long slow runs

Hi, currently training for my 3rd and 4th marathons. Looking for a sub 3.15 (7m27sec p/m). I can't get my head around LSRs. Would it not make more sense to practice running the required distance at your goal speed. ...I know it doesnt but would like to know why. Im worried that if I don't do 20+ at goal speed I won't be able to do it on the day. Currently out 6 days, 45+ miles a week.

Comments

  • Isn't one reason because of how knackered and sore you are for about 10 days after the real race? I wouldn't be out 6 days a week if I was running 20 miles at race pace on one of them.

  • MinniMinni ✭✭✭
    Is this what you did for marathons 1 & 2?



    You need the lsr to build up endurance.
  • Richard, imagine how knackering 20miles at goal pace would feel in training!

    I'm sure most plans would involve a gradual step up in MP miles though, but surely none up to 20.

  • RicFRicF ✭✭✭

    Well there is the aspect of the 'double step up' to consider.

    That's where on marathon day you find yourself attempting to run further than trained and faster than trained at the same time.

    In these days of gels and the like, I doubt if hitting the wall is a factor. That was from the days when nothing but one drink of water was allowed.

    Most so called marathon walls are just a gradual muscle collapse due to the sheer time involved.

    Could just do the long runs a bit faster. Closer to race pace.

  • From reading ive done on RW, need to run 3 or 4 20+ runs.



    True about being knackered.....just back from 16 miles. ...probably too quick tbh.



    Just hope on the day I can do the distance at favoured speed.



    Didn't train properly at all for 1 & 2. Never more than 25 mikes in a week
  • MinniMinni ✭✭✭
    So have you gradually built up to 40+ miles a week? If you've made a sudden jump up to that and you're running everything fast you run a much higher risk of injury.



    I'm aiming for 3:15 too and will do at least 7 x 20+ milers. A couple of those will be duration runs too.



    I'm running about 60 miles a week and have a half pb of 1:32 but hoping this will be closer (or under) to 1:30 before the marathon.
  • I read recently that Patrick Makau does about 80% of his long runs at race pace! Special case perhaps!  General consensus is to stay about a minute slower, to avoid injury and train your body to be active for the distances it has to face come race day

  • My heart rate is always fine. Don't feel tired at all.



    But my legs ache after about 10 miles. Will this omprove if I do a high weekly mileage?
  • MinniMinni ✭✭✭
    This will improve if you slow the pace a bit. What pace are you doing your long runs (and others)?
  • I will do the majority slower ( 60 - 90s) for time on feet, physical endurance, more efficient fat burning, run on empty and hope to improve greater glycogen capacity in the future, because its my favorite run, because I run on slower surfaces etc.

    Then I do the odd few on road, and progressively up the pace.

    Have a look what Mcmillan says to those worries long slow runners:

    http://www.mcmillanrunning.com/articlePages/article/2

     

  • How did your first two marathons go Richard ? What was your half pb and how did that translate into your full marathon time ?
  • Been out recently doing quick 10ks (38.30sec), 5k (18.30), hill sprints, tempo and interval.



    I think a slower pace shortens my stride length and therefore tightens my muscles. Any truth in that u reckon?



    Plus, anyone else feel they run with a yight pelvic floor?
  • First marathon 4hrs 45. Second was 3h 36.

    Got half at 1hr 36.
  • Been out recently doing quick 10ks (38.30sec), 5k (18.30), hill sprints, tempo and interval.



    I think a slower pace shortens my stride length and therefore tightens my muscles. Any truth in that u reckon?



    Plus, anyone else feel they run with a yight pelvic floor?
  • Richard. Stride length comes from speed, so yes, running slower will produce a shorter stride.

    Save your MP for the race itself, apart from sections, such as at the end of a training run or a shorter midweek run. Otherwise you'll burn out, get injured or simply not recover in time...also other training runs such as tempo runs could be compromised because you're too tired.

  • Not necessarily true, horse piss shoes.  I've been experimenting with stride length a bit and shortening my stride and increasing speed.  It's a significant increas in 'strides per minute' but can be quite effective on injury prevention.... and reputedly is more efficient that my previous longer striding form.

  • What i meant was, if youtry to increase your stride by reaching out more you'll simply overstride which slows you down. if you try incrrase your dtride by leaving your support foot on the ground for longer you'll akso slow down. range of motion may be bigger but won't make you run faster ot more efficuently.
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