RW Forum Six – Sub 3.30



  • Training Diary for forum 6 sub 3:30 (VLM)
    Week 4, (Day 27) Aim; 10m; 4 m w/u, then 5 m alternating between 0.5m @HMP with 0.5m @ MP. 1 m c/d


    I had the opportunity to run with a friend and work colleague today in Harrogate. We were both disappointed at not being able to run at the Brass Monkey and we failed to meet up in the week whilst at work due to being too busy.

    It was nice to be able to run with someone today. Not only did I manage to catch up with a friend, I also got to run around new streets which presented new challenges (mainly hills). I really couldnt believe how quickly the miles seemed to fly by. When we was on mile 9, I still only thought that we had done about 6-7. My legs felt great as did my breathing. It was reassuring that I was able to hold a conversation at the paces that we maintained to judge how much effort I was putting in, as when you are running on your own you cant do this (or you could but you would look strange)

    We managed to cover 9.5 miles at an average pace of 8:05 min/mls. Some mile reps were as quick as 7:14 min/mls but others were slower. One was alot slower (9:00 min/ml) when we ran up a long steep hill for a lot of it (which I was told is seb coe's hill...the one he use to run up alot before marathons).

    So I didnt do the run that was originally planned for me, however I thoroughly enjoyed it and felt very freshed leg. I felt I could have gone much further and faster. Despite not setting out to do half mile reps, there was still times when we did run at HMP and other times when we ran at MP. There was also several challenging hills on route. Therefore all in all I feel that I had a good and challenging run.



  • Total miles this week; 38.5 image

    Forgot to say, I also did some resistence training after my run today

  • My schedule for week five;

    Monday; Netball Match

    Tuesday; 9 miles which includes a 2m w/u, 7 x 1km reps @ 10 k pace (6.55-7.00 min/ml) with 2 min recoveries + c/d

    wednesday; Rest day

    Thursday; Club run...roughly 6 miles, steady

    Friday; 20 miles outdoors, steady

    Saturday; Rest

    Sunday; 8-10 miles; either XC race (5 miles + 2 mile w/u + 1 mile c/d) or progressive run: 3 mile easy, 4 @ MP, 2 @ HMP, 1 easy to cool down

    Total Mileage; 43-45 miles





  • She doesn't eat before a run and was away before nine, but I wanted to let my porridge settle a bit.

    If I do race I will indeed warm up, as we discussed earlier I've always done a lot better with a warm up. Not much of a cooler downer though, if I don't meet up with any friends I might go round again but more likely to go for a burger!
  • Haha, think I would be tempted by the warm food too.

    I really don't know how people can run without eating breakfast, I keep meaning to try but i always end up bottling it at the last minute and having something!!
  • Training Diary for forum 6 sub 3:30 (VLM)

    Week 4, (Day 28) Aim; Netball match

    Actual; Played in WD again for 4 x 15min quarters after doing some drills to warm up.

    Not the nicest conditions to play in...gail force winds and rain, but we survived....just.

    After not falling over all season, I managed to fall over three times today, luckily I landed on my behind all three times, unlike last year when I looked like I was attempting a flying head, but with the floor rather than a ball. I ended up being concussed for about 12 hours and had neck pain for several days due to the whip lash like injury I caused last year.

    The match did look like something more from a comedy sketch than a serious game...was fun but we were unfortunately unsuccessful and lost.
  • MinniMinni ✭✭✭
    Blimey Sarah I didn't realise netball could be so dangerous!

    Did you do your intervals on the TM? I ditched mine tonight partly because of the wind but mostly because I'm cream crackered. Swapped it for an easy 9 instead.
  • Mrs P is going to a Back to Netball session on Thursday, I'd better warn her.

    I rested yesterday and did my first proper tempo run for a while tonight. I still felt quite tired but after a mile slow up the hill from our house I got into it and my average pace was 8:02mm.

    I was a bit disappointed till I logged it on sporttracks and saw I was pretty much at the same level as in 2010, in April 2010 I was running the same route in 7:30's so still plenty of time.

    Minni I have a question please...

    If I do race 5 miles on Sunday, what should I do between now and then?  I would normally do my 8 miles easy tomorrow, but I wondered about perhaps something a little longer again between tomoorow and Sunday?

  • MinniMinni ✭✭✭
    Is the 5m race replacing a long run Puffy? If it is then I'd try and get a long one done on Friday or Saturday instead, or add miles onto the front and to the end of the race to make it into a long run with the 5m at MP?

    While a 5m race is good to do you don't really want to 'taper' for it because its not that important in the bigger picture. Much better to use it to fit into your marathon training schedule. Unless your schedule calls for a short race and that has been built in?
  • The schedule does call for a race but not Sunday. I did wonder about going early and jogging round the course and getting ten miles out of it, or, based on the below, go a bit longer on the Saturday.

    I was listening to marathon talk lasts week and the interviewee mentioned when he tried back to back 13 mile runs one time as he taperd for London, did anyone else hear it?

    His point was to replicate the last few miles of a marathon, by running half then not eating many carbs before doing it again the next day, I thought it might be an exercise to run 12 ish on Saturday then race on Sunday. I have to drop a car off at the garage on Saturday so I'll definitely be running back.
  • At least every month someone seems to get injured during a match or training...thats what worries me about playing. The pitch i was on yesterday was felted with overlying sand....this mixed with all the rain that we had made it quite slippy, but i must have been a little more clumsy than normal aswell. Luckily it was only my bum that suffered and it has felt fine today, so I think I got away with it.

    My next match is supposed to be a week on thursday but im currently seeing if someone else will take my place as I will have to drive 60 miles up from sheffield to play and might struggle to make it in time.

    Minni you make me laugh...most people wouldnt class 9 miles as easy!
  • Evening Mr P, I hope your wife manages to stay on her feet better than I did!

    8 min/mls is a good average pace especially if it was on a hilly course. How many miles did you run in total tonight? What was your fast and slow pace and in what proportions?

    I didnt hear marathon talk last week, but Ive heard other people talk about doing two consecutive long runs and trying to deplete glycogen stores before the second one. I think I may have also read the advice in RW once as well. This week im planning on running thursday night and then friday mid day although the runs will probably be 6 and 20 and I dont think I will dare leave the house on the friday until after ive ate breakfast. I dont know if I would have the bottle to run on empty. Are you going to try it?
  • Training Diary for forum 6 sub 3:30 (VLM)

    Week 5, (Day 29) Aim; speed session 9 miles including a w/u, c/d and 7 x 1km reps at 10k pace.

    Actual; 9 miles;

    2 mile w/u starting @ 10min/mls and increasing to 8min/mls

    7 x 1km reps @ 6:53 mins/ml with 2 min recovery @ 8:20min/mls

    1 mile c/u starting at 8:20 min/mls and finishing at 9:05 min/mls

    I did this on the TM after work, I found the first 4 reps quite fun and enjoyable but I was ready to stop the reps by the 7th one I didnt do any extras!

    I did some resistance training before and after the treadmill session, mainly because I will not get the opportunity to go to the gym to work with the weights until at least sunday now. Although I do have my balance ball, the core exercises in P&D and a video link that Minni sent me to try instead.
  • Just quickly posting to say hello to Mr Puffy, was on the Gazelle thread with us all last year. How are tricks Puffy? Targets for the year?

    Also to see how Sarah was doing. Phenomenal 18 miler this early if that felt easy? Many would be at 8:45-9:30mm at this stage, Shaggy actually had me do that last year. Aw Shaggy image

    3:20 or even under within your range?
  • MinniMinni ✭✭✭

    FRC - Sarah is indeed doing really well with the longs runs.  Too early yet to be thinking about marathon targets with still 12 weeks to go, in my opinion.   I believe Sarah is thinking along the lines of nailing a strong London time without risking blowing up then taking that forward into her Autumn marathon.

  • MinniMinni ✭✭✭

    Sarah - that is another great session nailed.  Its good to feel like that towards the end because you know you're working hard.  Unless we test ourselves its hard to know exactly where our limits are.  (Although I know where mine are without going through the pain image).

    Do you think you're feeling tired with the extra miles?


  • Hello FRC I'm fine how are you?  I do look at the other thread you all seem to be going great guns.

    My target is again 3:30 but after a bad autumn I think it might be case of - coincidentally - doing my best at London and then pushing on later in the year.

    I will always remember those miles I ran with Gazelle last year, it was a lesson in running really as I dropped back and was able to observe the style, then reading how hard she had to run at the end to get the time I really don't think I can bridge the gap yet, but I am really enjoying the structure and the motivation.

    I certainly won't be surprised if Sarah smashes it but I wouldn't say it out loud image


  • Hi FRC, lovely to see you on here, thankyou for popping on. It so hard to keep up with all the threads so for the last few weeks ive only had time to concentrate on a few.

    I think im going to try and run my LSR alittle slower this week and try not to get to carried away. Although I did feel fine last week during the run and afterwards to. Did Shaggy mentor you last year?

    Minni, you have only known me a short while but you can already read my mind!

    Did you manage to get your speed training in today. I love the feeling of tiredness at the end of a run...its so satisfying. Within an hour (and after having my tea) yesterday I felt fine again. Im actually feeling great so I dont think the extra milage has been detrimental as yet, however I have had two quiet weekends. Im normally dashing around all weekend travelling up and down the motoway, craming in as much as possible. This weekend will probably be the tester as I have the 20 miler planned and have a very busy weekend planned, and a child with tonsilitis coughed in my face today!

    Mr P, like Minni said, theres still 12 weeks to go, you never know, you might smash 3:30 (fingers and toes crossed) . Your training looks to be going well at the moment. Have you run tonight?
  • Training Diary for forum 6 sub 3:30 (VLM)

    Week 5, (Day 30) Aim; Rest day

    I had a busy day on call today finishing with a late visit after 18:00. Luckily my OH cooked my tea for me tonight so I had tea on the table as I walked through the door. 90 minutes later, stuffed, showered and packed I was on the road heading down to my parents. Arrived here just after 21:30, caught up with my parents and then thought I had better quickly come on here before nattering some more.

    Have a training day at central health clinic in the morning, followed by lunch and a bit of shopping with my mum, and then its a club run...first this year
  • Evening Sarah yes I have had a cracking run. I did my usual Wednesday route of 8 miles to our school and back. I felt really good right from the start. Last week I was heavy legged within the first hundred yards but today was brilliant. Theres a mile downhill then a two mile gentle climb before it goes flat and ends with the mile back up to our house. Average pace was 8.33, better than last week, and I did the last 4 miles at mara pace, with my hr staying just below 160 which is perfect for me.

    I listened to marathon talk again, the training talk was spot on and Tonys Trials was about HR training and physiological assessment. There's a girl in our club who teaches spors science at the local poly I will ask her to guinea pig me for the students I think.

    I'm not planning on racing without breakfast on Sunday, I don't think there's any gain at this stage, perhaps a little later when my runs are longer.
  • MinniMinni ✭✭✭

    Damn that child coughing in your face Sarah. image  image

    I got my tempo run in last night with 4 miles at MP.  Ran on effort because of the wind and thought I might be a bit slow but bang on target for every mile, so feeling happy.  I also seem to have got my energy back, which is a good thing.

    I hope you enjoy your club run tonight.  Its still a bit breezy here - what's it like down there?

    I've got 20 miles to do on Sunday and going to run from here to the coast and time it to see my son play rugby.  Nice to do a point to point but the only problem is its hilly. image  I feel as if I've earned some easier long ones in the next few weeks!


  • Im so glad to hear that you had such a positive and successful run yesterday Mr P...its those that keep us going. What do you use to measure your HR. I have a belt with my watch but ive never used it as I thought that it might be too complicated and be uncomfortable. Do you think I would benefit from digging it out of the cupboard? Do you feel that it helps you?

    That sounds really useful if she will use you as a guinea pig, you would learn so much from it (that you could share with us???? or is that being cheeky?)

    Im already planning my breakfast for tomorrow...I havent got my usual at my parents : (

    I know Minni, its terrible...touch wood no tonsillitis yet, hoping it never arrives but if it does, it waits until after my long run tomorrow!

    Glad to hear that youve got your energy back and had another good run...with resistance!

    I managed to go with the RC and really enjoyed it. Weve also organised the three peaks challenge which is quite exciting. It was really windy down here....luckily we were going steady anyway so it helped to make the run alittle more challenging.

    I hope the winds dies down by sunday for you, a hilly 20 miles and a windy coast sounds tough. How long will you have to run it? I dont know if I could run somewhere and then stand around and not get a shower, would go so cold!

    You certainly have earned some easier runs...more than me. Do you have any easy routes around where you live?
  • Training Diary for forum 6 sub 3:30 (VLM)

    Week 5, (Day 31) Aim; club run, steady 6 miles

    Tonight I met up with Maltby running club. It was lovely to see everyone and catch up on all the latest local running gossip. I initially went to a friends house first to plan our summer challenge (the national three peaks challenge) and then I ran down with her to the meeting point for the cub.

    Due to it being dark alot of the runs around Maltby are out as most of them are on the tracks, fields and back lanes. Our run therefore consisted of running down from my friends house roughly for a mile and half, followed but a mile on a half on the flat, we then turned round and ran back, followed by a loop around a housing estate, half of which being down hill and the other half up hill. The wind seemed to be against us on the up hill parts which did make the run slightly tougher in places.

    We did a total of 8.01 miles @ an average pace of 8:55 min/mls all on road. I was comfortable throughout and spent as much time exercising my jaw as I did my legs.

    Tomorrow my plan is 20 miles. I was going to do this on my own around where my parents live mid day however my dad doesnt feel that it is safe, even though I was staying to the roads (hes worse than my OH). Luckily one of the runners I ran with today is hoping for 13 miles in the morning. Im going to run with her and then add 7 on at the end...well thats the plan anyway. She is alot slower than me so least this will make me take the first 13 miles steady, it also means that I will get to run some of my long run in the countryside away from everyday car fumes and pollution.
  • Hello Sarah sounds like a good evening.

    There is something really weird this week...another great run, this time with our group. I can't understand it, but joking apart I am trying to be more careful about what I eat at work in the day. Pasta again today with a sandwich.

    We ran out towards the river, then doubled back up a short hill, then jogged over the bridge and did a loop around 4-500 metres before running to the next hill, slightly longer. Back over the river via another bridge, part of the old Chester half route, across the car park and up another hill to the racecourse. Then another downhill jog to the longest hill on the route, coincidentally part of the new Chester half route, then a muster at the top to recover. Down one street, a right turn then up the next one, and then a long downhill jog to a longish winding hill to complete the session. I really went for this one, I could hear my mate breathing down my neck so I put my foot down and I saw 5:32 on my garmin as I pulled up. A nice jog back to the start then. Total one hour and one minute for the session.

    I realised that even eyeballs out over a few hundred yards I was running slower than Paula in her NY marathon win.

    This has been the best week of this campaign, I don't really care about a "bad" long run, I know it will pass, but to get a Tempo run, a medium long run and a hill session done on three consecutive nights and still feel like I could go again is really encouraging.
  • Sorry Sarah...heart rate monitor...I use mine all the time, but not in races as I would hate it when I was trying hard.  I think you should givi it a try.

  • Afternoon Mr P, it was, it was just really nice to run with others for a change. I didnt hardly realise I was running to be honest.

    Im glad that you had another good run too. It sounds like you had some friendly compitition to spur you on! I didnt realise that it was that hilly in Chester, I always think of it as being similar to york, but thinking back to the hen party I went on last year in Chester, I do recall at least one steep hill which was on one of the main streets. How far was your run yesterday? 5:32 min/mls...thats pretty fast, I dont think ive ever seen that sort of pace on my watch! I prescribe lots of pasta and other carbs for us both for the next 11 weeks if this is there effect!

    Youve just made me remember how brilliant Paula Radcliffe is....I think she has too much negative press sometimes as people tend to dwell on the races that she has missed or not done as well in, rather than the races that she has won and records that she has broke!

    Whats the plan for today, is it a rest day?

    When I get back to york I will dig the HR monitor out and let chris read the instructions for me before I give it a go,
  • Training Diary for forum 6 sub 3:30 (VLM)

    Week 5, (Day 32) Aim; 20 mile LSR

    I wasnt sure how I would be this morning running 2 miles further than my last two long runs and after running a steady 8 miles last night (when normally I would rest the day before a long run), so I was pleasantly surprised when I succeeded in running 20.1 miles

    I met my friend at 9:30 in Wickersley (Rotherham) only 14 hours after finishing my 8 miles last night. We set off down one of the main streets for roughly a mile before we turned off onto country lanes for the next 11 miles. This is somewhere we both couldnt have gone if we were on our own so it was nice for both of us to be running with somebody else to get away from the busy polluted roads. At mile 12 we ended up back on the Main Street that we had gone out on and spent the next two miles running down this and around a housing estate to make the milage up to 14 for my friend. The first 12 miles flew by due to having a distraction from running (talking).

    At mile 14 I left my friend and ran 3 miles out and then back to make my run up to 20 miles.

    The route that we took was really hilly. What we class as hills in York the people of Maltby and Wickersley laugh at. The first mile today was relatively flat but after that there were several steep hills that we ran up and inbetween them the roads were quite undulating. By mile 11 I could feel my quads which I dont normally do when running in york and on the treadmill. The paces we kept to for the fiirst 14 miles was between 8:30 - 9:30 min/mls depending on the inclines. I cant remember all the miles splits to write them up on here and dont have my PC to find them.

    When I left my friend at mile 14, I ran down from Wickersly and in to Maltby. This was almost 2 miles down hill with the wind behind me. The only thing that seemed to slow me down was a few roads that I had to cross. I ran mile 15 at 8:05 min/ml and mile 16 at 7:51 min/ml. The next mile was roughly half on flat and half uphill, this I ran at 8:30 min/mls, I did struggle with this mile slightly but im not sure why. I was still on the pavement and the incline wasnt as bad as any of the others but I just didnt enjoy it. I wondered if it was more psychological with it being the last mile before I could turn round and head back to the finish.

    Mile 18 was half down hill and then half on the flat but this time in to head on wind. I ran this mile at 7:51 min/mls and found the breeze quite cooling and refreshing.

    Mile 19 was uphill, still into the head on wind but I managed to keep a pace of 8:22 min/mls

    My last mile, mile 20 was up one of the steepest hills of the day, into the wind, at a pace of 8:40 min/mls

    My average pace for the full 20.1 miles was 8:47 min/mls.

    I was ready to stop by the end but after doing a short walk around the block and some stretches, my legs have felt surprisingly ok so im pleasantly surprised and happy with my achievements today. My average pace has been slightly slower than usual but bearing in mind I ran last night, ran further and ran up some challenging hills im delighted. And it means I have actually ran my LSR slow, like im supposed to!
  • Hi Sarah.

    Excellent running!  I think if your training continues in such a positive way and everything goes right on the day you're going to come away with a nice pb come marathon day!image  I'm impressed with your paces and how easy you're finding them.

    Running my end has been consistent but still not hitting the mileage I would like.  I feel okay though and am looking to try and get some extra miles in over the next few weeks. 

    I'm sure you've said, but I've forgottenimage  Have you got any races planned in the next few weeks?

  • Yes today is a rest day, I will run tomorrow as I have to drop a car off at the garage, then do the race on Sunday if the weather's good.

    Mrs P is aching all over after Netball but she's going back next week image


  • MinniMinni ✭✭✭
    Sarah - nice run with the club last night and sensible to be talking and not worrying about pace so you were ready for today.

    Today - what a great 20 miles! Perfect pacing throughout and I agree that the mile you found hard was probably more in your head than your legs. Our heads can play cruel tricks sometimes!

    How do you feel tonight? I sometimes find that a long run or hard session can hit me more a few days later.

    I think it's two weeks till your half?

    I'm curious why there are lots of places you won't run on your own? You said about the lanes today being one of those places. Is it safety that worries you, or traffic? I used to hate running the roads myself but would go for hours off road. This was mainly why I did lots of fell running. But a couple of years ago I gave myself a good talking to and and now my favourite run is 20 miles on the road by myself. It's good thinking time and I like it that there's nothing else to do but run.
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