Parker's HR book

Coco-Cat

I've just finished reading Parker's Heart Monitor Training for the Compleat Idiot and am grabbed by the idea of running recovery runs at below 70%....mainly because I am knackered from the mileage I've run in the past couple of weeks. I would like some opinions from other people though:

1) Have any of you found that his ideas about the 70% limit work?

2) For those of you who have done a max HR test, how did you do it?

Thanks.

Unknown

CC, I read Parkers book last October or so and began training based on these methods then. I am a big fan as I have seen the following improvements:

1) Started at being able to do 3 miles under 70% in 12 min/mile and last weekend I managed to do 12 miles in 10:40 min / mile with Av. HR being 70% (and due to where I live all my routes have decent hills in them also). Based on this experience I am a believer in the 70% training.
2) I have been able to increase mileage so that I am now doing 35-40 miles / week without a lot of aches and pains and also enjoying my running and not thinking "Oh God, another hard session" before I go out on a run.

I did my max. HR test on an inclined treadmill but found that I had to adjust the pace during the session as I wasn't sure at the beginning what pace I needed to go at. I would suggest doing it on a hill outdoors where you can go hard for the 3-4 reps and you would be more likely to do the test correctly and find your max. HR.

Good luck!

[Deleted User]

We had a bit of a thread about this about a week ago - the heading was the book's title so you should be able to find it quite easily.

For what it's worth after a couple of weeks I've got much more used to the 70% running - I prefer to do it on a treadmill so that I can regulate the speed better (also no inclines, so no stopping and walking!) - and I do feel more rested and ready for the "hard" days out on the road. I've been able to up my weekly mileage a fair bit; though whether 11 minute miles every other day are very helpful overall is something I'll have to wait a few more weeks to find out!

Coco-Cat

Thanks guys, that's really helpful. Action Man, did you have anyone with you when you did the max HR treadmill test? I'm a bit scared of either not pushing it fast enough or going flying off the end!!

Can I just have your opinion on something else please? I run generally twice a week with some women from work and I enjoy it because it gets me out at lunchtime and I can have a chat with them. These are not 'hard' sessions but they are above the 70% level. Using the formula, 70% of my max HR should be 132bpm and today my average when doing this run was 158bpm. If you were working out a schedule based on Parker's book, would you classify these as hard runs?

[Deleted User]

Maths isn't my strong point, but it would seem that if your 70% level is 132 then your 85% level should be just over 160, so if you have an average of 158bpm your lunchtime runs are just slightly under that. You also have to take into account the length of time you're doing the runs for - obviously five minutes isn't going to have the same effect as an hour. As you know if you have the book the writer puts some suggested training schedules in for varying levels from beginner to competitive runner - it might be a good idea to see what these recommend.

I found with my "hard" sessions that they would be slightly too fast most of the time to have a comfortable chat whilst running, but as it says in the book the amount of effort you have to put in at a given rate depends on your own fitness level and should get relatively harder as you get fitter. If this makes sense!

Coco-Cat

Hi Ronnie. I've just found the thread you started on this actually. I've also just calculated the % for my lunchtime runs and found that they are between 80 and 85% MHR so they are too fast to be recovery runs. As I only do them twice a week I shall try slotting in 70% recovery runs on the days inbetween them. I will check the schedules though.

I am quite grabbed by his theories as I need to build up my mileage but always seem to get really knackered when I do this.

[Deleted User]

Hello C-C. Do be aware that if you haven't done 70% runs before you'll feel like an absolute plonker because it's so slow. Also any incline, however slight, will probably mean you'll have to walk for a while. That's why I started doing the recovery runs on a treadmill at the gym - it's also a good way of seeing if I'm getting any faster at the 70% heart rate.

And I got fed up of being overtaken by toddlers on the road!

[Deleted User]

I too was involved in last week's thread and have nearly finished the book. The 70% runs are frustratingly slow but interspersed with the hard runs (which were long but seemed easy - and I stayed in my 85% range) I realised that, on Tuesday, I had actually run 7 consecutive days and more mileage,although it didn't feel that way at all.
For this reason alone I am a convert to the book.
I also thought I would do all the embarrassingly slow runs on the treadmill in the gym, until I found that as soon as the belt starts the HRM shows 00!
However, the proof will be in race times I suppose, so watch this space!

Coco-Cat

I think the gym is looking a likely venue for the recovery runs as there are quite a lot of slow and overweight people in our gym trying to get fitter by just walking on the treadmills. On those grounds it would be less embarrassing than trying to keep to 70% down the canal here at work. Doing 80-85% today we got overtaken by loads of lunchtime gazelles.

[Deleted User]

Parker does say not to woory too much about going slightly over 70% max when going up hills. I run a very hilly 11 mile route and would end up walking half of it if I stuck religiously to the rule. These are all fairly short hills though and I run as slow as possible so only go over by 5 beats or so.

[Deleted User]

Hi everyone - I've been using Parkers book and schedules for a while (am at week six of the intermediate schedule) and have overall enjoyed it. I've done the recovery runs both on the treadmill and on the road and have seen the times come down a fair bit - still over what I would run before using the HRM though, although, I am now running 6 days a week rather than 3/4. I have found the millage hard going at times as I've increased from 15-20 a week to 30-35. This is the first time I've followed any kind of structured schedule so I suppose this is par for the course.

Although the 70% runs do feel very slow at first, they soon speed up, especially on the treadmills, although I would recommend doing some on the road as I've found treadmill times deceptively fast. AS PArker says, ignore the people overtaking you on those days (prefer to look at the people waiting for buses or sitting in their cars to reassure myself that I'm doing myself some good).

Coco-Cat

Hi Andy. What sort of speed were you running the 70% runs at on the treadmill?

[Deleted User]

Hi CC. My recovery ceiling is 151/2 bpm. The speed varies a fair bit to be honest depending on the time of day and what I've eaten etc, it's between 11.8 kph and 13 kph. I teand to start about 12 for a km and see how it goes from there adjusting up and down as I go. I've found in the past week or so that after 4 - 5 miles, my HR drops a few beets so I can speed back up a little. Probably all the water kicking in at that point.

Coco-Cat

That's quite fast to me!! I think I'm going to be crawling along on the recovery runs. I'm really a bit worried that I'll end up doing more walking than running on these.

[Deleted User]

You might have to walk a little, but it will soon pass. I found adjusting my stride a bit painful on my feet at first however, after a couple of weeks I sped up a bit and I found a natural pace.

It's worth giving the Max HR workout a go to check that you're using the correct figures. My traditional calculation was a fair bit out - the actuall giving me 7 bpm more, which helped. I did it on a treadmill doing 4-5 reps of 400m bursts on an incline getting faster each set until I thought my legs might give up.

I think its worth giving the schedules in the book a go. Ive started to see results in a relatively short space of time. Good luck.

[Deleted User]

Yes C-C, but you'll still be getting the extra miles in on those days, building up the legendary mitochondria and leaving yourself fresh to really go hard on the "hard" days.

Another benefit for me at least is that running at 70% means far less impact wear and tear on my legs, feet and ankles on those days. This can be important if, like me, you're in training for a marathon or something and need to up your weekly mileage - being easier on the body means that presumably there's less chance of injury.

[Deleted User]

As Andy said it’s really worth trying to determine your Max HR for real. I found my Actual MHR was about 15BPM higher than the mathematical formulas suggest.

It's bad enough doing the 65%/70% runs, as it is. If I had taken my Max HR based on the mathematical formula those runs would be a lot harder .... or should that read easier ;-) Well I'd certainly be walking a lot!!!

Great book - most useful one I've read.

[Deleted User]

Anyone using these principals for marathon training? I'm following it for a 10 miler on 4th April, then was going pick up a marathon schedule half way through for Blackpool end of June.

[Deleted User]

I definitely agree about those "extra" miles - and I certainly feel fresher on the hard days (well so far anyway).
Unfortunately as my hrm won't work on the treadmill, I have to do my easy days outside and get overtaken by anything on legs.
P.S. Spyder, I do presume you have got full permission to use the various wonderful spyder logos?

Coco-Cat

I'm planning on using it to help with half-marathon training. I'm doing the Bath half in March (which is probably a bit soon for it to have much impact) but am keen to do some others later in the year. My problem has always been running out of energy when increasing my mileage so I really hope this helps.

Will give the treadmill max HR test a go, I think. Will let you know if I break any legs flying off the end!!

Unknown

CC, good luck with the training and the Bath HM. I am doing the Stafford HM at the end of March myself and may need some of that luck.

Just remember there is no quick fix although we all wish there was.

Happy running!!

Coco-Cat

I used to work in Stafford...at the University, AM. What's the route like?

Muttley

I have this book. I didn't use the training schedules to the letter, but I incorporated the ideas into my training.

I do find the 70% malarkey works, and have upped my mileage since getting the book. Hrms are all very well, but you can become a slave to them.

Max hr test ... initially I did mine exactly as instructed in the book. But on a later run I got it higher by blasting up a hill after about two miles of running on the flat as fast as I could sustain. I think it's the lengthy period of close to max effort followed by that final spurt that finds your true max. In my case, the difference was 8 beats.

Unknown

CC, not sure about the route as haven't done the event before and haven't had a look at the route on the web yet. Have been told that it is a fairly flat course but with a couple of hills.

As far as I am concerned the flatter the better!!