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Carter, it's time to think of what WILL BE!! Come October you'll be running a marathon too!! It's going to be great to follow your journey (I guess this thread's going to continue!!?)
Oirish - are you 2 weeks today? Confidence boosting performance.
Spoons - Yep two weeks today. I have started to taper this last week and figured that if it took more out of me than I realised than I could push back my next run 24 hours or so and rest up. I think the feelgood factor outweighs any potential tiredness and I felt really good throughout. I got home absolutely buzzing.
Carter - I thought of you this morning when I read somewhere about it being Manchester today, how's it been? Not to bad hopefully.
Carl - I think you have picked an excellent test, running at that shorter, faster intensity will pose different challenges than your marathon training. Keeps it interesting eh?
Ricky - Top discipline mate. Jackie fullerton and Big Norm in the same room? Sounds magical
Not too bad Oirish. It's done now, move on etc. Have you settled on 8:30 for halstead then ?
Ricky - jackie Fullerton and big norm eh, what a night that must have been !
Rachel - yep, October it is, probably the Robin Hood in my home town. Yes, the thread will go on
Is your running still going ok ?
Nell - I've been walking up the pentlands, the trossacks, Pitlochry and glenco and they are all terrific places. I wouldnt mind running the trails in some of those places. I used to work up at fairmilehead. I now live in Sheffield about 5 minutes from the Peak District. Its no Scotland but its really good for some trail and hill runs
Dobster - definitely give ultra running a go. If you can run a marathon they say you can run a 50 miler if you put the training in. Try and go for runs in the countryside and on the trails if you can, I find that do much better than pounding the streets of a town or city. Whereabouts do you live ?
Ricky - nice pacing! At 33 years old I still haven't learnt how to pace myself when out at night
Oirish - Good luck with the taper, I'm impressed that you listened to yourself and your body and ran a shorter distance, I'm a bit of a stickler for sticking rigidly to the plan when I should listen to myself more!
Carter - I live in Oxfordshire (fairly flat!), lots of smaller vilages etc. I tend to do my marathon training out on the country roads and run between villages, very peaceful, I really enjoy it! There are alot of bridleways around but I'm nervous of getting to a field of cows and having to run through it so I avoid doing that on my own!
Carter - Totally right attitude. I had to withdraw once about two weeks before and funnily enough race day was the only day i wasn't sulking. as the thought of running it in the state I was in was so preposterous I knew I had done the right thing.
Funny how things work out, you'll be doing your hometown race which is always a bit special.
Fairly hilarious night - highlight was when Jackie Fullerton was announcing the ballot winners. My mates name was called out for the 5th and final prize (case of wine) and he jumped out of his seat, ran straight up onto the stage, grabbed Jackie either side of his head and gave him a full on snog. The place was on the floor and I think it's the first time I've seen old crooner Jackie stuck for words!
Big Norman waxed lyrical about his days with big Ron Atkinson, McQueen, Strachan, Macari et al with plenty of hard drinking stories!
oirish ... That run bodes well- ur in a good place sir.
So this taper lark ..... Only 3 short runs left. Should I keep some speed/intensity or run em easy?
Ricky when is your race?
Oirish - great run from you. You seem to have reached this stage of your training in great shape and good frame of mind. Bodes well my friend.
Ricky - if it were me I would get at least one in with the intensity but not the distance and probably do the other 2 easy. But it is not me ......
Dobster - next Sunday (May 5th) I do the Great Limerick Run
..... weekend away with the family in posh hotel combined with my race - everyone's a winner!
Carl - was kind of thinking that I would like to at least one fast session to keep me sharp.... well as sharp as a blunt old thing can be
Ricky - I agree with Carl, do at least one good session but cut back a bit in the length of the run. That was a grteam man utd team at the end of the 70s early 80s, until the mighty Nottm forest turned up and started winning everything !!
May 5th Limerick marathon - Ricky
May 12th Halstead & Essex marathon - Oirish
May 27th Bupa London 10k - Carl
June 8th Larne Half - Ricky
June 19th Lisburn Half - Ricky
June 22nd Wales Trail marathon - Spoons
July 7th Lake Coniston Trail 'HALF' marathon - Carter
September 22nd Ladybower 20m - Carter
September 29th Robin Hood marathon - Spoons, possibly Carter (or Chester)
October 6th Chester marathon - possibly Carter (or RH)
October 6th Royal Parks HM - Carl
October 28th Dublin marathon - Ricky, Bruno, Oirish and Carl
Oirish - from reading around the various forums and such like, the majority seem to suggest that you should do nothing the week after a marathon and then only easy runs for the next 2-3 weeks certainly no speedwork. Most 10k training plans are 8 weeks long but some do suggest 4 weeks if you are already sharp for a 10k.
With only 7 weeks between my marathon and my first 10k of the summer season, I think your description of a test is about right. I have had to introduce harder runs before my body is fully ready to accept this. I am also in new territory for me as after my first marathon I took a few months off; and after my second marathon I did no running until the same 10k last year and then only on and off over the summer.
Could not get out for a run early today so it was quite late when I ventured out. As I had been in the park watching the kids ride their bikes just previous, I decided that an extra layer was needed.
Covered just over 4.25 miles and each mile was progressively faster with mile 4 being a 7:46 mins. Overall average was 7:59 min/mile.
I feel good about this and hopefully this will set me up for 3 good weeks of training for a faster race.
It is hard going from marathon training and the marathon itself to focussing on a shorter distance. I never thought that I would hear myself sayng that.
According to my Garmin my cadence for my fastest mile was 90. I must have a look back at some of my longer stuff to see what it was then. I wonder is it the same or different ? Should my steps per minute be increasing or should my stride be getting longer ? Anyone got any ideas ? I know you will all have an opinion. Should I even be worrying about this ?
mmmm cadence - there's a thing. Not too clued up on it Carl I'm afraid but from reading etc over recent months my understanding is that increased cadence with shorter stride is preferable. Supposedly it reduces heel striking & increases mid/fore foot striking which is less likely to induce injury.
That said I think it can put stress and cause injuries in previously trouble free areas like calfs, shins & Achilles.
Going by recent photographs of me in "full flight" I appear to be a dirty great heelstriker!
Anyway getting back to your question (and bearing in mind the cadence numbers you quote mean nothing to me) I would say your cadence should be increasing - however that is based on the premise that most of us seem to be heel strikers. You of course may not be.
Another school of thought says "if it aint broken don't fix it" and advocates a cadence that comes naturally, feels comfortable and causes you to run largely injury free. So based on that then no you probably shouldn't be worrying!
Carl/Ricky - I'm no expert on cadence either but I thought I heard somewhere that running at marathon pace your cadence should be about 180 strides per minute. No idea if you are running quicker then your stride is shorter or longer ? I believe Ricky is right when he says a shorter stride means you dont have such a heel strike which means less impact on your knees. I think we need Mr Spoons to impart his knowledge on this
hi all,
long time away but just completed my entry for Brighton next year. Will be my third marathon after running London twice. Was gutted this yr to finish London in 4hr 1min 12secs, 73 seconds off my target of sub 4hr. Bit this was still 31 mins fast than last time so next aim is to go sub 4. Other race times suggest it should be possible. Half PB is 1:41 and I'm hoping to break that in the Oxford half in October.
Welcome Andrew. You may not have got under the 4hr mark but you did secure a 31 min PB. That is great stuff. When do you think you will go for your next marathon ? We are coming to the end of this years spring marathons on this thread but have a busy autumn scheduled in. Feel free to hang around as we will be here for some time.
Have just submitted my ballot entry for VLM 2014 and got email confirmation. Now just got to wait until October.
Apparantly Paris and London are on the same day next year. So cannot run both.
Good speedwork on the VLM ballot Carl, lets hope your 10k speed is equally as efficient
Ive submitted my application but no email as yet
Hi Andrew
Ricky - do a small session either today or Tuesday. something like 4x400s or 3x800s. Get the pace up to loosen the legs but don't smash yourself in you know what I mean! Take it easy after that.
re: cadence - 180 x foot strikes a minute or 90 if you are counting one foot is supposed to be perfect. Generally high cadence rather than longer strides is better for injury prevention. The quickest runners have the highest cadence. However - it's pretty difficult to control this as your body generally does what it wants to! I would suggest doing 400 reps whilst focusing on high cadence rather than speed and see what happens. Report back as it will be interesting to see the results!
Blimey Carl you weren't taking any chances with your ballot place this morning were you!?
I am in as well.
Hi Andrew - I agree with Carl D on your PB but can only imagine your frustration at just missing 4 hours. We are quite a positive bunch on this thread, always looking for positives and smashing a PB and having a target still to acheive must be quite motivating I would of thought? It is well within your grasp.
Ricky - What is the plan this week?
Carter - Big day Saturday for you too with Nottm
Forest?
London marathon entry done, though am planning to defer if i get in as ive entered Brighton 2014. I was looking at possibly entering Chester or Bournmouth but decided against it. Ive got two young boys at home (6 months and nearly 3yrs) and im trying to ease my wife in gently to the idea that im running more races now so the plan for the next year is: concentrate on breaking 10k PB in next couple of months with local races, October will be Oxford Half mara again hopefully looking for a new PB, then brighton in the spring followed by hopefully Abingdon (very local) in autumn. That way im only traveling for the one race next year which keeps the cost down and is easier with the kids.
Sounds sensible Andrew
Andrew - Where are you from? Abingdon is also very local to me!
School girl error this morning, went to ebter the ballot for London next year and it had already closed. Just shows my complete inexperience to this
Missed out on 'good for age' by about 10 mins!
Wow Carter, You would have been just around the corner from me. I live up the hill behind the Marie Curie centre on Frogston Road. Small world indeed! I was thinking of you on my log run yesterday and took a detour down to Portobello and ran along the front. Didn't hang around too long as is was windy. I'm small and light so thought I would avoid being blown over to Fife!
Carl - I'm no expert but have been working on cadence to rid myself of my ITB issues. The ideal cadence is as spoons says 170-180 steps per minute, taller runners move towards 170spm.The idea is to keep the cadence at that constant and reduce or open up the stride accordingly. Running uphill shorten the stride, on a flat start to open it up and downhill shorten again. If you are using the correct running posture you would lean fractionally forward, this would slightly open your stride length.
It does bring you on to a more mid/front foot strike bringing your feet underneath you. You can use a metronome or download a 180 spm to an ipod (save strange looks from folk as you click-click past!). Hope that helps...
There are free metronome apps on iphone.....
Nell - did shortening your stride help your ITB problems ?
I'm in for London too..... entered ballot as I ate breakfast this morning as I suspected by the time I go home from work it would have closed.... I believe it was closed before midday!
Welcome Andrew - you are in good company here with trying to fit in your running around family life. There are a good few of us who have exactly that challenge .... I have a 3 & 5 year old to keep me on my toes... and then the two teenage "part-timers" who come to sulk around on the occasional weekend!
Cheers Spoons - took your advice and did a speed session this evening but kept it to a shorter 4 miles in total with 4 x 800 @ 7.04 pace with 400 recoveries @ 9.14pace. Have to say it felt relatively easy - must be all the rest in this taper!
Oirish - plan says 3 short runs this week of 3ml, 4ml & 2 ml respectively. I think that's a little light so have done a 4ml speed session tonight and will prob do 5mls @ MP tomorrow night, 3mls easy on Thursday and a final 2mls on Friday. I travel on Saturday morning (4 hour car journey), expo on Sat anoon & Ristorante booked for Sat evening