RW Forum 5 - Sub 3

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  • I don't 'like' the idea of anything at mile pace. image

  • The mile pace for a 3 hour mara is 5:19/mile looking at mcmillan , that should be fun image

  • Not sure I could do that. That's 40 secs per 200m. I have this session planned for next week. Will report back then. I've had a busy day starting with a swim at 7 and a short run of 4 miles average 8.15pace. Then off to nutritionist . 2 hrs of analysis highlighted many mineral deficiencies and food intolerances that I didn't know I had. Diet change and some supplements should sort out my gastric and bowel issues when running.

  • I have a number of food intolerances too. I had the testing done a few years ago when it really started to become an issue after fast running. I cut out dairy, eggs and durum wheat completely during marathon training. I also have a number of minor intolerances. but it's too hard to cut them all out so just have to be a bit careful.

  • GobiGobi ✭✭✭
    Mile pace is YOUR mile pace not what a chart says. Basically you go out and TT a mile then run the reps as a percentage of YOUR mile pace



    :??)



    Simples
  • What's TT? is that as hard as I can?

  • GobiGobi ✭✭✭
    Oh yeah !!!!!!!!
  • MinniMinni ✭✭✭

    I think most people would be intolerant to something if tested.  What kind of changes were suggested? 

  • very low in iron. stressed kidneys....need to drink more (excluding wine and coffee) wheat and sugar, my 2 Fav things are to be STOPPED. The list of problems was endless but these were the main ones

  • MinniMinni ✭✭✭

    I drink too much wine and coffee too. image Although this will be my third dry day. image  

    I bulk bought green tea today to try and cut down on coffee. 

    is it iron tablets you've been recommended to take? 

  • Sugar could be a problem. Does that include things like fructose, glucose etc?

     

  • Yes. Iron tabs 2 daily. I can have natural sugars in fruit, but no biscuits, cakes etc
  • I'm a Pfitzinger fan and followed his 18x55-70 plan for my 3:01 marathon PB.

    I'm having trouble getting my head around this slow running idea! I generally run my ML and LRs at the quicker end of Pfitzinger's recommended paces, usually MP+10%.

    That said, I did pick up an injury (lateral lower leg) during my last campaign (hoping for 2:54 and first sub-3) and was forced to stop the plan about two thirds through it.

    Perhaps this was due to pushing too hard. I am quite aggressive when it comes to running. I'll give slower ML/LR some thought. 

     

  • Andrews - I sometimes use P&D for some longish runs.  I run the first half at MP+20% and the second half at MP+10%.  I find that I can recover from these easily.  If not then slow down.

    18 easy miles for me yesterday.  Ran to HR and not pace and ave pace was 7.50m/m.  Miles varied between 7.23 &8.18 depending on whether I was running uphill or downhill.  I even stopped myself from chasing down a runner ahead of me who sped up when he saw I was catching him!!

    4 miles this morning at 8.11 m/m brings up 52.7m for the week.  The first time ever I have ran more than 50 miles in four consecutive weeks.

  • Well I had a crap run this morning. Did 20 at average 8.40 with club runners. They run fairly slow so I thought it a good move to join them. By mile 17 very nauseous and struggled home. At least I now know it's not the spread, but the nutrition that's the problem. Will try something different next LR
  • Doppy - 20 miles is a good distance at this stage and the struggle shows that you have the mental toughness.
  • MinniMinni ✭✭✭

    Did you take anything during the run and what did you have before?  It's so hard getting it right. 

  • Could be the iron tablets making you nauseous too, if you've just started taking them.

  • Minni - green tea contains caffeine and isn't really any better for you than coffee in the amounts you drink in a mug of the stuff. Coffee tastes better. 

    Doppy, a lot of people struggle with iron tablets I believe. You can get a liquid form which is easier on the digestive system. I think its called Spatone. Or you could just eat loads of steak. 

    I also felt a little nauseous towards the end of my 18.75 miles today, but that's because I didn't take on any nutrition during it. I need to lose a few pounds to get back to a comfortable training weight (illness and Christmas!!!!) so I thought I'd go with a fat burning run. I still had breakfast beforehand, but the glycogen would have depleted after 90 mins or so. It was at around 2 hours that I started to feel dodgy.

  • Just read this I don't absorb iron properly or so I've been told -so take Spatone, the rest make me feel so sick. Speedy Goth so happy to hear my coffee has the same caffine - everyone at work has been trying to convert me to green tea which I hate -image

    I also get nauseous if I've eaten anything too fatty before hand but that could just be my oddness again .....

  • I had musli banana and yog with cup of banned coffee which I can't give up. One cup a day is ok. Took 2 gu gels mile 6 and 12 sipped electrolyte drink. SG can't do the steak I'm veggie! I am sure I'll be ok when I find the right food
  • Gu gels contain sugar though, so you're not supposed to have those either! Iron rich food is difficult if you don't eat meat. Spinach? 

  • could it be the gels that made you nauseous, doppy? Most of them make me sick and I have no food intolerances as far as I know. Never been to a nutritionist thoughimage. I use High 5 iso gels or those Sis ones.



    I'm also on permanent iron supplements but lucky I get on with tablets ok.
  • TRTR ✭✭✭

    Interesting long run there Doppy, why are you taking gels on a slow long run especially having had breakfast too ? Is this on the advice from the nutritionist? I dont have breakfast before a long run and wouldnt take any nutrition with me. But, if it was something like a 23M or a long run with some MP in it then I'd carry a gel just in case.

  • SG I eat loads of spinach. Chick I'm sure it's the gels. I keep trying different ones in the hope that one suits me. TR I have never heard of people running for 20 miles with no fuel! I certainly couldn't with no breakfast. WHY?
  • TR just noticed you were doing a fat burning run. I would struggle with that as I have none to burn. my body would start eating itself!!!

  • Doppy - I'm with TR on this one. I run early mornings and never eat anything before or take fuel unless it is a challenging long run and practising fuelling strategies for race day. Running without fuel teaches your body to use body fat as fuel and not just rely on glycogen stores (I believe).
  • MinniMinni ✭✭✭

    I don't fuel on long runs except water.  Towards the end of marathon training I start to introduce gels but more of a way to get my stomach used to them than anything else. (I often take on before a 5 or 10k too to test the stomach).  I take SIS and find anything else upsets my stomach.  I tried some long runs with nil breakfast last year and felt amazingly good on the run but was wiped out a couple of days later.  I think that was probably more to do with not getting enough calories in post run - something I still struggle with.

    I don't know about gu gels but I got some gels in a goodie back recently that said you had to take them with 400ml of water.  That's a lot of water per gel.  If its similar with the gu then could it be they're not being diluted enough, especially if you're taking electrolyte as well?  

     

  • I too run before breakfast - I always have done and when I started running longer distances never got to a point where I felt I needed any extra fuel. But I would take a couple of gels if practising race strategy, like Martin. Also I'd have a flapjack if I got up late and wasn't going to be finished before lunchtime. But that would be to ward off hunger pangs rather than for fuel. I probably do have more fat reserves than you though!

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