RW Forum Six – Sub 3.30



  • Training Diary for Forum 6 sub 3:30 (VLM)

    Week 11 ( day 76) - Aim East Hull 20 with the first 10 miles at 8:30+ and the second 10 miles @ MP (7:45-7:55)

    Well....I might be getting slight slapped wrists but im hoping not too badly!.

    I met up with my friends from my running club, three said that they were taking it steady and using it as a training run and the other one said that he was going to run round with me as I seemed to have a good plan. We also had two people joining us on bikes to hand sweets, water etc out, although I did carry all mine in a belt (to practice ready for London). Three of my friends are slower than me and one is quicker.

    The shot went and we were off. We were all taking it quite steady (well it felt like we were) and chatting along the way. I decided to look at my watch half a mile in and was shocked to be doing 8:00 m/m. I decided to slow down but no one followed suit. I found this really hard as all my friends were getting further and further away and I was left on my own. Because I was in two as planned Vs catch up with friends who im mainly quicker than my first two miles were slightly quick. Luckily the angel on my shoulder kept me on the right pace and by the third mile I had set in to my own pace and waved my friends good bye.

    One of the people on bikes came past me at about mile 4 and asked if I was ok as I was going so slow and was well behind the others...I just explained that it was all part of the plan.

    Between miles 4 and 10 I spoke to alot of other runners, most of which were preparing for london. There was one lady who I think I scared to death when I said I was planning on getting sub 3:25 in london. She was aiming for almost an hour that point she decided to slow down which then left me with my own thoughts until I got speaking to someone else. I spent the last 3 miles with someone from Doncaster AC, he was aiming for a sub 3 hours at london but I wasnt sure how realistic he was actually being, but fingers crossed for him.

    Lots of people passed me in the first 10 almost killed me when I group of 4 women did....but I managed to stick to the plan and remained running steady (distracted by the general chit chat I was having with lots of like minded people)

    My mile reps for the first 10 miles;

    1. 8:19          4. 8:26          7. 8:30          10. 8:30      

    2. 8:19          5. 8:30          8. 8:41          average paces 8:24 (I blame the first two

    3. 8:30          6. 8:30          9. 8:31          miles for that one)

  • Right the second part of the run....

    ....I was so excited when I hit mile 10, I felt like I had been let of my leash and couldnt wait to run off and catch up all those people that had already passed me. I thought that I had no chance of catching my friends up as I thought that they would be miles in front by now...but I was wrong.

    One of the people cycling caught me up at about 10.5 miles so I chatted to him for the next 2 miles, as he caught me up I did look down at my watch and panicked when I saw that I was running at 6:45 m/m but I managed to slow down and get in to a comfortable pace (which was still abit to quick).

    Just after mile 12 I had caught up three of my friends and continued to run on. I hadnt realiased on the way out that the wind had been behind us all of the way, but on the way back, it was against us and did make the run alittle harder. Im a bit odd as I see wind and hills as a challenge, so rather me slow down so I dont waist as much energy I always, stupidly speed up. For this reason I was constantly looking at my watch, deciding that I was running to quick and purposefully trying to slow down slightly....but unfortuantley not as slow as I was supposed to.

    The next 8 miles I passed so many people (male and female), I lost count. Its so rewarding running negative splits...I really need to do it more often! My last mile was much quicker than the rest, I felt great, my legs didnt ache too much and I could see a women infront.

    Even though I ran quicker than I was supposed to I did feel comfortable all the way round and I had a very enjoyable run. At the end of the race, I felt like I could have continued for at least a few more miles comfortably which I found very reassuring. My legs did and do still feel alot better than all the other previous 20 and 18 milers that I have done so far. Was this due to the carbo loading or fuel during the race?? Or was it because I was running with others im just not sure.

    mile splits in the second half

    11. 7:36         14. 7:26         17: 7:31         20. 7:00

    12. 7:31         15. 7:30         18. 7:36         ave 7:27 m/m

    13. 7:16         16. 7:30         19: 7:30


  • So my time (according to Mrs Garmin) was 2:39:08 and my average pace was 7:58. Somehow I managed to only run 19.98 miles, although all my friends made it 20+.

    I practiced my in race nutrition again today and it went well. I had a shot block at 2,4,6,10,12,14,18 miles and 2 jelly babies at 8 and 16 miles.

    Im feeling positive about VLM image

  • Forgot to say....the weather wasnt too bad. It tried alittle to rain during mile 13 and 14 but it was only a light drizzle. On my drive home though it started raining quite heavily and is now lucky it held off! image

  • MinniMinni ✭✭✭
    Sarah - that's a great run. I was a little worried that you might have ran the whole thing too fast but you did well to hold back in the first half. I know so many people who get on the start line of a 20m race at this stage and end up putting everything into it, run a storming time and feel very confident for the marathon but then don't recover and end up disappointed a few weeks down the line. What you did was have a 10m warm up then raced the next 10 and finished in a great time.

    I think you should stick to easy running for this week ahead of your next race. There's no need to put in any speedwork and emphasis will be on recovery.

    Well done!

    Angela - how did you do?

    And Mrs P?
  • Hey hey, so I have the full race report I just posted on my blog, and I have to thank you all for helping me with a perfect race plan! image

    So today was the Colchester half marathon, I knew I was in shape for a pb and as a result nerves and excitement meant I was wide awake at 4am. I managed to doze for another couple of hours and was up again at 630. I must say, having the race in your home town is ideal- didn't need to leave home until 40 mins before the race start and still had plenty of time to go to the toilet before racing.

    Breakfast: oats so simple porridge, cup of tea, glass of beeple (beetroot and apple) juice and 500ml SiS go electrolyte. A lot of liquid, but had perhaps kept the bedroom a bit war m overnight, so needed to rehydrate.

    I didn't do a warm up for this race, so I struggled in the first mile, even though it was mainly down hill. My aim was 8:50-8:56 for the first five miles, 8:45 for the next 5, and then speed up for the las t 3. The reason being the course was supposed to be flat after mile 5. I reality, the effects of the tough climb up north hill early in mile 3 lasted well into the race, and I think we saw our last significant energy sapping hill around mile 7. Whilst for the most part I remained below 8:56, I struggled to speed up to 8:45, as these were the miles I was taking on water and gels and it w windy in the country part of the course. I did draft to protect me from the wind, but I found I was overtaking throughout the race so couldn't find a drafting runner for long.

    Pacing was as follows:

    Mile 1: 8:58

    Mile 2: 8:42

    Mile 3: 9:00

    Mile 4: 8:58

    Mile 5: 8:54

    Mile 6: 9:04

    Mile 7: 8:48

    Mile 8: 8:51

    Mile 9: 8:51

    Mile 10: 8:54

    Mile 11: 8:51

    Mile 12: 8:47

    Mile 13: 8:34

    0.1: 7:03 avg pace.

    Chip time: 1:56:06.6

    Pb by 3 minutes. I'm really pleased with this record. On the whole I felt properly trained and fuelled. What has held me back is probably a tiring week at work, the wind. There was a psychological issue at miles 6 and 7 where I wasn't expecting any hills, yet there were, and again at mile 9. In addition, I didn't realise that even without stopping to walk, taking on fluid and gels still slowed me. All in all a great first race of the year, and very happy with a well executed race plan.

    Negative? The giant blood blister...
  • Thankyou Minni for the positive feedback, I was alittle worried about what you would say with me running the second half a little too quickly, but I was still holding myself back for it and I really didnt feel like I had been running when I got to the 10 mile mark.


    An easy week sounds good to me...I will try to take Chris out for a run on one of those days, maybe tomorrow so it will be nice and steady and not to far.....a nice recovery run image

  • Well done on an awesome race Sarah, it's funny, I followed a similar carbo load plan to u yesterrday- even sneaked in some tuna into my pasta sauce! Though instead of toast/bagel after dinner, I had some popcorn. I actually found I felt fairly hungry- I think I'm just used to eating a fair amount more protein... Hmmm
  • imageimageimage A huge congratulations Angela on a fabulous new PB imageimageimage

    You must be over the moon and especially with knocking 3 minutes of your last PB. Your last 1.1 mile was so speedy aswell, being able to finish so strong means that you still had something left in the tank and will probably do even better on your next half.

    Where abouts was your blister? To run with one can be so painful, so for you to maintain your paces aswell, you have done so well.

    How do your legs feel now?

    It was really windy in the open wasnt it? I was trying to do the same as you but then I quickly over took people and was left exposed again!image

  • Angela Isherwood 2 wrote (see)
    Well done on an awesome race Sarah, it's funny, I followed a similar carbo load plan to u yesterrday- even sneaked in some tuna into my pasta sauce! Though instead of toast/bagel after dinner, I had some popcorn. I actually found I felt fairly hungry- I think I'm just used to eating a fair amount more protein... Hmmm

    I went to bed feeling hungry too...was quite strange to eat all that and rather than fill me up, left me wanting either speeded up my metabolism, or it strecthed my stomach (or I was just being greedy as food tastes so good)!

    So hard to eat pasta and sauce with no meat/fish isnt it? it just didnt seem right.



  • Hi Sarah, I lied, I actually only took 2 mins 57 seconds off my last half mara pb!image

    Blister is on the ball of my right foot on the inside, u know the joint of the big toe. It's huge- if u look at my blog u can see a picture- size of a ??2 coin. I could feel something around mile 5; its a common blister site for me, but i just thought it was some rubbing, as it stopped bothering me after mile 7. Dr sister says don't pop it, so I went to get some compeed instead. Legs are ok, just stiff in my left calf which is still weak! Growl.

    You're going to do so well in London! Very excited for you. Now I have Orion 15 next Saturday. No race plan at all, just enjoy it! Any other tips for cross country? It's in Epping forest
  • Hi Sarah,

    Sorry for not posting recently but been bit rough at work (the joys of lots of politics and my impending resignation) so been keeping low...

    Congratulations on the race yesterday, times were excellent. I like doing fast finish long runs and think they set you up well for the big day when you want to keep grinding it out. How do you find the shot block? I tried them before and didn't get on at all- changed to High Five, and all was well. Going to try the new nectar ones a friend recommended- dont know if anyone else has tried them?- as they are small volume but not sticky...

    Which shoes do you wear? I'm slightly suprised the same model are troublesome, particularly if you bought them at the same time? it is more common when they upgrade the model that I notice a change. Have you tried racing flats?

    What runiing you planning this week?

  • Mr PuffyMr Puffy ✭✭✭
    Excellent run Sarah, perfect. Talk about a negative split...your second ten was two minutes faster than my ten mile pb! Superstition prevents me from saying how it's going to go in April....

    Interesting what you say about carbo loading, we had pasta on Friay and an enormous baked potato last night, mrsp had beans I had chili image Mrs P had a good day too, 2:08:02 at Liverpool which is a big improvement on last year and a very positive day all round. She actually works in Liverpool and is out from 7:30 am to 7:20 pm so she can only run on her days off and again a little structure has paid big dividends where time is short.

    I hope youve got a nice evening ahead and can enjoy the feeling a bit before tomorrow and the grindstoneimage
  • Hahaha...I think that passess as 3 mins off your last PB image

    Blisters are so annoying, but least it didnt seem to bother you whilst you were running...I bet it is now though! Will have a quick look on your anything like that...must be the doctor in me! Its a tough one with blisters, I try not to pop them as the liquid is there to protect the skin underneath, however I always find that I have to pop them otherwise they end up filling back up on my next run. Luckily I dont get that many. for cross country, hmmm image, I would say take it steady and try to enjoy it. If you have trail shoes I would wear them. If its really muddy you could tie a shoelace around them to hold them on, just incase the mud wants to steal them off you! image

  • Hi Clive. How long do you have left at your old hospital now? I bet you cant wait to leave.

    Did you manage to find anyone to have that TR24 place?

    Im having an easy week this week. Three easy/steady runs but then a 9 mile race on sunday in france. Have the joy of driving there so im sure I will be up for a good race by sunday!

    I quite like the shot blocks but you have to have a lot of them. Last year in VLM I only had a few (reason for probably "hitting the wall" at 16 miles). Ive worked out (well Ruth did for me) that I need to have a block every 15 mins, thats why ive decided to have one every 2 miles as least my watch will beep me to remind me, with 2 jelly babies at 8, 16 and 24 miles instead for variety and to give me something to look forward to. Ive never tried any of the gels. A friend recommended the blocks and I seemed to get on with them straight away.

    Im hoping that the trainers do just need stretching and wearing a bit and then they will be ok...although I probably wont wear them properly until after london now.

    Have you done much running?

  • Hi Mr P and a huge congratulations to Mrs P on a new PB image imageimage Looks like its been a good day all round.

    I havent much planned except staying indoors as the weathers turned nasty out there. Once Ive finsihed on here I will probably try and do some reading (medical stuff) whilst waiting for chris to come down from newcastle and then watch something later with him. Im also in the middle of making my tea, spiced lamb meatballs with paprika potatoes and veg, mmm....running does have loads of bonuses!!

    Whats your running plan look like next week? Mines going to be an easy one, which im looking forward to after a busy week this week with 2 netball matches and 4 runs.

  • Well done on today's race Sarah, you've done really well holding back in the first half.  I love racing like that, reeling all of those people in who have gone off too quickly!  You're going to have a cracking London, keep today's smart pacing work in mind in those early miles and you'll not go wrong image

  • Hi Sarah, thanks for the XC advice.

    Carrot, I did the same in my race today, at mile 12 to motivate me to push on, I was counting how many people I managed to over take.... It was about 25 image
  • MalcsMalcs ✭✭✭

    Sarah - really well done on holding back for those first 10. It must have been a real mental strain having to hold fire but you did it! And wow, fantastic splits for the second 10. 

  • I'm not sure why but I've been told that something has been posted by Carrot but I can't see anything whilst using my phone and my PC to access runnersworld. I also can't send messages from my PC but I can on my phone! Grr!

    Its so much more nicer to be passing runners at the end instead of being passed! Not one person passed me today in the last 10 miles, its such a confidence boost. 25 is loads Angela especially in the last 1.1 miles!
  • Malcs its one of the most hardest things I've had to do in my running career so far (that and run a marathon), but it paid off and I did well from doing it. If I had gone of like I normally do I wouldn't have enjoyed those last few miles half as much!

    Did you get a long run in today?
  • MalcsMalcs ✭✭✭

    Did mine yesterday - accidentally did 23 after taking a wrong turn! Today was rest day, well from running anyway!

    It's definitely the way to go - running slower then picking up the pace. It's just incredibly hard to hold back, as you've found. But you did it!

  • Congratulations on getting a 23 in, that must be really reassuring for you. If you can do 23, you can easily do 26.2. I'm still hoping o do a 22 a week on Friday but part of me thinks that if I don't get it in its not the end of the world. Last year I wanted to do 22 just to give me some confidence for the marathon (I.e if I can run 22 I can run 4.2 miles extra to do 26.2, as 6.2 extra seemed like a huge ask), this year I know I can do 26.2 with little training and in race fuel!

    Weather looks awful outside.....snow on the ground, raining and cold, I want to hibernate until Thursday!
  • Hi all,

    Sarah - Well done on a great performance yesterday. It takes great willpower to hold back when your body wants to go faster, but it looks like you really let yourself off the leash for the second half of the race! 

    Regarding your question about speed training, my usual sessions are one of the following - 8 x 800m, 10 x 600m (I'll often  add 5 x 100m strides at the end of each of these), 10 x 400m or 12 x 1 minute (the latter two I tend to do if I'm out at lunchtime from work so have limited time) with between 1 and 1 1/2 mins slow jog inbetween each rep.  

    Angela - well done to you as well, that's a great PB image


  • MalcsMalcs ✭✭✭
    sarah osborne wrote (see)
    Congratulations on getting a 23 in, that must be really reassuring for you. If you can do 23, you can easily do 26.2. I'm still hoping o do a 22 a week on Friday but part of me thinks that if I don't get it in its not the end of the world. Last year I wanted to do 22 just to give me some confidence for the marathon (I.e if I can run 22 I can run 4.2 miles extra to do 26.2, as 6.2 extra seemed like a huge ask), this year I know I can do 26.2 with little training and in race fuel!

    Thanks Sarah. It wasn't intentional so I'm hoping I don't suffer as a result. Last two miles were quite tough which is not ideal. However, it was a good reminder of what it's like after you cross the 20 mile barrier. 

    I'm no expert but I agree with your thinking - it won't be the end of the world if you don't get a 20 mile run in. I can see why you want to do it though. 

    In an ideal world I'd want to do two things at this stage:

    1. get a feeling for how I'd be at the 22/23 mark.

    2. try running say 15 miles at MP to see what I'm like after that.

    Not sure if (2) is a good idea though. My thinking is that if it's only 2 hours on my feet it won't be too hard to recover from. Would be interesting to hear what Minni thinks. The main aim is to try and make a final call on MP. I haven't yet decided if I'm going to go for 8mm or start at 8:20 or 8:30 and see how things go. 


  • I did 20 miles yesterday in 2:46:40 (ie 8:20/mile). Luckily I managed to get out in between the early downpours and the later hail showers and it was quite a pleasant morning for a run. It was a relief to be able to complete the distance after having to cut my run short the previous week - I was certainly feeling it in my legs for the last few miles but I managed to keep up a steady pace throughout and did the last mile in 7:53. My only slight worry is that I found that my feet felt a bit sore towards the end (the same happened last week) so I'm wondering if I need new shoes. My current ones have never felt quite as nice as my old ones - they are generally comfortable enough but I don't feel like I get the same level of cushioning, and I need it because I'm quite heavy footed.

    Anyway, next Sunday it is 22 miles, which should be a challenge as I've never run that far in training before. Still, once that's out of the way that the long runs get progressively shorter (well until the 26.1 mile one in a few weeks' time).

  • MalcsMalcs ✭✭✭

    Nice one AndyA. I had problems with sore feet towards the end of my longer long runs last year. It wasn't my shoes but my feet - they were just struggling a bit from running for so long. I found that standing on a tennis ball and rolling it round the arch and foot made a big difference.

    This year I've nicked a hard rubber ball from the kids and used that (one of those bouncy things about 3-4cm in diameter). It works briliantly on the foot fatigue and I've had no problems when running this year. I do it routinely while sitting at my desk. Maybe worth a try if you haven't done so already.

  • Wow, looks like a great weekend of running for everyone- my marathon is May 12th so I'll be lonely on here when you're all done with London and Wales..

    So this delayed onset muscle soreness never works for me: instead from about an hour after my race yesterday I was really stiff and sore, to the extent I had trouble sleeping, but now, whilst downstairs is still a bit hard, on the most part am absolutely fine. Have I misunderstood? Does anyone else get it this way? I was naughty and didn't stretch v much immediately after.
  • Hi Andy, thankyou, and thanks for the details on your speed training. Do you do the shorter ones say at 5k pace and the longer ones at 10k and HMP?

    Sounds like you had a fabulous run aswell yesterday and you managed to do a quick last mile despite feeling it in your legs which is always good. I felt really strong at the end of my run yesterday, but on some of my previous training runs ive had to really push myself in the last 1-2 miles.

    Im getting paranoid about my old trainers now. I think because I have wore the new ones a few times, it makes my old ones feel less cushioned. They felt ok yesterday though and for my easy 4 miles today but I am starting to worry a little as they are not as comfortable as 2 weeks ago....although then I think of those people that do barefooted running...least they have more cushioning than that!!

    I know so many people doing 22 miles next so jealous as I only have a 9 mile race scheduled. Are you looking forward to tapering? Last week I was ready for it, however this week I feel like I want to get another long run in this week
  • carterusmcarterusm ✭✭✭

    Hi Sarah

    Just popped in to say hi and that things look like they are going very well for you. A good controlled run yesterdsy as well.

    Have you decided on your pace/target for London yet ? Not long to go now !!

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