter - I'm glad I am not the only closet running nerd mapping routes  image 

    My half and full marathon routes are fairly "undulating" which is a bit like those personal dating ads, you know where they use euphemisms like "Bubbly" when actually meaning "loud when drunk" (A red indian name if ever I 've heard one) Undulating means up and down like a yo-yo

  • Think my marathon is same time as yours Oirish? 5th May if do Limerick or 6th of May if I plump for Belfast.

    4 weeks to Paris - wow... taper starting soon Carl?!

    Well I have had to juggle a little this week - my 2nd MLR of the week is usually a Sat afternoon after work and Fri is a rest day. Family stuff after work tomorrow meant I had to do my 2nd 9 miler of the week tonight - my 5th consecutive session of the week back to back.

    Was feeling tired after work & not really too enthusiastic about going out in the wind & rain however off I went intending to run easy/9 min miles'ish.... after a couple of miles I then thought I'd run the rest at MP ... was feeling surprisingly good so moved it up a notch again in the final 2 miles:

    9.21; 9.05; 8.48; 8.37; 8.35; 8.25; 8.34; 8.19; 8.01

    So a wierd run in that I expected to struggle as I was feeling tired but I felt fresher than expected and stronger as the run progressed.... hence the tendency for it turning into a progressive type run I guess. It was a hilly route also - mostly on (puddle laden) country lanes

    Overall the run was around MP I suppose averaging 8.38 pace with avg HR of 148bpm.

  • carterusmcarterusm ✭✭✭
    Morning all. I've just completed my second LSR in 5 days. 19.7 miles @ 9:49.

    The old legs struggled to start with as I had optimistically chosen a hilly route for today's run. After 3 miles I decided to find a flatter route which I think was a wise move. Breakfast, gels and water are now becoming a normal part of my long run routine and there were a couple of times today where I felt the benefit and the legs pushed on well. I felt I could have done a couple more miles if I had to but the little aches in my legs persuaded me to call it a day when I did. Time for a long soak in the bath......

    Happy running everyone or swimming/cycling/coaching/supporting Spoons
  • impressive stuff Carter - how many miles in total this week then? 60+?

    Rest for me today - 21 to do on my own image in the morning (my pacer is off to spain to play golf)

  • carterusmcarterusm ✭✭✭
    Cheers Ricky. I've got another 6 tomorrow and that will be 52 for the week. I dropped my MLR for this week so only had 4 runs. Enjoy your rest day. Wish I was playing golf in Spain
  • Sorry - I've been offline for a bit....

    Carl - 4 weeks to go??!!! Right - what's the plan between now and then?

    Oirish - glad to hear it's coming together for you.

    Carter - brilliant well done. Glad you managed to get the LSR done this morning. How are you feeling about things now? More confident? Time to start focusing on next week's half....

    Not sure about the golf but I wish I was sitting in a bar in Spain....

  • Sorry - nice run Ricky too image

  • carterusmcarterusm ✭✭✭
    Am I feeling confident ?

    For next weeks half I definitely am. To be honest, if I don't knock 5 mins off my PB I will be disappointed. But of course I might just have a bad day.

    For Manchester I am confident I will finish. The last couple of long runs have been on tired legs and one of my runs was about 3:40 so comfortable that I can finish.

    If I can run about 16 miles @ MP 8:30 then start struggling I reckon I could do the last 10 @ 10:00 which means I would come in under 4:00, which was my original target.

    At the moment I'm not convinced I could do the full distance at 8:30. However, I will of course have 3 weeks of tapering so will be on the start line feeling great. So, with all the training I've been doing, plus a taper, plus the conversion of my HM into a FM time (I know this is only a guide) does give me confidence. Then, of course, there is your knowledge and experience that you have been kind enough to give me.

    So, overall, I would say I am 95% confident and with the last few weeks training to come I am intending to be standing on the start line telling myself I can run a 3:45.
  • Good mileage off 4 runs Carter! IF I get my 21 done in the morn that will top me off at just over 53 mls for the week (my biggest yet) although that's off 6 sessions.

    Hope it dries up a bit for the morning - it has rained incessantly here all day image

    Feet up & Chinese food for me to tonight image
  • carterusmcarterusm ✭✭✭
    Ricky - the white stuff is coming down here now so glad I did my long run today.

    Magners Saturday in the USM house today. I've already scoffed my home made curry, had a couple of creme eggs as a treat and just about to settle down on the sofa with 1 or 2 magners. Happy days. And the mighty reds won again and are now in the play offs. Top day all round
  • carterusm wrote (see)

    If I can run about 16 miles @ MP 8:30 then start struggling I reckon I could do the last 10 @ 10:00 which means I would come in under 4:00, which was my original target.

    That doesn't work I'm afraid. That 10:00 pace can quickly slip to 11:00, then 12:00 and then a walk. You're safer running even 9:00 pace. At the minute my guesstimate would be 8:45 pace but we'll see how the half and MP in long run goes.

  • Carl DCarl D ✭✭✭

    So back home. Landed at Heathrow at 6.30 am this morning and have had such a busy day that it is only now I am sitting down to really catch up on wwhat has been happening over the last week. Took my son to football. Had to deal with the car as the OH had managed to get a puncture and fix it (fair dues) but had done some underlying damage to the wishbone which needed replacing !! Managed to get my 20 miler in and attended a quiz night at the girls school.

    Bruno - welcome aboard. As Spoons suggests, if you hold your pace from the start I think you will be fine. Do lets us know how  you get on. I would not worry about the marathon. If you have put in the training, done the Hm, you will be fine. Best thing is to do a decent marathon from a pacing point of view and if the time comes with it great, if not, there will be another one.

    Dobster - good to see that you know what is going on and it looks like everything is now under control. Let us know when you think you will be back training and we will help you all the way to race day.

    Hannah - good to see you out running again and that you know what is going on. If you are able to run without racing it it might well be worth doing London especially as you cannot defer your place again this year. Keep your options open and see where you get in training. You can always run it at a slower pace from the start and see how you are during the latter stages. You never know you might surprise yourself.

    Spoons- good to see you out running again. Must have been so frustrating but then you have enough experince and marathons under your belt to know that taking it easy duing a come back is the best thing. Have you given up on your Spring marathon or are you still thinking of doing it ?

    Oirish - good to hear the benefit your running has had from the counsel from Spoons. Its funny we all struggled with the concept of slowing down to speed up in the long run but it really does work. I guess if your HM and marathon are up and down like a yo-yo that a few more hill sessions might be in order over the coming weeks.

    Thanks for keeping me amused during the last week. You have a great sense of humour. And you are right, Spurs do look good at the moment so the match tomorrow maty not turn out as hoped. Hopefully the wee fella will not be too upset if the worst happens.

    Some good running from you during the week. Did you manage the 20 miles that you had planned for today ?

    Dissapointed with the rugby. We gave that one away.

    Big G- how is the training going at the moment ?

    Ricky - Some impressive runs for you this week. If you can do some of these runs when tired imagine what  a few weeks taper will help you do. When do you make the call on which marathon you do ?I am assuming you will not leave it to the last minute.

    Best of luck with the 21 miler tomorrow. I am gald to have my long run done for this week.

    Hat's off to you with that mileage for the week. Must check back but do not think I have had a more than 50 miles week yet. I am jealous.

    Carter - interesting plan for the South Yorksire half next weekend. I am assuming that it is a fairly flat course as that is some pace to start with. But it looks like you are going for it so good luck with that.

    On the subject of taking gels before starting a LSR or race. I know some people do but I have never been convinced of any benefit. If you have fuelled up before the race as normal, this extra stuff is not really going to help - at least that is what I think. I am not sure I would ever say I like taking gels so taking one when the benefits are marginal at best seems daft to me. But each to their own.

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