Jeff Galloway approach to R/W/R London Marathon 2014 -Help!

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  • Hi All - like Minnie just had a quick flick on to see how you were all getting on and saw my name

    Chris - well done and be proud i hope i'm still going at your age very inspiring.image

    Minnie - very well done too and congrats on PB image

    My training for Manchester was going really well did an 18 with a friend it was trail and we walked some of the steeper parts and difficult paths and had a blast.  Then i got floored by a virus and missed about 10 days of running including my 2nd 18 miler and alot of family stuff going on at the moment so my confidence took a bit of a hit.  But going to do a 20 on Saturday and after catching up with how well everyones being doing on here i'm now planning to throw more walking back in thinking of around .4 mile run to .1 mile walk (did .8/.2 for snowdon).  Will let you know how i get on but i already feel more confident and happy about it. 

  • Hi Chrissi, good to hear from you. It is so annoying when something messes up your training like that. I suppose the only consolation is that it happens to just about everyone somewhere along the way.

    it's an interesting variation of R/W ratios you do, using distance not time. I think there are almost as many versions as there are people using R/W. That is one of the things I like about it, not many training methods are so "you specific": it is a very individualised approach. I think it helps us to feel more in control and therefore more successful. 

  • Chris we love the run disney events as they are all about enjoying the runs rather than chasing times.  We've been for the past three January's and it's the highlight of our running year.  JG is there and gives some speeches at the expo. We've adopted his 'stay strong to the finish' quote as our mantra ????.  Have you found the coaching you've had to be good value ? MM

  • I have found the e-coaching useful but I have to sometimes chase Jeff for his reply: not sure how thinly he is stretched at times. I can't remember how much it cost, I think it was about £260 for 6 months, however much it was, it beats the £50 per week I was paying someone before. His advice is usually spot on.

    The Run Disney events sound great. Would love to hear more.

  •  

    Disney have a number of events through the year in Florida and California.  We do the marathon weekend in January As our annual treat.  

    The other events are mostly based around a main event of a half marathon but they normally run a 5k or 10k the same weekend along with some kiddies races so the whole family can join in.   

    The courses are littered with optional character stops  and entertainment so there is something to see every mile or so. Because most people are running to have a good time rather than to log a good time it's nice and friendly and relaxed atmosphere.   Oh yes - and the medals are awesome !  

    Check out the videos on youtube by a chap called lee hoodle and the run disney web site - i sound like a trailer lol 

    I'm glad you've found the coaching to be good and that the rwr is working for people. I am having a few problems with a sore achilles and a dodgy knee so am hoping it will allow me to keep running without battering my body too much.  m x

     

  • ^^They sound like awesome events.  Would love to do them one day.  Thanks for the info!

  • Isit expensive to go over for the event? Airfares? Accommodation? Entrance fee? How long do you go for? And even more important...............how much training do you need to do for such an awesome event?

    C

  • Just been wondering how Max is doing with the ultra this weekend. A good day for it so far. 

    Re- my own running:

    I stupidly decided to try and do my 23 miler yesterday. It was down for this weekend, and I had been a bit concerned all week about doing it on the back of last week's very hard race in Blackpool.

    Anyway, instead of leaving it as long as possible and doing it on Sunday, I decided to try it yesterday, which meant only 5 days after the race. If I'd been sensible I'd have left it until next weekend, never mind doing it early. I was just really worried about going straight back to work this Monday after the longest run in my life. I struggle with Monday mornings at the best of time.

    To cut it short, I ended up ringing my husband to pick me up after 15 miles. I did an extra mile (walking) whilst waiting for him to arrive, but that still only made 16 miles. Now I'm not sure how to fit in my long runs before London. I had a 23 (this week) and a 26 (three weeks before the race) scheduled in before the taper. I am hoping JG comes up with a cunning plan that will work, as yesterday knocked my confidence a bit.

    I don't know why I should be surprised by not being able to run both a hard Half and  a 23 mile long run within one week, but I had been feeling a bit invincible using RWR method. Doing the half and 16 miles would have seemed like being more than invincible 3 months ago, but now I thought I had moved on to another level.

    So what went wrong:-

    I used 30/30 as usual but still started to feel tiredness creeping in at about 8-9 miles. Nothing major but it was there. Then at 10 miles my left calf started tightening up, it wasn't exactly cramping, but it felt like it was thinking about it. By mile 15 it was no better, and if anything marginally worse: I decided I should be sensible and call it a day...........better that then regret continuing later.

    Lesson for learning.

    The R/W method probably saved me from myself yesterday. I need to remember that I still need to listen to my body and make wise choices about my running.

    And today, tired but no worse for wear. Thank goodness.

    C

  • Chris - a wise decision not to press on for the whole 23 miles. Hopefully JG will come up with a plan for you, but I am not expecting to do more than 20 miles before my marathon in April. And last week's long run I did 30/60 to help save my legs. Think I will do the same tomorrow as well. You will be able to do the full marathon, you know you will be able to keep going on the day, even if you haven't done the 26 before the day. I think doing 26 before the day is more for the mental boost it gives you knowing you can do the distance. 

  • Lainey23 one for the to do list definitely

     

    Chris it is expensive but it's our birthday and christmas presents to each other.  We go for a week which doesn't leave much time to do much but run but its all we can squeeze in after xmas.  we just train for the marathon and take it steady which seams to work ok but jeff does a specIal plan which he puts in the run disney site x 

  • Minnie, Do you book the different bits separately or through an agent or Disney themselves? Wondered how to start researching it for next year.

    Max, what ratio do you use for your really long runs? Trying to decide whether to do my last 2long runs using my usual 30/30 or something even more conservative.

  • The race entries go on sale In April. We enter first then just get a holiday package from a Travel agent afterwards. 

     

     

  • Hi Chris. Still popping in. I've really enjoyed doing the runs and it took sheer willpower to stop and walk so soon in my recent half marathon. It's been great reading these posts. I did struggle with my recent run and nervous for the 18 miler next week,...x
  • Got a serious telling off from JG when he realised I'd tried to do my 23 miler so soon after racing. I was polite and didn't mention he wrote the schedule. Lol. Although I am still fine and did a short run this morning. 

    He still wants me to do the 23 and 26 before London. Initially using a negative ratio i.e. Shorter run time than walk. Now that idea has really taxed me emotionally. Anyway, just for the hell of it I tried it on my 3 miler this morning. Amazingly, I still did an average of 12:20 m/m and got a sweat on. It was just easier to both run and walk faster. All very bizarre. I will do as I am told on my 23 mile run in 2 weeks and see what happens. JG said, endurance-wise, not speed, I would get the same training effect whether I ran it all or walked it all. Mmm, I suppose it is all miles under the feet. I will do 15/30 with good grace....honest.

     

  • 15/30 sounds like a nice ratio actually - be interesting to see how you find it

    I did 45/60 this morning and actually found it tough - but stuck it out and did 15 miles. I think because I am doing laps it makes it mentally hard, but means I am near the leisure centre and can pop in to top up my water bottle and use the loo. And the lap includes a hill, so it is probably harder than it needs to be. 

  • Hi Plodder

    Missed you up above. How did you do in the half marathon? Can't find a post about it. Hope you enjoyed it, Blackpool was a bit like torture at times with the strong wind. JG suggested that I intersperse some walked miles in between on my long run, if I start to tire. Perhaps that is something to look at on the mega long ones.

    Liainey (sorry if I spelt it wrong), how did you do in yours too?

  • ChrissiChrissi ✭✭✭

    Chris - sensible decsion to stop the run you don't want to risk injury.

    I did 21 miles yesterday but not exactly as planned.image  I ended up running with a friend so the first half was pretty much all running except for gel breaks then coming home we were running and walking but not with any particlar pattern. We took 4hr23 and i can't help thinking we wouldn't of been any slower if i'd of done the intervals as i don't think i'd of been struggling as much at the end.  Still i did it and just a bit sore today so it has given me a huge confidence boost. 

    Can't get my head around how you all manage such short intervals how do you time them? 

     

  • chrissi - I use my garmin, just set it up and it beeps at me, actually it feels fine to be doing such short intervals and works really well. 

  • Chrissi, I use a gym boss interval timer as I don't always hear my Garmin. It does up to 99 intervals so on a really long run I have to restart it after 99 minutes. I like my 30/30 intervals, it keeps me fresh and I don't seem to ache much at all afterwards. I do have an ice bath (well just a bath of cold water,no hot at all, works as well) for 15 mins and that really stops aches and pains like magic. Between short intervals and the cold baths, I feel pretty good after.

    Well done on 21 miler, I'm now down to revisit 23 two weeks today. Wish I'd got it out of the way this week.

    C

  • Thanks for asking Chris.  I was really pleased as I went 2:51.  I would have loved to go 2;4X but the wind towards the end was so strong and my hands were numb.  legs aching now, but very happy as last year I did a half marathon that broke me mentally and physically, and I feel I have put it behind me!

  • Lainey - Glad you felt better in the half marathon this year. It as not the best day for racing.

    Max - I hear you have successfully done your 34 mile Ultra doing RW. Awe inspiring. You'll have to let us all know how it was.

    Chrissi - You have done 1 mile further than me! You do ache a lot less using structured RW.

    Mathschick - I think I'd really know it if my run section on the very long runs was over 30 secs, so I thin you did well with 45. JG suggests 30/30 or 20/20 on long runs at our sort of pace.

    However, he has suggested negative ratios at 14/45 or 10/30 for my 23 miler and 26 miler because there is only one recovery week between the two and then only one recovery  week between the full distance training run and London itself. He also says don't be worried about walking any of it, just get the miles under my feet to build up the endurance. Goodness knows how long this will take, but he insists it will work out okay and get me to London in good shape.

    C

  • Chris - yes, I think last week when I did 30/60 it did feel a lot more comfortable! Although I didn't do as far either.

    Got a half marathon this Sunday so not sure what ratio to use. I want to use it more as a training run than a 'race' so maybe I will stick with 30/30 so that I am ok to do 18 the week after.

  • Chris - Ive been looking at buying a gym boss to help time my intervals but I also like to listen to music.  Do you think the vibration would be strong enough for me to notice without the back up of the sound ?


    Cheers

     

  • ChrissiChrissi ✭✭✭

    Chris - i'm going to try to be more disiplined on my next 20 and stick to R/W intervals as i don;t want to blow up this close to the race.  If i end up with company they'll have to do it my wayimage

    Lainey - well done

     

  • Mini- I clip it to the neck edge of my top and have never missed it yet. You can do buzzer/vibration or both for a range of seconds.

    Mathschick- I'd do 30/30 unless you feel proper fit. The reason JG has asked me to do negative ratios is that the 2 long runs and the marathon itself are so close together with just one week between each.

    Chrissi - I think you should really give it a proper go in your long run. You'll be surprised how well you can keep your pace up and so lose very little if any time.

    I am doing very gentle training this week after my excesses from the last few weeks

  • Thanks chris. I've ordered one from amazon but it might take 5 weeks to arrive.... Not very good at waiting ....,,

  • Interested in catching up with your thread......I'm running / walking VLM. I had intended to try and run the distance but I've been injured for 6 weeks. Knee difficulties.  My only chance of completing the race is RWR. 

    Im currently trying out different ratios. My longest run/ walk since returning is 9 miles. A long way to go. I know people knock it and I've got to remain focused and not get carried away. 

    I've only been running 2 years. My half PB last year was 2.03.54. 

     

  • LMA -Wish I had a Half BP like that. I'm hoping to do R60/W30 at London but won't know for certain until I have done my last 2 long runs. I am doing those using negative ratios (see above, but basically run less time than I walk). I am finding that concept quite hard because I have quite a competitive nature. However, I have been trying out 15/30 this week on my shorter runs (JG has told me to really try and rest up my legs this week ready for a 23 miler next week). Surprisingly, I really wasn't that slow using this ratio on a shorter run and my legs felt fresh after.

    The key appears to be not to try power walking in the non-run bit, or your legs just get tired from over-striding. I think my big problem is I try and keep the speed up too much whatever ratio I use. I probably need to chill out about this aspect of things. JG told me last week that the biggest threat to an enjoyable marathon is getting hooked on to going fast (in relation to your capabilities) at the beginning and not reserving energy for later. I hope I can learn this lesson before I learn it the hard way. LOl.

    So, yes I would use run/walk. If you are injured that use small segments 30/30, 20/20 or even negative ratios. Don't go mad  doing bigger segments as it just puts more pressure on your legs and you are trying to protect your knees. Walk the non-run bits in a relaxed way and don't over stride when either running or walking. And most importantly do all this right from the very beginning of your run/race. Don't wait until you are tired or worried about a niggle in some joint or muscle.

    Have a look at Jeff Galloway's web site all the basics are there. He has been honing this approach for years and I think really knows what he is doing.

    Good luck with the training

    C

  • Chris - thanks, yes, I think I will use 30/30. I have used it a few times now and it has felt good. 

  • Thanks Chris. I did run all that half marathon. I have the same half next weekend which I intend to run/walk. Will be interesting to see just how much slower I am! 

    So am I right in thinking the shorter the ratio the less tiring It should be? 

    Will try short ratios on my next training run. 

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