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My #asics262 journey to Paris: Sub-3 Roger
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Millsy I am used to doing my long runs closer to 7.30, i was always led to believe they should be 30-60s slower thank MP. I feel 8.00 is slow, Steve has said that I can go 7.45-730, not faster though (where there are 8 mmile). Knight rider, I did my first run yesterday early, 2 miles through the woods with a really bright head torch with my dog, dropped him off and did another 3 on the road. I am struggling with pacing a bit, I am always rushing, so I am used to punching the runs about qui kick as I can, I keep catching myself doing 6.45 pace. No track will setup garmin to beep for me
I couldn't manage doing my long runs at that pace every weekend it would just tire me out for the rest of the week.
Good luck with week 1.
Roger - well done on kicking off the programme! It completely doesn't surprise me that you were rushing that first run. You were like a greyhound stuck in the traps at the Asics store. If they'd opened the doors you would have been off like a rocket
Good luck with the rest of the week's running!
I used to be the same regarding pace for the longer runs and the thought of running 8 minute miles used to make me laugh and I'll be honest I found them hard to do if that sounds weird. But I guess with the amount of mileage it is a good thing to be able to have a broader range of paces within a weeks training. Running in the woods in the dark with a dog sounds very feral!
Sorry I missed a few messages with the page turn, DS2 well picked up yes that was me overdoing things on the men's health 10k obstacle race in Battersea seen by few on channel four, I got a few mentions which made me feel special.
Feral, Yes a good word for it!
That really is quite low mileage. I'm intrigued to see how that works out. Although you do say it's similar to what you've done before in terms of volume, which will make a difference. If I dropped down to that sort of mileage I dread to think what would happen. I'm somewhat jealous that you can run so fast off so little!
Hi all Roger's runs are going to be slightly quicker than the plan - not because he is aiming for well inside 3:00 but because he finds 8:00 too difficult -
sometimes I find even 9:00 difficult - ie feels too quick rather than like Roger finding 8:00 too slow! as experiment I did do a faster than normal long run - 18 mile at 7:30s on Sunday and have a feeling my track tonight will be much worse than normal.
I'm seemingly in much better marathoning shape than I have been for about 3 years so hopefully sub-3 will be feasible for me this year if can stay fit and healthy.
It does seem a paradox but running faster in training doesn't always make you faster in races if you do at the wrong time on so-called 'easy' days and then feel tired on the 'fast days'. I know many runners who got faster when they slowed some of their runs down.
Thanks malcs good luck to you too
Roger your 5k PB is similar to where I think mine was when I ran sub-3 first time around, (2.53 - the course was 200m short though hmmm) I did it off low mileage, and my half PB at the time was 1.32 believe it or not!
I think with the marathon one of the biggest things is getting your head right in the days leading up to it!
Best of luck my friend.
Good luck with the training Roger!
I will be keeping an eye on your thread with great interest as am also attempting to break 3hours for the 1st time at the Paris marathon. Just praying we dont have the same Winter as last year....
possibly wrong about the longer harder sunday run affecting my speedwork this week as did 8 x variable pace 1000s on track quicker than expected but very good conditions last night - wet but cool and little wind.
Nice going Steve - looks like you are well on track !
Good to hear Steve. Sadly there was lots of wind for my XC hills session on Newcastle Town Moor this morning. But then, there always is on there. That's my only hard session this week since marathon training starts on Monday!
WOW OT23 pretty good going, I agree about the headspace!
Steve I enjoyed the 800/400's good work out.
Thanks Roundman, I will see you in Paris
thanks - wish marathon was in 4 weeks rather than 4 months
CC2 see you were running really well in the summer and sub-3 looks on if you can get back to that speed. Is the fitness returning?
the 1000m variable reps were
1 400 hard 200 float 400 hard
2 accelerate each 200
3 faster straights and slower bends
4 start fast and ease back each 200 - ie 39, 43, 44, 45, 45
5 200 hard, 200 float, 200 hard etc - ie 41, 45, 41, 45, 40
6 500 steady, 500 hard
7 5 x (50 float, 150 harder)
8 600 steady, 400 pick up ie 44, 44, 44, 40, 38
find it more interesting and get better pace judgement and get better range than running all at same speed and seem to run them quicker this way anyway - helped had about 30 from club doing, 10 of which were roughly same speed
Hi Roger
what speeds did you manage?
My head is exploding at the thought of that session Steve. I'd need someone running next to me to tell me what to do and when to do it! I did have an OK summer, ran the GNR hard but not all out as I'd had an injury and missed some training, failed to improve on that time due largely to howling gales on race day at Nottingham and Worksop then peaked at the National XC relays I think. Then had a much needed break. Just when I started running again I came down with a particularly virulent cold that knocked me out completely. I feel very much like I'm starting from scratch, but I'm sure it will come back soon. Hopefully.
yes saw you had a good run at Mansfield CC2.
re the session - everyone just does as I say but I do have to run it too and then in the minute or so recovery, then try and explain the next rep to everyone but am quite often still repeating it to someone who didn't quite hear in first 50 metres of rep. I think the explaining slows me by at least five seconds!
I think mentally the range of speeds makes the session easier and it's not all just at around 10k pace which it would be if steady as part of the 1000m are at mile or 5km pace and some at half-marathon pace.
Steve - great to hear that you're in such good shape.
I was wondering if you could give a quick "coach's corner" explanation of how to structure a proper fartlek run, and what you see to be the benefits of it. I must admit, definitions seem to vary so wildly that I've never really understood what a decent fartlek session looks like...! But I do remember you had AW doing a few of these last year, and I wondered if it's something you'll be recommending for Roger (and the rest of us aspiring sub-3 marathoners).
I think they are a great session but the vagueness can be a good or bad thing and some people do too much hard running and others too much easy running. In ideal world you use terrain ie surge up a hill or put a burst in to a landmark but you can do it to a more strict schedule ie over any surface,
ie 5 minutes at Marathon pace, 2 mins jog, 3 mins at HM pace, 90 secs jog, 2 mins at 10k pace, 1 mins jog, 1 min at 5km pace, 30 secs jog, 30 secs at mile pace, then 5 hills of at least 30 seconds with jog/walk back, and then repeat the speeds in reverse, ie 30 secs at mile pace and then all the way back up to 5 mins at marathon pace
Good to see your good form holding Steve. That looks a good 1k session at the track. Do you think it is more beneficial to do them at a track?
What sort of splits did you manage on your reps Roger and where did you manage to do them?
I ran 5 x 800m reps at my local park (ideal as it is traffic free, well lit paths & quiet) and battled with the stormy weather. Managed to average 2.55 times, so pleased with first my speed session for 8 weeks!
Hi KR - you are obviously sharp then.
I prefer them on the track as you can monitor pace - ie I take 200m splits during 800s and 1000s and you can get into a rhythm and I have a big group to oversee which is easier on the track,
but, if a good park and well lit then that's fine. A long straight softer surface is better for avoiding injuries than the track as the constant bends do put some strain on the body.
Thanks very much Steve - that's a really helpful explanation! What you've outlined seems like a great session to incorporate into the plan.
Hi Everyone.
Sounds like your running really well Steve.
I still do the Fartlek session Steve set out for me last year and love it, good mix of all the paces.
Hi all,
Yes - I'm trying to mix in a bit more speed and always liked fartlek sessions. I will no doubt incorporate those outlined by Steve!
I don't think that many fartleks are in the schedule but they are a great session to incorporate if track is closed, weather bad or you need an easier session after a weekend race or don't feel mentally up to banging out mile efforts or 400m reps but want to get a range of paces in.
Have we lost Roger already?
I think he is way on holday but I think he said he thought he might be able to stay in contact
On holiday? Is that permitted coach Steve?
It's blowing a howling gale out there today, so the plan is to run 5 miles further than I have managed for about 6 weeks, including a parkrun (at LSR pace) on the most exposed piece of land in the area. Yay. (Planning 15 miles, since Worksop HM the furthest I have run is 10 miles and that was, erm, yesterday).